Fungus gnats or WINGED ROOT APHIDS???

[inreplyavalon]

Also, since I probably won't totally eradicate them this round and see the signs of deficiency (due to the aphids) should I go ahead and give them some cal/mag? I feed with GH flora micro/bloom 6/9 per gallon (wouldn't normally need cal mag if it wasn't for the aphids sucking on my roots).

I have found supplementing with some extra nutes when the plants are deficient from aphids, to help a bit. The deficiency never goes away, but it just may help the plant continue to grow. Be careful you dont over do it towards the end, they still should get a proper flush

 

[CFP65]

i had Fungus Gnats last winther, and im free of them now.

i literally tried all i could get hands on to get rid of those bastards.
but to no awail, Neem oil they eat the stuff and get bigger on it, increasing amounts of dis soap watered down, did not affect them, 4cm of fine sand around on top of the soil together with placing the pots in trays with 10cm of sand, just sloved things down for at bit, even tried some brown liquid bacillus something that nailed my wallét to the drain.

untill i eventually took as many cuts from the mothers as i could, and put them in the fridge, and took the moters and washed ALL soil of the roots with lukewarm water, after that i repotted the mothers in fresh soil, and kept an eye out for anything that had wings and sure enough they came back, so all i could do was to kill the mothers dispose of all soil in the appartment and start all over again 2 weeks later from the cuts i took and placed in the fridge.
during those two weeks i literally vacumed all of my appartment, washed all surfaces (for the first time ever) and done with that i sprayed all of the windowsills with H2o2, and at the day of repotting i purchased new soil. even my cacti got their soil washed off, and was layed barerooted to dry for the 14 days.

this treatment worked, and i have not seen those things since, now im just pestered with PM

 

[Yes4Prop215]

anybody got pictures of plants in veg/flower with RA? i got a couple plants in my trays taht are looking real droopy, i figured it was overwatering or possible deficiency but they arent bouncing back yet..i have fungus gnats but praying to god they arent aphids..

edit FUCK....just checked my fly traps and these are definately root aphids...too thick and fat to be gnats.

holy fuck shit....so i guess i gotta scrap these plants. one tray i layered with DE and is looking very healthy, but ive definately lost a couple in my other tray..

should i dose them up and hit them with extra nutes....any chance at saving them?

fuck evergreen 60-6 is 340 bucks a gallon god damn!! even the merit was like 80 bucks for a tiny bottle...

 

[nickman]

anybody got pictures of plants in veg/flower with RA? i got a couple plants in my trays taht are looking real droopy, i figured it was overwatering or possible deficiency but they arent bouncing back yet..i have fungus gnats but praying to god they arent aphids..

edit FUCK....just checked my fly traps and these are definately root aphids...too thick and fat to be gnats.

holy fuck shit....so i guess i gotta scrap these plants. one tray i layered with DE and is looking very healthy, but ive definately lost a couple in my other tray..

should i dose them up and hit them with extra nutes....any chance at saving them?

fuck evergreen 60-6 is 340 bucks a gallon god damn!! even the merit was like 80 bucks for a tiny bottle...

How do u like the DE?
How thick do u layer it on top of the soil?
Also after i water i then have to put down more DE again because the water will kind of wash it away...

I also noticed that the DE doesnt really affect the Fungus Gnats as much i guess because of their small and lite size, they can basically land on it and walk around on top of it sometimes...(i've seen it happen)...

It just seems next to impossable to get rid of these little fvckers......

 

[overgrowit]

The worst part is that a lot of times they infect your plants with viruses causing you to have to restart and possibly lose your old genetics

 

[Yes4Prop215]

i put a thick layer, usually at least half inch long. and yea when you hand water it definately does wash it around a bit....but im currently doing ebbnflow so the water never touches the surface anymore. so far the tray i put DE on last week is doing very good, showing zero signs of fungas gnats or root aphids. however i was lazy and didnt cover another tray and those ones are all infected...i just soaked with a combo solution of merit75 and SNS203 and did a DE topping. if they dont recover within a week i guess im tossing them....

 

[GeorgeSmiley]

anybody got pictures of plants in veg/flower with RA? i got a couple plants in my trays taht are looking real droopy, i figured it was overwatering or possible deficiency but they arent bouncing back yet..i have fungus gnats but praying to god they arent aphids..

edit FUCK....just checked my fly traps and these are definately root aphids...too thick and fat to be gnats.

holy fuck shit....so i guess i gotta scrap these plants. one tray i layered with DE and is looking very healthy, but ive definately lost a couple in my other tray..

should i dose them up and hit them with extra nutes....any chance at saving them?

fuck evergreen 60-6 is 340 bucks a gallon god damn!! even the merit was like 80 bucks for a tiny bottle...

Wassup yesprop

Is it a fat fungus gnat so it looks more like a scariad fly or is it a winged root aphid? How many wings? Gnats have 2 wings and winged aphids have 2 longer wings then 2 short stubby ones behind it. Several different sizes and shapes of the gnats and fly's so you really need to look closer to see what youre dealing with.

I keep seeing people with deficiencies post pics of fungus gnats, shore flies, scariad flies,

http://eycb.pagesperso-orange.fr/scorpions/Images/Photos galerie/Enemies/Phorides2.jpg


Got any pics man?

Cheers
gs

 

[Yes4Prop215]

my camera sucks so couldnt take a picture..but it looks almost exactly like the picture posted on the first page. short fat and with large wings..

ive started a root drench of 2tsp per 5gal of Merit75 and 40ml of SNS203 per 5/gal and did a flush....going to follow it up with some bayer tree and shrub and pray. i have also layered the top of the soil with an inch of Dio. Earth...

 

[rasputin]

Alright, I need some input from the root aphid guru's...

What's the best strategy to quarantine and treat new cuttings that came from a garden battling RA's?

I have some Bayer tree & shrub on hand. I'm thinking dunking the cuttings for 90-120 seconds and then applying as a drench when they're in clone trays. Once they root I'll follow up with drenches for the first 2-3 weeks of veg. A systemic application of imid 'sounds' like it should work but I've read some horror stories about these bastards.

I'm also getting some DE, gonna pick up some bayer insect dust, and bomb the entire veg space as a preventative and the clone tray they'll be rooting in.

Any other suggestions? I've never dealt with aphids so I hope this approach will work.

My thinking is, since I haven't had them and they're only cuttings the RA's present would be in early larvae stage or possibly even dormant eggs (they've been in the fridge), which Bayer should be able to take care of. No? I don't know shit about aphids so I'm all ears to any suggestions.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

whats the dosage for Bayer tree and shrub? use the same on bottle or special mix for marijuana..

also what is your guys fert dosage looking like too? running straight pesticide or are you adding in feed as well...

thanks

 

[Yes4Prop215]

A few things I've noticed.



Imidacloprid 1.5% @ 10ml/g once weekly for 3 weeks in veg or early flower. Back off on watering a lot, and lower your room temps so the medium is cooler and less prone to rot. Only apply when really dry(important for efficacy) and don't wash it out over the next few days, its easy to do. Also might want to back off on nutes if plant isn't drinking much


If your plants aren't taking up water you can hit them with imid but then seriously don't give them any more water until they dry. As in don't water another pesticide next day. I've read to keep watering the sickly plants and that they will get better because of the exchange of oxygen and coco. In terms of RA and the subsequent root rot I have not found this true.

did a little searching came up with this...

]

Tonight I flushed. The soil was still very wet, only just starting to show signs of drying. I applied a mixture of tap water (100 ppm) with CalMag (3ml/g), PBP Bloom Soil (7ml/g), FloraNectar (4ml/g), Liquid Karma (10ml/g), Hygrozyme (10ml/g), Roots Excelurator (1ml/g) and 3% H2O2 (1/2oz/g).

My theory was that, with such wet medium and slow uptake, I only get one shot for the next 3-4 days, so I wanted to provide a full spectrum of nutrients as well as root growth stimulators, enzyme treatment for dead root tissue, and hydrogen peroxide to provide oxygen to the water logged roots and hopefully disinfect some of the undoubtedly rotting roots. I was uncertain, however, if the h2o2 would make the hygrozyme ineffective.

By the time I was finished watering, there was dramatic visible recovery. Many dying yellow leaves with severe mottling and and spotting are flush, lush green. Leaves are perk and full. It's too bad I don't have a good before pic.

but then this guy is saying he gave them a light nutrient dose and they recovered well..

so i think my next watering willl be 1tsp per gallon of Bayer tree and shrub along with a light dose of nutrients, roots excel, and maybe some h202 to clean up the dead roots and help fight root rot.

going to water everything with..everything per gallon
1tsp bayer tree and shrub
1/2 oz h202
10ml liquid karma
3ml calmag
5ml FF big bloom
some Great White

i also have merit and SNS203 on hand..gonna use that next week possible after i let everything dry out.

 

[zor]

hey guys,
what a nightmare
sorry to hear that some of us are still getting wiped out by the ra's. Recently, after thinking, i had finally won the war, i was reinfested as well. I saw no damage and no fliers for weeks so i stopped my preventative routine of azamax, and imid. Big mistake.

It seems that with both roots organic soil and compressed coco bricks (botanicare), i get an outbreak after transplanting into bigger containers. The roots organic has been notorious on the forums for pests, but strangely, the compressed coco seems to be tainted as well imo.

Castings ftw here as well.
One thing that has helped tremdendously is worm castings and worm casting tea .

Despite the aphids, i was able to make it through harvests with a lower yield, and save mother plants by using a top dress of castings combined with a tea to help heal damaged roots.

Just this past couple of weeks, i had an outbreak with fliers everywhere. An immediate routine of rotating treatments with worm tea has preserved the dark green the plants had going into the cycle even though the fuckers were literally just morphing into the speedy flyers crawling all over. I also had ravaged clones on the verge of death that were saved by the regimen.

The battle isn't over for me as i have a few weeks of bloom to go. I have botaniguard and evergreen on hand which i haven't tried before, but I'm not to hopeful that it'll be a cure all in coco/soil.

switching mediums?
I've run hydro plants next to infested coco that didn't seem to as easily get effected at all by the invisible death. They made it through runs better than the coco plants (with no castings ) .

I've also noted F.dupp's experience with wiping out imid resistant aphids in one shot in aero using evergreen. I'm switching as we speak to go aero. I will let you guys know how it goes.

i feel that with a aero tube system and no medium, there are less places for these fuckers to hide from stuff like evergreen.

I know there are plenty of people with hydro aphid issues, but it seems that for the most part, we have coco and soil grows getting fucked the most.

 

[inreplyavalon]

so i think my next watering willl be 1tsp per gallon of Bayer tree and shrub along with a light dose of nutrients, roots excel, and maybe some h202 to clean up the dead roots and help fight root rot.

going to water everything with..everything per gallon
1tsp bayer tree and shrub
1/2 oz h202
10ml liquid karma
3ml calmag
5ml FF big bloom
some Great White

i also have merit and SNS203 on hand..gonna use that next week possible after i let everything dry out.

Hey man, these guys can be at the very least controlled. I pulled 12 from 8400w last round and was infested pretty badly. I hit them with spectracide on day 10 of bloom as soon as i identified some crawlers, and then botanigard a few times later on. They were definitely still cruising and eating, but with big plants and large root masses they were still able to flower. Strains i had been running for years did not chunk up as usual but was still able to get a decent pull. This round i have been using merit/spectracide in veg along with met52 at transplant in veg, and just tonight hit them with botanigard. Its day 19 and when i pull a plant out of the saucer, white furry roots below. I can see the met52 has spread through the coco pretty well. I am hoping i can have long term control using just met52 and botanigard as they are both living organisms and not chems. If this round finishes strong i will do a few tester plants next round and see if the above two work on their own. This may be no help to your current situation, but maybe it will help someone out. Merry xmas
EDIT: forgot to mention that H202 will reduce/eliminate the effectiveness of roots excel.

Zor my best guess is that the aphids are not being completely destroyed. I can say with certainty that a root aphid cannot live in a DEHYDRATED coco brick. Impossible. a bag of roots soil, definitely. Just sayin...

 

[inreplyavalon]

Alright, I need some input from the root aphid guru's...

What's the best strategy to quarantine and treat new cuttings that came from a garden battling RA's?

I have some Bayer tree & shrub on hand. I'm thinking dunking the cuttings for 90-120 seconds and then applying as a drench when they're in clone trays. Once they root I'll follow up with drenches for the first 2-3 weeks of veg. A systemic application of imid 'sounds' like it should work but I've read some horror stories about these bastards.

I'm also getting some DE, gonna pick up some bayer insect dust, and bomb the entire veg space as a preventative and the clone tray they'll be rooting in.

Any other suggestions? I've never dealt with aphids so I hope this approach will work.

My thinking is, since I haven't had them and they're only cuttings the RA's present would be in early larvae stage or possibly even dormant eggs (they've been in the fridge), which Bayer should be able to take care of. No? I don't know shit about aphids so I'm all ears to any suggestions.

That could work. Any chance these infected clones have not seen the light of your grow space yet? If not you may want to consider sourcing somewhere else. I recently brought aphids into a new space to save myself two months time, and not sure if it was a mistake or not at this point.

 

[rasputin]

Prop, 5mL/gal is the commonly used rate it seems. T&S label calls for 5mL per 1 gal of medium in containers. And a buddy of mine who's treated his garden for aphids recommended fruit/veg/citrus at 5mL/gal.

That could work. Any chance these infected clones have not seen the light of your grow space yet? If not you may want to consider sourcing somewhere else. I recently brought aphids into a new space to save myself two months time, and not sure if it was a mistake or not at this point.

They haven't seen the garden yet. I'm still debating on whether to do this or not. As nice as this cut is, I don't need to risk getting aphids for it but I'm kinda intrigued by the challenge. That probably sounds terribly naive to someone who's had them, but they can't be untouchable. I think location has a lot to do with reinfections. They've been quarantined from the start. They're in the fridge in a different location and I'll be cloning them far away from the garden. They're just snips so the stem/leaves are the focus to clean up and treat. They got a merit75 dunk prior to arriving so hopefully that helped.

Have you had any success using imid products like Bayer? A friend swears by it, claims it cleaned his veg room up entirely. I haven't talked to him recently so I can't pick his brain or see if he's still aphid free but I know last time we talked he was still raving about how people waste time with other stuff that doesn't work, like botaniguard and DE, and insisted if I ever got them to get some Bayer ASAP and start drenching.

 

[zor]

Zor my best guess is that the aphids are not being completely destroyed. I can say with certainty that a root aphid cannot live in a DEHYDRATED coco brick.

i agree with you that an aphid cannot live in a coco brick. The eggs i'm not so sure about. At the hydro store where i bought the bricks, the bricks were stored right next to the roots organic. The whole shelf had fliers. I thought i'd be safe with the bricks as well, which is why i bought them ( i used loose coco before).

On materials like plastic, the waxy secretion left by the aphids calcifies to the point where it has to be scraped off. This is where i'm guessing that the eggs get laid. When the wax dries up, i wonder if the eggs can survive.

any thoughts?

 

[inreplyavalon]

Prop, 5mL/gal is the commonly used rate it seems. T&S label calls for 5mL per 1 gal of medium in containers. And a buddy of mine who's treated his garden for aphids recommended fruit/veg/citrus at 5mL/gal.



They haven't seen the garden yet. I'm still debating on whether to do this or not. As nice as this cut is, I don't need to risk getting aphids for it but I'm kinda intrigued by the challenge. That probably sounds terribly naive to someone who's had them, but they can't be untouchable. I think location has a lot to do with reinfections. They've been quarantined from the start. They're in the fridge in a different location and I'll be cloning them far away from the garden. They're just snips so the stem/leaves are the focus to clean up and treat. They got a merit75 dunk prior to arriving so hopefully that helped.

Have you had any success using imid products like Bayer? A friend swears by it, claims it cleaned his veg room up entirely. I haven't talked to him recently so I can't pick his brain or see if he's still aphid free but I know last time we talked he was still raving about how people waste time with other stuff that doesn't work, like botaniguard and DE, and insisted if I ever got them to get some Bayer ASAP and start drenching.

Imid is absorbed through the roots and is not a contact killer. Unless you use bayer complete which is both. Something to consider if dipping unrooted cuttings.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

its weird i popped my worst looking plant out of its pot, and nothing but white fuzzy roots!! i couldnt find a damn root aphid anywhere......so now im fucking confused as hell!

saw root aphid females in my flyer traps though....everything is layered with DE and havent caught a new flyer in days. nothing is flying anywhere now.....so im guessing that my rootzone has a bunch of juvies still in there.

does the RA have to break the surface to mate or reproduce? or is its entire life cycle contained within the pot?

 

[Holmes Slice]

I am about to lose my whole med grow to an unseen killer...if anyone wants to read my pleas for help

After a few weeks of looking at roots and dissecting plants under a microscope (and finding nothing) I randomly saw this pest today. It looks larger than a fungus gnat as I've had them before. Haven't had gnats in almost a year. This one is much bigger and was a real pain to catch. Do I have root aphids or is this a gnat?

 

[Yes4Prop215]

yo that doesnt look like a root aphid man...the body is too long and slender. looks like a giant fungas gnat to be honest, or a mosquito.

RA females are more squat and fat, and look like little beetles.