Why do people get irritated when you ask what strain they're selling
- Thread starter hempknowsis
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yea all i see in this colorado med scene is crap crap and more crap... strain,variety or what ever you call it
I think it's a great idea who time has come .. it's about time someone steped up to the plate I didn't think it would be on a board lol . I know the reaseachers are doing this and why wouldn't they .. Aww the more you know peace out Headband707
Some of those are bigger than my 60 year old boxwoods. Thanks for the stunning pics, Tom.
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Good morning.
Gypsy,
You gave it some thought and thats all you could manage to come up with? i see. I gave you some good ideas. Did you think about those?...maybe you dont sleep too well...?
If you arent willing to make any changes toward improving genetic erosion on your end, then there is no point in me(or anyone) having a conservation forum on a site you own, where YOU are the apex of the erosion. That would be RICH.
In 'my' forum, you will STILL be the bad guy for facilitating genetic erosion in the name of greed. And I would certainly mention you, often for that. You dont think your forum would 'buy me out' and 'shut me up', do you?
We have already done the breeder labs/forums and all of that. You have one on here already that has not stopped you from delivering junk mail.
The offer is nothing more than a diversion to try and draw the attention away from yourself and put it onto me. A little forum has no leverage against your LURE of easy seed money. Your Seed Processing Machine is where the MAJOR problem lies, and must be addressed from your end, at the distribution of all this hack shit.
If I accept your offer, what are you going to do for cannabis, Gyp?
Gypsy,
You gave it some thought and thats all you could manage to come up with? i see. I gave you some good ideas. Did you think about those?...maybe you dont sleep too well...?
If you arent willing to make any changes toward improving genetic erosion on your end, then there is no point in me(or anyone) having a conservation forum on a site you own, where YOU are the apex of the erosion. That would be RICH.
In 'my' forum, you will STILL be the bad guy for facilitating genetic erosion in the name of greed. And I would certainly mention you, often for that. You dont think your forum would 'buy me out' and 'shut me up', do you?
We have already done the breeder labs/forums and all of that. You have one on here already that has not stopped you from delivering junk mail.
The offer is nothing more than a diversion to try and draw the attention away from yourself and put it onto me. A little forum has no leverage against your LURE of easy seed money. Your Seed Processing Machine is where the MAJOR problem lies, and must be addressed from your end, at the distribution of all this hack shit.
If I accept your offer, what are you going to do for cannabis, Gyp?
Well I would think that the question would be, "What are you going to do for cannabis that couldn't be acheived by anyone else to date?"
Gypsy has placed the offer on the table for you to show all of these wonderful techniques that will prevent people from erroding the genepool... and pretty graciously at that.
I wouldn't even offer it if I was him, if not just because you point fingers and call him the bad guy, then because you point fingers at everybody that isn't you.
But as it turns out he did it anyway. I for one am just dying to see what you put on the table.
I am fifty-one years old, I grew up in a family that was enmeshed in the 1960's culture and drug distribution community. Besides hearing names like 'columbo' or 'the paw', I lived according to:
"it's green, it gets you high".
I only recently discovered the plethora of strains and attractive names available.
I still view this plant, as a plant we dry out and consume, rather than the latest fruity-tootie flavor of the month. I have, through this forum and others, come to understand the differences of strains that originate in various locations around the globe. Obviously they too, have names yet, I like to refer to them according to the continent, longitude/latitude they originate from.
Just imagine, asking the same folks you are speaking about,
'what latitude do these buds come from?' ;>}
You may want to forget about names and just ask your friend if they know the percentage of Indica/Sativa you can expect in the buds.
I bet, you'll receive the same response and shitty grin
http://www.icmag.com/modules/Journal/viewjournal.php?journaluserid=3749
Ethiopian Highland
Genotype: Sativa
Nepali ~ Landrace from Nepal
Genotype: Sativa
Mazar-I-Sharif...(Freebies!!) Thanks Gypsy !
Genotype: Afghanica
While I have little experience and should be considered a seedmaker, not yet a breeder, I have some seeds I made by crossing Mazar x Nepali
All three strains, I obtained because of the efforts of Gypsy and his associates.
They may not be as diverse as others around the world or on this forum but, I'm just beginning to grow, learn, collect as well as plan a breeding between strains in search of an improvement.
If such a cannabis conservation group forms here on IC.mag, please send me an invitation.
One step I have thought this community should support is preserving the range of landrace strains by submitting seeds to the Millennium Seed Bank Project
Perhaps through the inter-connections in this global community, IC.mag members could organize an effort towards this goal ?
Richard
VanXant, while reading this entire comment, I was nodding in agreement.
You expressed many noble notions and exhibited passion.
I was impressed with your thoughts, until I came upon the diatribe at the end of your comment.
After reading those vicious, hate-filled words, I would not cooperate with such a person, regardless of how noble the cause.
I do not know Gypsy Nirvana, only through this forum and Seedbay.
It is through the efforts of Gypsy, I can present this journal of my efforts.
http://www.icmag.com/modules/Journal/viewjournal.php?journaluserid=3749
Do you have a journal I could browse ?
The idea remains a good one although the execution of it maybe another story lol. Can't let a person with a chip on their shoulder change that as he has brought up a good point and he need some good bud obviously lol peace out Headband707
The End Is Near
Member
The fuck is this shit? I came to talk smack about the douchey kids I used to buy from and instead see accusations of fucking up cannabis's gene pool? Like all the landraces suddenly went extinct or that all these breeders with proven products are supposed to change their methods due to a hypothesis. Or suggesting that the profit margin for seeds be cut 90%? Don't get me wrong, I'd love to be able to get seeds at that price, but we all know that isn't happening, at least not in the extent you're demanding.
But back on topic, it's hilarious to see idiots try and act cool by calling mexibrick hydro, G13, etc. It's only a matter of time until they call their brick pineapple express.
But back on topic, it's hilarious to see idiots try and act cool by calling mexibrick hydro, G13, etc. It's only a matter of time until they call their brick pineapple express.
Hi again VanXant,
Re: OP's only. You can't be suggesting removing from the table offering SC hybrids (etc) in this outcrossing species. Perhaps you are saying that F1's should only be made by way of bulk crossing, instead of locating and using only proven superior genotypes from within the parental populations? No selfing, no ExE, no backrossing etc, anywhere along the way, or? I'm having a hard time (even though well rested) following the totality of this proposed paradigm shift here - Except that you are pretty closely describing what I have been doing for decades and thankfully have the pure lines to show for it.
So now, to be clear, in addition to what I do I'd like to do some much more intensive breeding in the creation of new hybrids. This is damaging to the gene pool in your opinion? Thanks. -Tom
ps: I also really did want to offer breeder packs of 100, and that would certainly warrant a price break. But then businesses other than my distributors would likely buy them and repackage them into tens then sell at maybe even a better price than my distributors so that didn't seem to be a doable option. There are already businesses out there breaking into 10packs and selling single seeds etc, lol.
Re: OP's only. You can't be suggesting removing from the table offering SC hybrids (etc) in this outcrossing species. Perhaps you are saying that F1's should only be made by way of bulk crossing, instead of locating and using only proven superior genotypes from within the parental populations? No selfing, no ExE, no backrossing etc, anywhere along the way, or? I'm having a hard time (even though well rested) following the totality of this proposed paradigm shift here - Except that you are pretty closely describing what I have been doing for decades and thankfully have the pure lines to show for it.
So now, to be clear, in addition to what I do I'd like to do some much more intensive breeding in the creation of new hybrids. This is damaging to the gene pool in your opinion? Thanks. -Tom
ps: I also really did want to offer breeder packs of 100, and that would certainly warrant a price break. But then businesses other than my distributors would likely buy them and repackage them into tens then sell at maybe even a better price than my distributors so that didn't seem to be a doable option. There are already businesses out there breaking into 10packs and selling single seeds etc, lol.
I think We should make a system on I.C. mag for breeders, growers, and smokers like the Sommelier system based around wine. They have level 1, 2, 3, and then masters. anyone can be a lvl one or 2 if they can pass a pretty hard test. To be any levels higher you must be invited by the masters. People like GN, Tom Hill, and DJ short would be masters. The list of masters could go on. Anyways check this out on wiki. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sommelier
now to the other part of the discussion.
I would agree with the fact that there is many new breeders out there that just make a cross from two plants, and call it a strain, and then steal the original name thus diluting the original good genetics. Then they sell them, They are a problem.
Then you have good guys like Benji who make a few crosses from proven good cuts as starting points for a new strain. They are honest about it being a cross, and dont sell them. They give credit to the original breeder. They give out beans as gifts too. These are good folks.
then you have people who pretend to be true breeders, but really just rush out strains to win some contest like the cannabis cup. They are a problem.
Then you have true Master Breeders like Tom Hill, DJ short, Bog.... etc. These guys are rare. they are the only type of people around making truely good stable strains, based on the best phenos from thousands of plants.
now to the other part of the discussion.
I would agree with the fact that there is many new breeders out there that just make a cross from two plants, and call it a strain, and then steal the original name thus diluting the original good genetics. Then they sell them, They are a problem.
Then you have good guys like Benji who make a few crosses from proven good cuts as starting points for a new strain. They are honest about it being a cross, and dont sell them. They give credit to the original breeder. They give out beans as gifts too. These are good folks.
then you have people who pretend to be true breeders, but really just rush out strains to win some contest like the cannabis cup. They are a problem.
Then you have true Master Breeders like Tom Hill, DJ short, Bog.... etc. These guys are rare. they are the only type of people around making truely good stable strains, based on the best phenos from thousands of plants.
C
Cookie monster
While i agree with a lot of what you say i'm left with one question.
What is the point in debating the issue any further?
Gypsy has offered you your own slot on this site why not take advantage of his offer.
Help to educate people, who cares if it seems a tad hypocritical.
To me somebody who has the knowledge or ability to change or at least try to change something they care about and turns down an opportunity to make a difference must accept that they are part of the problem.
Not only should there be top breeders but there should also be medusers that have no agenda or seeds involved so ppl don't think that it's about the breeders genetics. It should also be about science and not just the taste of the ppl involved.To get a true reading of the genetic pool it should be more like 1000 seeds finding one with the right pheno. Could get very complicated if you started recording lol. Looking for the super seed could be fun be more over could be helpful to many.peace out Headband707
Isn't even that selection, subjective to the individuals opinion ?
If I had 3000 seeds from one strain, gave 3 people 1000 seeds each.
I do not believe these 3 people would select the same pheno traits.
To me it doesn't look like VanXant actually lives in the real world where bills have to be paid and funds have to be made to be able to pay those bills........for instance VanXant has the pleasure of posting upon this site to directly insinuate that I am commiting some sort of crime towards the cannabis gene-pool where-as the site itself is here being fueled by cannabis itself from the kind donations of hundreds of members that have done and continue to contribute to the server fund with the seeds that they make.....
For 5 years I have funded this site from my own pocket to be able to have here on the internet a place where all things cannabis can be discussed openly by anyone with an internet connection from most all countries on the planet........where those that want to learn to grow can do so from the information available on ICM and help from the members that come here to create today a very popular place for anyone wishing to grow in any style they might wish to.........
VanXant accuses me of being 'greedy'......'the head of a serpent'.........'a purveyor of hack jobs'.......e.t.c......e.t.c. ad nauseum.....and he says that he is all for cannabis conservation.......He is saying that my 'Seed processing machine' is where the problem lies, and yet I don't have any machine that processes seeds........what we do have here are many members/breeders/growers and seedmakers that might make seeds that in turn help fuel the site........
.....and when VanXant is given the opportunity to have his own forum on the site to help encourage those that make seeds to learn how to create them thru better breeding practices...(btw I don't currently make seeds myself, I collect them from all over the world).....VanXant turns down this offer and continues to insult/criticize me..........when he says he is all for cannabis conservation.......but couldn't be bothered to help conserve cannabis by educating the growers and breeders on this site that actually do make seeds.......
So I have made an effort at preventing genetic erosion and so helping cannabis conservation at my end by offering VanXant a position as a Moderator in his own forum on ICM......and he has flatly turned me down....
So basically VanXant is a person that talks the talk.......but does not walk the walk......
After all you are not going to change anything VanXant without educating those that make these seeds that you so brazenly call 'Hack Jobs'.......I have tried to give you a place where you can voice your opinions VanXant........a place where you could share what knowledge you have and perhaps make a difference by teaching those that make seeds to do so in a way that won't 'pee in the genepool'.........but quite obviously all you are interested in doing is calling those seedmakers and myself various names.....
VanXant, you wouldn't necessarily have to grow to moderate the forum. All you'd have to do is lend your wisdom and on occasion, stroke your ego. Wouldn't be any different than your posts in this thread albeit on a somewhat larger scale.
I've already learned that what I'm growing (most likely) isn't what I'm calling it. I've also learned some of your assertions have been challenged. I continue to read in efforts to learn more of what you speak. It would be nice to get your perspective in your own posts along with the other threads you join.
I've already learned that what I'm growing (most likely) isn't what I'm calling it. I've also learned some of your assertions have been challenged. I continue to read in efforts to learn more of what you speak. It would be nice to get your perspective in your own posts along with the other threads you join.
Tom,
You have it right.
Im talking about open pollination with low to NO selection. The purpose of the change is to facilitate genetic diversity and nothing more. Culling clearly undesirable/unfit individuals would be part of it.
This is the important paradigm shift over typical modern commercial seed breedings.... because the entire focus is on the diversity being maintained, not reduced.
The diversity from OP populations will serve to increase the opportunities for unique genotypes to arise for growers. In contrast, poor selections from small populations LIMIT genetic options for growers and breeders because of the exclusionary breeding methods.
Growers will "request" an OPed seedlot over what they are getting now, once they are up to speed on the benefits of a diverse seedlot. Growers dont have genetically stable seeds now, and they do not seem to notice or care. Gypsy will still fuel his site and his lifestyle, and seedmakers will adapt, or get out of the seed racket. Cannabis will be more able to adapt and to be improved in the future. Thats a win'win'win or GTFO situation.
By "SC" do you mean single crosses? If so, then sure..., after complying with a standard set forth, by Gypsy.
cookie monster:"What is the point in debating the issue any further?
Gypsy has offered you your own slot on this site why not take advantage of his offer.
Help to educate people, who cares if it seems a tad hypocritical."
>>>> Probably no point in arguing with Gypsy about it any more, I agree. I hope he is willing to make some changes.
Uhh,... I never wanted a forum. That was Gypsy's idea.
Gypsy,
Its not that I couldnt be "bothered" with genetic conservation, come ON. I bet youd never even heard the words put together until I started talking about it years ago...
Its because the problem is something you have control over and are apparently not willing to explore any further. ????
I gave you some good ideas, man. You just pissed on em..haha...yep, like it was a cannabis gene pool.
How about it Gypsy? No more of these hack jobs for profit, man...its almost 2010...50 years of shit seedmaking now....how much more do you think cannabis should take of this shit?
Please consider it.
Do you know that in MY NEW FORUM, the first thread will be a plea to Gypsy Nirvana to stop the hacking? ..in which we continue this discussion until you probably close it or make it invisible or some shit like that....lol
You have it right.
Im talking about open pollination with low to NO selection. The purpose of the change is to facilitate genetic diversity and nothing more. Culling clearly undesirable/unfit individuals would be part of it.
This is the important paradigm shift over typical modern commercial seed breedings.... because the entire focus is on the diversity being maintained, not reduced.
The diversity from OP populations will serve to increase the opportunities for unique genotypes to arise for growers. In contrast, poor selections from small populations LIMIT genetic options for growers and breeders because of the exclusionary breeding methods.
Growers will "request" an OPed seedlot over what they are getting now, once they are up to speed on the benefits of a diverse seedlot. Growers dont have genetically stable seeds now, and they do not seem to notice or care. Gypsy will still fuel his site and his lifestyle, and seedmakers will adapt, or get out of the seed racket. Cannabis will be more able to adapt and to be improved in the future. Thats a win'win'win or GTFO situation.
By "SC" do you mean single crosses? If so, then sure..., after complying with a standard set forth, by Gypsy.
cookie monster:"What is the point in debating the issue any further?
Gypsy has offered you your own slot on this site why not take advantage of his offer.
Help to educate people, who cares if it seems a tad hypocritical."
>>>> Probably no point in arguing with Gypsy about it any more, I agree. I hope he is willing to make some changes.
Uhh,... I never wanted a forum. That was Gypsy's idea.
Gypsy,
Its not that I couldnt be "bothered" with genetic conservation, come ON. I bet youd never even heard the words put together until I started talking about it years ago...
Its because the problem is something you have control over and are apparently not willing to explore any further. ????
I gave you some good ideas, man. You just pissed on em..haha...yep, like it was a cannabis gene pool.
How about it Gypsy? No more of these hack jobs for profit, man...its almost 2010...50 years of shit seedmaking now....how much more do you think cannabis should take of this shit?
Please consider it.
Do you know that in MY NEW FORUM, the first thread will be a plea to Gypsy Nirvana to stop the hacking? ..in which we continue this discussion until you probably close it or make it invisible or some shit like that....lol
Tom,
Gypsy will still fuel his site and his lifestyle, and seedmakers will adapt, or get out of the seed racket. Cannabis will be more able to adapt and to be improved in the future. Thats a win'win'win or GTFO situation.
By "SC" do you mean single crosses? If so, then sure..., after complying with a standard set forth, by Gypsy.
cookie monster:"What is the point in debating the issue any further?
Gypsy has offered you your own slot on this site why not take advantage of his offer.
Help to educate people, who cares if it seems a tad hypocritical."
>>>> Probably no point in arguing with Gypsy about it any more, I agree. I hope he is willing to make some changes.
Uhh,... I never wanted a forum. That was Gypsy's idea.
Gypsy,
Its not that I couldnt be "bothered" with genetic conservation, come ON. I bet youd never even heard the words put together until I started talking about it years ago...
Its because the problem is something you have control over and are apparently not willing to explore any further. ????
I gave you some good ideas, man. You just pissed on em..haha...yep, like it was a cannabis gene pool.
How about it Gypsy? No more of these hack jobs for profit, man...its almost 2010...50 years of shit seedmaking now....how much more do you think cannabis should take of this shit?
Please consider it.
Do you know that in MY NEW FORUM, the first thread will be a plea to Gypsy Nirvana to stop the hacking? ..in which we continue this discussion until you probably close it or make it invisible or some shit like that....lol
I cannot see where I am doing any of this 'Hacking' that you keep spouting about and accusing me of VanXant......your problem seems to be with the growers, seedmakers and breeders that I have given YOU the opportunity to educate on this site.......Maybe your first post on the forum I have offered you should be directed at these growers, seedmakers and Breeders that you consider are making 'Hack Job's'........and then use what knowledge you have on the matter to convince them to grow the next generations of cannabis in such a way that pleases you in your quest to conserve cannabis...
So you see I am willing to make some changes in regards to cannabis conservation other than what I already do in gathering and storing landrace varieties/strains (whatever you deem to call them).....by offering you the opportunity yourself VanXant to have a forum here to promote better breeding practices........so the ball is firmly in your court...
Please consider it......
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