Coco Tree's

[DJM]

Mowood I have heard the same thing from my Bro. A guy he know's is getting 2lb a plant or a bit more, but his quality is not up there with my bro's but that aint to say that DJM's isnt the bomb or the next guy's.

you can get large plants like that and still maintain quality..but for large plants you NEED high rh..as they require more moisture to stay hydrated than a small plant...i use to run 1 plant per light for many years and usually got 2 pounds or more...quality is the same as if i ran 16 per light

here is a pic of an old grow running 1 per light...plant on the left did 2.25 pounds plant on the right did 2.5...hoods are 4 feet wide as a reference point...strain is chem 4

 

[DJM]

I hadn't considered the rh factor tho.. Perhaps bumping up the rh is needed to run the higher temps n still get the fire...

I could see where the more moisture could be it, so the high temps dont suck the life out of the bud. Could and probably go hand in hand. But like I said Im also green behind the ears.

you are absolutely correct..cant run high temps without high rh or plants will suffer..just like you cant run low temps with high rh, which most do and that's why high rh has a bad rep

 

[DJM]

Not really. one may see a slow down for a day or so with multiple feeding, however if environment is good and plant is healthy they adapt and take off as well.

DJM, you are WASTING SOOOOO much space with only 10 per tray. What fucking joker you are, WTF? hahaha

Keep up the great work in here my man

Peace

in a perlite mix or small pot, id agree..they will adapt and grow but the root system will not be on par with a wet dry cycle, unless its cut with perlite or something else..ive gave it a try and didn't like it so now im cutting with perlite to start on a drip from the jump in early veg

i know, wasting a ton of space..total rookie move..i have no idea what im doing

thanks boss

 

[DJM]

DJM do you burn Sulphur? we love that junk, let those RH hit the 70s! Peace

nah never needed to...only had pm once..cleaned room top to bottom, treated all plants and ive never seen it again..it works great, but boy does it reek..i just make sure plants are clean top to bottom as is the room before flip..i also treated all the bushes in my yard so pm cant find its way back inside

 

[DJM]

yield and quality are not mutually exclusive..some commercial flowers, all from my own selections from seed

 

[DJM]

some more commercial flowers

 

[Yes4Prop215]

nice thread and those flowers speak for themselves. also recognized your grow from IG, cool to see all the details in here, feel the same way about IG vs IC. I'm in a hot dry environment so can't really do the same thing as you, but your method is similar to jackmayoffers new setup, root bound coco trees watered multiple times per day, with high rh and temps in first month of flower. but then he brings down the temps on them through harvest.

i did something similar, did the high temp high RH in first month of flower and had super crazy veg growth. but i still got many things to dial. thanks for sharing all your advice and tips.

 

[DJM]

nice thread and those flowers speak for themselves. also recognized your grow from IG, cool to see all the details in here, feel the same way about IG vs IC. I'm in a hot dry environment so can't really do the same thing as you, but your method is similar to jackmayoffers new setup, root bound coco trees watered multiple times per day, with high rh and temps in first month of flower. but then he brings down the temps on them through harvest.

i did something similar, did the high temp high RH in first month of flower and had super crazy veg growth. but i still got many things to dial. thanks for sharing all your advice and tips.

thanks for popping in prop. good to see ya around. been following youre outdoor season, very impressive..nice to see you gave it a try..once you dial in vpd, co2 and multifeeds in coco, its a game changer

jack is a good friend, he is one of the few growers that I always see eye to eye with, and one of the few that still inspire me..depending on the strain ill drop temps and rh 1, 2, or 3 weeks pre harvest..the more sativa blood, the later I drop it, more indica blood the sooner...this run I dropped it for the last 2 weeks..still experimenting with different times and levels..constantly tweaking my grows, cutting what doesn't work and implementing what does..always striving for perfection

jack flash, day 49

 

[smurfin'herb]

thanks..well i run trees.. so shoving 100 in a dome isn't necessary, as i only run 30...so only need 5 domes and root 50, then pick the best 30 out of them..also what other peoples definition of a clone isn't the same as mine..i root huge clones..only from main tops ..while most root tiny secondary branches..with big clones, you cant fit more than 12 in a dome max with them that big..if you do, leaves will over lap and it will effect rooting and general clone health...you can get 100% with 72 a dome..shit ive done 100% on 50 a dome many times..i do what i do for a reason..you can root 72 , sure, but how large are they? i guarantee you would need to veg them 2 weeks to be the size of mine after rooting

pure coco ; house and garden or plagron

during stretch its dependent on how many they need to stay wet..can be as little as 2-4 a day or 6..depends

i personally like pure coco but perlite mixes work well in some scenarios

i use straight tap water...i never use calmag

id never flower right at transplant, they veg a min of 2 weeks before flowering after transplant..flowering a plant without a root system is like trying to run a marathon with crutches

ferts are constantly changing, right now running a no name brand of water soluble ferts..called aqua grow hydroponic special..first grow posted was 6/9 and tap

Thanks for the reply DJM.
When i was stuffing trays, i could get 72, 5" clones in there. Your right tho, they dont turn out as good and strong as if you did lesser density. I rarely failed using the 50 site trays with rapid rooters. Those prepackaged deals they sell are pretty much idiot proof. The quality from the 50 sites was always pretty decent. Remember, more times than not, a small cutting will root faster than a larger cutting. I would like to do a side by side and compare growth rates after a few weeks of say 4" cuttings vs. 6" cuttings. I wonder if the small ones will catch up before the big ones get rooted up, and start growing. Now days Im like you. Take big healthy cuts from the tops.

I used to flower straight from clone with maybe a one day veg after transplant if i was feeling generous. We used to pull single plant 2 liter colas all day long. We were getting around 2lbs per 600watt light this way. They were sativa dom hybrids, so the shock at transplant would help keep them short, preventing them from stretching. This allowed for higher plant count. Instead of ending up being 3 foot tall with a wide structure and aux buds, each plant was about 1.5 feet tall with one single cola. 24 plants per light with an average of about 38-40g per plant. This was in cap ebb n grows tho with hydroton, not coco. The only reason i quit doing it this way is because once you pass a certain threshold in bud size, the quality starts to go down the shitter. At least with the variety i was working with. Coco gives best quality imo. I attribute it in part to its release of potash during decomp. Potash is the macro element responsible for quality and, overall health of the plants.

I didnt know plagron, and house and garden made coco. Interesting.

Have you used the plagron nutrient line before? Results?

 

[Fields~of~Green]

Good to see ya back Don

Pulling up a seat

 

[moses wellfleet]

Thank you for helping the community like this by taking the time to post up all your stuff!

 

[squarepush3r]

I got a question! You say you feed 6 times a day during lights on, so I don't know what the times are, but have you considered a recycle timer, and do a watering schedule like "5 seconds every 1 minute" or something to make it more of like a constant water during lights on (while of course having it dialed in not going to run off). Would a recycle time like 60x feed a day be better than 6x a day?

Just curious what you thought or if probably it would be worth the hassle

 

[Treetroit City]

I got a question! You say you feed 6 times a day during lights on, so I don't know what the times are, but have you considered a recycle timer, and do a watering schedule like "5 seconds every 1 minute" or something to make it more of like a constant water during lights on (while of course having it dialed in not going to run off). Would a recycle time like 60x feed a day be better than 6x a day?

Just curious what you thought or if probably it would be worth the hassle

Seems a .25 gph dripper would give the same 3 gallons that the plant gets in it's 12.

 

[DJM]

Thanks for the reply DJM.
When i was stuffing trays, i could get 72, 5" clones in there. Your right tho, they dont turn out as good and strong as if you did lesser density. I rarely failed using the 50 site trays with rapid rooters. Those prepackaged deals they sell are pretty much idiot proof. The quality from the 50 sites was always pretty decent. Remember, more times than not, a small cutting will root faster than a larger cutting. I would like to do a side by side and compare growth rates after a few weeks of say 4" cuttings vs. 6" cuttings. I wonder if the small ones will catch up before the big ones get rooted up, and start growing. Now days Im like you. Take big healthy cuts from the tops.

I used to flower straight from clone with maybe a one day veg after transplant if i was feeling generous. We used to pull single plant 2 liter colas all day long. We were getting around 2lbs per 600watt light this way. They were sativa dom hybrids, so the shock at transplant would help keep them short, preventing them from stretching. This allowed for higher plant count. Instead of ending up being 3 foot tall with a wide structure and aux buds, each plant was about 1.5 feet tall with one single cola. 24 plants per light with an average of about 38-40g per plant. This was in cap ebb n grows tho with hydroton, not coco. The only reason i quit doing it this way is because once you pass a certain threshold in bud size, the quality starts to go down the shitter. At least with the variety i was working with. Coco gives best quality imo. I attribute it in part to its release of potash during decomp. Potash is the macro element responsible for quality and, overall health of the plants.

I didnt know plagron, and house and garden made coco. Interesting.

Have you used the plagron nutrient line before? Results?

That is true about small clones rooting faster than large clones..This use to be the case for me..But is also one of the reasons I dialed in my technique around rooting large cuts, and why I only put 10 per dome..And hydrate cuts pre plug and soak plugs in a mild solution..with 10 per dome, kept uncrowded, from thriving health tops, large clone root just as fast as small ones for me. No difference at all. As mentioned I have large cuts poke out roots by day 6-7 and ready to transplant by day 10..i don't see how you could get any quicker than that with small cuts...large cuts also have more surface area on the stem, leading to more root shoots and a more vigorous and abundant roots system..Meaning faster growth after transplant..i also have one shaved node under the surface of the plug ontop of the 45 degree angle at the bottom, so roots shoot out of the sides, not only the bottom..Rooting is one element of growing that I can honestly say I have dialed back to front. I see very little room for improvement
I haven't noticed a difference in quality with larger colas or plants..Unless they were grown in a un ideal environment or were to close to the light..In most gardens the main colas are way to close to the light, leading to larger tops, yes, but also a drop in quality..As the closer you get to the bulb, the hotter and drier the air is..It all goes back to proper temps in relation to rh

Yes , h and g and plagron both make coco...Both great consistency and quality..I will say plagron is probably a little better in terms of texture..But not by much..Ive germinated seedling and rooted clones in both straight out of the bag with nothing but great results.. Apparently plagron comes from the same plant as canna coco, just different distributors. Its also very reasonably priced, I get a 50 lt bag for 18 dollars, h and g is 20 a bag..I use whichever one they have in stock

Never used plagron nutrients

 

[DJM]

:jawdrop:

I have so many ideas that I want to try now. Thanks for keeping the fire lit, and passing on the torch! This is some serious growth and info.

I'm using Growstones GS-1 with my coco, and they seem to love it. I like them because you can reuse them while the perlite just turns to dust at the end of my runs.

VPD...any good links/threads to help monitor and maintain?

My pleasure..I agree on coco turning to dust..Chances are I will end up cutting with hydroton in early veg..Ive gotten sample packs of growstones but never used them

Here is a vpd chart..Follow it and dial the rh in relation to the temps you are running. For lights on and lights off. Monitoring and maintaining levels will be up to the controller in you're room. And how you dial it in. I wouldn't be able to do it consistently without my controller

 

[DJM]

^The green blocks are ideal VPD levels for RH, in relation to the temps. So stay inside that and youre good

 

[DJM]

Also wondering why you don't use garden fence? I feel like if the screen was more sturdy your plants and room might look more uniform? Easier to install, just make a pvc frame and zip tie the edges/corners, but then again, your pulling 2.5+ off a 1k so I should be asking you haha

I own a hardware store and sell hydro equipment, have showed 5 customers your pics/thread today. I AM SOLD OUT OF COCO & HUMIDIFIERS! THANK YOU!

Garden fence is a huge pain in the ass to install , as well as to harvest plants from. When I chop , I cut each plant out of the canopy, cutting the trellis it has grown into..No way to do that with garden fence. Ive tried it in other set ups, huge pita. I also don't have walk ways or isles. My canopy is wall to wall, back to front. 32 feet long by 11 feet wide. There would be no way to effectively install and use garden fence with frames for a canopy of that size, and be able to easily extract the plants from it come harvest time , plus be able to reuse the fence..I use a double layered trellis. Some strains prefer a triple layered trellis..Depending on the strain, ill put a triple layer. However, most of the time I prefer a double layer..As come flush time the colas begin to lean over, making the canopy look un even, sure, but also allows light to get down to other areas of the lower canopy for the last few weeks. It really depends on the strain though

 

[DJM]

I own a hardware store and sell hydro equipment, have showed 5 customers your pics/thread today. I AM SOLD OUT OF COCO & HUMIDIFIERS! THANK YOU!

Haha that's whats up. Thanks for the support, glad it helped sales

 

[DJM]

Good to see ya back Don

Pulling up a seat

Thanks man. Good to be back

 

[DJM]

Thank you for helping the community like this by taking the time to post up all your stuff!

My pleasure man. Thanks for the love