So why would you vote against legalizing marijuana?
ICMAG Administration endorses The Regulate, Control and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010
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So why would you vote against legalizing marijuana?
I can't imagine them willingly giving up revenue based on some shaky medical justification. This is just one more downside to the masses running under 215 - it is evident to everyone that there are a lot (read majority) of people that are not really justified for a medical cert. Thus, the justification of not taxing medical goes out the window.
Well, because it not true legalization.
nobody has said yet what will happen at california's borders? will the import of marijuana be legal? will exporting it lead to jail time? will California citizens be able to leave the state freely without being searched or scanned? how much more law enforcement (police) will be hired to enforce these regulations?
and who will enforce these enforcers?
and who will enforce these enforcers?
is the importation or exportation of marijuana legal now?
does exporting lead to jail time?
are california citizens able to leave freely?
what language in prop 19 makes you think any of these things will change?
So not getting arrested for cultivating and consuming cannabis isnt legalizing?
I completely understand your reasoning and stance on the issue Gypsy, and respect it.
If it does pass, as written, it's gonna be interesting to see how it will be enforced. I would hate to see it affect any part of Prop 215 anywhere in the state. That has been a long fight to get to where it is now and the last thing I'd want to see is a step backwards.
Time will tell, but I'm not optimistic that if it needs tweaking down the road that tweaking would be done for the better. Once the broke municipalities find a cash cow they'll milk it til the teat dries up.
are you one of those who thinks that marijuana will ever be completely unregulated and taxed?
you do realize that absolute prohibition is the strictest form of regulation and a fine is just a more enforceable form of tax with the added bonus of a conviction or infraction on your record.
this initiative allows users to grow smoke legally....
please explain how making marijuana legal for adults to consume w/o having to ask anyone for permission is not legalization.
i can explain very easily how a no vote is def. not legalization
So not getting arrested for cultivating and consuming cannabis isnt legalizing?
Since we obviously differ as to what "legalization" means, what is YOUR defintion of true legalization?
Tossed SALAD: Stoners Against Legalization Article of the Day
By Russ Belville
NORML Outreach Coordinator, host of NORML SHOW LIVE
I have been blogging recently about dispensaries in California that are hostile to Prop 19- - California's marijuana legalization initiative. What I suspect are sock puppet fronts for these businesses have also sprung up, the so-called "Stoners Against Legalization" blogs. I've decided to feature these in a semi-regular post I'm calling "Tossed SALAD -- Stoners Against Legalization Article of the Day", because I can't resist a catchy acronym.*
It's a perfect storm of sorts for me. I'm a die hard cannabis activist, so I'm excited about the possibility of the world's eighth largest economy legalizing marijuana. I'm a talk radio host and blogger for the cannabis community, so I'm constantly researching and discussing marijuana on the web. Most of all, though, I'm a huge fan of irony, so ranting against fellow blogging tokers over their opposition to legalization is like an irony sundae with nuts on top. Like the nuts who write for Stop19.com.
I already covered, in far too many words, the breadth of their website in a previous post. Their home page at the time displayed modified Camel and Marlboro ads warning of the "600 addictive and poisonous additives in your cannabis as we put in your tobacco!" This, of course, being the result after Big Tobacco takes over cannabis in California and mass produces toxic schwaggy joints. Except that Richard Lee and a "politically connected" "cannabis cartel" are taking over cannabis in California with industrial mega grows. Or maybe Big Tobacco actually hires Richard Lee. Something like that.
The latest screed from Stop19.com warns us all that if cannabis is legalized and all adults can grow a 5'x5' personal garden, that might not apply to renters:
I'm still trying to wrap my head around the Möbius strip of logic that makes this objection a reason to vote no. If my landlord catches me right now with a marijuana plant in the closet and an ounce of marijuana, I will be evicted and arrested. If Prop 19 passes, but my landlord denies me permission to grow marijuana on his property, at least I can have my ounce of weed without his permission or any intercession by the police. So I should vote... no?
At least when Stop19.com is arguing that we should vote no on legalization because it infringes on the joy of toking up with teenagers and puffing in front of pre-schoolers, I can understand the motivation. If you're an adult over the age of 21 and you're fond of smoking joints with high school kids, you would have to vote in your best interest, I suppose. (We're looking at you, David Wooderson.) Here they seem to be arguing that since your landlord might not (but might) let you grow cannabis, you should vote to keep that activity a felony for everyone, even people who own their own property.
As usual, this is more "I Gots Mine" grumbling; the parenthetical reference to Prop 215 gives it away. Never mind that home-renting Prop 215 patients are evicted for growing medical marijuana now or that most California adults who are tokers aren't Prop 215 patients.
I couldn't leave the site without a comment, but reports from some of my other activists buddies tell me that Stop19.com is not posting any opposing comments. So I left the following in my nom de provacateur, hoping the editors are sarcasm-impaired enough to let it through:
I don't think it will get past moderation, but since these are people who think "space" in the context of smoking around a minor could be interpreted as "apartment building", maybe their language processing deficiencies will turn in my favor.
* Or maybe because tricking stoners into voting no on Prop 19 means they're voting yes on the chance to room with this guy. Don't worry, it's not some graphic photo or video. It's just a man in a prison documentary discussing fresh young inmates and tossed salad. How bad could it be?
By Russ Belville
NORML Outreach Coordinator, host of NORML SHOW LIVE
I have been blogging recently about dispensaries in California that are hostile to Prop 19- - California's marijuana legalization initiative. What I suspect are sock puppet fronts for these businesses have also sprung up, the so-called "Stoners Against Legalization" blogs. I've decided to feature these in a semi-regular post I'm calling "Tossed SALAD -- Stoners Against Legalization Article of the Day", because I can't resist a catchy acronym.*
It's a perfect storm of sorts for me. I'm a die hard cannabis activist, so I'm excited about the possibility of the world's eighth largest economy legalizing marijuana. I'm a talk radio host and blogger for the cannabis community, so I'm constantly researching and discussing marijuana on the web. Most of all, though, I'm a huge fan of irony, so ranting against fellow blogging tokers over their opposition to legalization is like an irony sundae with nuts on top. Like the nuts who write for Stop19.com.
I already covered, in far too many words, the breadth of their website in a previous post. Their home page at the time displayed modified Camel and Marlboro ads warning of the "600 addictive and poisonous additives in your cannabis as we put in your tobacco!" This, of course, being the result after Big Tobacco takes over cannabis in California and mass produces toxic schwaggy joints. Except that Richard Lee and a "politically connected" "cannabis cartel" are taking over cannabis in California with industrial mega grows. Or maybe Big Tobacco actually hires Richard Lee. Something like that.
The latest screed from Stop19.com warns us all that if cannabis is legalized and all adults can grow a 5'x5' personal garden, that might not apply to renters:
I've been a renter all my life and my parents were renters before me. I'm still trying to recall even a single rental application's fine print that read "If you want to grow a 5'x5' garden of marijuana, that's fine with us."
I'm still trying to wrap my head around the Möbius strip of logic that makes this objection a reason to vote no. If my landlord catches me right now with a marijuana plant in the closet and an ounce of marijuana, I will be evicted and arrested. If Prop 19 passes, but my landlord denies me permission to grow marijuana on his property, at least I can have my ounce of weed without his permission or any intercession by the police. So I should vote... no?
At least when Stop19.com is arguing that we should vote no on legalization because it infringes on the joy of toking up with teenagers and puffing in front of pre-schoolers, I can understand the motivation. If you're an adult over the age of 21 and you're fond of smoking joints with high school kids, you would have to vote in your best interest, I suppose. (We're looking at you, David Wooderson.) Here they seem to be arguing that since your landlord might not (but might) let you grow cannabis, you should vote to keep that activity a felony for everyone, even people who own their own property.
As usual, this is more "I Gots Mine" grumbling; the parenthetical reference to Prop 215 gives it away. Never mind that home-renting Prop 215 patients are evicted for growing medical marijuana now or that most California adults who are tokers aren't Prop 215 patients.
I couldn't leave the site without a comment, but reports from some of my other activists buddies tell me that Stop19.com is not posting any opposing comments. So I left the following in my nom de provacateur, hoping the editors are sarcasm-impaired enough to let it through:
I don't think it will get past moderation, but since these are people who think "space" in the context of smoking around a minor could be interpreted as "apartment building", maybe their language processing deficiencies will turn in my favor.
* Or maybe because tricking stoners into voting no on Prop 19 means they're voting yes on the chance to room with this guy. Don't worry, it's not some graphic photo or video. It's just a man in a prison documentary discussing fresh young inmates and tossed salad. How bad could it be?
nothing, that's why i say fuck prop 19.
i think it will mean more gov't control, not less
AND you conveniently left out my 2 key questions in your quote, you fucker
how much more law enforcement (police) will be hired to enforce these regulations?
and who will enforce these enforcers?
why dont you try to spin that?
THERE IS NO SUCH THING....
you have been duped into thinking prohibition is somehow not government control..
jeebus they have done a good job on the younger generations...
i did not address your subsequent postulating because it is not worthy of a response...
but lets do it anyway..
question 1: no new officers will be needed why would they?
question 2: see question 1
G
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i see the No vote posting they vote no b/c it MAY have a negative impact on 215 so why mess up a good thing, we just dont know how things will turn out and i may not be able to feed my family.
lets play the What If game.
what if by prop19 not passing the far right takes that as a sign that the Majority in Cali dont want Legal Cannabis and they take that inch, prop19 failing, and run with it and attack 215 and how liberal recs are handed out.
both are possible outcomes of prop19 not passing. if your vote is based solely on speculation then at least look at all possible negative effects.
hey No's. care to respond or just ignore if you cant.
lets play the What If game.
what if by prop19 not passing the far right takes that as a sign that the Majority in Cali dont want Legal Cannabis and they take that inch, prop19 failing, and run with it and attack 215 and how liberal recs are handed out.
both are possible outcomes of prop19 not passing. if your vote is based solely on speculation then at least look at all possible negative effects.
hey No's. care to respond or just ignore if you cant.
NORML, Slightly Stoopid and Cypress Hill: Bring Attention to California’s Initiative to Regulate and Tax Marijuana for November Ballot
August 9th, 2010 New York, NY – The National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws (NORML), a Washington DC-based marijuana advocacy group, has partnered with jam-based dub rock heavyweights Slightly Stoopid and hip-hop juggernauts Cypress Hill on the Legalize It 2010 tour for a YouTube based video contest to raise awareness for California’s Prop 19, the initiative to regulate and tax marijuana. The initiative will be on the California ballot November 2nd, 2010 and its passage would be a historic step forward in the fight to end marijuana prohibition and legalize marijuana nationwide.
NORML, Slightly Stoopid, and Cypress Hill invite US residents to create 30-60 second videos of themselves answering the question, “What could California do with the revenue generated from taxing marijuana?” Participants are to upload their entries to YouTube with the tag “YesOnProp19.” Members of both bands and representatives from NORML will personally pick one grand prize winner and two runner-ups from a selection of the most viewed, rated, and commented upon videos.
Prizes include a personal phone call from B-Real, a limited edition Slightly Stoopid vaporizer, a framed autographed tour poster, a free one-year membership to NORML, plus more. Winners’ videos will be shared on all the partners’ social network profiles. For official contest rules visit here.
Proposition 19, the Regulate, Control, and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010, will give local governments the ability to tax the sale of up to one ounce of marijuana for recreational purposes to adults age 21 and older. According to the Board of Equalization (BOE), California’s tax regulator, controlling and taxing marijuana in California could generate $1.4 billion in much needed revenue each year. These funds could go towards jobs, public safety, health care, parks, transportation, education and more.
According to research conducted by the California chapter of NORML, the sale of marijuana could save over $200 million in law enforcement costs, generate $12-18 billion annually from spin-off industries (similar to the CA wine industry) and create between 60,000 and 110,000 new jobs, generating $2.5 -3.5 billion in wages for workers each year. NORML also reports numerous public safety benefits such as putting drug cartels out of business and refocusing police efforts on violent crime. Says Miles from Slightly Stoopid, “I think the whole negative outlook [on pot] is silly. You can go to the store and buy as much booze as you want, and it gets taxed. I think that’s way worse than marijuana. If they passed that bill and taxed (marijuana), it would generate a lot of money for the state and help cut into the deficit faced by the state of California. If I was a politician or a judge running California, I would have passed this a long, long time ago.”
Slightly Stoopid and Cypress Hill, along with Collie Buddz are currently on a nationwide 22 date tour called Legalize It 2010. Local NORML chapters have booths set up at stops along the tour, where interested parties can learn more about their mission, the contest and how to get involved in marijuana law reform.
August 9th, 2010 New York, NY – The National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws (NORML), a Washington DC-based marijuana advocacy group, has partnered with jam-based dub rock heavyweights Slightly Stoopid and hip-hop juggernauts Cypress Hill on the Legalize It 2010 tour for a YouTube based video contest to raise awareness for California’s Prop 19, the initiative to regulate and tax marijuana. The initiative will be on the California ballot November 2nd, 2010 and its passage would be a historic step forward in the fight to end marijuana prohibition and legalize marijuana nationwide.
NORML, Slightly Stoopid, and Cypress Hill invite US residents to create 30-60 second videos of themselves answering the question, “What could California do with the revenue generated from taxing marijuana?” Participants are to upload their entries to YouTube with the tag “YesOnProp19.” Members of both bands and representatives from NORML will personally pick one grand prize winner and two runner-ups from a selection of the most viewed, rated, and commented upon videos.
Prizes include a personal phone call from B-Real, a limited edition Slightly Stoopid vaporizer, a framed autographed tour poster, a free one-year membership to NORML, plus more. Winners’ videos will be shared on all the partners’ social network profiles. For official contest rules visit here.
Proposition 19, the Regulate, Control, and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010, will give local governments the ability to tax the sale of up to one ounce of marijuana for recreational purposes to adults age 21 and older. According to the Board of Equalization (BOE), California’s tax regulator, controlling and taxing marijuana in California could generate $1.4 billion in much needed revenue each year. These funds could go towards jobs, public safety, health care, parks, transportation, education and more.
According to research conducted by the California chapter of NORML, the sale of marijuana could save over $200 million in law enforcement costs, generate $12-18 billion annually from spin-off industries (similar to the CA wine industry) and create between 60,000 and 110,000 new jobs, generating $2.5 -3.5 billion in wages for workers each year. NORML also reports numerous public safety benefits such as putting drug cartels out of business and refocusing police efforts on violent crime. Says Miles from Slightly Stoopid, “I think the whole negative outlook [on pot] is silly. You can go to the store and buy as much booze as you want, and it gets taxed. I think that’s way worse than marijuana. If they passed that bill and taxed (marijuana), it would generate a lot of money for the state and help cut into the deficit faced by the state of California. If I was a politician or a judge running California, I would have passed this a long, long time ago.”
Slightly Stoopid and Cypress Hill, along with Collie Buddz are currently on a nationwide 22 date tour called Legalize It 2010. Local NORML chapters have booths set up at stops along the tour, where interested parties can learn more about their mission, the contest and how to get involved in marijuana law reform.
For those of you trying to reason with some of the ones arguing against this bill, you're wasting your time.
Greeds a much more powerful tool than logic. You're not going to change their minds. It wouldn't matter what the Bill said and how it was worded. Instead of looking at other avenues to make money, and pass the Bill for the sake of the thousands charged with Felonies every year because of small grows, they'll fight tooth and nail for the sake of themselves.
Ya see, in truth, even if the Bill passes, and it sucks, it's still better than what's there today. Just ignore it and grow your own.
Do you guys grow weak Cannabis? Because I have news for you. If you're bud is good, you'll still be able to get rid of it. And if worse comes to worse, you still have 49 other States that it's illegal in that are dry as hell most of the time. Take advantage of it. Oh I know, now you're going to say "but I could go to jail for that", right? Well now you know how the millions of other people feel every time they smoke. Or worse yet how the thousands of people feel sitting in prison because they had a small grow and got caught.
If you think things are going to stay the way they are now, even if this Bill fails, guess again. The Gov't will know that it failed due to the hundreds of thousands of people that are making tax free money from Cannabis, and they'll be more determined than ever to change things. They may even change the med laws when they see it's the reason legalization failed. If it's one thing the Gov't is good at, it's seeing ways to make money. And they're going to get their hands in the pie one way or another.
But what would worry me the most is the negative Karma following me around. You want to be careful what you wish for. Because when it's fueled by greed. and it hurts other people, Karma has a way of making your wishes come true.
Greeds a much more powerful tool than logic. You're not going to change their minds. It wouldn't matter what the Bill said and how it was worded. Instead of looking at other avenues to make money, and pass the Bill for the sake of the thousands charged with Felonies every year because of small grows, they'll fight tooth and nail for the sake of themselves.
Ya see, in truth, even if the Bill passes, and it sucks, it's still better than what's there today. Just ignore it and grow your own.
Do you guys grow weak Cannabis? Because I have news for you. If you're bud is good, you'll still be able to get rid of it. And if worse comes to worse, you still have 49 other States that it's illegal in that are dry as hell most of the time. Take advantage of it. Oh I know, now you're going to say "but I could go to jail for that", right? Well now you know how the millions of other people feel every time they smoke. Or worse yet how the thousands of people feel sitting in prison because they had a small grow and got caught.
If you think things are going to stay the way they are now, even if this Bill fails, guess again. The Gov't will know that it failed due to the hundreds of thousands of people that are making tax free money from Cannabis, and they'll be more determined than ever to change things. They may even change the med laws when they see it's the reason legalization failed. If it's one thing the Gov't is good at, it's seeing ways to make money. And they're going to get their hands in the pie one way or another.
But what would worry me the most is the negative Karma following me around. You want to be careful what you wish for. Because when it's fueled by greed. and it hurts other people, Karma has a way of making your wishes come true.
you wrote the bill?
sorry couldnt help it..
seriously though how does me and thousands of others growing their own smoke without having to ask anyone permission or fear arrest benefit R.Lee or hurt you EXACTLY ?
Assuming that you are right, and I am not sure that you are, I think that this is a wonderful example of a symbiotic relationship. While Richard Lee is admittedly setting himself up to make a ton of money, he has spent a ton of money doing it. For the 99% of California's population that will have no interaction whatsoever with his enterprise, it is still a win. Also, painting a giant target on your back and telling the DEA to come and get you in the most flagrant way imaginable takes some major stones in my opinion.
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