Origins of the Virus

[Amynamous]

exactly, google the home land security list of what makes a domestic terrorist and realize it means everyone is a potential target. there is a million every day activities that get you on the list ffs. omg i can't believe it i really can't. as if the US police don't have enough power already? you complain they are killing people so you want to make them even more powerful, Jeezus Christ al mighty!

Just curious why are you railing against the US government when it’s YOUR government that appears to be more restrictive in its day to day covid restrictions than what I am experiencing locally here in my little sane and peaceful corner of the US.

As for the US H.S. labeling White Nationalist groups as domestic terrorists several years ago, they got that shit 100% correct. People in the US are free to have different opinions and they are free to protest in a peaceful manner. But NO ONE is free to conspire and organize a violent insurrection against the lawful transfer of power that occurs after an election.

 

[mowood3479]

Just curious why are you railing against the US government when it’s YOUR government that appears to be more restrictive in its day to day covid restrictions than what I am experiencing locally here in my little sane and peaceful corner of the US.

As for the US H.S. labeling White Nationalist groups as domestic terrorists several years ago, they got that shit 100% correct. People in the US are free to have different opinions and they are free to protest in a peaceful manner. But NO ONE is free to conspire and organize a violent insurrection against the lawful transfer of power that occurs after an election.

So what’s wrong with prosecuting these criminals with laws already on the books? What is the need to grant law enforcment powers to hunt and arrest us citizens sans trial or charges?
Do you not see a downside to unaccountable police powers?

edit: also what fairy tale world do u live in where several hundred unarmed people storming a building somehow magically prevents a transfer of power?
The politicians weren’t doing a magic spell, their little meeting was delayed several hours, thats about the extent of the disruption to the govt.
specious reasoning to say that the capitol riot in anyway effected the transfer of power (or could have)

 

[gaiusmarius]

Just curious why are you railing against the US government when it’s YOUR government that appears to be more restrictive in its day to day covid restrictions than what I am experiencing locally here in my little sane and peaceful corner of the US.

As for the US H.S. labeling White Nationalist groups as domestic terrorists several years ago, they got that shit 100% correct. People in the US are free to have different opinions and they are free to protest in a peaceful manner. But NO ONE is free to conspire and organize a violent insurrection against the lawful transfer of power that occurs after an election.

thats rich that is, so you are pro covid restrictions for everyone else, but you yourself are not effected? you still take planes? i see, very interesting.

we still can't get an anonymous sim card after you yanks forced us to abolish them after 911. as i said, our idiot politicians tend to copy your worst examples.

btw you are mixing covid and the war on terror and don't even realize it. but you probably think its a good thing to start a new war on your fellow citizens, so there is no point arguing.

 

[Gry]

A connection between the virus and the war on terror.
We do live in interesting times.

 

[Veggia farmer]

Loved your perspective, how did the heroin dealers do it ? First ounce is free, the second one, well, lets just say nothing stays the same for long. Expect big pharma will put them to shame.
Wonder how much they will change for the booster shots next year.

I dont have any shots yet, and dont plan on it either. So the booster is price is not my concern. Im more concerned about this vaxpass to be honest. As you compare with the heroin dealer the first ounce is free. Did you pay for you shot? If you don pay for it, well, then your the product the famoues qoute says, hope Im wrong. But what about the ones that says pass? Is it only freedom for the ones that shoots up or not? The ones that "gambles" do they have the right to walk freely when we go back to "normal"?

Motorhead fan here hehe:

You know I'm born to lose, and gambling's for fools
But that's the way I like it baby, I don't wanna live forever
And don't forget the joker!

 

[gaiusmarius]

A connection between the virus and the war on terror.
We do live in interesting times.

well its current events and the conversation just drifted into the subject of the newly declared domestic war on terror.

speaking of which, did anyone else chance to notice that the war on terror actually increased terrorism around the world statistically? just like the war on drugs increased the black market supply of drugs. so there is that to look forward to.

im just shocked that th same people who complain about power tripping cops some how want to give them even more power and less accountability. its a power grab, traditional leo has plenty of weapons to go up against anyone. the system is already skewed against the defendant, i thought that was bad, but some want it to be even worse, aka military tribunals and detention without charge. water boarding and all that good stuff. just as long as it's only trump supporters, yes.

 

[gaiusmarius]

Was COVID-19 made inside a Chinese lab? | Under Investigation

and the msm have heard about the bat cave and how much logical sense that theory of origin makes.

 

[Amynamous]

well its current events and the conversation just drifted into the subject of the newly declared domestic war on terror.

speaking of which, did anyone else chance to notice that the war on terror actually increased terrorism around the world statistically? just like the war on drugs increased the black market supply of drugs. so there is that to look forward to.

im just shocked that th same people who complain about power tripping cops some how want to give them even more power and less accountability. its a power grab, traditional leo has plenty of weapons to go up against anyone. the system is already skewed against the defendant, i thought that was bad, but some want it to be even worse, aka military tribunals and detention without charge. water boarding and all that good stuff. just as long as it's only trump supporters, yes.

I haven’t heard or read anything locally about a newly declared domestic war on terror.
Are you referring to the feds rounding up the traitorous lot that violently attempted to overtake the US capital building on January 6th or are you referring to something else? Some days i find it challenging to keep up.

 

[Chi13]

i think people just want this to be over and they think the vax is the solution. they assume that once it's over, everything will go back to normal, so pain now will pay off in the long run. i on the other hand remember how things never went back to normal when it comes to privacy and travel after 911. what makes people so sure this time? better not let them go too far with abridging human rights imo.

Things will go back to normal. This is a response to a health crisis, nothing more. You are making this into an ideological argument about personal freedom. I'd argue that it is nothing of the sort. It is simply governments trying to protect their citizens.

Are you aware of restrictions that some countries had during the Spanish Flu, and how they did go back to normal once it was over? Things can and do go back to normal. Do you think this is the first pandemic? It has happened throughout history.

911 has zero to do with Coronavirus but if you are going to bring up that argument' look at what happened during the McCarthyism era in the US and other Western countries, and it's aftermath. I'd argue that what you are saying is happening now is nowhere near as bad as that. Political oppression goes both ways.
During the McCarthy era, hundreds of Americans were accused of being "communists" or "communist sympathizers"; they became the subject of aggressive investigations and questioning before government or private industry panels, committees, and agencies. The primary targets of such suspicions were government employees, those in the entertainment industry, academics, and labor-union activists. Suspicions were often given credence despite inconclusive or questionable evidence, and the level of threat posed by a person's real or supposed leftist associations or beliefs were sometimes exaggerated. Many people suffered loss of employment or destruction of their careers; some were imprisoned. Most of these punishments came about through trial verdicts that were later overturned,[SUP][8][/SUP] laws that were later declared unconstitutional,[SUP][9][/SUP] dismissals for reasons later declared illegal[SUP][10][/SUP] or actionable,[SUP][11][/SUP] or extra-legal procedures, such as informal blacklists, that would come into general disrepute, though by then many lives had been ruined.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarthyism

I think Brother Nature brought this up in another thread. Thanks for the reminder of this period of history.

 

[mowood3479]

Well I feel much better now chi13 trusts the governemnt to return all of the un democratic power they’ve siezed in the last year.

 

[mowood3479]

I haven’t heard or read anything locally about a newly declared domestic war on terror.
Are you referring to the feds rounding up the traitorous lot that violently attempted to overtake the US capital building on January 6th or are you referring to something else? Some days i find it challenging to keep up.

If u can’t keep up with the tyranny ur govt is enacting perhaps ur opinion is not so valid

 

[Microbeman]

If u can’t keep up with the tyranny ur govt is enacting perhaps ur opinion is not so valid

The Google algorithm sure has mo and Gaius dialed in.

 

[mowood3479]

The Google algorithm sure has mo and Gaius dialed in.

10/10
actually the truth is you have to kind of work to find news of us tyranny.
As prevalent as it is, it’s not well publicized.
I could make some assumptions as to why this is...lol

 

[exploziv]

Please keep this discussion civil.

 

[gaiusmarius]

The Google algorithm sure has mo and Gaius dialed in.

what does this even mean? what has google algo to do with the origin of the virus or any part of the discussion? why are you focusing on personalities? anything to say on the subject being discussed?

 

[gaiusmarius]

Things will go back to normal. This is a response to a health crisis, nothing more. You are making this into an ideological argument about personal freedom. I'd argue that it is nothing of the sort. It is simply governments trying to protect their citizens.

Are you aware of restrictions that some countries had during the Spanish Flu, and how they did go back to normal once it was over? Things can and do go back to normal. Do you think this is the first pandemic? It has happened throughout history.

911 has zero to do with Coronavirus but if you are going to bring up that argument' look at what happened during the McCarthyism era in the US and other Western countries, and it's aftermath. I'd argue that what you are saying is happening now is nowhere near as bad as that. Political oppression goes both ways.
During the McCarthy era, hundreds of Americans were accused of being "communists" or "communist sympathizers"; they became the subject of aggressive investigations and questioning before government or private industry panels, committees, and agencies. The primary targets of such suspicions were government employees, those in the entertainment industry, academics, and labor-union activists. Suspicions were often given credence despite inconclusive or questionable evidence, and the level of threat posed by a person's real or supposed leftist associations or beliefs were sometimes exaggerated. Many people suffered loss of employment or destruction of their careers; some were imprisoned. Most of these punishments came about through trial verdicts that were later overturned,[SUP][8][/SUP] laws that were later declared unconstitutional,[SUP][9][/SUP] dismissals for reasons later declared illegal[SUP][10][/SUP] or actionable,[SUP][11][/SUP] or extra-legal procedures, such as informal blacklists, that would come into general disrepute, though by then many lives had been ruined.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarthyism

I think Brother Nature brought this up in another thread. Thanks for the reminder of this period of history.

i will say this again, for all those that seem to forget everything else said and focus on only on ones latest post.

i really hope you are right about the governments of the world giving up all their new tools of surveillance and oppression,

but history tends to show us that its very rare. comparing this to Spanish flu is no reassurance either. that was 100 years ago when a few thousand men could have a successful revolution in a few weeks. the federal government of today is way more powerful and way less accountable to the citizens and has a thousand times more power, military and police then they did in those days. so no, that they retuned some rights to people 100 years ago doesn't reassure me that all this tracking and tracing of every step, will stop. our right to assemble freely, privately and in protest have all been made into privileges which the government can turn on and off as they see fit from now on, this can't be un done, the precedent is set.

for the record, the only reason the subject turned to the war on terror is because someone felt it was a good thing to declare a domestic war on terror.

of course law breakers, including potential rebels, terrorist and separatists need to be investigated and stopped by the government. but LEO actually have a frightening array of powerful tools at their disposal to fight crime etc already, there is no reason to declare a war. just like there was no reason to declare war on terror. war on drugs. etc.

do you really want to see news of blown up houses saying: hank tumbelweed was killed in a drone strike on his residence, sadly his wife and 3 kids were collateral damage, the neighbours for 1 km around, all have broken windows and explosion debry spread all over their yards, including parts of mr tumbelweed and his family. tumbelweed was radicalized when his sister was accidentally killed in a anti terror operation by the special forces hunting down the number 2 man in the old glory militia, bla blah blah and on it goes until you turn the whole population against you and make them in to terrorists, just like happened in many places where the US decided to air strike instead of arresting suspects.

weddings, funerals, school buses, each time you create hundreds more people who hate your guts. in war accidents will happen, its guaranteed. you can't unkill people. you can set them free after arrest if they are not guilty. big difference.

you guys have laws disallowing the use of those type of tools of terror on your own population, don't let them trick you into cancelling those protections that they guaranteed you when they made the exemptions for foreigners after 911.

 

[armedoldhippy]

talking to you is strange, you bring all the collectivist arguments to the fore front when arguing for covid restrictions etc, but you claim to believe in individual rights. and yes, when it comes to your pet weapons you will stand tall. but it seems to me accepting that the government can even temporarily take away your rights, means that those rights are no longer right, you have let them become privileges to be bestowed by government in the name of the collective good. so you should just cop to it, you are a collectivist, you are happy to be tracked and traced and let the government decide which human rights apply and when they will let you have them or not.

people wouldn't need the government to tell them what to do if this was a real plague, everyone would be doing it out of self preservation. when the government has to enforce that stuff you know its being exaggerated. as i said before, how the fuck can you talk about a global pandemic when the planets population hasn't decreased by even 1% since it started. this is a first in the history of plagues.

you people want to stop living so that you will not die! its insane. live your fucking life now, you only have 1 and there is no over time for the years you put your life on hold. you might fucking be dead tomorrow and you will have wasted your last year living in abject fear. fear to even touch things, fear to get close to another human. fear to go outside in the sun and air, lmao, great work.

you truly have an expansive view of what "rights" are, and little (if any) knowledge RE (or refuse to acknowledge the existence of) the responsibilities inherent in having those rights. you also do not understand that there are, of necessity, limits to those rights in times of crisis. only exception to that is the right of self defense. there are limits on that right, as well, in countries other than the US. (actually, here too, unless you can prove you did not know that the guys kicking your door in at 3 am were police when you shot at them) people don't need to govt to tell them what to do? that's a damn laugh, and one tinged with sadness at the the inanity involved. there has to be instructions on EVERYTHING! i'm not going to "cop" to your mistaken ideas & assumptions in this matter. self preservation? folks do what they want, not necessarily what is best. small-minded people make small-minded decisions.

 

[gaiusmarius]

you truly have an expansive view of what "rights" are, and little (if any) knowledge RE (or refuse to acknowledge the existence of) the responsibilities inherent in having those rights. you also do not understand that there are, of necessity, limits to those rights in times of crisis. only exception to that is the right of self defense. there are limits on that right, as well, in countries other than the US. (actually, here too, unless you can prove you did not know that the guys kicking your door in at 3 am were police when you shot at them) people don't need to govt to tell them what to do? that's a damn laugh, and one tinged with sadness at the the inanity involved. there has to be instructions on EVERYTHING! i'm not going to "cop" to your mistaken ideas & assumptions in this matter. self preservation? folks do what they want, not necessarily what is best. small-minded people make small-minded decisions.

an expansive view of human rights is it? that right there speaks louder then anything else.

i am talking about the most basic of rights, the very fundamental rights of freedom of association, protest and travel and you talk about an expansive view of human rights? omg thats so scary, it seems you have forgotten what rights even are. had we discussed this before the pandemic your answers would have been different. go with the flow i guess, most people do.

 

[Microbeman]

what does this even mean? what has google algo to do with the origin of the virus or any part of the discussion? why are you focusing on personalities? anything to say on the subject being discussed?

it just means that once you focus on a certain agenda on a subject it keeps feeding you more of that way of looking at things. Perhaps why you are sure there is a new announced war on national terrorism, while Amy has not heard this; which also has little to do with the subject of the origin of the virus. I already spent my 2 cents on that a few pages back.

 

[Chi13]

Well I feel much better now chi13 trusts the governemnt to return all of the un democratic power they’ve siezed in the last year.

And I feel better knowing you feel better.

What powers do you think were gained that won't go back to normal? How will Governments justify it?