Fertilizer and Yield

[Guest]

I come from a traditional farming background, and as i watched on tv, poor, north Korean peasant farmers scrapping up every single pellet of fertilizer that had fallen through the floor cracks of a train car it occurred to me that even those poor folks know what all of the worlds farmers know: Fertilizer equals yield...
..and the more you have,( to a point), the bigger your yield

I also know that when petroleum based ferts were first created, the farming world jumped for joy. Prior to chemical fertilizers, farmers were forced to grow organically. Organic growing may be popular for many, but there is no organic formula that will create the kind of growth that chems will, especially during rapid growth periods. Farmers used to a have to use manure, (disease), compost, (disease) and then harvest only moderate yeilds in the best of years. Plants must have chems to fullfill thier full potential.

Now to cannabis farmers. It the time of year where i remind everyone that your crop and your yield will be set in stone in the next 60 days and that this 60 day period is the most critical time of the entire grow season in determining yield.

Indoor stretch begins very quickly , as soon as you turn the lights back. Outdoors, reduction of light is much much slower and so is the growth one could consider to be stretch. Where I live near 38 degrees, this period is from early july until mid august and during this 45 day period, the plants should nearly double in size. They will grow faster during this period than any othe time and therefore, they need much much more fertilizer.**

If you dont pour double and tripple doses of ferts on the plants at double the rate, you are going to loose yeild, period. The bigger the plant, the more juice to pour on it.
Keep in mind that the amount of ferts needed for a 12" plant are very different than a 9' plant, so dose accordingly, but by all means dose and dose hard.

My formula for a typical 6' plant: 1 big heaping tablespoon of miracle grow and one teaspoon of urea per gallon per 7 days. Every 7 days. Doses will start around the first of july and will continue at that level until 2 weeks after flowering begins. Starting in mid august, i stop completely and move to low nitro, flower nutes.

The double edged sword? You can grow mould and mildew on a long flowering equatorial sativa if you pump it full of nitrogen during flower development and have nitrogen being prespired onto the leaves and buds. It is important to draw back the nitro at least a couple of weeks before serious flower development to avoid this problem.

Don't miss this period for fertilization!!! 2 plants side by side. 1, six foot tall plant is in fine organic soil but gets no ferts. The other is in average soil but has a farmer with an active watering can. The organic plant will yield
7oz's, the chemically fertilized plant will produce a lb. Everytime.





** (these dates become later the further north one travels. At 45 degrees, i think its from late july to sept)

 

[THC123]

Well having compared chemical ferts and solid organics , i must say i got the same results with organics , only better tasting.

For the rest good tips

 

[fisher15]

Yeah I agree on some points (that we're getting into BOOST time) but you can't convince me my yields will suffer due to my organic growing methods. My goal is to have huge yields of kind KIND organic tasty meds. Got some friends who chem their shit out with MG, Shultz, etc and am always dissapointed in the final product. That's what it's about, right??

 

[.clunk]

Great article!

This is the first year that I have used a potent chem-based fertilizer and I must say that I am very impressed by the results so far. Advanced Nutrients Heavy Harvest is what friends have been swearing by for the last few years and I finally jumped on board and must say it's better than I expected.
I have used organics for the past 3 years, and I have good success but for growing cash-tree's the chemical fertilizers just seem to be much more potent.

What impresses me is how quickly the nutrients appear to become available to the plant, even though they are coated for slow release over a 2 week period.

With organics, I always find myself top dressing and waiting for at least a week before I start to see real effects of the fertilizer. With such a short growing season here in Canada, every week of veg time is really important. Usually I see a one week lag after I begin fertilizing post-transplant with organics, but this year with the chem ferts the plants responded very well and took off immediately, the level of growth was beyond what I have seen before!

 

[jakeh]

Fertilizer equals yield...
..and the more you have,( to a point)

A few years ago my neighbor went to amsterdam and brought back some dutch passion shaman. We started at the same time, with same genes and 25 ft apart. He went with miracle grow moisture control and I went with promix with pure blend pro. I fed probably every watering and he just added water since the fertilizers were in the soil. Up until mid august we both thought the others plant looked better(grass is greener on the other side). He gave his a shot of some kind of miracle grow bloom booster and ended up producing twice as much as I did. I am getting close to that point this year where what I am doing now will dictate what I end up with. Sometimes I do think I probably over do it and it will cost me. I will see in october.
As for organic I don't have any experience outside of my miracle grow organic choice that did not do worth a damn before being dug up by armadillo's. A friend with as much experience as you but an organic only type says if you take an organic hole and a hole with osmocote the osmocote will out produce the first year hands down. The 2nd, 3rd, etc years will be won by the organic hole. He tried to steer me his direction but I just don't like not knowing what is going in and when it will be released to the plant. Not to mention the incredible work load of hauling in all the crap that goes into his holes. I hall 2 cubic ft bags at 1 per hole. Very simple and effective.
jake

 

[fisher15]

Clunck try foliar feeding with organics, you'll see results overnight.

And silverback- a 'fine organic soil' to me is one that includes dry organic nutrients. With no ferts, I'd call it soilless.

 

[THC123]

to see "instant" results , just let the soil recipe with the dry nutes fermentate 1 month minimal so they are immedialtely available.

After that just give the npk pellets monthly and always take into account they take 1-2 weeks to start working and will work well for 8 weeks.

U can try different npk pellets for veggging and flowering and then u also add the bone bloodmeal one month before flowering

 

[PrinceOfPersia]

I dont agree on the comparison thing. but on the other hand i dont have too much experiance with chem ferts.

But have you tried brewing a bacterial or fungal tea. Best feeding ive done! and best yields.

 

[.clunk]

to see "instant" results , just let the soil recipe with the dry nutes fermentate 1 month minimal so they are immedialtely available.

After that just give the npk pellets monthly and always take into account they take 1-2 weeks to start working and will work well for 8 weeks.

U can try different npk pellets for veggging and flowering and then u also add the bone bloodmeal one month before flowering

I usually do this, a few weeks in advance with a 4-4-4 organic fert. It works okay but isn't potent enough after it's fermented for a few weeks. It seems to get the soils "going", but still isn't enough to really kick the plants into gear. One season I upped the application a bit but ended up with some burning because it was too much. I usually use guano's as well later in the season with good results. Everything about organics works great for me but as I got into higher numbers the frequency of top dressings and the amount of nutes I was lugging in was getting ridiculous.
This is my first season using chem nutes though so I shouldn't be saying much one way or another until I'm done this season and I can compare the results.

 

[Sparky14]

I thought we decided on OVERGROW years ago that Miracle Grow was not good for us health wise...somewhere someone posted up the idea (with some documentation) that it was radioactive.

I grow organic veggies, and I just ordered half a beef (organic grass fed) and 35 free range chickens...my 27 cannabis plants will get just Rapid Grow this year for the same reason...


www.garabandal.org

 

[Hindu Killer]

I think your right SB, Ive a friend that puts a ton of fertilizer on his plants. Id think it would kill it......but he knows his stuff. Always a tip or trick to be learned from the "Pro's"!

 

[THC123]

@clunk 4-4-4 isn't really a good proportion for veg

 

[.clunk]

@clunk 4-4-4 isn't really a good proportion for veg

Yeah I know, that's why also amend with guano's (high N or P depending on time of season) and a few other top dressings as well.

 

[slider420]

So give us The skinny??? What NPK should you run with?? Man made or organic fert.??? when / where/ and how much??? PLEASE.. I"m Freaking out....there is 200 feet of stuff at the store....I can't sleep at nite thinking about FERTS....

 

[fisher15]

Slider, no offense but it sounds like you've got a lot of reading to do. You are asking opinions and mine is to read the stickys in the organic soil forum.

 

[slider420]

Sorry dude if i sounded like a straight "newbie" The reply i made ..It was for the greater good of the movement...If everyone grows then "THEY" can't stop the movement...overgrow the Gov. My new clan are overwhelmed buy the info overload..(Old ladies & Men) They just are sick of paying pharmaceutical companies... So Sorry Dudes

 

[Guest]

high guys

I dont want you to think i have anything against organics, I dont. I try to make my hole as full of rich black earth as possible and I also back off of ferts in time that they wash out a bit before harvest. I'm a firm believer in the notion that if you put chemicals on your smoke during late flower, it will taste like chems. So, im not an organics hater. The only reservation i have at all with organics is that they cant maximize that rapid growth period that starts 30 days or so before flower. That period is a critical feed period for me. I believe they need too much to often for a while and then it has to be shut off before flower. Ive been unable to accomplish that with organics, even fish emulsions and the such.

But i work my ass off to bring in a crop of weed and its just the facts that if im going to maximize my yeild, im gonna have to use chems. That applys to every single crop im aware of, not just cannabis.

Crop yields around the world jumped dramatically with the intro of chemical ferts and that wasn't a coincidence.

Hey HK

Damn, if miracle grow is dangerous, im screwed. I didnt get that memo.

 

[fisher15]

I can see how crops, as a whole may have seen increased yields with chemmys. But if it's yields of mj you're talking, I just don't see it necessary to get huge plants. If you've seen my thread I've got a bunch of giants, some 6x6 already and growing inches daily. No chems come near my plants, in fact most have been fed only water, as I mixed dry ferts into the soil mix. What do your plants normally yield silverback?

 

[PrinceOfPersia]

Hey silver im not saying you are a organic hater, but how can you claim that inorganic fertz/chems in "FACT" does maximise yield. Please prove it. Hundred of different things play a role in the yield. If you have a better experiance with chems it doesnt mean that it its in fact better than organics.. Feel me bro, im not hating. I would just like too see exactly what you got, except ur own experiance to back it up.. Is this your experiance with one two 10 strains, or all of what you grow!.
I find it a bit odd the way you put it all up. Ive never heard too much n in the plant causes mold.. did i miss something? but i do believe many many factors play a complex role in developing mold.

 

[mahuta]

hi silverback, I'm also a farmer and also use chem fert, and agree that organic just can't do the same as organics. take it in a farming context and i believe all thats happening is a mining of the chem ferts that were put on before the change back to organics.but i do think that in a small scale such as growing weed though that you can come pretty dam close. when you're only digging a hole you can pile in all the nutes needed for a good grow. because of the small intensive scale its achievable. this obviously doesn't work in a large scale farming because of the cost/time. yes the weed will probably taste better to some (I've never noticed the difference) grown organically. but chem fert is able to be put on the plant when its needed, and taken up by the plant within a few short days (although its about 5 for urea) and as long as to much hasn't been used then the plant should use it all up before flowering leaving no "chem taste" . the biggest benefit i see is that the plant doesn't need to expend so much energy in root mass as it can gain all it needs in a smaller rooting system, resulting in more vegetation - something i think you've shown in your 5g buckets. when i think of organics i think back to a holiday in Nepal 15yrs ago where you only ate in a restaurant where the vegetables had been soaked in potassium permangenate (yum) and this would be written on the door next to the menu. so healthy - although better than the bum on the bog and head in a bucket!