The Problem with Ultrasonic Foggers

[PetFlora]

There are several problems incorporating a UF. They generate a lot of heat, which will quickly take your nutes way over 75 degrees.

Another problem with these devices is they are not designed for the high ppm DWC/Aeroponic growers use. Anything over 500 ppm will kill them in a short period of time.

I learned this the hard way, so you don't have to.

The concept of creating a nutrient dense fog for the roots to gorge on is better served with ELX type fog heads and a high pressure pump.

This method also simplifies your set up as you will no longer need air stones.

 

[zenoonez]

I thought ultrasonic foggers didn't create excess heat? Hmmmm. I was thinking about trying foggers vs lp aero...

 

[Oldmac]

Ultrasonic POND foggers do create heat and the tranaducers get very hot.

I'm using an ultrasonic fogger, designed in Isreal and mfg in Canada, called a FrapaPlas fogger.


Creates alot of sub 5 micron dry fog. No heat.


Will take an 8cuft root chamber to 98+% humidity in abt 5 mins.

Just my -Oldmac

 

[fatigues]

Ultrasonic POND foggers do create heat and the tranaducers get very hot.

I'm using an ultrasonic fogger, designed in Isreal and mfg in Canada, called a FrapaPlas fogger.


Creates alot of sub 5 micron dry fog. No heat.


Will take an 8cuft root chamber to 98+% humidity in abt 5 mins.

I've seen their website, but no information on where to purchase one.

Could you please provide some more information and grow reports here using this fogger? This is quite interesting new information.

 

[zenoonez]

Ultrasonic POND foggers do create heat and the tranaducers get very hot.

I'm using an ultrasonic fogger, designed in Isreal and mfg in Canada, called a FrapaPlas fogger.


Creates alot of sub 5 micron dry fog. No heat.


Will take an 8cuft root chamber to 98+% humidity in abt 5 mins.

Just my -Oldmac

Interesting do you have a grow journal where you are using these badboys? What is your review of so called fogponics? Pros cons etc...

 

[Aerohead]

There are several problems incorporating a UF. They generate a lot of heat, which will quickly take your nutes way over 75 degrees.

Another problem with these devices is they are not designed for the high ppm DWC/Aeroponic growers use. Anything over 500 ppm will kill them in a short period of time.

I learned this the hard way, so you don't have to.

The concept of creating a nutrient dense fog for the roots to gorge on is better served with ELX type fog heads and a high pressure pump.

This method also simplifies your set up as you will no longer need air stones.

I am not finding these results, with my fogger, did you use the teflon coated ceramic disks in you fogger? I am cooling mine with a small radiator.

 

[Oldmac]

Hey fatigues,
You can purchase the FrapaPlas fogger direct from the Mfg: Plastique Frapa. It cost $629cdn last year when I bought mine, plus if you are lucky enough to live in the Ole US of A, you need to provide a personal social security number or a business federal ID number for NAFTA paperwork.

Yo zenoonez,
Sorry, don't have a grow journel, but do have an album showing the contruction of the fog trays and the parts that I used.

Besides this unit, I have built some smaller and cheaper versions of it for others. Fogponics is an excellent method to grow with, it is just "pure" aeroponics. But the trays I built, called "fogfognugen", is really a aero/fog combination since I use both a high pressure pump (180-200psi) with mister nozzles and the dry fog from the Frapaplas. Mostly this is for redundancy so if one system takes a crap the other will maintain it without losing the entire 2 trays (276 plant sites).

Biggest plus is NO MEDIUM, when done the only thing to dispose of is root mass. Biggest negative is when going from the clonner to trays plants tend to loose thier terpitity, they wilt badly till they adapt to fog. Much the same way cuttings wilt out when placed in a clonner. The answer to that is to introduce fog to the clonner. In the smaller systems I've built, they are being used from cuttings to finish all in the same tray.

 

[zenoonez]

629 dollars for one fogger? One fogger supplies how many tables?

 

[Oldmac]

It's capable of filling an entire room. But my design allows for 4- 4'x4'x6"deep trays, plus 2 ez-clonner 120's in the next room. You also want enough fog to reach 100% humidity in a reasonable time, and then let it cycle off for awhile.

When I built this set up it was to be state of the art plus last a long time. The brass inpingment nozzles for the areo side cost $13.50 each (bought 36 for 4 trays and discount). If you go cheap, you'll grow cheap. Nothing wrong with that, like I said before, I've built smaller and cheaper verisions. But using aquarium pumps and plastic spray nozzles gets you only so much aero vs. 200psi and .012 orifice brass nozzles and a 629 dollar fogger will get you 5 micron or less fog, and lots of it vs. a pond fogger based unit.

 

[zenoonez]

I wasn't trying to be cheap, I thought that the one fogger only ran one table. I was about to shit myself. So wait this 629 dollar fogger you have is coupled with a high pressure aero system or are you talking about in the cheaper systems you build you incorporate the high pressure aero to increase redundancy? Whats your on off cycle a couple minutes on and 15-20 minutes off? Sorry for the 20 questions, I just have always found aeroponics very interesting. What sort of ppms do you find to be best? I have always heard that you needed to keep the ppms down in aero units. Anyways, I will take a gander at your albums, sounds like you should do a DIY thread

 

[Surrender]

Excellent write up Oldmac! What's the maintenance like vs. a standard DWC or ebb-flow kit?

 

[auto44]

It's capable of filling an entire room. But my design allows for 4- 4'x4'x6"deep trays, plus 2 ez-clonner 120's in the next room. You also want enough fog to reach 100% humidity in a reasonable time, and then let it cycle off for awhile.

When I built this set up it was to be state of the art plus last a long time. The brass inpingment nozzles for the areo side cost $13.50 each (bought 36 for 4 trays and discount). If you go cheap, you'll grow cheap. Nothing wrong with that, like I said before, I've built smaller and cheaper verisions. But using aquarium pumps and plastic spray nozzles gets you only so much aero vs. 200psi and .012 orifice brass nozzles and a 629 dollar fogger will get you 5 micron or less fog, and lots of it vs. a pond fogger based unit.

how do you get that shurflo 8035 to put out 200psi? id like to bump my 8000 series up to 200psi but dont know how. do you use some sort of valve?

 

[Oldmac]

how do you get that shurflo 8035 to put out 200psi? id like to bump my 8000 series up to 200psi but dont know how. do you use some sort of valve?

The 8035 uses a pressure limiting switch, the one I have was set for 160psi I think. I just by passed the switch. Originally I had a return line from the mister circut to the nutes jug and had a inline ball valve to adjust the pressure, open it more to have less system pressure. But I have found that I didn't even need that, with the mister system closed the pump runs to 200-210psi which seems to be a "sweet" spot with the misters.

 

[auto44]

The 8035 uses a pressure limiting switch, the one I have was set for 160psi I think. I just by passed the switch. Originally I had a return line from the mister circut to the nutes jug and had a inline ball valve to adjust the pressure, open it more to have less system pressure. But I have found that I didn't even need that, with the mister system closed the pump runs to 200-210psi which seems to be a "sweet" spot with the misters.

thanks didnt know you could do that. i assumed since the pump curves listed didnt go above 150-160psi the pumps werent capable of those pressures. if i folowed the imaginary curve on surflows data it would seem the flow would almost be nothing though at those pressures since at 150psi its already at .21 GPM. how many of the BETE nozzels are you able to run at those pressures.

 

[Oldmac]

thanks didnt know you could do that. i assumed since the pump curves listed didnt go above 150-160psi the pumps werent capable of those pressures. if i folowed the imaginary curve on surflows data it would seem the flow would almost be nothing though at those pressures since at 150psi its already at .21 GPM. how many of the BETE nozzels are you able to run at those pressures.

I currently have 8 nozzles per tray and am experimenting with just one tray at this time. My original calculations showed I should be able to support 16 nozzles at a minimum of 180psi, and possibly more pressure.

And you are very right, the higher the pressure, the finner the mist, and the less water used.

 

[Surrender]

I'm having this vision of fog-buckets run by one of these Frapaplas units. I might have to try this. Is the fog coming out under any pressure or does it just sorta drift out the end of the hose i.e. do you just pipe it to the destination without any boosting?

 

[Oldmac]

Hey Surrender,

Sorry, between being busy with two grows and seeing patients daly I must have missed it somehow till today.

The Frapaplas fogger has a fan in it that propels the fog out the pipe and that can be plumbed to a tray or trays....or buckets. A major advantage to using ultrasonic fog is that the fog is sterile and will sterilize the root zone. It could be a great additon to a bucket based DWC system.

 

[PetFlora]

I looked at those, but was turned off by the six large, no problem for a commercial grower.

So I went the way of the pond fogger as sold in Walmart/Kmart, etc. ($30)

The AMS from Reptile Basics is all a small grower needs. The entire kit (including short burst timer) is only $200. If you buy a couple 'Y' fittings, you can run 4-6 totes. hehehehehehe

 

[Oldmac]

I have built pond fogger based fog generators, and they can work pretty well. I call it a "bucket of fog" and it consists of a 5 head pond fogger, in a 5 gal bucket with a fan located on the lid blowing INTO the bucket and a pvc bulkhead fitting with a flexi hose attached for fog out.

In fact I may be building another one soon for myself, to introduce fog to my ez-clonners. When I do, I'll document the build and show here.

Total cost is less then $150 dollars and the fog output is pretty decent at abt 1500ml per hour. Ain't no Frapa, but pretty good.

 

[zenoonez]

I have built pond fogger based fog generators, and they can work pretty well. I call it a "bucket of fog" and it consists of a 5 head pond fogger, in a 5 gal bucket with a fan located on the lid blowing INTO the bucket and a pvc bulkhead fitting with a flexi hose attached for fog out.

In fact I may be building another one soon for myself, to introduce fog to my ez-clonners. When I do, I'll document the build and show here.

Total cost is less then $150 dollars and the fog output is pretty decent at abt 1500ml per hour. Ain't no Frapa, but pretty good.

Can't wait.