Liver issues

[Stondestmanaliv]

Actual scientific papers, published, peer reviewed and cited.

It's wonderful that you're a first responder, honestly. But right now I'm not getting you or your attitude.

WOW... you post your biased opinion and offer NOTHING for actual truth. Post some clinical information for us to read, I DONT BELIEVE YOU. i`m not a first responder, you obviously don`t know the difference between a first responder and EMT-1. I am also in my second year of medical school. I`m ignoring you, you offer NOTHING for me.

ps.. the person who started this thread has thanked me on multiple occasions. I don`t know why people like SeaMadien want to troll and highjack this thread. Go away SeaMadien or post some CLINICAL INFORMATION for us to read.

 

[Stondestmanaliv]

FDA-approved doesn't really mean a thing. The best one can truthfully hope for is that the FDA has determined it won't kill you. But they've approved bullshit like cold lasers. That doesn't mean they work, especially as advertised. It only means that the FDA has ostensibly decided it won't kill you. Which ultimately doesn't mean a whole lot. They're not like the UL, that much is for sure.
(I have a friend who worked for the FDA and now works for a gov't contractor under auspices of FDA. The shit he's got to say about the FDA ain't pretty.)

Personally, I'd be more afraid of those eastern European suppliers than the Chinese.

I don`t have much faith in the FDA. However, I AM required to maintain clinical usage of FDA approved medication only. (It`s like a standard for all American prescribed and induced medication.)

I support the - (but I can`t offer medication by any other than FDA)

http://www.nice.org.uk/
http://www.mhra.gov.uk/index.htm#page=DynamicListMedicines


and a number of others who don`t offer cancer survivors Chinese rat food which comes from here:

http://sunbears.wildlifedirect.org/2009/02/10/eco-warriors-undercover-bear-bile-farming/

 

[delta9nxs]

hey, HB, i would just add that the cannabis caution in the ehow statement is really to be taken on an individual level as reactions are highly subjective.

i guess my liver likes me and i like it so we're getting along famously.

i take the lowest possible dose of prograf which is .5 mg twice a day.

my tacro blood levels show me in the mid part of the desirable range but not close to any danger point.

i consume around 2 grams a day of rather potent bud so obviously the cannabis use is not affecting my prograf levels negatively.

but slightlysolids friend may not be so lucky.

the aspergillus warning is for organic gardening in general and not specific to cannabis. decaying compost piles are to be avoided.

so i'm an indoor hydro guy. really no danger there if you keep molds under control.

 

[Sativa Dragon]

Mango Mango Mango!!!

Mango Mango Mango!!!

mango mango mango....

Mango's facilitate the uptake of THC there are Terpenes in the Mango that act directly on the receptors that interact with THC making the uptake more efficient thus getting you more HIGH!!

Peace

 

[SeaMaiden]

WOW... you post your biased opinion and offer NOTHING for actual truth. Post some clinical information for us to read, I DONT BELIEVE YOU. i`m not a first responder, you obviously don`t know the difference between a first responder and EMT-1. I am also in my second year of medical school. I`m ignoring you, you offer NOTHING for me.

ps.. the person who started this thread has thanked me on multiple occasions. I don`t know why people like SeaMadien want to troll and highjack this thread. Go away SeaMadien or post some CLINICAL INFORMATION for us to read.

Troll and hijack threads? Biased opinion....? What?

You're right, I don't know the difference between a First Responder as trained and EMT-1 as trained. You're 100% correct. I disagree strongly that I'm trolling or hijacking any threads, including this one. You've endeavored to do exactly what you claim you're not wanting to and that is enter into an argument, based on what I've seen to this point pretty much with any and every one you possibly can. You have my concession regarding these particular professions, I was using the terms via my common nomenclature.

I'll look up the paper on blood glucose levels, I am fairly certain something here was posted, but I could be wrong, it could have been through the patient advocacy group I work with.

Oh. Here. The Mayo Clinic. They say "may", but I hope the Mayo's good enough for you.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/marijuana/NS_patient-marijuana/DSECTION=safety

I'm sitting here looking at quite a body of anecdotal evidence posted right here on the site, which, last time I checked, is quite often what spurs funding for experiments, science, the sort of thing that leads to more and more papers. And I'm finding plenty of papers talking about glucose utilization in the brain. Is it really such an extrapolation to suggest that increased use of glucose in whatever regions of the brain just *might* lead to a total lowered blood glucose level?

Here's another point to consider. If something such as blood sugar levels may be affected by the endocannabinoid system, is it again really such a stretch to consider that there may be a corollary in the spectrum of phytocannabinoids? Really? That much of a stretch that you feel personally compelled to ridicule someone for mentioning it?

At this point the thread is being polluted with not much that's useful, but I'll post up what I'm finding any way. I'll let those who feel up to it to bother parsing through the searches for what they're after, as I'm finding, as expected since we're talking a whole class of chemicals here, conflicting results on some studies. There are plenty discussing glucose levels in the brain and lots of reports of diabetics, both types, of differing levels of control but more difficulty *if* they develop 'munchies' (again, common nomenclature).

I still haven't found the specific paper I'm thinking of, but I believe there is plenty of evidence that cannabis (cannabinoids, endo-, phyto-, whathaveyou-) can affect glucose levels in the blood and the brain.

Cannabis effect blood glucose.

Cannabis affect blood glucose.

To close, I don't know about you, but I'm not here to fight with people, I'm here to learn and I think there is lots more room for knowledge. I offer up what I've read, prayers, observations and what support I can, but I work very hard to not beat down on others. It would be appreciated by more folks than just myself if you could just check the attitude at the door. Sharing information and support is wonderful.

This is not a competition and you won't be graded on it, except maybe at the end of life. Which is where a lot of folks here are.

 

[Stondestmanaliv]

Interesting.. I was reading the mayo clinic.. I too find it odd they constantly state, "IT MAY CAUSE"... I guess even some of the finest medical institutions are even missing "FACTUAL" data.. So, I state it again.. I`m here to learn some of the effects of cannabis on certain medical issues. I try to place here-say and biased opinions in the trash.

If these biased opinions lead to a sense of false hope or endanger the life for someone dealing with a possible terminal disease, I am going to get involved...

Regarding every study I have read, some studies have been posted in this thread, clearly state cannabis causes the body to gain and store weight, not the opposite as others might have stated. Intelligent conversation please.

here is one, it might be difficult for the layman to understand. (not that anyone is, just high level medicine)
http://www.jci.org/articles/view/17725

 

[slightlysolid]

thanks for the all information everyone, sad to see arguing still going on in here when my sole intention was to get help for my friend who is trying to enjoy cannabis as much as he can.

as far as the last bit of information headband posted about negative effects of marijuana on anti rejection drugs that is quite scary but my friend has told me he has never had any issues with his blood test numbers and besides the poor diet he is shown to be quite healthy... he just took a blood test a few days ago so he will be getting the results back soon...

 

[siftedunity]

I never said I was a doctor you weirdo.... Please read those studies and explain to us what you think ....No comments...means you have nothing to offer... here some reading for you understand why we test on mice.... and medical treatment in the U.S is on another level that anything the UK has... we have the best clinics for everything medical in the United States..you just need to have money...

http://www.mskcc.org/research/ski

http://www.mdanderson.org/

Best in the world buddy all people from around the world come here for treatment



http://zdb.ru.lv/conferences/3/VTR8_II_305.pdf

Indeed, 99% of mouse genes have an equivalent in humans, making mice ideal for studying
the function of human genes in health as well as diseases such as cancer, cardiovascular
diseases and diabetes. These multifactorial diseases are in part due to mutations in our​

genes.

man you are full of shit you think you know everything which is unfortunate for you. i pity you. a test on mice is not 100% indicitive of how it will result on humans. if you dont realise that your even more stupid than you appear.
dont give me your run down on uk health service you know fuckall about.

one post you say doctors in the usa are shit and just pill pushers, next post your saying the usa has the best healthcare in the world. are you a drug user or a drunk? your ramblings are just either perpetual cut and pastes and links(most likely of which you dont even understand the content) or ramblings of your own biased and ignorant opinion which you will generally contradict a few posts after. your a loser bro .

 

[Storm Shadow]

man you are full of shit you think you know everything which is unfortunate for you. i pity you. a test on mice is not 100% indicitive of how it will result on humans. if you dont realise that your even more stupid than you appear.
dont give me your run down on uk health service you know fuckall about.

one post you say doctors in the usa are shit and just pill pushers, next post your saying the usa has the best healthcare in the world. are you a drug user or a drunk? your ramblings are just either perpetual cut and pastes and links(most likely of which you dont even understand the content) or ramblings of your own biased and ignorant opinion which you will generally contradict a few posts after. your a loser bro .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tN9EC3Gy6Nk

 

[Storm Shadow]

http://sciencelife.uchospitals.edu/2012/06/14/the-western-diets-immune-impact/

The Western Diet’s Immune Impact
Posted by Rob Mitchum on June 14, 2012 in epidemiology, gastroenterology, Genetics, immunology, Microbiology, Research

By John Easton
Inflammatory bowel disease is an ailment on the rise. A European study found that the incidence of IBD roughly doubled from 1990 to 2001, and even larger surges in IBD cases have been observed in areas of the United States and Europe studied since 1965. But intriguingly, this epidemic of IBD appears to be localized only to particular parts of the globe, appearing more commonly in developed or “Westernized” countries, with the highest rates seen in Northern Europe, the United Kingdom, and North America. While a heightened risk for IBD has been traced back to genetic factors, an increase of this magnitude and selectivity would suggest an environmental trigger for the disease.
This week, a study published in Nature by University of Chicago researchers points the blame at the Western diet as a driver of this increase in IBD and other immune disorders. Only in this case, the concern is not packing on the pounds. The researchers linked the high amounts of certain saturated fats in the food preferred by modern Americans and Europeans to a disruption of the bacterial ecosystem in the human gut that can have dangerous consequences for health. The finding helps explain why once-rare immune-mediated diseases have become more common in westernized societies in the last half century, and provides insight into why many individuals who are genetically prone to these diseases are never affected and how certain environmental factors can produce inflammation in individuals already at risk.
A team led by Eugene Chang, the Martin Boyer Professor of Medicine at the University of Chicago, found that concentrated milk fats, which are abundant in processed and confectionary (and, sadly, delicious) foods such as ice cream, alter the composition of bacteria in the intestines. These changes can disrupt the delicate truce between the immune system and the complex but largely beneficial mix of bacteria in the intestines, leading to the emergence of harmful bacterial strains that can unleash an unregulated tissue-damaging immune response.
“This is the first plausible mechanism showing step-by-step how Western-style diets contribute to the rapid and ongoing increase in the incidence of inflammatory bowel disease,” Chang said. “We know how certain genetic differences can increase the risk for these diseases, but moving from elevated risk to the development of disease seems to require a second event which may be encountered because of our changing lifestyle.”
The researchers worked with a mouse model that has many of the characteristics of human IBD. Genetically deleting a molecule, interleukin 10, which acts as a brake on the immune system’s response to intestinal bacteria, caused about 25 percent of mice to develop colitis when fed a low-fat diet or a diet high in polyunsaturated fats. But when exposed to a diet high in saturated milk fats, the rate of disease development within six months increased to more than 60 percent. In addition, the onset, severity and extent of colitis were much greater than that observed in mice fed low-fat diets.
Why would milk fat — a powdered substance that remains when fat has been separated from butter and dehydrated — trigger inflammation when polyunsaturated fat did not? The researchers traced the answer to the gut microbiome, the complex mix of hundreds of bacterial strains that reside in the bowels. The researchers found that an uncommon microbe called Bilophila wadsworthia was preferentially selected in the presence of milk fat. Previous studies had found high levels of B. wadsworthia in patients with appendicitis and other intestinal inflammatory disorders, including inflammatory bowel disease.
“That piqued our interest,” Chang said. “These pathobionts, which are usually non-abundant, seem to be quite prominent in these diseases.”
Indeed, while Bilophila wadsworthia levels were almost undetectable in mice on a low-fat or unsaturated-fat diet, the bacteria made up about 6 percent of all gut bacteria in mice fed a high milk-fat diet.
“Here we show how the trend in consumption of Western-type diets by many societies can potentially tip the mutualistic balance between host and microbe to a state that favors the onset of disease,” Chang said.

As its name implies, Bilophila wadsworthia has an affinity for bile, a substance produced by the liver and released into the intestines to help break down ingested fats. Milk fats are particularly difficult to digest and require the liver to secrete a form of bile that is rich in sulfur. B. wadsworthia thrives in the presence of sulfur. So when the bile created to dissolve milk fats reaches the colon, it enables wadsworthia to blossom.
“Unfortunately, these can be harmful bacteria,” Chang said. “Presented with a rich source of sulfur, they bloom, and when they do, they are capable of activating the immune system of genetically prone individuals.”
The byproducts of B. wadsworthia‘s interaction with bile also can amplify the effect. They serve as “gut mucosal barrier breakers,” said Suzanne Devkota, a member of Chang’s laboratory and first author of the study. “By increasing the permeability of the bowel, they enhance immune-cell infiltration, and that can induce tissue damage.”
Much of the recent progress in understanding the biology of inflammatory bowel disease has focused on gene variants that can increase risk, beginning with the discovery in 2001 of Nod2 by researchers at the University of Chicago and the University of Michigan. But the new study puts the focus on changing environmental factors that might trigger the disease in high-risk patients.
“Right now we can’t do much about correcting genes that predispose individuals to increased risk for these diseases,” Chang said, “and while we could encourage people to change their diets, this is seldom effective and always difficult.”
“However, the balance between host and microbes can be altered back to a healthy state to prevent or treat these diseases,” he added. “In essence, the gut microbiome can be ‘re-shaped’ in sustainable and predictable ways that restore a healthy relationship between host and microbes, without significantly affecting the lifestyles of individuals who are genetically prone to these diseases. We are testing that right now.”
=====
Devkota, S., Wang, Y., Musch, M., Leone, V., Fehlner-Peach, H., Nadimpalli, A., Antonopoulos, D., Jabri, B., & Chang, E. (2012). Dietary-fat-induced taurocholic acid promotes pathobiont expansion and colitis in Il10−/− mice Nature DOI: 10.1038/nature11225

 

[Storm Shadow]

The foods your being fed are breaking your body down into toxic shit..... The system doesnt benefit keeping people around for too long... Bro Science 4 Life

Page 24
http://www.vcuhealth.org/upload/docs/Transplant/liver_transplant_booklet.pdf

la la la la la la la la la

 

[Stondestmanaliv]

regarding the Lethal Dosage of cannabis, I know it has to be VERY high!

I have 130lbs Bull Mastiff and she is about 9 years old. She has a life expectancy of about 10-12 years so she is in her final days. <3
Anyway, a few months ago she decided to treat herself to anything she wanted on my coffee table. (where I usually keep food and stacks).. For some reason she decided to just start eating shit on my coffee table. She left the food and snacks and went straight for the 65grams of (VERY) high quality homemade hash. Later that day I was looking for my hash.. WTF, WHERE IS MY HASH??? I look over at the dogs, one dog is looking at me funny and the other looks like Jimmie Hendrix playing the guitar. She looked like Jimmie for a few days, I didn`t think it would be lethal so I let her just go with it. I was not mad about losing the hash but I was not going to take her to the vet, her fault..

After about 72 hours of playing the Jimmie, she finally came out of it and she was horny as hell.. She and my male bull mastiff mated like 10x a day for a week.. I didn`t think old dogs got that frisky.. hahahahah..

..so, 65grams of 70%-75% THC @ 130lbs did NOT kill my dog. I was watching her pulse and such, she was always in the green for a dog. 6 months later and absolutely no side effects. (except maybe a larger respect for the master`s stash).



ps

Indeed, 99% of mouse genes have an equivalent in humans

hahahahah... complete bullshit.. lolol... Chimpanzees are the closest living relative to humans and they share about 95%-98% of our DNA, 99% of that 95%-98% is "similar" in structure to human DNA.

 

[siftedunity]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tN9EC3Gy6Nk

the usa and the british are friends as far as im concerned. im sure if you want to start insulting other nations it will be frowned upon by the mods

 

[Storm Shadow]

the usa and the british are friends as far as im concerned. im sure if you want to start insulting other nations it will be frowned upon by the mods

Anime Porn avatar says it all for me.... cheers Mate

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2AgMKO-LV4

 

[headband 707]

hey, HB, i would just add that the cannabis caution in the ehow statement is really to be taken on an individual level as reactions are highly subjective.

i guess my liver likes me and i like it so we're getting along famously.

i take the lowest possible dose of prograf which is .5 mg twice a day.

my tacro blood levels show me in the mid part of the desirable range but not close to any danger point.

i consume around 2 grams a day of rather potent bud so obviously the cannabis use is not affecting my prograf levels negatively.

but slightlysolids friend may not be so lucky.

the aspergillus warning is for organic gardening in general and not specific to cannabis. decaying compost piles are to be avoided.

so i'm an indoor hydro guy. really no danger there if you keep molds under control.

LOL I was thinking that ,, that it is an indiviual thing... I'm glad you brought this up.. You could be doing much better atleast right now then this guy.. Good info though from everyone stay safe headband 707

 

[slightlysolid]

my friend got his blood test results back today and he said everything looks great including the prograf levels

 

[Truthman]

It's probably a bad case of constipation. How many times out the week does he take a shit? If it isn't at least 4 days, he needs to get more fiber in his diet. Just tell him to start off slow to get his system used to it ,and he doesn't have a lot gas that may hurt. I explained the rest in my previous post. Tell him good luck.

 

[SS-]

Hmm. I can't offer much into this convo besides I, for one experience slight tachycardia when smoking certain strong sativas.

Also one day I too experienced a terrible attack. Ripped the bowl twice. Between the two rips inhaled about .4g of Sour D / Jack Herer salad. My bp spiked to easily over 180. Stayed there for about 2 hours. Stayed high for about 4-6 hours. Can't remember now. But it was the highest I've been for an extended amount of time like that ever. Honestly didn't even feel like a high. Just a terrible feeling I never want to experience again. I've had my fair share of panic attacks. but this one takes the cake.

Fucked me over for awhile might I add. My heart has not, till this day been the same. Was put on a holter monitor i'd say about 2 week after this happened for 5 days. I'm a Mobile Detailer. When working, not even quickly my bp was spiking to 221 for certain episodes.

Now for the most part it's gotten better. Just a slightly higher BP and heart works a bit harder now. When working out it beats so hard my vision looses focus sometimes. Got used to it though, and it has faded and continues to do so as I keep working out though

And yeap. I Still smoke. Have my days when I go just as hard as I used to. Try to limit myself to one of those a week though.

 

[headband 707]

I would really recommend vaping at this point ... Don't smoke bud just vape it .. headband 707

 

[delta9nxs]

my friend got his blood test results back today and he said everything looks great including the prograf levels

so he is having an idiopathic response to cannabis. too bad! he is going to die some day!