What Male to use in a cross?

[dopeshow]

untull someone elightens me to the contrary

Dude... when they did and do it doesnt matter anyway.

the range of conditions, resource levels and densities of other species allowing the survival, growth and reproduction of an organism or species. Hence, if each condition, resource or other species is seen as a dimension, the niche is an n-dimensional hypervolume.

There isn't even a thought in that first "sentence." I understand what you're getting at but would you mind defining densities of species as it applies to cannabis breeding in your n-dimensional hypervolume model??

I'd also love to hear how you connect repairable parallel-series system to cannabis breeding.

Just as a curious question Rick, do you have any background in Calculus or Physics? Or is all this quantum stuff youre on about a hobby?

 

[has_some_sinse]

When one stops doing it for the love it all goes to hell. We are proud and passionate about what, why and how we do it. Could it be that there is more than one path to the same destination? It is through various methods we find our own personal truths. We learn our methods through watching others on their path and trying, doing and adapting their behaviors for ourselves. We have a responsibility as guardians of this sacred plant, not to dilute the gene pool. It is also our duty to know the role of breeding material and hybrids.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

Sam-
In case you don't realize it you're doing nothing in here but instigating nvisionary.

I promise it is not my intention, I am dead serious when I say just ignore him, and that is exactly what I mean. If people enjoy this kind of diatribe they can go to his threads and argue until they are blue in the face, I know I tried in the past, but maybe this guy is just beyond redemption and really does need to be just ignored? I meant it as a way to calm things down a bit, myself included.

Sam-
Don't feel like answering my questions? I'd love to hear some info on the long term value of a real RSS program with drug cannabis. I'd like to know more about your YYs. I'd like to hear who taught you to reverse males. I'd like to hear why you don't want to use feminized lines while the company that bought your lines does? I don't know, any of my wishes would be more productive for our community than you baiting nvisionary into the same sort of situation you consider his M.O. Respectfully, GitT

There is no end to your questions in fact.
I am the wrong guy to talk about RSS I am not a fan of the method at all.

As for my YY's the seeds barely finished and don't look so hot but I will germinate them next year and see what happens, then test any that do grow and check if they are YY.

But to be honest I see no value of this work other then random curiosity, I mean do you know anyone that wants a YY drug variety male or any of the resulting all male plants it could produce? I do think it is interesting to judge hidden traits the male will pass on to progeny like smell, taste, and type of high and potency but not for seeds.
I don't.

I already posted the references I used to learn about transforming males to females. I read it years ago, but never tried it until this year.
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=99597

My thoughts about using feminized seeds were expressed pretty clearly, that you don't agree I have no problem with, but please allow me to have my own beliefs on what is important to the future of a healthy Cannabis genepool, and the ability of Cannabis to naturally propagate with males and females, maybe I am just a worry wart but it is how I feel. You can ignore my warnings most people do. But I have been at this longer then anyone else and I have insights that maybe make me feel different then most. I don't know a lot of people that have spent the time or funds to travel everywhere and see and collect the germ plasm collection I have compiled, I know very few that have grown or even bred Cannabis on my scale. Maybe it allowed me to see things other folks don't worry about, maybe I am just a foolish guy worrying about things that don't matter, but that is how it is and I see it.
I have worried for years that when Cannabis is legal only a few female clones would be used in the Cannabis industry, like in the wine industry, and the gene pool will get all that much smaller.
-SamS

 

[buddah]

I have worried for years that when Cannabis is legal only a few female clones would be used in the Cannabis industry, like in the wine industry, and the gene pool will get all that much smaller.
-SamS

i totally understand sams points....hope it not will turn into an industry like the wine or vegs are today...most races are gone and only the organic growers keept a "big" variation of races!!!! Most old gens are lost forever

 

[kopite]

I have worried for years that when Cannabis is legal only a few female clones would be used in the Cannabis industry, like in the wine industry, and the gene pool will get all that much smaller.
-SamS

But when its legal is it not gonna be some what of a quagmire as to who owns what etc... ie will GW be holding a license that says Skunk No 1 is theirs? I saw you mention about the Thai landrace before, If my memory is right was it found that in the 90's it was about 90% pure? if so what do you think it is at now? I am glad you have collected seeds from far away but what happens with these seeds in the future? do you forsee a time where they will be taken back to their native land (or acclimatised land) and reintroduced? or will they be sold to a company? I basically feel we are playing catch up and lots are lost already... preserve what you can...

Preservation is the most honourable thing you can do in the current political climate - Hyb

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

No Skunk #1 is mine plain and simple.
I can't say what you refer to when you say Thai was or is 90% pure in what?
My seeds are frozen at -30c they will be good long after I am dead.
I am both saving for the future and using some of what is useful to me.
I have thousands of Landraces and local farmers cultivars, took me over 35 years to collect them, mostly myself. But I have also used other collectors that went to a few places I never visited. This is my life work.
I am sure they will be used but I saved them to be sure someone had them.
Many areas of traditional Cannabis cultivation are under attack and the police do every thing they can to destroy the crops, not good for preservation. Thai used to be the best commercial Cannabis in the world produced by the ton. Today it is a shadow of it's past and it is grown in Laos. Things that you would think would never change are gone in the blink of an eye. I just wanted to be prepared regardless of what happened, that is why my collection is in three different countries, 1/3 in each, frozen. I have taken out seeds after 25 years and got over 95% germination. But I get 90% germination with well made seeds stored 10 years at +3c in a refrigerator.
-SamS

 

[kopite]

My seeds are frozen at -30c they will be good long after I am dead.
I am both saving for the future and using some of what is useful to me.
I have thousands of Landraces and local farmers cultivars, took me over 35 years to collect them, mostly myself. But I have also used other collectors that went to a few places I never visited. This is my life work.
I am sure they will be used but I saved them to be sure someone had them.
Many areas of traditional Cannabis cultivation are under attack and the police do every thing they can to destroy the crops, not good for preservation. Thai used to be the best commercial Cannabis in the world produced by the ton. Today it is a shadow of it's past and it is grown in Laos. Things that you would think would never change are gone in the blink of an eye. I just wanted to be prepared regardless of what happened, that is why my collection is in three different countries, 1/3 in each, frozen. I have taken out seeds after 25 years and got over 95% germination. But I get 90% germination with well made seeds stored 10 years at +3c in a refrigerator.
-SamS

I'm glad you had the foresight and balls to do it... I will go through my notes re 90 percent purity etc.... its an old doc somewhere..

Kopite

 

[joaquin386]

Sam what would you do with your collection of seeds after you dont want to play with them anymore or fell bore of them. Will you give it to a seed company or just to a close friend to keep the preservation. Are you considering giving them away to these Norweian seed storage that they are building (or they have build already).

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

I will use them until I die.
Then my relatives will decide unless I decide to will them to people I admire.
-SamS

 

[eugenegreen]

Could be true Sam, but he has made some valid points which are reason for discussion... But alas, just like a comedian; your material is only a quarter of the bit, the "delivery" is the other three-quarters! You can have the best joke in the world, but a soul won't laugh if you can't say it right!! Perhaps if visionary got his shit together, and learned how to speak with fellow human beings respectfully, he wouldn't have such a hard time getting folks to listen to him... Shame really, for it seems he has some valid ideas and points to make which are highly relevant...

eugene

p.s. Sam, where has the RKS gone?? The real one man, not that sweet dutch bullshit... The real stanky danky meaty skunky farty doodoo smoke!!!!

Folks,
If nvisionary makes negative posts or tries and bait anyone the best and only thing that works is to ignore him, do not respond, sooner or later he will just go away pissed because no one appreciates him and all of his superior knowledge. He thrives on conflict and to ignore him is death.
Please remind any newbie's why this needs to be done, because he can't be nice at all.

I have nothing against his posts in fact, until he seem to inevitably turn to being a crude, rude, little kid. Why, I don't know but maybe it is because he was bottle fed and is still pissed at his mom? Or maybe because you really don't like anyone here and you only come to vent your personal frustration and anger? He also brings out the worst in me and I don't need it. Any way it is a shame and energy drain.

Let him make his own threads and let any posters on his threads beware!

-SamS

 

[Owl Mirror]

I will use them until I die.
Then my relatives will decide unless I decide to will them to people I admire.
-SamS

Hi Sam, have you ever considered a donation to the Svalbard Global Seed Vault ?

Doomsday Vault Protects World's Seeds
Svalbard Global Seed Vault opened its doors on February 26, 2008 to the world.

I would hope someone makes the effort to preserve Cannabis seeds to this degree.

http://www.regjeringen.no/en/dep/lmd/campain/svalbard-global-seed-vault.html

Grethe Helene Evjen, Senior adviser
Tel. +47 93 28 79 53
E-mail: [email protected]

 

[GreenintheThumb]

I promise it is not my intention, I am dead serious when I say just ignore him, and that is exactly what I mean. If people enjoy this kind of diatribe they can go to his threads and argue until they are blue in the face, I know I tried in the past, but maybe this guy is just beyond redemption and really does need to be just ignored? I meant it as a way to calm things down a bit, myself included.

Don't worry, it's pretty easy to ignore him when they've erased everything he's said.

There is no end to your questions in fact.
I am the wrong guy to talk about RSS I am not a fan of the method at all.

Well sorry. I wanted to at least keep this train on it's tracks instead of shitting on the guy who just got banned. I think maybe some others were curious about the stuff I asked as well. I still don't know what your problem is with RSS. I completely understand and agree with you its impractical/impossible to accomplish in the current legal environment but post legalization I don't understand why you would argue against it.

As for my YY's the seeds barely finished and don't look so hot but I will germinate them next year and see what happens, then test any that do grow and check if they are YY.

But to be honest I see no value of this work other then random curiosity, I mean do you know anyone that wants a YY drug variety male or any of the resulting all male plants it could produce? I do think it is interesting to judge hidden traits the male will pass on to progeny like smell, taste, and type of high and potency but not for seeds.

Yeah, I agree with you on all of that. I guess it's just my curious nature that makes me want to know. And it does seem like a fairly novel experiment. I've met no one who claims to even know if the YYs will germinate or what phenotypes they will display. Besides answering that question I agree the real benefit of reversing them is to judge the traits hidden in the male phenotype.
I don't.

I already posted the references I used to learn about transforming males to females. I read it years ago, but never tried it until this year.
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=99597

Thanks, forgot about that.

My thoughts about using feminized seeds were expressed pretty clearly, that you don't agree I have no problem with, but please allow me to have my own beliefs on what is important to the future of a healthy Cannabis genepool, and the ability of Cannabis to naturally propagate with males and females, maybe I am just a worry wart but it is how I feel. You can ignore my warnings most people do. But I have been at this longer then anyone else and I have insights that maybe make me feel different then most.

Yes, certainly I want you to have your own opinion on all the subjects I've asked you. Otherwise this place would be pretty boring, no? I respect your opinions and insights, otherwise I wouldn't be in a discussion with you. Personally, I still feel properly used feminization techniques are a valuable tool. I thought maybe you had more reasons to not trust reversals but I guess we can just agree to disagree

I don't know a lot of people that have spent the time or funds to travel everywhere and see and collect the germ plasm collection I have compiled, I know very few that have grown or even bred Cannabis on my scale. Maybe it allowed me to see things other folks don't worry about, maybe I am just a foolish guy worrying about things that don't matter, but that is how it is and I see it.
I have worried for years that when Cannabis is legal only a few female clones would be used in the Cannabis industry, like in the wine industry, and the gene pool will get all that much smaller.
-SamS

Me either Sam. I greatly respect your contributions to our community. I am kind of surprised you believe the pool will be even thinner post legalization. What makes you believe that? Do you think if everyone had access to OG Kush or Cheese, that's all they'd want? I always imagined the pool would get wider post legalization and we could start returning what's left of the preserved landraces to their lands or origins and start trying to heal the damage done. I guess, another possibility is that only a few companies would be working towards real improvement and everyone would just grow out the few superior clone releases. I don't know tho. I guess I think it could go either direction, towards homogeneity like the wine industry or towards heterogeneity like the craft brewing industry. I suppose only time will tell, lets just hope we pull our collective heads out of our asses and legalize it before we all drop dead.

Thanks for stopping by Sam, we value your input. Take care.

 

[GreenintheThumb]

No Skunk #1 is mine plain and simple.
I can't say what you refer to when you say Thai was or is 90% pure in what?
My seeds are frozen at -30c they will be good long after I am dead.
I am both saving for the future and using some of what is useful to me.
I have thousands of Landraces and local farmers cultivars, took me over 35 years to collect them, mostly myself. But I have also used other collectors that went to a few places I never visited. This is my life work.
I am sure they will be used but I saved them to be sure someone had them.
Many areas of traditional Cannabis cultivation are under attack and the police do every thing they can to destroy the crops, not good for preservation. Thai used to be the best commercial Cannabis in the world produced by the ton. Today it is a shadow of it's past and it is grown in Laos. Things that you would think would never change are gone in the blink of an eye. I just wanted to be prepared regardless of what happened, that is why my collection is in three different countries, 1/3 in each, frozen. I have taken out seeds after 25 years and got over 95% germination. But I get 90% germination with well made seeds stored 10 years at +3c in a refrigerator.
-SamS

This post warms the cockles of my heart

I swear I read you had sold skunk1 to GW. Maybe you just sold them a really nice clone, not the rights to the whole line?

Thanks for having the foresight of preservation. And I'm glad you didn't put all your loot in one boot. Spreading your seed collection out to a few Countries was a great idea.

 

[englishrick]

i wana know how to get into sams will,,,,,

 

[Owl Mirror]

When I read OVERGROWTHEGOVERNMENT I never envisioned it being done with clones.

 

[dj3hut1]

seedmaking using polyhybrids without forethought or a breeding plan only weakens our valuable resource - the limited genepool.

Please don't harm the species we love by going ahead with this "plan".

Grow sinse. Don't weaken or resource.

Please reconsider.
-Chimera

all i know is that people have been crossing and re-crossing their strains in their basements for decades. occasionally one gets popular and makes it to a seedbank. if you have problems with one person doing it. you need to PM everybody on these boards and tell them to stop making their own "OGK X SD". i think theyll tell you that you wont ever have to worry about their crosses as theyre just for themselves and friends.

the commercial genepool was effed up when everybody thought skunk,haze,nl was the shit and started crossing it to everything and back to itself. to say its weakening an already limited genepool, these genes had to come from somewhere (columbia, thailand, afghanistan, mexico). its not like these places stopped growing pot. the genes are still there. so i would assume the genepool youre talking about would be the actual breeders that took time to travel the globe, attain the genes, and make strains that people go GAGA over.
worry about yourself, and do what you do best.

 

[dj3hut1]

i wish you guys would provide a more realistic approach............this is just gettin silly........especialy with the characterization of system reliability when handling redundancy allocation problems you guys oviously have no clue...........

consider repairable series-parallel systems comprised of components subjected to corrective maintenance actions with failure-repair cycles modeled by renewal processes where "multiobjective optimization" is applied..........

since increasing the number of redundancies not only enlarges system reliability but also its associated costs..........

a multiobjective genetic algorithm is coupled with discrete event simulation and its solutions present the compromise between system reliability and cost..

please consider it.........

think of repairable systems subjected to perfect repairs......... what i say might be valuable tool for the decision maker when choosing the system design....

in the selection step,,,,,,, the relation of dominance among individuals in the current population is evaluated according to their penlized fitness values...... on the other hand, the nondominated individuals continue and are candidae solutions that may be stored....

imo we need to walk many many roads and we need many friends to walk them roads with us, then old man time wont catch up with all of us, an the comon goal of man will be achived remember a beautifull mind

imo.. peeps cant expect a kush to stay a kush "forever" if peeps take a bunch of seeds out of the mountains and breed with it indoors under a sh11ty HPS. the only way to retain novel traits after an enviroment collaps is ......N-Vishon,,,,,i wish he were here now

kinda like how freemasonry is forever

 

[englishrick]

^^^thats the magic right there^^^^

i thought this thread was dead,,,,,but its good to see it alive

that post of mine was the top-and-bottom........imo

 

[dj3hut1]

lol oops... just got caught up in reading

 

[mean mr.mustard]

Why is this thread back?