Ogre's DIY Ebb & Grow / Multi-Flow Controller Tutorial

[EvilTwin]

k...built the controller, question: how exactly do you set one timer to run the whole thing...this is the one thing i havent seen on here is how to set up the timer can someone please help?!?!?

The timer must be a very specific 5 pole timer as Ogre uses. Dheil brand or something like that.

When the timer switches to what would normally be the "off" mode can then actually be connected to power a different pump. Shit...this is really hard to put into words. Go into this thread or Krypto's and you'll find a wiring diagram for the timer. That may help.
ET

 

[sundancer245]

The timer must be a very specific 5 pole timer as Ogre uses. Dheil brand or something like that.

When the timer switches to what would normally be the "off" mode can then actually be connected to power a different pump. Shit...this is really hard to put into words. Go into this thread or Krypto's and you'll find a wiring diagram for the timer. That may help.
ET[/qu


hey ET, thanks for replying, i figured it out, just had to mess around with it for a few to see how it worked and it was easy after that, just like you said when it switches to off it actually activates the other pump to drain it back out...so i just push down 3 tabs for a total of 45 mins, it comes on and fills for about 20 mins then soaks for about 25 mins and then kicks on the drain pump to pump it back out. works like a champ thanks again bro!

 

[EvilTwin]

The timer must be a very specific 5 pole timer as Ogre uses. Dheil brand or something like that.

When the timer switches to what would normally be the "off" mode can then actually be connected to power a different pump. Shit...this is really hard to put into words. Go into this thread or Krypto's and you'll find a wiring diagram for the timer. That may help.
ET[/qu


hey ET, thanks for replying, i figured it out, just had to mess around with it for a few to see how it worked and it was easy after that, just like you said when it switches to off it actually activates the other pump to drain it back out...so i just push down 3 tabs for a total of 45 mins, it comes on and fills for about 20 mins then soaks for about 25 mins and then kicks on the drain pump to pump it back out. works like a champ thanks again bro!

Glad you got it figured out despite my weak advice. Hey on the times, you need to consider the total time the root are underwater.

With these systems some people have had root rot problems from the roots being underwater too long. Aeration of res before flooding will help, as well as keeping the res temp from getting too warm.
ET

 

[sundancer245]

Glad you got it figured out despite my weak advice. Hey on the times, you need to consider the total time the root are underwater.

With these systems some people have had root rot problems from the roots being underwater too long. Aeration of res before flooding will help, as well as keeping the res temp from getting too warm.
ET

i have been contemplating the times...the tabs are in 15min increments so i can either have 2 down for 30 mins or 3 for 45, its taking around 17-20 mins to completely fill....so that would leave around 25-30 mins of soak time before it drains...and the drain cycle seems to take around 20-23 mins...so im not sure if using 3 tabs would be too much time underwater in all ...my concern with using 2 is that after almost 20mins of fill time that would leave not much more than 10 mins for soaking...unless you can incorporate some of the fill and drain time as time underwater....thats where im not sure...i dont want to over or under soak them....

 

[EvilTwin]

...go with 2 tabs Sundancer

3 tabs would increase your risks of root rot. The hydroton actually can retain considerable nutrient solution.
ET

 

[rmcc-luke]

...go with 2 tabs Sundancer

3 tabs would increase your risks of root rot. The hydroton actually can retain considerable nutrient solution.
ET

Thanks again for the reply - I have read the other howto's on this subject but even the wiring diagram in the Krypto's is for a 5 term SPDT timer - I would love to see the diagram for the 3 relay + 1 digital timer setup.

 

[sundancer245]

...go with 2 tabs Sundancer

3 tabs would increase your risks of root rot. The hydroton actually can retain considerable nutrient solution.
ET

thanks dude, thats what i was thinking too... so i will go with that...i'll let ya know how it goes

 

[EvilTwin]

Sundancer,
Here's an interesting article about E&F. read the whole thing because it has some cool info on the "hidden reservoir" which is the solution retained and held by the media.
ET

http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/eftips.htm

PS: Ooops, forgot the link. Note the comment about how long to flood. Says just till overflow is reached. So that confirms the 2 tab thing.

 

[sundancer245]

Sundancer,
Here's an interesting article about E&F. read the whole thing because it has some cool info on the "hidden reservoir" which is the solution retained and held by the media.
ET

PS: Note the comment about how long to flood. Says just till overflow is reached. So that confirms the 2 tab thing.

hey thanks man....sounds like a good read, but you forgot the link to the article lol

 

[EvilTwin]

hey thanks man....sounds like a good read, but you forgot the link to the article lol

http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/eftips.htm

 

[sundancer245]

http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/eftips.htm

thanks ET...i will check this out

 

[FrameOMind]

I built one of the Krypto systems a few years back and ended up selling it, but I had made these changes:
#1 - I used 12V DC relays and a cheap "wall wart" to supply the 12 volts. I was dead set against using 120V on switches below the water line. Too close for comfort IMO.
#2 - I figured out how to get around the four-switch-hysteresis issue and only used two float switches. Instead I wired the relays so that they latched and used the normally closed contacts.
#3 - As mentioned earlier, I used a single pole timer and a double-pole relay instead of the double pole timer.
#4 - I used 3/4" bulkheads from Lowes. You can find them near the plastic electrical conduit.
#5 - I used the same horiz float switches that Ogre used, (again with 12V, not 120V).

I managed to get everything locally except the float switches.

I had a detailed wiring diagram at one point, I'll try to find it and if I do I'll post it. That system worked like a charm.

 

[recirculator]

Question about the timer

Question about the timer

Hello and mucho props to Ogre for a great tutorial.

I'm building this system but have had trouble finding the diehl timer locally in Montreal. I have found a similar unit from Intermatic/Grasslin (Which is Identical to the one on the CAP system) and have ordered it for 32 bucks....should get here on friday they say.

here is a link to the page

http://www.intermatic.com/~/media/f...ctions/grasslin/fm1 series time switches.ashx

and the data sheet for the diehl unit

http://www.borggeneral.com/pdf/Series880.pdf

I just want to make sure before i put it together that the numbers on the terminals correspond to the same functions as on the diehl unit in the tutorial. In other words because the tutorial says only which number terminal to connect to on the timer I don't want to take it for granted that all the terminals are numbered the same on my timer...

From what I understand about the diehl....Terminal 5 is the power and is normally closed to terminal 4 (in "Off" or "drain mode"). When the "Flood" cycle starts (IE timer in ON position) terminal 5 disconnects from terminal 4 and connects to terminal 3.

It seems that on my timer terminal 3 is the power which is connected to terminal 5 in off mode and then connects to terminal 4 in on mode. Which would seem to mean to me that I have to swap the power cord to terminal 3 instead of 5 and then connect the upper floats to terminal 4 and the lower floats to terminal 5.

Does that sound about right??

Thanks in advance to anyone who can answer this for me...

 

[Cargo]

Hey... Quick question. I'm hoping someone here can help.

2 questions.....

1. ive found some horizontal float switches that were way cheaper, will these do ok. jus lookin for a confirmation. i've got some of the other stuff(timer, pumps, tubing) all on its way, jus trying to wrap up the float switches.. anyway these are the cheaper ones i wanted to buy
http://cgi.ebay.com/Liquid-Water-Le...emQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item5190ecedf0
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-Liquid-Wate...emQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item5ad7a6ec75
maad cheap right? im hoping it will work.

2. when crimping the wires do you need to expose any wire, or jus simply bend it? Don't. Sorry this is my first venture into anythin even DIY electronic, so if i sound really dumb dont mind me.

Anywho any help is appreciated. thanks guys

 

[pimpjuice]

Hey cargo, check krypto's thread, his build uses those switches, I don't think I'd really call those 'horizontal' switches', if you tried to use them in this build it wouldn't work. The switches in this build are easier to work with IMO, just drill a 5/8 hole and install.

 

[Cargo]

Hey cargo, check krypto's thread, his build uses those switches, I don't think I'd really call those 'horizontal' switches', if you tried to use them in this build it wouldn't work. The switches in this build are easier to work with IMO, just drill a 5/8 hole and install.

Thanks PJ. I was jus trying to cheap out cuz the one ogre suggested are $10 each as compared to the ones on ebay for $3 shipped. I figured if it was that cheap it wouldnt work out lol. Its all good tho. Thanks for the advice PJ +rep for helpin out.

2. when crimping the wires do you need to expose any wire, or jus simply bend it?
Anywho any help is appreciated. thanks guys

Sorry if my second question was vague, but I meant when crimping the float wires. The HLL wire is crimped, should it be cut and crimped like Ogre suggested for the other wires? Here's the step i'm referring too.

Thanks again all

 

[<~Hades~>]

props~ Mygyver award

 

[pimpjuice]

Sorry if my second question was vague, but I meant when crimping the float wires. The HLL wire is crimped, should it be cut and crimped like Ogre suggested for the other wires? Here's the step i'm referring too.

You need to strip a little of the insulation off the wire before you crimp the disconnects on to make a good connection. If you make it look just like his pics it'll work perfect.

 

[Cargo]

Thanks PJ.

Here's my list of what I've ordered so far and what i've picked up.. I'm hoping that I'm all set up.. here it goes.

4 float switches.
Diehl timer TA4079
12 ebb and flow bulkheads
9 ebb and flow bulkhead screens(http://www.wormsway.com/detail.aspx?t=prod&sku=BBH204&AC=1)
6x 3/4 tees, 3x 3/4 elbows
2x 400gph pumps
1x 10LPM active air pump
4x 12 inch stones.. but im thinking to use 2 in my rez and 2 in my cloner or use this instead..
spades, disconnectants, relays etc...
18x 2 gal buckets
kitter litter bucket for controller
25 ft 3/4 vinyl tubing
mad coco
mad super coarse perlite
i left out the rez cause I havent picked it up yet, im only running 9 buckets for my first run so I don't think im going to get a 55 gal drum, however I can get them for free. Idk yet.

So do I sound alright, or am I missin something?

Once again thanks PJ for the help and anyone else that might chime in

 

[rmcc-luke]

Quick Update:
Aquahub's new kit and directions (for a single SPDT timer) are here:
http://www.aquahub.com/store/media/EbbandFlowControlInstruxCompressed2010.pdf
This helped me, hope it helps you.
-Luke