I was thinking of planting Zamaldelica, Panama, Kuamoni, and either Nep Jam or Mextiza sometime next month, but I may just hold off on the Zamaldelica until I do a really long flowering run.
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Zamaldelica
- Thread starter Terpene
- Start date
G
gloryoskie
Hey, for you micro growers, Zamaldelica is very do-able. Flowered from cuttings, LST'd in
a 12" x 18" x 24" box along with a Thunk and 3 bagseed lolly popped Indicas.
Coco hempy in a 16 oz cup, dry weight 15 grams. Smells like mangos, real sharp.
Flowered for 110 days +/-. Fuck yeah. Sweating as we speak, will try some soon.
Thanks Dubi!
a 12" x 18" x 24" box along with a Thunk and 3 bagseed lolly popped Indicas.
Coco hempy in a 16 oz cup, dry weight 15 grams. Smells like mangos, real sharp.
Flowered for 110 days +/-. Fuck yeah. Sweating as we speak, will try some soon.
Thanks Dubi!
Zamaldelica
I hope this thread continues for a while, and I look forward to detailed smoke reports on the various phenos. It is impossible to find good info on Zamaldelica outside this thread, but looking for the ultimate psychedelic sativa genetics, recently acquired these Z seeds.
Also, I am interested to know what technique people find to be the "best" in selecting for a motherplant:
1. plant all seeds, take cuttings of all plants during vegetative growth, labeling all the plants & cuttings to match them up later when making a final selection.
2. plant all seeds, wait until far enough into flowering to make a final selection, then take flowering cuttings from the selected plant and try to root them and revegetate them.
3. plant one seed at a time, and if it is female, keep it as a motherplant as long as you enjoy it.
I got the regulars, not the feminized, so Zamalx(MeaoThaixMalawi), and am interested to opinions on the effect of the MeaoThai, compared to the feminized ZamalxMalawi. Was it better to leave the Thai out of the cross? I have been debating that in my mind for several days.
Also, I would be interested in any short asides/thoughts/comments, somewhat related to the thread, related to mixing sativa/indica genetics. As much as it may be true that sativa/indica hybrids are "the best of both worlds", it is equally true that they are "the worst of both worlds", and it seems to me that it makes more sense to perfect sativas and indicas in their own worlds for what they are each best at, and leave the mixing to the bowls. I don't see much sense in mixing indica/sativa genetics, which seems to be the dominant focus of breeders. It's limiting the ultimate experiences available from cannabis. It's not pushing the boundaries of sativas or indicas, it's just playing around with endless dilutions.
I hope this thread continues for a while, and I look forward to detailed smoke reports on the various phenos. It is impossible to find good info on Zamaldelica outside this thread, but looking for the ultimate psychedelic sativa genetics, recently acquired these Z seeds.
Also, I am interested to know what technique people find to be the "best" in selecting for a motherplant:
1. plant all seeds, take cuttings of all plants during vegetative growth, labeling all the plants & cuttings to match them up later when making a final selection.
2. plant all seeds, wait until far enough into flowering to make a final selection, then take flowering cuttings from the selected plant and try to root them and revegetate them.
3. plant one seed at a time, and if it is female, keep it as a motherplant as long as you enjoy it.
I got the regulars, not the feminized, so Zamalx(MeaoThaixMalawi), and am interested to opinions on the effect of the MeaoThai, compared to the feminized ZamalxMalawi. Was it better to leave the Thai out of the cross? I have been debating that in my mind for several days.
Also, I would be interested in any short asides/thoughts/comments, somewhat related to the thread, related to mixing sativa/indica genetics. As much as it may be true that sativa/indica hybrids are "the best of both worlds", it is equally true that they are "the worst of both worlds", and it seems to me that it makes more sense to perfect sativas and indicas in their own worlds for what they are each best at, and leave the mixing to the bowls. I don't see much sense in mixing indica/sativa genetics, which seems to be the dominant focus of breeders. It's limiting the ultimate experiences available from cannabis. It's not pushing the boundaries of sativas or indicas, it's just playing around with endless dilutions.
Apology
Apology
I must apologize. For 2 weeks, this was the only good place for information on Zamaldelica, and I was searching for information using a text-only browser, and kept reading the 1st 5 pages and last 5 pages of this thread, and got the impression that the grow wasn't fully completed.
However, I just now spent the time to read the entire thread with a graphical browser, and found that all the good information was in the middle - pages 6,7,8
And my post was a lot of ignorance.
This thread is full of all the information I needed to know about Zamaldelica, and I think I am happy that I chose the regular seeds with the 2 Malawi and Thai phenotypes. It makes the cross more interesting to me, and more of a keeper. I like the long-lasting no-ceiling no-tolerance "lysergic" sativas, but I don't have much time to mess around with growing, and generally, I find sativas to be much more carefree, almost as if they get everything they need from tap water. There are plenty of ways sativas make up for their long flowering cycle. I am the type that is happy to never see an indica, and am happy with the regular Zamaldelica selection.
I miss the highs of the late 70s and early 80s, and other than Haze, haven't seen much emphasis on these types over the last 30 years, but it looks like things are changing a little, and I am very happy for that. Old age and indica hybrids don't mix well unless you enjoy sleeping your life away.
Thanks to Terpene for all the work and effort he put into making this thread.
Apology
I must apologize. For 2 weeks, this was the only good place for information on Zamaldelica, and I was searching for information using a text-only browser, and kept reading the 1st 5 pages and last 5 pages of this thread, and got the impression that the grow wasn't fully completed.
However, I just now spent the time to read the entire thread with a graphical browser, and found that all the good information was in the middle - pages 6,7,8
And my post was a lot of ignorance.This thread is full of all the information I needed to know about Zamaldelica, and I think I am happy that I chose the regular seeds with the 2 Malawi and Thai phenotypes. It makes the cross more interesting to me, and more of a keeper. I like the long-lasting no-ceiling no-tolerance "lysergic" sativas, but I don't have much time to mess around with growing, and generally, I find sativas to be much more carefree, almost as if they get everything they need from tap water. There are plenty of ways sativas make up for their long flowering cycle. I am the type that is happy to never see an indica, and am happy with the regular Zamaldelica selection.
I miss the highs of the late 70s and early 80s, and other than Haze, haven't seen much emphasis on these types over the last 30 years, but it looks like things are changing a little, and I am very happy for that. Old age and indica hybrids don't mix well unless you enjoy sleeping your life away.
Thanks to Terpene for all the work and effort he put into making this thread.
Welcome aboard 2cb. Glad to see another exotic sativa lover. Terpene has proven he is well adept at taming these beasts indoors and under LED, no less. You came to the right spot.
In case people are afraid of sativa grows, this is my general experience over a few decades with sativas, which is not applicable to indicas at all:
1. Hang a HPS/MH bulb vertically in the center of the grow area, without a reflector, and then bend and twist branches around each other as the plants grow in the shape of a bowl around the HPS/MH bulb. This easily allows plants to grow 4-5ft (1.5m+) or more in a closet or room. You get about 330 degrees of lighting, and you don't need to waste money on reflectors.
2. Strip leaves that come off easily to increase total lumens throughout the grow area to hit the multitude of buds. I never noticed any bad effect from this, and obviously notice good effect on more buds getting more light.
3. Use large containers (50L) and plant many plants in a single container (6-12), instead of 1 plant per container; I have never changed soil in 20+ years (mostly perlite with a little peat and humus from past grows). My thinking is that cannabis is designed to grow in bunches and drop seeds on its decaying ancestors, and is happy to make its own soil. Although it may be a small sacrifice for individual plants to share soil, a bigger container allows all the plants to have much more rootspace for their long lives, and it's a lot less hassle to have 2 big containers than 24 little ones. Only fertilize if you sense a need for fertilizers, sativas are generally more like weeds and not so nutrient hungry like commercial indicas (which can easily deplete soil very quickly). Allow a healthy microbe population to develop in the soil over time, they are important for making nutrients available.
With a few small additions of nutrients, it is very easy to grow sativas perpetually without any hassle or worries about size. It is also generally better if you get busted to have a few giant sativas than many small plants. It's generally much worse legally if you have 100s indica clones (plants) than a handful of sativa giants.
1. Hang a HPS/MH bulb vertically in the center of the grow area, without a reflector, and then bend and twist branches around each other as the plants grow in the shape of a bowl around the HPS/MH bulb. This easily allows plants to grow 4-5ft (1.5m+) or more in a closet or room. You get about 330 degrees of lighting, and you don't need to waste money on reflectors.
2. Strip leaves that come off easily to increase total lumens throughout the grow area to hit the multitude of buds. I never noticed any bad effect from this, and obviously notice good effect on more buds getting more light.
3. Use large containers (50L) and plant many plants in a single container (6-12), instead of 1 plant per container; I have never changed soil in 20+ years (mostly perlite with a little peat and humus from past grows). My thinking is that cannabis is designed to grow in bunches and drop seeds on its decaying ancestors, and is happy to make its own soil. Although it may be a small sacrifice for individual plants to share soil, a bigger container allows all the plants to have much more rootspace for their long lives, and it's a lot less hassle to have 2 big containers than 24 little ones. Only fertilize if you sense a need for fertilizers, sativas are generally more like weeds and not so nutrient hungry like commercial indicas (which can easily deplete soil very quickly). Allow a healthy microbe population to develop in the soil over time, they are important for making nutrients available.
With a few small additions of nutrients, it is very easy to grow sativas perpetually without any hassle or worries about size. It is also generally better if you get busted to have a few giant sativas than many small plants. It's generally much worse legally if you have 100s indica clones (plants) than a handful of sativa giants.
got some Zamaldelica's just above the coco and they will get flowered in my 4x4 tent under 1200 watts so once they veg a bit ill post some pics for others growing them.
peace
peace
i have the 600's in cool tubes so that helps me out but ive burnt a bud or 2..........sucks but the plant lives on.
although they are in a 4x4 i am going to get a larger one and eventually convert to led's but for now the 4x4 it is.
peace
EDIT: veg shot
although they are in a 4x4 i am going to get a larger one and eventually convert to led's but for now the 4x4 it is.
peace
EDIT: veg shot
Alternate View
Alternate View
I have grown for about 28 years (mostly sativas/hazes), but I would not consider myself to be as much of a connoisseur as people on cannabis forums, nor do I seem to grow like any of them! It's just part of my duties in life to provide something nice for myself, and not being a reader of cannabis forums typically, I am not sure how much is done for perfection/presentation, and how much is done for practicality.
I am not afraid to hack and butcher my sativas. I treat them like crap compared to what I see other growers doing on forums, and feel a little depressed by the wrap sativas get for being "difficult", because sativas excel in their varieties of up highs, and deserve to be bred out and selected much more in their native gene pools to preserve their unique diversities/chemical-profiles.
I have no problems chopping off branches or doing heavy topping, even well into flowering, and I don't consider it much of a loss because the plant will then channel its energy toward more productive growth; and with the long flowering sativas, there is plenty of time, and no need to worry about a loss from pruning even a few weeks into flowering. It's no problem to even chop off a cola a few weeks into flowering - all the bud weight will simply be channeled into the side branches.
When I am growing sativas, I am thinking "biomass", and effective light distribution on that biomass. I don't care what the plant looks like, I will chop it and bend it and work with it however necessary to maximize biomass in the available light, and see it as just fundamental to growing sativas indoors. And really, it's part of the fun of growing sativas indoors - that's when you are really working with the plants, when you are shaping them and designing their growth pattern; and at the end of a grow, hardly any light should escape the cannabis canopy - all width and height of the grow room (except the area directly above the bare lamp socket) can be used by a good branchy sativa like Zamaldelica.
Contrary to the myth that indicas yield more faster, I have never found that to be the case (though my experience with strains is likely more limited than many). Indicas typically have big buds in relative solitude, but sativas can create a lot more buds in 3-dimensional space with all of their flowering nodes and branching, and for a personal grower at home with a small closet or whatever, my experience says that sativas win in yields despite a few extra weeks of flowering due to more efficient use of 3D space.
For example, with sativas you can use a 5x5x5ft (1.5 m3) space with a 400-600W bulb dangling vertically in the center and use all of that space for budding sites, with the exception of a 2ft (60cm) diameter where the bulb is. But with indicas, you are growing much more on a plane in 2D using clones; or if the indicas are tall, the buds are much more solitary with much more air-space between them, and not as productive as a "nest" or "bush" of branchy intertwined sativas that occupy all available radiant light-space.
And as far as electricity, indicas lose again in my opinion, because despite sativas taking a few weeks longer, they are doing almost all of their growth with 1/2 the amount of light (12/12 or 11/13). And they are not nutrient pigs either. So I disagree with most of the claimed advantages of indicas.
I agree with Dubi's comment in the "commercial" factory production sense where uniformity, "bag appeal", smell/taste, and lack of personal interaction with plants is the main concern - in that way, indicas excel; but for most personal-use growers concerned with a steady daytime/good-time endlessly potent buzz and high yield, I would recommend sativas across the board, excepting the "go to sleep" category.
I highly recommend people not be afraid, and try out Zamaldelica or other sativas from breeders that offer them. It's just a win-win-win deal all the way around for the personal-use grower unless you really want a plant that puts you down like a barbituate.
Thanks for the good thread, I have read it several times over from beginning to end and am waiting for my own Z to arrive, soley for novelty purposes of course ...
Alternate View
I have grown for about 28 years (mostly sativas/hazes), but I would not consider myself to be as much of a connoisseur as people on cannabis forums, nor do I seem to grow like any of them! It's just part of my duties in life to provide something nice for myself, and not being a reader of cannabis forums typically, I am not sure how much is done for perfection/presentation, and how much is done for practicality.
I am not afraid to hack and butcher my sativas. I treat them like crap compared to what I see other growers doing on forums, and feel a little depressed by the wrap sativas get for being "difficult", because sativas excel in their varieties of up highs, and deserve to be bred out and selected much more in their native gene pools to preserve their unique diversities/chemical-profiles.
I have no problems chopping off branches or doing heavy topping, even well into flowering, and I don't consider it much of a loss because the plant will then channel its energy toward more productive growth; and with the long flowering sativas, there is plenty of time, and no need to worry about a loss from pruning even a few weeks into flowering. It's no problem to even chop off a cola a few weeks into flowering - all the bud weight will simply be channeled into the side branches.
When I am growing sativas, I am thinking "biomass", and effective light distribution on that biomass. I don't care what the plant looks like, I will chop it and bend it and work with it however necessary to maximize biomass in the available light, and see it as just fundamental to growing sativas indoors. And really, it's part of the fun of growing sativas indoors - that's when you are really working with the plants, when you are shaping them and designing their growth pattern; and at the end of a grow, hardly any light should escape the cannabis canopy - all width and height of the grow room (except the area directly above the bare lamp socket) can be used by a good branchy sativa like Zamaldelica.
Contrary to the myth that indicas yield more faster, I have never found that to be the case (though my experience with strains is likely more limited than many). Indicas typically have big buds in relative solitude, but sativas can create a lot more buds in 3-dimensional space with all of their flowering nodes and branching, and for a personal grower at home with a small closet or whatever, my experience says that sativas win in yields despite a few extra weeks of flowering due to more efficient use of 3D space.
For example, with sativas you can use a 5x5x5ft (1.5 m3) space with a 400-600W bulb dangling vertically in the center and use all of that space for budding sites, with the exception of a 2ft (60cm) diameter where the bulb is. But with indicas, you are growing much more on a plane in 2D using clones; or if the indicas are tall, the buds are much more solitary with much more air-space between them, and not as productive as a "nest" or "bush" of branchy intertwined sativas that occupy all available radiant light-space.
And as far as electricity, indicas lose again in my opinion, because despite sativas taking a few weeks longer, they are doing almost all of their growth with 1/2 the amount of light (12/12 or 11/13). And they are not nutrient pigs either. So I disagree with most of the claimed advantages of indicas.
I agree with Dubi's comment in the "commercial" factory production sense where uniformity, "bag appeal", smell/taste, and lack of personal interaction with plants is the main concern - in that way, indicas excel; but for most personal-use growers concerned with a steady daytime/good-time endlessly potent buzz and high yield, I would recommend sativas across the board, excepting the "go to sleep" category.
I highly recommend people not be afraid, and try out Zamaldelica or other sativas from breeders that offer them. It's just a win-win-win deal all the way around for the personal-use grower unless you really want a plant that puts you down like a barbituate.
Thanks for the good thread, I have read it several times over from beginning to end and am waiting for my own Z to arrive, soley for novelty purposes of course ...
D
dramamine
2cb, nice post. You made a lot of really good points.
2cb, I must spread rep around but your points are perfectly clear. I like the idea of the vertical system. I am growing in the 2d scrog sense, but I have seen amazing things with vertical growing styles.
Vertical Light
Vertical Light
This is my 2x4ft clothing closet, with 4ft vertical growing space, with 400W hanging about 1.5ft from the top, and 2.5ft off the soil surface. 2 50L containers at the bottom with several plants in each container. The plants are pruned and managed to form a "U" shape around the lamp, and grow to 6ft on average.
I don't weigh things, but in my experience, an indica grow will supply me until the next grow finishes (approximately 3-4 month supply), with maybe a little left to spare. But my sativa grows leave me with enough for 2 more sativa grows (approximately 8 month supply).
The sativa's in the photos still have about 2 more months of flowering left, and will totally pack the 2x4x4ft area from top to bottom and side to side when finished. The photo only shows 1/2 of the closet. A 4x4x4ft area with access to 2 sides would be more than twice as good.
Vertical Light
This is my 2x4ft clothing closet, with 4ft vertical growing space, with 400W hanging about 1.5ft from the top, and 2.5ft off the soil surface. 2 50L containers at the bottom with several plants in each container. The plants are pruned and managed to form a "U" shape around the lamp, and grow to 6ft on average.
I don't weigh things, but in my experience, an indica grow will supply me until the next grow finishes (approximately 3-4 month supply), with maybe a little left to spare. But my sativa grows leave me with enough for 2 more sativa grows (approximately 8 month supply).
The sativa's in the photos still have about 2 more months of flowering left, and will totally pack the 2x4x4ft area from top to bottom and side to side when finished. The photo only shows 1/2 of the closet. A 4x4x4ft area with access to 2 sides would be more than twice as good.
G
gloryoskie
These Zamaldelicas are very hearty plants. I noticed they want to
grow and they like my 150w hps box and my cfl box. Almost foolproof,
I must say.
They veg fast and take pruning/LST well. And the yield is 20-30%
more than my bagseed indica blends in the same volume pots and
grow area. Responds well to nutes + boosters, a real trooper.
As for the flowering time, I can wait, well worth the time invested.
I grow micro so my yields aren't super magnificent, but man,
what a power house strain! Pure quality smoke, not for the
meek. 2 month cure is tight. Fuck yeah.
Thanks for the seeds, and for this very good thread!
grow and they like my 150w hps box and my cfl box. Almost foolproof,
I must say.
They veg fast and take pruning/LST well. And the yield is 20-30%
more than my bagseed indica blends in the same volume pots and
grow area. Responds well to nutes + boosters, a real trooper.
As for the flowering time, I can wait, well worth the time invested.
I grow micro so my yields aren't super magnificent, but man,
what a power house strain! Pure quality smoke, not for the
meek. 2 month cure is tight. Fuck yeah.
Thanks for the seeds, and for this very good thread!
