About distillation of hard liquor, it is really not the same-- You can make shit that is pure poison, as was often the case during Prohibition...and it is also very easy to blow your house (and possibly your neighbors) the fuck up!!
Calif. pot dispensaries told by feds to shut down
- Thread starter vta
- Start date
About distillation of hard liquor, it is really not the same-- You can make shit that is pure poison, as was often the case during Prohibition...and it is also very easy to blow your house (and possibly your neighbors) the fuck up!!
abellguy
Member
I am not sure about beer and wine but with hard liquor manufacture you can easily run the risk of having a product that can cause serious health issues. If the person who made it was the only one that consumed it well that would be different but we all know that your not gonna drink every bit of what you produce yourself even if you aren't in the business and same with herb.
Even people that spray stuff up close to harvest on their herb aren't going to be spreading that type of health danger.
Similar maybe, but in the end, why waste time and energy trying to draw parallels by having to explain or defend both? Attempting to win an argument or make a point by saying "This is legal so that should be legal also" usually winds up as a long and costly debate and the original point of contention can become lost. Sort of like this thread!! LOL Over here, the new season is just around the corner and my county would love nothing more than a long dragged out legal discussion over constitutions, distilleries and oh yea, there;s that damn medicine too! The longer the debate goes on, the longer the new ordinances stay in place.
The med community isnt under fire in your town and my town because of distilleries wanting to be banned and in my town, the city and county baffoons arent interested in whether the 2 are related. They are only interested in controlling the med pipeline. Simply because they think we believe they can. Yes, you can make the argument that consuming cannabis creates no victims but that isnt really the point which is to say, we are beyond that. The real issue is we as California's voted in the Prop 215 and 420 measures and we have a legal right to protect what we have voted into law. That and whether yours and my appointed officials are within the Prop215 legal and given boundaries.
In my case, the bottom line is my county has done what now will take time to get legally sorted out and that was their primary intention. These guys arent all that dumb. Whether we win the argument that distilleries and Prop 215 are one and the same doesnt change the fact that this upcoming season, they WILL ENFORCE the new restrictions on growers and continue to pressure any surviving dispensaries and the folks who get hauled off to jail...will have to wait even longer. But by then...the damage has been done...CC
Sorry, but the reason people got sick from bad booze during prohibition was not because it is easy to make poisonous moonshine, but because people were selling ADULTERED liquor to make a buck- adding nonbeverage alcohols to stretch it.
All fermented beverages naturally have methanol,and even sloppily distilled moonshine will usually have LESS than wine.
D
dorkvan420
CanniDo Cowboy...I dont believe you are correct in saying that "we" voted in Prop 215 AND SB420, yes we voted in Prop 215, but wasnt it the state that illegally added SB420 to the original Prop 215, as I believe they couldnt do that(oxymoron saying government cant do this or that) as we as voters would need to approve & vote for the provisions they put into place, is this correct? Im not 100% but thought that was the case.......and in no way trying to start shit or contradict your words CanniDo, just i know I didnt vote SB420 in, just 215, and wanted to point this out.
oldbluedog
Member
that poison myth is fluff. unless you are drinking a lot of the first vapors off a huge still then you might get some methanol and other nasties. The rest is sweet moonshine...lol
LOL DV...Um actually bro, techincally youre right...420 was an amendment (Senate Bill) to P215..Hey, 2 pages of me rambling and ya comment on an clerical error? Jeeez, tough crowd... LOL CC
Well see there I guess is the difference between you and I, you read stuff and if it sounds good to you that becomes your opinion. I on the other hand gather the facts and form my own opinion. I guess what you share with all the sources you say I should read was a belief that Obama would legalize marijuana for you and now that it's not working out like you expected you're all pissed at him. To me it was pretty clear all along that marijuana was not on his list of priorities and any possible pro cannabis comments made were pure political glad handing that most politician's running for an office will practice. I never expected much from Obama, frankly I was surprised he even won because I didn't feel this nation was ready for a black President yet. I still have doubts it was but I guess it was less ready for a woman President and after Bush I doubt even Jesus Christ himself could have won on a Republican ticket. So unlike the millions of idealists that bought the whole hope and change thing I was not hugely disappointed or even surprised when things didn't work out the way I personally felt they should. When Obama talked of Change I always envisioned him working to get the public more involved in the day to day political process rather then just electing someone and sitting back for 4 years hoping they do what I want. Which is/was the way the majority of Americans approach politics. That's how he presented the change concept to his grassroots movement so I saw no reason to read anymore into it then that.
As for regulation of consumables I really don't care as I am not planning on growing to sell. I know regulations are tough and companies bitch about them all the time because it represents an expense and/or loss of profit. They could give a rat's ass about how good or bad something is for the consumer if they did then alcohol and tobacco wouldn't need to be regulated because nobody would be selling it for the harm it causes people. I imagine the same to be true of Commercial marijuana. People looking to get into that will be doing so for the money not because of some sort of compassion for the sick. This site even this thread is loaded with tales of how truely uncompassionate most of these so called compassion clubs are. To me the people that are truely compassionate are the ones helping people to learn how to provide for themselves rather then become medically dependent on someone else.
As for the why's and hows of alcohol and tobacco you got me on that one. Given how bad they are and with the government pretending to want to do what's best for us it's a real mystery as to why either item was ever allowed to be legal. It's a good thing though because if it weren't for the success of tobacco here in the early days of America the US might not have ever come into existence. Still setting that aside I guess the reason Alcohol and tobacco were approved boils down to extreme addiction. So extreme that most Americans will break the law without hesitation to have it. As evidenced by things like speakeasy's and bath tub gin. Which is kind of funny to me because the main arguement I see being used, since harm caused by marijuana is difficult nearing impossible to prove, is that marijuana is addictive. You know addictive like a nation of alcoholics getting prohibition repealled or a nation of smokers paying 5 times what they should be paying for tobacco in the form of sin taxes. See the government really doesn't give a damn about addiction. Not so long as they can tax the hell out of it to get their share of the pie. If they did truely care alcohol would still be illegal because it's one of the few, if not the only drug whose withdraw symptoms can actually kill you. Other drugs may make you wish you were dead for a time but alcohol can actually get the job done. While not as bad as alcohol, tobacco is pretty bad too. I mean talk to most recovered smokers and you'll find even years later after complete abstinance they still have cravings. More importantly though is the fact that smoking tobacco not only harms the smoker but others around the smoker. Yet we're supposed to believe that marijuana is still illegal because it's so addictive? I say bullshit. I'm a daily smoker of marijuana, have been for years. Currently I'm out due to poor planning and it'll be another 6 to 8 weeks before I can smoke what I am growing now. Now I'm not happy that I'm out because I enjoy smoking but it's no big deal. I'm not looking for places to buy stuff from, I'm not turning to alcohol or pain meds to pick up the slack and I sure as hell am not interested in trying new drugs I've never done before (so much for the gateway drug theory
).Alcohol and tobacco are two of the most addictive things on the planet. Alcohol is not only addictive but is often responsible for making people do things they will severely regret when they sober up. If that weren't enough it's actually so freaking toxic to the human body that the liver and kidney's need to convert it into an acid corrosive enough to eat thru metal before they can remove it from the our systems. Which is why long term alcoholism has the destructive impact it has on the human body. Tobacco is almost as bad but in a very different way. To me the worst thing about it is that it does absolutely no good for you until the point you've become addicted to it. That's when you start to experience the nerve calming effects people credit tobacco with. All it's really doing though is calming the body's craving for it. Beyond that it is a taste one must learn to like. Most need to learn how to inhale it without coughing, it makes you smell and stinks up just about everything in places where the smoke is allowed to linger. Go into a cigarette smoker's home and you'll find that almost everything, walls, ceiling, furniture, clothes etc has a thin layer of tannish colored residue on it this is from the smoke. It's also one of if not the leading cause of heart disease and lung disease in this country if not the world. So if the government needs to protect us from ourselves so much then yeah, why is alcohol and tobacco legal but MJ isn't? The only answer I can come up with is that those of us who want it legal have not applied enough pressure to cause the government to change their position like they did with alcohol.
Yes, about many things.
Well then I guess all the people I see buying home brewing kits and entering into home brewing contests are operating illegally and I'm talking hundreds just in the immediate area I'm currently in, are either operating illegally or the permits are easy and cheap to get. I say that because most of the people I see doing this do so to try to save money from buying beer and live pay check to paycheck, they also don't seem to be the sharpest tools in the shed. Now the people I know who grow tobacco aren't typical as they're all farmers who happen to grow their own tobacco because they have the space and skill to do so. I've never asked them about whether or not it's legal to do so but I imagine that they would think like me and say "who cares as long as I'm not selling it or giving it to anyone else?"
I wonder though you compare it to LLC's and other corporate structures so is this only the case for those distilling with the intent to sell it? If so that's not the people I'm talking about. It must be though because surely ATF doesn't believe all these people buying home brewing kits are going to be putting the beer they make into cars yet according to what you say the only way one could get approved is to say just that. Nor am I seeing raids on stores selling home brewing kits so the government seems to be okay with everything just so long as one isn't trying to distribute and profit from what they make. On another note if you're correct that corporations are not legally bound by the same restrictions as the private individual then how could they possibly enjoy the rights of an individual when it comes to taxes and political contributions? Seems to me there should be some sort of legal action that can be taken against such selective distribution and restriction of rights.
Hate to say it, but you are pretty off base about how the body deals with alcohol.
Your stomach is full of Hydrochloric acid that is vastly more acidic than the small amounts of acetic acid formed by ethanol metabolism. Which, by the way, is a pathway essential to almost all forms of life- even when alcohol is not deliberately drunk, it is formed by natural process in the body, which is why there are specific enzymes to metabolize it.
Also, you don't seem to get it about distilling- as has been correctly pointed out, unless you have either a federal permit to make fuel, or an actual license to make booze, it IS illegal to produce, period, whether you are going to sell it or not. Beer is completely different, but was also illegal to make at home, even for personal use, until 1978- it was left out of the law repealing prohibition until then.
Your stomach is full of Hydrochloric acid that is vastly more acidic than the small amounts of acetic acid formed by ethanol metabolism. Which, by the way, is a pathway essential to almost all forms of life- even when alcohol is not deliberately drunk, it is formed by natural process in the body, which is why there are specific enzymes to metabolize it.
Also, you don't seem to get it about distilling- as has been correctly pointed out, unless you have either a federal permit to make fuel, or an actual license to make booze, it IS illegal to produce, period, whether you are going to sell it or not. Beer is completely different, but was also illegal to make at home, even for personal use, until 1978- it was left out of the law repealing prohibition until then.
Now this is something we can all do and we should all be in relative agreement on. So long as people also understand you can really only take someone to task for not doing what you elected them to do, when you make it clear to them what you want and that is why in fact they were elected by you. I remember hearing GW Bush tell the nation that 2/3rd's of Americans favor amnesty for illegal immigrants while at the same time poll after poll was coming out demonstrating that over 90% of Americans were against that very thing. The only way a politician can have such a disconnect from the people he/she serves is if most of those people aren't really making their feelings known allowing the politician to formulate opinions from the few that are making their feelings known.
Ah okay I see now, you're talking about hard liquor while I was only ever refering to homemade beer. I have no idea what the laws are governing the manufacture of hard liquor but as has been pointed out it is potentially very dangerous and therefore regulation even to the level of private citizens is probably a good thing. Then again I've never met anyone into making their own liquor so I have nothing to draw on for that topic.
Well if you had actually been following that point from it's origin you would have seen I was only ever talking about home brewing hence my use of the words "Home Brewing" and "Home Brew Kits" in several posts. Seamaiden said she wanted to say what she said in response to my post so naturally I'm thinking she was talking about home brewing. When I finally saw she was talking about more then that I commented on and acknowledge that but you had already made your post.
As for the way the body metabolizes alcohol, well I was taught what I refered to from books and people with credentials I could check. You are essentially a nameless, faceless entity who may or may not have an agenda, who I have no way of checking on. So in this case I'll trust the verifiable sources I got my information from and take your words with a grain of salt.
Or you could just check any Biology textbook published in the past 60 years or so...
Why should I when what I got came from a biology teacher and a biology text book published in the past 60 years or so?
D
dorkvan420
Jeez Cannido it was just an observation, dont get your panties in a bunch !!!!!!
Enjoy all the arguing I'd much rather go work in the garden, no attitudes and egos out there!!!
These cannabis websites are getting ridiculous, thank goodness there just for reference!!!
Enjoy all the arguing I'd much rather go work in the garden, no attitudes and egos out there!!!
These cannabis websites are getting ridiculous, thank goodness there just for reference!!!
Calif. pot dispensaries told by feds to shut down
U.S. prosecutors send letters even though state law allows
SAN FRANCISCO — Federal prosecutors have launched a crackdown on pot dispensaries in California, warning the stores that they must shut down in 45 days or face criminal charges and confiscation of their property even if they are operating legally under the state's 15-year-old medical marijuana law.
Marijuana plants are shown for sale in a medical marijuana dispensary in Oakland, Calif.
In an escalation of the ongoing conflict between the U.S. government and the nation's burgeoning medical marijuana industry, California's s four U.S. attorneys sent letters Wednesday and Thursday notifying at least 16 pot shops or their landlords that they are violating federal drug laws, even though medical marijuana is legal in California. The attorneys are scheduled to announce their coordinated crackdown at a Friday news conference.
Their offices refused to confirm the closure orders. The Associated Press obtained copies of the letters that a prosecutor sent to 12 San Diego dispensaries. They state that federal law "takes precedence over state law and applies regardless of the particular uses for which a dispensary is selling and distributing marijuana."
"Under United States law, a dispensary's operations involving sales and distribution of marijuana are illegal and subject to criminal prosecution and civil enforcement actions," letters signed by U.S. Attorney Laura Duffy in San Diego read. "Real and personal property involved in such operations are subject to seizure by and forfeiture to the United States ... regardless of the purported purpose of the dispensary."
The move comes a little more than two months after the Obama administration toughened its stand on medical marijuana following a two-year period during which federal officials had indicated they would not move aggressively against dispensaries in compliance with laws in the 16 states where pot is legal for people with doctors' recommendations.
The Department of Justice issued a policy memo to federal prosecutors in late June stating that marijuana dispensaries and licensed growers in states with medical marijuana laws could face prosecution for violating federal drug and money-laundering laws. The effort to shutter California dispensaries appears to be the most far-reaching effort so far to put that guidance into action.
"This really shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone. The administration is simply making good on multiple threats issued since President Obama took office," Kevin Sabet, a former adviser to the president's drug czar who is a fellow at the University of Pennsylvania's Center for Substance Abuse Solutions. "The challenge is to balance the scarcity of law enforcement resources and the sanctity of this country's medication approval process. It seems like the administration is simply making good on multiple statements made previously to appropriately strike that balance."
IRS ruling strikes fear in medical marijuana industry
Greg Anton, a lawyer who represents the Marin Alliance for Medical Marijuana, said the 14-year-old dispensary's landlord received an "extremely threatening" letter Wednesday invoking a federal law that imposes additional penalties for selling drugs within 1,000 feet of schools, parks and playgrounds.
The landlord was ordered to evict the pot club or risk imprisonment, plus forfeiture of the property and all the rent he has collected while the dispensary has been in business, Anton said.
The Marin Alliance's founder "has been paying state and federal taxes for 14 years, and they have cashed all the checks," he said. "All I hear from Obama is whining about his budget, but he has money to do this which will actually reduce revenues."
Ok ok. I.E. people not for the MEDICINAL MOVEMENT, and only in it for the dolla dolla bill. BEWARE: Your Being Watched and your get rich quick scheme IS TO GOOD TO BE TRUE,
I have said this, Demonstration, it, and predicted it, to be our demise of the only Door we open to Legalizing Marijuana since 1937. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marihuana_Tax_Act_of_1937 )
But i dont believe in fear tactics, I believe in Strengthening Tactics, for results. Not to cry, but try!!!!
This plant was so prohibited, we couldn't use it to wipe your Butt with. Why? Because of Money.... Randolph Hearst, who started the Prohibition on Cannabis to Fatten up his already rather HUGE POCKETS. As well as contributors like Budweiser, Miller, and any other product that might effect their bottom line MONEY, Like Paper (we would have our forest back), Clothing ( Cotton Industry, clothing, to department stores), Medication ( FDA makes BILLIONS) ( DEA is well paid too) , GAS, oil ( affected oil Drilling, big corporations like Chevron, Car Companies, our Government, car sales ) . Materials that were so strong they didn't break. And thus less replacing, less spending, less money, less likely to try anything else, Less Consumers. More D.I.Y. People. also it wasVery Strong Wood ( building supplies, housing, realty). Lets move on shall we.
Farming ( everyone would want to use our " Valuable Growing Space" we were small minded in early 1900 and didnt see the BIG PICTURE of Crops.) Alcohol ( This Huge Industry knows Marijuana will limit if not completely Eliminate any need or urges for Alcohol in whats very Physically Addictive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CAN CAUSE DEATH IF NOT WEANED OFF. AND WAS A HUGE PROBLEM DURING THE DEPRESSION. WHEN AA WAS FORMED. If you ask me, that is more defined under as any Scheduled 1 Drug. Which i quote directly from United States of America's Government's Classifications.
This in the decline in sales, in which late 1920's in the great Depression, Budweiser, Miller, Ford, paid for our Bill on that MASTERCARD. Before America went into a further slump. If Cannabis was the Sole Reason we made it out of the depression. Just think of how we would look at it now. Just like Beer. Or like Henry Ford, looked at a indirect hero of the rescue, of the great depression in the late 1920's.
Im sure i am missing Many other industries, but these are just a few to name off the top of my Head. And if you have not Youtube Henry Ford hemp Car. An almost indestructible Hardened Oil outer Shell, to interior design, engine oil, and Gas. Henry Ford was always looking for cheap, economical ways, to build automotive as fast as they can Sell. A practice that is still used to this day by the company. But because of our governments witch hunt on Marijuana, He was denied this proto type of a new type of Auto Mobile. During the Craze of DRIVING. and he moved on to other projects as any Inventor, Biz-nes minded person would do. Prime Example of possible explosion in a financial stance, in just one industry, from just one man, Whos Name we see every day on the way to work.....
Randolf Rudolf Hearst, in my opinion was a Crooked man, who cared nothing about society, and only cared about his obsessions, and his need to have the biggest, the best, the most expensive, and the most Uniqe items, He had many different Honey Pots so to speak, from cotton industry, to buying Rare things from all over the world, just to have them shipped to his own Docking station, right over the West Coast. From Art, To Zebras. Pools made of 24 K gold. Yet this man had a big fish to Fry. MARIJUANA
He knew that Marijuana was one of the only things that could affect His bottom line, and change the country as we knew it. If we had one product that did what 20 products do, or 100. He knew his Diversity, and gambles would be less if he put it all in one pot. So him and other Political Figures decided to start MARIJUANA MADNESS!!! THE BIGGEST REASON WHY ITS ILLEGAL TO THIS DAY. MARIJUANA MADNESS> IT WILL MAKE YOU RAPE< STEAL< KILL< WANT TO FLY. They made a 2 hour black and white movie about it, i recommend you watch if you want a good laugh.... Make sure to pack it up! LOL its funny...
Well, this lead to education, Family, friends, teachers, church officials, to be educated, on WHAT TO LOOK FOR, if you suspect marijuana use. typical, roaches in the ash tray, red eyes, among im sure some ridiculous things said, for physiological warfare, that just started on a plant, which has no brain, or no mouth. And 80 years later, its seeming to win over without a word....
This FEAR that was started by our government, which is a whole lot more detailed then what i just explained. They used anything from mexicans to how you will kill your mother, as to why we should not grow this plant..... That we have already been growing in a INDUSTRIAL STYLE way for a Century just in the American Culture, let alone around the WORLD.
Now to back up. Yes. we had full on operations, of Hemp farming. Farms full of 8 foot marijuana plants, that were grown, harvested, and was one of the hardest things to work with. Until a new machine was invented to help the harvest portion of the farming, and the processing of the hemp, which was fiber that was in strength unheard of. Even in LEATHER. Our Declaration of Independence was written on Hemp Paper. It still looks brand new to this day without age. not because of preservation of history, but because the preservation of Hemp Paper and its properties.
Everything i mention here is easy to find with a simple google. if you want links. p.m. me. We always can learn something new everyday.
So here we are, in 2012...... WOW what a wait!!!! a handful of sick and dying patients were able to go through the hoops of funding, getting enough signatures, attention, and legal help, which in my opinion, and my heart, was a miracal. in 1997, we finally RE LEGALIZED MARIJUANA AS A MEDICATION. As Before 1930's it was in our pharmacy and was used as a aspirin, pregnant women, as a oil ointment, all kinds of things. So Marijuana as a Medicine, is nothing New, except to United States, who after only 250 years of being a country and completely slaughtering, destroying, and erasing the actual Culture that Originated here 1000's of years ago with Indians. In which im sure Cannabis was used as a valuable resource.
And having a Bi Polor Stance on Marijuana as a whole, and thats a fairly liberal comment compared to the actual, time, energy, and curoption, it took to not only make it illegal... but think about this burden now, to keep it illegal.
Its like Cheating in a relationship yet denying it at all cost. Even if the evidence is right in front of their face. Wasn't them. Like any true Compulsive Liar, Thief, and or Con Artist, typically very shallow people. So now we showed our true colors. Do these colors Run? or do they Bleed? For now, i see blood stains, and i can only hope the Kinematic Damage Done by The United States Of America, Will be a lesson, to the rest of Humanity. But unfortunately, the narrow minded, News watching, TV following, Brain Washed Americans wont even be prepared....... Because were to busy worrying about what cars are in our drive way, how big our house is, how much money (PAPER AND INK) they have, etc....
Because all the money in the world can never buy you back the time you spent, when you relise all you have are you possessions, yourself, your thoughts, your mind. Its your Choice. "To think for yourself, you must question authority. You must form in your mind, a place of Choas, erasing everything you have learned, and reprogramming yourself, to think for yourself. Question Authority. " quote by Timothy Leary
To Be Continued... I hope, to get into some more recent history, laws, misinformation, A Lack of Understanding, and some Major Clarifications on the Laws of Medical Marijuana, all across the board. But especially in our Mother State. California where it all started.... And were... It may all end... If you allow fear and your imagination run wild....
Were in a fight! Be prepared to defend yourself!!!! Always be prepared, equipped, and well educated. And continue to maintain that balance to spread the word, educate, and get more and more people informed on the truth! With Facts, and Scientific Data. and 1000's of years of primal use. Google... We didn't have it in the 80's. Yet i knew three quarters of this information. So it was awesome to be able too, in these days, google, and find the facts, and documents, to be well informed. So Use it!!!!!!
After reading about what greed of money does to you ( making gods gift to man kind illegal) Do you really want your get rich quick scheme? Or do you want to slow it down a bit, Think, create a system that is Ethical, Financially Driven for customers, not OWNERS. Those people are in for a BIG SURPRISE. If you didnt Visit the 3rd floor in Oakland back in 2001, the first walmart of marijuana..... Feds raided them and left them upside down in less then a year.... and any company affiliated with them. Those who remember, know.. It can happen at anytime, Like a drop of a hammer. and its done here in California. The other states legality of medical Marijuana does not give us strength in numbers. As we went at this, at a state level. So every state is a individual. Just like you and I.
Now do you think we should of legalized it in California, to be regulated by the Tabbacco and fire arms? Legal to grow, posses, transport, smoke, do Cart Wheels in the park High! what EVER! and also would of open the doors to Hemp production, which is the next big billion dollar industry. When and if approved.
It only took this state 2 years after the Failure of that Prop, where even Growers voted no on it. As they felt it would affect there bottom line in the medical field. But guess what . Its not about them, THAT LAW WAS CREATED FOR THE PATIENT. NOT FOR SOMEONE TO GET RICH, FOR SOMEONE TO GET RELIEF FROM A PLANT WITHOUT THE FEAR OF PROSECUTION < INCLUDING THE FREEDOM TO GROW IT.
This Right was offered to you as Citizen without having Disabilities. Yet it still wasn't enough.... 2 years later we are twice as bad off, with gangsters owning a lot of clubs in L.A. and they are giving us a BAD reputation with their high prices, false genetics, and lack of care for a patient. So when and if they tighten it up, to get rid of all the Loose Ends. I hope all this greed and corruption hasn't ruined the chance for people who NEED TO GROW IT will be safe from going to Prison. I guess we forget, before 1997, 5 plants would give you a Minimum of 4 years in Prison. and just 2 years ago, over a ounce was a FELONY! 28 grams...... Chew on that for a bit. Thanks for reading.
Dude, by no means is ANY of this going to get "my panties in a bunch..." And yea, it's a given that grow forums should be taken with a grain of gro-salt. LOL We're good bro. Meanwhile, in an attempt to drag this thread back on point:
Landmark Court Decision Affirms Legality of Storefront Dispensaries in California
February 28th, 2012
Posted by Kris Hermes
http://safeaccessnow.org/blog/?p=2366
Second District Court of Appeal rejects Attorney General’s argument that all collective members must participate in cultivation
The California Court of Appeal issued a landmark published decision last week affirming the legality of storefront dispensaries and rejecting the argument that every member of a collective or cooperative must participate in the cultivation. Didn’t hear about the ruling? Maybe because the decision came from the Second Appellate District in Los Angeles, the domain of District Attorney Steve Cooley and City Attorney Carmen Trutanich, famously intolerant to medical marijuana dispensaries. It would be an understatement to say that the ruling jabs a large thorn into both of their sides. You’ll certainly see no publicity from their corner.
The case People v. Colvin involves William Frank Colvin, the operator of Hollywood Holistic Inc., who was arrested while lawfully transporting a pound of medical marijuana from one collective he operates to another. Even while acknowledging that Colvin was operating a legitimate dispensary, the trial court denied him a defense on the grounds that transportation of medical marijuana was illegal under state law. After being denied a defense, Colvin was convicted.
On appeal, California Attorney General Kamala Harris advanced the view that under state law all members of a collective must somehow participate in the cultivation process and “come together” in “some way” for this purpose. In characterizing Attorney General Harris’s argument, the Court said:
The Attorney General does not specify how many members must participate or in what way or ways they must do so, except to imply that Holistic, with its 5,000 members and 14 growers, is simply too big to allow any ‘meaningful’ participation in the cooperative process; hence, it cannot be a ‘cooperative’ or a ‘collective’ [in compliance with state law].
The Court then compared medical marijuana cooperatives with food cooperatives:
[The Attorney General’s interpretation of state law] would impose on medical marijuana cooperatives requirements not imposed on other cooperatives. A grocery cooperative, for example, may have members who grow and sell the food and run a store out of which the cooperative’s products are sold. But not everyone who pays a fee to become a member participates in the cooperative other than to shop at it.
However, the Court of Appeal unanimously rejected the stringent requirement that an “unspecified number of members to engage in unspecified ‘united action or participation’ to qualify for the protection of [state law].” Perhaps most importantly, the Court said that the “logical conclusion” of such requirements would likely “limit drastically the size of medical marijuana establishments.” Furthermore, the Court said that:
[T]he Attorney General’s vague qualifier provides little direction or guidance to, among others, qualified patients, primary caregivers, law enforcement, and trial courts. Rather, imposing the Attorney General’s requirement would, it seems to us, contravene the intent of [state law] by limiting patients’ access to medical marijuana and leading to inconsistent applications of the law.
It should be no surprise why Cooley, Trutanich and the other opponents of medical marijuana would want to downplay such a landmark decision. However, at a time when trial courts are denying a defense to medical marijuana dispensary operators, the Court’s decision is a welcome one that is long overdue.
