Sealed Room, Gavitas Deficiencies

[_Underscore_]

"400ppm co2 isn't enough. So why do outdoors plants that recieve 400 ppm grow 10 feet tall and put down 10+ # per plant?"

You aren't growing outside. Outdoor plants usually have many more months of veg time allowing them to get much bigger which translates to a much larger yield than indoor plants.
Higher indoor CO2 levels allow for larger harvest and quicker growth. Also, indoor co2 levels at 400 ppm won't remand consistent. It gets used up quickly, in a room with as many plants as you have, especially in a sealed room. When it's used up plants quit growing properly.
CO2 levels that are low, especially with all the light you have in that room, could be your problem. The higher the light levels the more you need in a sealed room. Unless you constantly recirculate and replenish the room.
If the scientist who study the effects of co2 on indoor crops who's research show higher co2 levels directly correlate to higher yields why would I waste my time and money supplying it at lower levels for no benefit?
I understand what you're saying but do some research on what I just said. A quick google search will give you much more detail than I care to type here.

Now, I have heard of growers having problems/effects on their plants when switching to gavitas. Others have great results. But it sounds like you have plenty of space between your lights and canopy so that's likely not your problem.
Feed rates and ph seem on point, but I rarely feed floranova above 1.4 ec
Well water at 8.0ph may be a problem. A lot of crap in hard water. I have the same type ph from my well and only use ro water because of it. But you're having the same problems using both well and ro so I doubt that's it.
Offgassing could be your main concern but I don't think thats the problem either.
Your problems get better when you turn lights below 600w watts but gets worst when you turn back up. Your nutes and ph are on point, your temps are on point, everything else is on point except for your co2. Look into it.

This is the thing. I have never grown with c02. I have had a sensor in my rooms back in the day when my room was vented and it was atmospheric. 300-400 ppm. I know people running gavitas that are not in a sealed room. So they have the gavitas on at 1000w with atmospheric c02 being 300-400 ppm. Even when I had the c02 at 1000ppm the plants still looked like shit. I now have the the room vented and when i look at the sensor it says 235.... So it might be slightly off calibration but even if that was the case I should of seen a difference when I turned up/down the c02. I have completely disconnected my tank from my controller and im letting my intake handle it. Trust me c02 was my first guess since I never used it before, but regardless if I ran it at 400 or 1100 the plants looked no different.

 

[resinryder]

You hand watering or pumping? Can't remember how you're doing it
Edit to add--Saw where you are hand watering it. Was wondering if tubing could be off gassing but that's not the issue.
The only other thing I can see if ph. I have run strains in the past that get funky with anything over a ph of 5.6. Most of what I run does fine at 5.8 but there are exceptions. I had a Kush several years ago that was giving me hella fits. Dropped the ph from 5.8 to 5.6 and straightened her right on out? Maybe drop it down and see if it's a ph issue. Stranger things have happened. Also, as mentioned earlier, GSC do better at a lower ec.

 

[siftedunity]

how far into 12/12 are these plants? are you supplementing with co2 when the lights are off? and with ph id never drop it below 5.7 at the very minimum. but you know your ph's your not a newb im not sure why that would be good advice at all.

 

[_Underscore_]

how far into 12/12 are these plants? are you supplementing with co2 when the lights are off? and with ph id never drop it below 5.7 at the very minimum. but you know your ph's your not a newb im not sure why that would be good advice at all.

I thought it was the hose too one time after reading a post, but im using a standard garden hose from home depot. I mean maybe. As far as runoff I checked to day. Put in 1.2EC 6.0ph and what came out was 1.3EC 5.9PH. I honestly wish it was my PH because I know how to fix that relatively easy.

 

[_Underscore_]

how far into 12/12 are these plants? are you supplementing with co2 when the lights are off? and with ph id never drop it below 5.7 at the very minimum. but you know your ph's your not a newb im not sure why that would be good advice at all.

Nah ive been scared shitless to flip them with this issue. Never flipped a room looking this bad. Goal is to get them healthy then flip, even if its only at 600watt. I only fed 5.5 once or twice because someone told me it was a good idea, but when I didnt see an immediate change i switched back to my regular scheduled 5.8-6.0. Usually when you have a c02 controller with a tank the sensor will tell the regulator to turn off when lights are off so it wont keep dumping c02 during sleep time. I have alos went in there in night time to double check its not dumping and it wasnt.

 

[_Underscore_]

I didnt expect these many comments guys. Thanks for everyone offering advice.

 

[noyd666]

we gotta win.

 

[siftedunity]

Nah ive been scared shitless to flip them with this issue. Never flipped a room looking this bad. Goal is to get them healthy then flip, even if its only at 600watt. I only fed 5.5 once or twice because someone told me it was a good idea, but when I didnt see an immediate change i switched back to my regular scheduled 5.8-6.0. Usually when you have a c02 controller with a tank the sensor will tell the regulator to turn off when lights are off so it wont keep dumping c02 during sleep time. I have alos went in there in night time to double check its not dumping and it wasnt.

well im gonna throw these ideas around. ive tried putting plants which were perfectly healthy in veg under t5s under full power hps for veg and they took a shit big time. I think maybe if you veg under t5 first then id put them under a hps with it on low and high away from them. but then again it appears you know your shit so im guessing its not that.


ive actually had your exact same issue. same color stems and leaves, looked like they were over watered or deficient while at the same time, had pearly white roots. same water as vegging plants which were fine. it didn't make sense. I tried everything then gave up. culled the lot. bought new nute bottles, coco, new pots, everything because I was sure it was some kind of contamination somewhere. next run there was no issue at all. id serious consider off gassing of something or contamination of some kind. are you using canna coco by any chance. I swear that shit comes in bad batches sometimes.
im also really wary of most plastics or building materials. if I build a room I run extraction fans and let the room air for a long time before use. like a week or so or more. or make sure all the materials are not toxic to animals or plants.
trust your instincts. you know how to grow. so it must be something else. stick with what you KNOW works.
sorry I cant offer better advice!


edit.. maybe its worth venting the extra co2 out before lights off so they are not sitting in co2 whilst needing o2. im not sure if that would have caused this.

 

[siftedunity]

we gotta win.

yah exactly. its even bugging me that I cant figure it out.

 

[maimunji]

Check carefully for root aphids on this plants with yellow leaves.

 

[Fourtay]

Hi, I'm sorry if I missed the answer in the thread, but are you in veg and have you bloomed in this room before?

 

[Fourtay]

Nah ive been scared shitless to flip them with this issue. Never flipped a room looking this bad. Goal is to get them healthy then flip, even if its only at 600watt. I only fed 5.5 once or twice because someone told me it was a good idea, but when I didnt see an immediate change i switched back to my regular scheduled 5.8-6.0. Usually when you have a c02 controller with a tank the sensor will tell the regulator to turn off when lights are off so it wont keep dumping c02 during sleep time. I have alos went in there in night time to double check its not dumping and it wasnt.

I just read this. So you're still in veg. 18/6? Imma put all my money on your DLI being too high, possibly with a combination of VPD problems.

 

[_Underscore_]

I just read this. So you're still in veg. 18/6? Imma put all my money on your DLI being too high, possibly with a combination of VPD problems.

Next time Im in there I will take a picture, but I have the VPD chart taped up in each one of my rooms so I dont have to look it up on my phone anymore. My VPD is not perfect because according to VPD it wants you to run 70% humidity for anything over 79F. I stay in the 40%-60% which honestly shouldnt cause this bad of an issue. I see people with pictures of there shitty grow and a thermostat that says 12% and their plant looks better than mine. I have the roome being vented so fast right now im literally changing the air every min. Im gonna buy some timers tomorrow to control them.

 

[Weed Killer]

I got my first set of gavita's a few years back, with the old HPS I fed at 1.2, 1.1 nutes and .1 water. I started getting a mag defency that looked similar
to yours. I bumped the feed to 1.5, 1.4 nutes and .1 water. worked for me

 

[maimunji]

I really can't see mag def in pics and video only drooping plants and yellowish leaves. Maybe purple stems gives this conclusion but I really think you have huge root aphids infection.

 

[Fourtay]

Next time Im in there I will take a picture, but I have the VPD chart taped up in each one of my rooms so I dont have to look it up on my phone anymore. My VPD is not perfect because according to VPD it wants you to run 70% humidity for anything over 79F. I stay in the 40%-60% which honestly shouldnt cause this bad of an issue. I see people with pictures of there shitty grow and a thermostat that says 12% and their plant looks better than mine. I have the roome being vented so fast right now im literally changing the air every min. Im gonna buy some timers tomorrow to control them.

For sure, I have also ran with a wide range of humidity. I was suggesting reducing your vpd to aid in recovery. Have you noticed improvement from reducing your lights down to 600? Too much light for your light schedule was my first guess.

 

[siftedunity]

yeah could defiantly be light stress or/and lack of food for the high intensity of the gravitas and co2 combined.

 

[_Underscore_]

I got my first set of gavita's a few years back, with the old HPS I fed at 1.2, 1.1 nutes and .1 water. I started getting a mag defency that looked similar
to yours. I bumped the feed to 1.5, 1.4 nutes and .1 water. worked for me

Yeah I used to feed 1.5 under HPS and they would be maaaddd green. I have fed a couple times at 1.5 but then I feel like my issue was salt buildup related so Ive been trying with the less food. Maybe I will try to feed hotter .

 

[_Underscore_]

I really can't see mag def in pics and video only drooping plants and yellowish leaves. Maybe purple stems gives this conclusion but I really think you have huge root aphids infection.

I have checked so many times for aphids and Im about to treat the root zone for them even tho I dont see them, but thats what I kept thinking. I pulled my roots on some plants to check them, but they dont look like they are under attack.

 

[_Underscore_]

OK so here is an update. Installed an intake and exhuast and have been running the room 24/7 air cooled. I need to get timers and maybe drop it down to 15 mins ever hour or something. The plants have been bouncing back. I dont have any pictures of today, but its been about 48 hours and after about 24 hours they started looking better.

Here is a bad pic of how I did the intake.

Here is another bad pic, but kinda how the plants are looking now.

Ive been wondering if my coco and nutes are the issue, but my ourdoor in the same coco and nutes seem to be fine.

The indoor still has purple stems , but its only been 48 and they are for sure happier. So I have all lights up at 600w and my plan is to flip tonight and start turning them up 1%-2% every day. I have been foliaring cal-mag too and it seems to be helping. Ill prolly post some new pics tomorrow for DAY 1!!!!!!!!!