Court will hear ASA vs. DEA case on rescheduling

[SeaMaiden]

Big pharma is the reason why women are being given the synthetic hormones that *cause* cancer. Why? Because, you can't patent bioidentical hormones! Here in the US it's illegal to use testosterone without a prescription. It's a naturally occurring hormone, but the government feels it is of such import that it must be restricted. Yet I can get progesterone over the counter..? In China you can't use facebook, but you can use all the medications you like. Except cannabis.

In any event, big pharma = federal government, at least one new branch. In fact, I think the branches of the government need a redistricting, based on whose lobby gains the most.

The ASA can no longer be trusted, folks should look into it. Don't be so quick to assume that rescheduling means that the noose will be loosened, just the opposite. Expect it to be like those hormones I just mentioned above (and hormones are another area where US doctors are depressingly IGNORANT).

 

[Guest 88950]

i see fear and speculation that you will no longer be able to grow Cannabis if big pharma gets involved.

what about those who are uninsured or too poor to buy big pharmas canna-med?

what if the specific cannabinoids in the canna-med dont work for some?

will those people be forced to suffer with their medical condition since they cant grow Cannabis?



it amazes & surprises me to see unfounded fear so prevalent here.

 

[rives]

big pharma is big trouble

I agree with all of that. However, there is no way that we can take this plant to the level that it is undoubtedly capable of. We've seen that it has the capacity to help with things like MS, arthritis, muscle spasms, etc, etc, etc. What if it can actually cure some of these things if the proper components are isolated? Some remarkable things have come out of bizarre origins as far as pharmacology goes - snake venom, poisonous plants, poisonous bacteria, and other things that would scarcely be termed "beneficial" have all been the start of some incredible medications. It isn't much of a leap for me to think that cannabis could be the building blocks of far more considering the success that I've had with it - shit, my topical oils amaze everyone that tries them, and my methods are little improved over aboriginal techniques.

Look at how CBD's have been largely bred out of the plant - it is relatively easy to selectively breed for the attributes that attract most of us. The medicinal side is more subtle, more diverse, and of little interest to most of the breeders. Take a look through the 'Bay, the 'Boo, and the competition and tell me that this side of the plant is getting the attention that it deserves.

There is no way in hell that they are going to leave the plant alone - there is far too much money and too many potential benefits associated with it. We'd better plan on making lemonade, because the lemons are inevitable.

 

[SeaMaiden]

SSH, I wouldn't know where to begin with presenting my argument, but between patents, how we already know big pharmaceutical lobbies (et alia) work and their ultimately beneficial results, both in the legislative and judicial branches, along with having their own representatives IN appointed government positions (look up people who head the FDA and staff it, for example) and the actions of the government in question I don't see why you don't see it. All you have to do is *look*.

Let me post a letter I received in my inbox last night.

http://www.tokeofthetown.com/2012/07/call_to_action_stop_the_feds_from_silencing_robert.php

Here's What You Can Do To Fight Back Against The Feds Who Would Trample On Robert Platshorn's Rights For Spreading The Truth About Marijuana

It's time to push back and expose the bureaucrats that are now moving behind the scenes to silence cannabis activists like The Silver Tour's Robert Platshorn all over the country. They are acting as a secret army, in anticipation of the upcoming spate of pro cannabis ballot initiatives. There are serious First Amendment rights at stake, not to mention their intent to kill the tremendous public momentum for ending cannabis prohibition.

"We must shine a light on these bureaucrats and expose their actions," Platshorn told Toke of the Town Friday morning from his home in Florida. "There is nothing that frightens them more than jerking them out of the shadows that hides them from public scrutiny while they do their dirty work."

"The first time I noticed something odd was the announcement in The Modesto Bee that Bryan [Epis] was given an extremely odd sentence reduction -- if he agreed not to speak in public to promote legalization," Platshorn told us. (Oddly, the link to the newspaper story -- from just two days ago -- is now dead.)

"Although we had strong claims, I understand and concur in Bryan's decision to accept the government's offer ... in order to get back to his family as soon as possible," Epis' attorney, John Balazs, said Monday. "At the same time, it seems un-American for the government to insist ... that Bryan give up his First Amendment right to advocate for the reform of our country's marijuana laws."


The Silver Tour
Platshorn thought this just a bizarre incident, until his parole officer, Scott Kirsche phoned and rescinded Platshorn's permission to travel to Chicago to speak at the national meeting of The American Bar Association, with this chilling caveat:

"I am ordered by my superiors [Reginald Michael and Frank Smith] to inform you that your permission to travel to Chicago is rescinded and you cannot travel to promote the legalization of marijuana without the permission of the U.S. Parole Commission in Washington D.C. You must request their permission directly."

"Last night, I began getting messages indicating that activists in several key states with ballot initiatives were being pressured to modify their messages or curb their public activities," Platshorn told Toke of the Town. "No one could pinpoint the original source of these pressures."

As for the forced cancellation of his appearance at the A.B.A. convention, Platshorn told us, "I can't begin to quantify the loss to the movement, The Silver Tour, to our TV show, Should Grandma Smoke Pot? and the financial lose of much-needed book sales that buy my groceries.

"I had planned a really powerful presentation that I believe would have raised millions of dollars for Grandma and a tremendous upswell of support from the nearly 400,000 influential members of that organization," Platshorn said.

What can be done?

Here is a good start.

"This man has remained in the shadows, but exerts tremendous power over thousands of people like me," Platshorn said. "The man who is ultimately in charge of my fate in this matter and all other parole matters, is Isaac Fulwood Jr., the Commissioner of the U.S. Parole Commission in D.C.

Call to Action: Thousands, Not Dozens Are Needed

In order of effectiveness, phone calls, letters and emails are needed to Fulwood with copies to the press expressing outrage at the actions of his subordinates trampling on Robert Platshorn's First Amendment rights and denying Platshorn the opportunity to address the A.B.A. and speak at legitimate political rallies to promote sensible changes to our draconian cannabis laws.

Correspondence to the U.S. Parole Commission may be sent to:
U.S. Parole Commission
90 K Street, N.E., Third Floor
Washington, D.C. 20530

By Email
USPC FOIA: [email protected]
Media Contact: [email protected]

By Phone
(202) 346-7000

USPC Officials: See the Directory of Department Officials

If you can't reach Fulwood at The U.S. Parole Commission after several tries, try him at the University of the District of Columbia. Presently, Commissioner Fulwood is an Adjunct Professor at the University, where he teaches Law Enforcement subjects, Community Policing, and Ethics in Law Enforcement.

"Please get the word out and take action," Platshorn said. "More than the fate of one activist is riding on this. Dozens of letters or calls will only be annoying. Hundreds of calls will get his attention and thousands of calls and letters will bring change."

Now, can you deny that the illicit cannabis trade is worth billions? If not, then you don't have to look very far to find the bouncing ball (i.e. The Money) and where it lands is squarely on corporate takeover of a commodity by governmental intervention and here's the rub--there is already case law from the 40s (wheat) using interstate commerce law to prevent a farmer from growing his own wheat, because it may interfere with interstate commercial interests.

Gimme a minute, lemme find the case citation. Here we go:
Wickard v. Filburn 1942 Summary.
Scroll down a short way to Issues and go from there. It's not a far leap once the government allows cannabis to enter the national commercial market to expect EXTREME controls, including on who may and may not grow and how much. I was stunned when I learned of this case, I'll tell ya that much! But I am not surprised with the groundwork being laid, either.

There is SO MUCH MORE that demonstrates this is exactly the case, like I said, all ya have to do is look. But, whatever you do, please don't tell me that it's all nothing but mere speculation.

 

[Smoking Gun]

Seamaiden, I read through that synopsis and you are correct the ruling does allow the government to control how much wheat you grow. However it does not prohibit you or I from growing enough wheat to sustain ourselves. If you were growing commercial sized crops, it would affect you, but for someone growing a patch of wheat in their backyard for personal use this ruling has no bearing.

If we carry this over to cannabis, then someone with tens of acres of cannabis growing would be subject to limitations on how much they grow. However a person with several plants, or even a small plot would not likely be subject to these kind of regulations. However regulations would likely make it more difficult for those selling several pounds to dispensaries to do so; but far from impossible. Think of farmers markets, these are places small farmers are able to sell their produce, and it does fall outside of the same regulations that govern supermarkets.

 

[MadBuddhaAbuser]

i see fear and speculation that you will no longer be able to grow Cannabis if big pharma gets involved.

what about those who are uninsured or too poor to buy big pharmas canna-med?

what if the specific cannabinoids in the canna-med dont work for some?

will those people be forced to suffer with their medical condition since they cant grow Cannabis?

I think you would have to look no further than how the present day medical field is conducted to find your answers for these. Standard treatments for disease are often not specifically tailored to the patient like they should be. The government allows medicines to be sold that include stroke as a side effect. What is the point of taking something to lower blood pressure if there is a good chance it may kill you? I don't know, but the FDA sure seems to think its worth it.

I agree with all of that. However, there is no way that we can take this plant to the level that it is undoubtedly capable of. We've seen that it has the capacity to help with things like MS, arthritis, muscle spasms, etc, etc, etc. What if it can actually cure some of these things if the proper components are isolated?

The real money is in the treatment, not the cure.

The thing I don't get is why people think if it is finally federally acceptable as medicine, that it wouldn't follow the path of all other medicines.

Can you grow oxys? make and sell your own viagra? Medicine is the most heavily regulated and controlled thing going. About 2% of our food is inspected, yet medicine is tracked down to the pill. There is no good argument from the opponents point of view as to why people should be allowed to randomly make their own medicines and sell them to the seriously ill. i don't think they'd be fans of going back to the days of snake oil salesmen.


time will tell.

 

[rives]

The real money is in the treatment, not the cure.

The thing I don't get is why people think if it is finally federally acceptable as medicine, that it wouldn't follow the path of all other medicines.

Can you grow oxys? make and sell your own viagra? Medicine is the most heavily regulated and controlled thing going. About 2% of our food is inspected, yet medicine is tracked down to the pill.

Many of us were growing this plant for decades before there was a glimmer of making it even quasi-legal. If we were doing this before, how do you think "they" are going to stop us if it goes medically legit? While there are certainly some valid complaints about medications, much of it is bullshit. For instance, I take Celebrex and have since it first came out. For me, it is a very important component in making life worth living. It was nearly taken off the market, and is currently black-labeled, because a small segment of obese patients had an elevated risk of heart attacks. Huh. You don't suppose that this increased risk may have been due to their obesity and related issues?

This society refuses to exercise, eats the worst diet imaginable with best availability of options in the history of mankind, and is the fattest in history. They demand pills for every problem and think that "science" is going to cure the results of their sloth. Then they bitch when the best efforts of the medical establishment don't give them a 100% cure.

Most of us have experienced some of the magic that resides in cannabis. I think that it is a dead certainty that we have only scratched the surface, and none of us are equipped to take it further.

 

[Weird]

rives

i agree with everything except that we as a community cant take it the next step

if we can all embrace cannabis in every form and communicate gracefully as a collective many of the things left to be discovered will be

how do we keep cannabis free to us all like the air

when i was a kid i could say water too but its not free anymore

 

[headband 707]

i do too and with Cannabis as a Schedule II it acknowledges there is accepted medicinal value and with that admission i'll take my chances in court.

i fail to see where rescheduling also gives big pharma an exclusive on meeting the needs of the public. sure its a capitalist market where only the well funded survive but it doesnt automatically mean the little guy cant survive.

adapt or perish

I hate to say this but I have become such a cynic when it comes to all of this now.. I used to believe in honesty and truth now I don't believe that truth prevails. I believe there are ppl with cash pulling the strings and no one can stop them and if they have known about cannabis stopping cancer since 1974 then this has been one big cover up. The scientist didn't march on our parliamant building with coffins for nothing headband 707

 

[headband 707]

I think you would have to look no further than how the present day medical field is conducted to find your answers for these. Standard treatments for disease are often not specifically tailored to the patient like they should be. The government allows medicines to be sold that include stroke as a side effect. What is the point of taking something to lower blood pressure if there is a good chance it may kill you? I don't know, but the FDA sure seems to think its worth it.




The real money is in the treatment, not the cure.

The thing I don't get is why people think if it is finally federally acceptable as medicine, that it wouldn't follow the path of all other medicines.

Can you grow oxys? make and sell your own viagra? Medicine is the most heavily regulated and controlled thing going. About 2% of our food is inspected, yet medicine is tracked down to the pill. There is no good argument from the opponents point of view as to why people should be allowed to randomly make their own medicines and sell them to the seriously ill. i don't think they'd be fans of going back to the days of snake oil salesmen.


time will tell.

OTC Pills Kill More Than Guns? Why Is Medical Marijuana Main Focus?
Posted July 27th, 2012 by Monterey Bud & filed under Business, Legal, Science, Studies.
Pssst… Pssst… "Mr. Obama, can we talk for a second? Did you know that your buddies over at ‘BigPharma.com’ are responsible for killing about 285 + U.S. citizens per day? That smokes the nearest competition on our race to the "grim reaper." The scary thing is … we know that’s the subdued number, scaled back by the unadventurous souls over at the "Journal of the American Medical Association?"
Since we live in a skeptical world… and most need some type of evidence in black and white, to feel "warm and fuzzy" about the info they will regurgitate; and use against the uninformed later on, in meaningless "small talk" conversations…here’s the source: JAMA Vol. 284 – No 4, July 26th 2000
This is an OTC pill slaughter of epic proportions… brought to us by the big boys: GlaxoSmithKline, Pfizer Inc., Eli Lilly, and Co. The not so funny thing about this –the Feds are about to hop on the profit train.http://www.marijuana.com/news/wp-co...y/are-you-on-drugs/not-your-type-of-drugs.jpg
　
The U.S. government will help drug companies find treatments for a host of diseases through a new collaboration in which researchers will test experimental drugs provided by manufacturers.
The National Institutes of Health said on Thursday that Pfizer Inc, AstraZeneca Plc and Eli Lilly and Co have agreed to make 24 compounds available for a pilot phase of the project, the biggest of its kind ever launched in the United States. [Source]

The good old boys’ lips are sealed on this one, no one in Washington is talking. They’d rather talk about the "Evils of Marijuana" than about the multitudes of prescription drug deaths. Where is the tearful child whose mother is addicted to prescription pills? Working the corner to pay for her habit, shown only on the evening news as a busted prostitute.
Make no mistake about it folks this is "chemical apocalypse." It happens silently, hidden in the shadows, and behind the nicest closed doors. To put this info into the proper context; imagine if you will, a 747 fully loaded with mothers, fathers, and other innocents… slamming into the ground, killing all on board. Day, after day, after day. Never ending, no help in sight… and not a word of it in the press.
But in this greed driven world, where a backslap, a wink, and a nod can bring mass death and greed-driven docs are habitually corrupted by the "good ol boys" that run these giant drug companies… and increasing our country.
As the CDC’s numbers clearly demonstrate – Guns kill, but at least you know that they kill. Their only job is to kill. You don’t expect your medication to have the same potential outcome as a gun, not to mention out pace it, and yet – the total sum of lives lost in the U.S. each year is crudely put around 12,600. So in a perfect world that would mean a person has a 62% higher risk of being "offed" by the pills prescribed by very own your doctor, than being killed by a nut-bag with a gun. Put another way… what happened in Colorado last week, would have to happen once an hour, every day, 365 days a year. CRAZY! Yet marijuana prosecution is the administration’s main focus. Source: Marijuana.com

 

[Guest304546]

yea i feel like an asshole

you're not an asshole bro, ..you're just a little weird, lol.

peace, AD

 

[SeaMaiden]

Seamaiden, I read through that synopsis and you are correct the ruling does allow the government to control how much wheat you grow. However it does not prohibit you or I from growing enough wheat to sustain ourselves. If you were growing commercial sized crops, it would affect you, but for someone growing a patch of wheat in their backyard for personal use this ruling has no bearing.

I got something rather different from the case and ruling. The farmer was growing wheat for his own needs, not just inject into the interstate commercial market. Of course, the reason for this case going to a jurist in the first place was unexpected from me, as I'd only read the questions posed and the ruling.

In any event, I can see rulings just like this one being used to severely restrict, or make illegal, home cultivation.

If we carry this over to cannabis, then someone with tens of acres of cannabis growing would be subject to limitations on how much they grow. However a person with several plants, or even a small plot would not likely be subject to these kind of regulations. However regulations would likely make it more difficult for those selling several pounds to dispensaries to do so; but far from impossible. Think of farmers markets, these are places small farmers are able to sell their produce, and it does fall outside of the same regulations that govern supermarkets.

Regulations like this will make it impossible. Remember, we're talking about an economic force that totals in the billions. They, meaning our Corporateaucracy, are not going to let the Moms & Pops run this show, they're going to create a situation where it's IMPOSSIBLE for the Moms & Pops to participate legally.

Farmers markets are still regulated, some moreso than others. They are not regulated like supermarkets, but they absolutely are regulated. Now, how many farmers markets sell beer, wine or other alcoholic beverages? None that I know of. I'd be happy (happier) if we could look to similar regulation for a more open recreational use model. But that's not the groundwork the government is laying down.

A bad wind is blowin' and it ain't coming from my hoo-ha.

 

[Guest 88950]

im not disagreeing with the potential for big pharma to try and prevent people from growing their own by lobbying congress but its all speculation and i prefer to have an optimistic outlook on things.

i still dont see this occuring for reasons already stated: not all people respond to pharmaceuticals or will have insurance coverage or can afford it.

 

[MadBuddhaAbuser]

Many of us were growing this plant for decades before there was a glimmer of making it even quasi-legal. If we were doing this before, how do you think "they" are going to stop us if it goes medically legit?

Yeah I know, For instance ive never even been close to quasi-legal. I still can get seeds. You're missing the point. LaRoche isnt going to get me for seeds, but everybody doing the cushy growing their own thing out west could have a problem.

While there are certainly some valid complaints about medications, much of it is bullshit. For instance, I take Celebrex and have since it first came out. For me, it is a very important component in making life worth living. It was nearly taken off the market, and is currently black-labeled, because a small segment of obese patients had an elevated risk of heart attacks. Huh. You don't suppose that this increased risk may have been due to their obesity and related issues?

This society refuses to exercise, eats the worst diet imaginable with best availability of options in the history of mankind, and is the fattest in history. They demand pills for every problem and think that "science" is going to cure the results of their sloth. Then they bitch when the best efforts of the medical establishment don't give them a 100% cure.

I'm not going to believe for a second that "most of it is bullshit". cuz it's not. Greedy companies get fast-track approval for untested meds, cover up negative research etc. That shit is real. Of course it works for some, but no one has any clue what half of these long term effects are. not to mention half the stuff is just two old drugs thrown together.

Yea, people being lazy is part of theproblem, but at least an equal part is the pharma world that tells us they have a pill for everything that may or may not be wrong with us. If we cant sleep enough, or sleep too much, or get tired when we are old, or cant get it up when we're 80, or can't lose weight without exercising, and on and on. It's a two way street.

 

[MadBuddhaAbuser]

im not disagreeing with the potential for big pharma to try and prevent people from growing their own by lobbying congress but its all speculation and i prefer to have an optimistic outlook on things.

i still dont see this occuring for reasons already stated: not all people respond to pharmaceuticals or will have insurance coverage or can afford it.

staying positive is good.


but.

1. they could always try the latest and greatest, or new combos, etc.
2. obamacare makes you get insurance. and of course it will save the world.........lol


not saying this is happening or gonna happen tommorow, but its just good to see your options

 

[Hydro-Soil]

big pharma is big trouble
--snip--
big pharma doesn't want to lose market share and they have the power to influence the government

The only thing Big Pharma has really done (that's obviously evident in my life) is make 'walking wounded' out of the majority of the population.

Stay Safe!

 

[Bi0hazard]

Weird,

I agree with what you said, its definitely big pharma along with the prison industry and alcohol companies - they even put up money to campaign against Prop 19.

The only thing I wanted to point out, is patients still have to go to a doctor to get a "recommendation" for cannabis which does still bring revenue to doctors, the way it's currently set up =)

Sure it may not be as often as getting put on multiple prescriptions but there should still be follow ups as well as yearly check ups.

I think we have a strong argument for why that is not a good reason to block medical cannabis, which is a good thing. =)

 

[headband 707]

Weird,

I agree with what you said, its definitely big pharma along with the prison industry and alcohol companies - they even put up money to campaign against Prop 19.

The only thing I wanted to point out, is patients still have to go to a doctor to get a "recommendation" for cannabis which does still bring revenue to doctors, the way it's currently set up =)

Sure it may not be as often as getting put on multiple prescriptions but there should still be follow ups as well as yearly check ups.

I think we have a strong argument for why that is not a good reason to block medical cannabis, which is a good thing. =)

You know I find it so ironic that we still need to go to the doctors for presc. You don't need to go the doctors in Costa Rica the Pharmasist knows all you need and will give you what you want,without a prescrption. I think it's a great idea to CUT OUT THIS MIDDLEMAN alltogether what a waste of taxpayers money here.. Headband 707

 

[Hydro-Soil]

OTC Pills Kill More Than Guns? Why Is Medical Marijuana Main Focus?
　
The U.S. government will help drug companies find treatments for a host of diseases through a new collaboration in which researchers will test experimental drugs provided by manufacturers.
The National Institutes of Health said on Thursday that Pfizer Inc, AstraZeneca Plc and Eli Lilly and Co have agreed to make 24 compounds available for a pilot phase of the project, the biggest of its kind ever launched in the United States. [Source]

That's new to me...

Experimental drugs aren't though. Thankfully not to me personally but I've seen the ravages.

Strange case. Was living in a remote town in S. Cali and had a neighbour couple with a few kids move in. Not too happy folks but the kids were doing their best. Apparently, a short while back, their oldest boy went to the doc for a rare brain something or other and they gave him some pills. The next morning after the first pill his left eye was looking right, like it was cross eyed while his right eye was normal. Turns out the condition was permanent. Sad case.

Then... Literally as we're packing the moving truck to leave cali this old couple pulls in, looking for a place to rent. Husband has the same eye condition as the kid and the wife has it to a lesser degree. Same story about going to a doc and getting pills that made it happen... no info on what they went to the doc for.

Both couples came from Boron... You know, the town where they make Borax, the 20 mule team laundry conditioner. Bad water, crappy food.


I really don't see it getting rescheduled. I would love to be wrong.

Stay Safe!

 

[TB Gardens]

F it, I'll just stay a god damn outlaw