i let them flower for about 75-80 days. i didn't check trichomes, i just played it by eye and smell. i think i pulled them in the perfect window. they have not been curing as long as the sage n sour and already i think i am favoring the sage over the sage n sour pheno i have. the smell is awesome with my sage, the bag appeal is insane too. smells so dank and it smokes great with a minimal cure. i will be looking for more phenos of sage n sour that are more sour d dominant though.