Botanist
Member
Their is no such thing as public property.
-
Happy Birthday ICMag! Been 20 years since Gypsy Nirvana created the forum! We are celebrating with a 4/20 Giveaway and by launching a new Patreon tier called "420club". You can read more here.
-
Important notice: ICMag's T.O.U. has been updated. Please review it here. For your convenience, it is also available in the main forum menu, under 'Quick Links"!
Should Government Regulate Cannabis Quality?
- Thread starter Skip
- Start date
Their is no such thing as public property.
How about:
Testing is only required to prove a seller's claim that requires or implies added selling value.
Testing done by a reputable local University or Clinic not associated with the Feds or growers.
Testing for:
100% Organic Label
-NO Harmful synthetic chemicals used during grow and cure.
100% Medical Use Label
-No organic elements foreign to the plant that could compromise patients health.
(Fruit flies, mold, gnats, human or animal hairs, dirt etc.)
In that way WE are compensated for the extra work and somehow less yield due to quality control prior to testing.
Seems fair and money stays local.
Money stays as close to the community as possible.
Feel like Solomon here... LOL
Testing is only required to prove a seller's claim that requires or implies added selling value.
Testing done by a reputable local University or Clinic not associated with the Feds or growers.
Testing for:
100% Organic Label
-NO Harmful synthetic chemicals used during grow and cure.
100% Medical Use Label
-No organic elements foreign to the plant that could compromise patients health.
(Fruit flies, mold, gnats, human or animal hairs, dirt etc.)
In that way WE are compensated for the extra work and somehow less yield due to quality control prior to testing.
Seems fair and money stays local.
Money stays as close to the community as possible.
Feel like Solomon here... LOL
SeniorBuzz
Member
we can do that
You are dead wrong about what Botanist suggested. He said we are all free people allowed to grown and smoke as we see fit. NOTHING in his posts suggests that 800,000 arrests per you could continue.
Perhaps you are paying too much attention to your personal ideology and not reading / listening to what others are saying.
Also government regulations ALLOW poison to be sprayed on food, tobacco, and flowers, so it seems like your solution will not achieve the chem free weed you desire.
Leaving home growers alone and focusing on large registered operations is a good test of safety / quality; but I'd put my stuff and my ICmag friends up against the government approved weed any day.
Hydrosun,
You are missing the picture completely, I did read what Botanist had to say but it will not change that over 800,00 Americans are arrested every year, and the same with all your posts, they will not change that more then 800,000 will be arrested this year. I did not say either of you want the 800,000 arrests to continue, I did say they need to stop and your approach will not stop them. Neither of you are doing anything to change this with your posts. I do understand that you both think individual liberty, ideas, property, are more important, but you guys need to realize that to me and most others here, Cannabis liberation is possible, within our grasp, if we don't spend all our time arguing about stupid crap, that will not be solved here and now anyway.
Focus on what can be changed, not what may well be impossible.
Objectivism or Pseudo-philosophy.
The Oxford Companion to Philosophy, defines pseudo-philosophy as "deliberations that masquerade as philosophical but are inept, incompetent, deficient in intellectual seriousness, and reflective of an insufficient commitment to the pursuit of truth."
Contradictions do not exist. Whenever you think you are facing a contradiction, check your premises. You will find that one of them is wrong. Legalize Cannabis today, regulate tomorrow.
Wise up, you need to give big biz and big government a stake in Cannabis, Tax, regulate, and big biz selling... then we will see legal Cannabis and an end to the 800,000 yearly arrests. Or we can spend the next 50 years trying to implement your idea of perfect government, not achieve it, and still have Cannabis illegal and arrests continuing to get higher every year. Your choice.....
-SamS
A
amberglass
to be safe ,test for any bad things . keep it healthy
HempHut
Active member
Invoke whatever semantic contortions you can muster -- in the case of the article about the Amish that still leaves a real existent body of water with dead zones. I'll ask again, this is good why?
In the case of pot, as Sam points out, that still leaves people being arrested for pot and people consuming pot that hasn't been checked for contaminants.
Where's your praxis?
If my law treats it the same as any other blade of grass on the planet, how are you going to arrest 800,000 people?
How can you read that in my or Botanists posts? Personal freedom is completely compatible with ENDING the arrests.
I don't NEED to GIVE anything to ANYONE. I AM FREE arresting me over MJ is IMMORAL and part of YOUR CREED not mine!
Contradictions do not exist. I do not steal from my neighbors. I don't lock up my neighbors. I don't inspect my neighbors. It appears you have an insufficient commitment to the truth, because GIVE and FREEDOM are incompatible (and an impossible contradiction). One is not free if he is FORCED to GIVE. I need not GIVE any of my FREEDOM to big biz or big government in EXCHANGE for the freedom I was BORN with. Yours is an illusory proposal because you ask me to give up freedoms for NOTHING in return.
The current state of the law is immoral. You seek to replace one immoral infringement on my freedoms with another. You sir with your new regulations and rules will lock up XX# number of mj users or growers because they don't follow your rules. I guess you will be comparatively more or less evil depending on your lock up number compared to the current regime's.
I think wising up is accepting NO infringement on your natural rights and refraining from infringing on the natural rights of others.
So feel free to be superior with your COMPLETE PHILOSOPHY of Socialism / Collectivism. I will be satisfied with my pseudo-philosophy of Objectivism and freedom for all. I will always have "An insufficient commitment to the TRUTH" when the TRUTH = Majority Opinion or ANY contradiction.
I don't want this community to spend the next 50 min implementing anything. I want them to stand up for their freedoms and that of their neighbors NOW!
I overgrow the world and condone ZERO of the 800,000 arrests, you choose to disregard my freedoms and the freedoms of all ICmagers and institute your rules in the hopes it leads to 800,000 - X, but I am already at ZERO.
I don't need or want perfect Gvt. but repeal of immoral laws is easy, this wouldn't even take an amendment to the constitution AND the 21st amendment is a great example of this country repealing a MUCH TOUGHER prohibition.
Please never ask me to wise up to anything that would include the imprisonment of ICmagers for growing MJ as THEY see fit.
May I interject to say that you are both RIGHT !!LOL
May I interject to say that you are both RIGHT !!LOL
GUYS your both right no need to fight lol you both have really good points lol ..lol But Sam is right it has to be done ultimately or what will be the outcome? Can't keep this up ,they are going to look back in History on this time as a" Black mark" and "say what the hell were they doing to the ppl with this medicine this was WRONG!"I still can't say I trust them but I can't see it going any other way..but again foxes in the hen house lol peace out Headband707
May I interject to say that you are both RIGHT !!LOL
GUYS your both right no need to fight lol you both have really good points lol ..lol But Sam is right it has to be done ultimately or what will be the outcome? Can't keep this up ,they are going to look back in History on this time as a" Black mark" and "say what the hell were they doing to the ppl with this medicine this was WRONG!"I still can't say I trust them but I can't see it going any other way..but again foxes in the hen house lol peace out Headband707
Corporations will takeover the production of cannabis for public consumption. We will be permitted to grow a determined amount just as you can brew beer or wine at home.
But cannabis will have to be certified that it does not contain herbicides, pesticides or any booster chemicals to make quick growing low quality cannabis on par with high quality cannabis. We will need to watch these corporations closely so they don't pull any bull shit that tobacco companies are famous for. Of course regulations will drive the cost of cannabis up but competition will help keep them down.
But cannabis will have to be certified that it does not contain herbicides, pesticides or any booster chemicals to make quick growing low quality cannabis on par with high quality cannabis. We will need to watch these corporations closely so they don't pull any bull shit that tobacco companies are famous for. Of course regulations will drive the cost of cannabis up but competition will help keep them down.
Botanist
Member
I will answer. but 1st let me explain why public property does not exist. 1st of you may think that you are part of the "public" you are not. You are only an individual. The deceptive mentality that we all some how own this "public property" is what has gotten us in this mess. the truth is that no one owns the property. No one and everyone in general except for the few bureaucracy that control the use, sale, permits, mineral rights, and everything else. They would be more then happy to sale you a permit to use your own land. It is yours isn't it, i mean, you are part of the "public" aren't you.
No your not. the "public" is what ever the hell the people in charge want it to be. In resent years we have seen the "public" become Massive multi national industries. It was in the "publics" good to give them your money. You not being part of the public at the time.
To answer you other question "is it good?"
That all depends on what you consider good. What are your standards. If you believe that the cow shit truly is killing off parts of the watter and you hold the habitat of fish above and against the survival of man. Then no this is not good. But if you know that mans goal on earth is his own happiness. that he must learn what he needs and how to get it. That his goal in life is not the survival of the fish but of him self then the fish are of no concern to you. You do not care to change the way you live or make survival even the smallest bit harder for the sake of another creature. Man must adapt or die. So must the fish.
nun of this would matter if we where smart enough to reject the mythology of "public property". Say the waters where privately owned. The owner could simply take them to court for damages.
But to get back onto the topic of this thread. The question should be... should government take control over the privet property of growers and business owners through regulation, in the name of the public good?
Those that have said no, are the ones who know that they will never be the public.
Those that have said yes have failed to see this truth so far.
Its not that government is corrupt at the moment. that we simply need bettor people in charge of our life's. Its that government is incapable of running our life's, the economy, or even a field of weed.
Botanist
Member
Impossible! Why such a defeated attitude? lol. I think its fair to say that we all want cannabis freedom. The only difference we are having is in the definition of freedom or possibly a difference in will power. What your asking me to do is trade my economic freedom for my freedom of liberty. I refuse to except that i cannot have both.
As far as what i do to advance my philosophy, I can tell you that for the last 2 years if have worked well within the Republican party (yuk) and have not compromised my self for the approval of others. I am not liked but for some reason i keep getting elected. How the hell did that happen? LOL The republicrats aside, I have spent more time then you know organizing people in my small part of the world and use every medium possible to spread my ideas.
You may have underestimated how contagious the philosophy of liberty is. Simply posting small glimpses of it on this site could very well change the world.
I will not back down from what i know to be right and I will not compromise my values away for the sake of government approval.
Do i think i will live to see an anarcho-capitalist society?
Yes. I refuse to think man will sink back into the twisted economics of the dark ages. 2 steps forward one step back.
.
.
The only thing how would be tolerated and normal would be for the consumer to know if it has been grown organicaly or with chemicals and this could be done by a group who do not belong to the governement.
honnestly people,, you ve all seen as I did what governements are doing.
monsanto is through the gov and they kill people,, problem is this fucked up companies are leading countries through governement puppets.
Once governement are gonna start being involved in MJ they gonna create more stupid laws about cannabis they re gonna tax it and what is it gonna become?... big firms growing pile of crap? Removing all the spirit from MJ
Honnestly the way I see it or MJ is tolerated or we might be better of doing something illegal in our gardens cos the time the gov will make it legal the end will be close.
Finally the president of my country is such an ass hole than it s not even gonna be tolerated in the next 20 years or more and since most of my country has voted for this dum guy ( a bit like bush but worse) i do not know how the public opinion will change.
So skip,,, governements are here to fuck people most of the time so what we need to do is find a way to fuck them back.
.
The only thing how would be tolerated and normal would be for the consumer to know if it has been grown organicaly or with chemicals and this could be done by a group who do not belong to the governement.
honnestly people,, you ve all seen as I did what governements are doing.
monsanto is through the gov and they kill people,, problem is this fucked up companies are leading countries through governement puppets.
Once governement are gonna start being involved in MJ they gonna create more stupid laws about cannabis they re gonna tax it and what is it gonna become?... big firms growing pile of crap? Removing all the spirit from MJ
Honnestly the way I see it or MJ is tolerated or we might be better of doing something illegal in our gardens cos the time the gov will make it legal the end will be close.
Finally the president of my country is such an ass hole than it s not even gonna be tolerated in the next 20 years or more and since most of my country has voted for this dum guy ( a bit like bush but worse) i do not know how the public opinion will change.
So skip,,, governements are here to fuck people most of the time so what we need to do is find a way to fuck them back.
SeniorBuzz
Member
Botanist
Member
LOL Nice!
If my law treats it the same as any other blade of grass on the planet, how are you going to arrest 800,000 people?
How can you read that in my or Botanists posts? Personal freedom is completely compatible with ENDING the arrests.
I don't NEED to GIVE anything to ANYONE. I AM FREE arresting me over MJ is IMMORAL and part of YOUR CREED not mine!
The current state of the law is immoral. You seek to replace one immoral infringement on my freedoms with another. You sir with your new regulations and rules will lock up XX# number of mj users or growers because they don't follow your rules. I guess you will be comparatively more or less evil depending on your lock up number compared to the current regime's.
I think wising up is accepting NO infringement on your natural rights and refraining from infringing on the natural rights of others.
So feel free to be superior with your COMPLETE PHILOSOPHY of Socialism / Collectivism. I will be satisfied with my pseudo-philosophy of Objectivism and freedom for all. I will always have "An insufficient commitment to the TRUTH" when the TRUTH = Majority Opinion or ANY contradiction.
I overgrow the world and condone ZERO of the 800,000 arrests, you choose to disregard my freedoms and the freedoms of all ICmagers and institute your rules in the hopes it leads to 800,000 - X, but I am already at ZERO.
I don't need or want perfect Gvt. but repeal of immoral laws is easy, this wouldn't even take an amendment to the constitution AND the 21st amendment is a great example of this country repealing a MUCH TOUGHER prohibition.
Please never ask me to wise up to anything that would include the imprisonment of ICmagers for growing MJ as THEY see fit.
"Your laws" are not on the books, and I am not arresting anyone, I am the guy trying to end the arrests, now.
Now when you and Botanist get political control and end all Cannabis arrests your way. Which will never happen, lets be honest.
Really I suspect all you want to do is convert people to your brand of politics, me I do not care for any politics, I care about Cannabis legalization.
One thing is sure, as long as Cannabis is illegal 800,000+ arrests will continue, and your method of changing this has zero immediate chance of ending the arrests, which means millions of more arrests. Lets be honest, how many years before your politics will offer relief to the 800,000+ arrests a year? Can you lay out an outline for us?
My method, implementing the Tax and Regulate bill has a good chance to end arrests if implemented, and then nation wide, lets start the ball rolling....
This is not about politics, no matter what you think, it is about stopping the arrests, over 800,000 a year. People with their heads buried in politics can't see what is really important, they only see politics.
Last edited:
Unless the anarcho-capitalistic society gives out food stamps and welfare I doubt it has a chance to be voted into power. Governments gain power by making the people dependent on them, who will be dependent on an anarcho-capitalistic society?
If few then no one will vote for it, be honest, or do you have a much higher opinion then me about our voters?
And again this is politics, not Cannabis legalization.
-SamS
Put it in two catagories #1 legal #2 Not legal
Put it in two catagories #1 legal #2 Not legal
#1 legal the Gov. will be all over this and ppl will get their life back One oz. will be taxed $50.00 I think they said ffs lol lol. yup $50.00 lol.. and that is just the beginning. But no more locking ppl up. and yes they will be regulating it right up our butts lol. Just like tobacco ?? lets hope not they put 2000 chemicals in that.. In those regulations it will cost us more.. and ppl will be able to have small grows I'm assuming. Not sure what will happen to the ppl they have locked up now? They should let them out.
#2 Not legal yeah I'm having a hard time coming up with anything good here LOL LOL..Gov stays out of our business as they are slimmy assholes LOL LOL..There is no doubt in my mind that I don't trust the Gov. after all they have done in the past I would be a fool to trust them now lol seriously lol. so I don't ever, yet I don't see this going any other way but legal can't keep locking ppl up for medicine and recreation!! peace out Headband707
Put it in two catagories #1 legal #2 Not legal
#1 legal the Gov. will be all over this and ppl will get their life back One oz. will be taxed $50.00 I think they said ffs lol lol. yup $50.00 lol.. and that is just the beginning. But no more locking ppl up. and yes they will be regulating it right up our butts lol. Just like tobacco ?? lets hope not they put 2000 chemicals in that.. In those regulations it will cost us more.. and ppl will be able to have small grows I'm assuming. Not sure what will happen to the ppl they have locked up now? They should let them out.
#2 Not legal yeah I'm having a hard time coming up with anything good here LOL LOL..Gov stays out of our business as they are slimmy assholes LOL LOL..There is no doubt in my mind that I don't trust the Gov. after all they have done in the past I would be a fool to trust them now lol seriously lol. so I don't ever, yet I don't see this going any other way but legal can't keep locking ppl up for medicine and recreation!! peace out Headband707
Botanist
Member
This is getting a little of topic and thats my fault. Sorry, but the original topic has some deep roots.
True I do not think the voters will ever vote to kill the government handouts. The government hand outs will kill them self, good or bad that is what will happen.
What happens when an artificial road block (regulation or tax) is put in place, for what ever reason, it always causes problems some where else in the market. When this unintended consequence becomes to big, government then puts up more artificial road blocks to stop that. Before you know it every sector of the market is taxed, regulated or subsidized. The people who implemented every intervention may have had wonderful intentions or bad ones, but now one ever in the history of man has been able to control even the smallest market. every regulation makes production and trade that much less efficient. Making survival of man on earth just a little bit harder.
then we see the country start to eat its stock seed. eventually the government collapses much like a virus dies after it has killed its host (the market) .
I feel that when this happens the people will no longer fall for the same old lie, that the free market is responsible for the unintended results of misguided central planners.
You see when the government begins to die you will see food stamps that wont buy anything. because government can legislate a billion food stamps into existence but not a single loaf of bread they intended the stamps to buy or even the paper they intend to print them on.
the day will come that their is little wealth for the government to consume and thus destroy. People will have been taxed and regulated out of the ability to produce what they need to survive. People, despite what government wants, simply will not work for the benefit of others. Why would a farmer produce only to see his production consumed by everyone but himself?
This is why i seem so hostel against the smallest amount of marijuana regulation. No matter who it is intended to benefit, or how small and seemingly "reasonable" if seems to be. In reality all it can be is just one more small peace of that chain link fence they have been building around us for the last 100 years.
I am wondering Botanist, do you buy government regulated beer or wine or spirits? Why? Aren't you supporting what you don't believe in? What about a drivers license? What about taking a plane ride in a government regulated industry? Same with automobiles, gasoline, medicine, and most everything else in modern society. Unless you avoid them all you are supporting the very things and regulations you oppose.
Quit thinking so much about politics, and just legalize Cannabis, 800,000+ people a year will thank you. Sure regulations suck, but 800,000 people a year is much more important, can't you agree? Maybe if you or a loved one, were one of the 800,000 you would.
-SamS
Quit thinking so much about politics, and just legalize Cannabis, 800,000+ people a year will thank you. Sure regulations suck, but 800,000 people a year is much more important, can't you agree? Maybe if you or a loved one, were one of the 800,000 you would.
-SamS
