where did we go wrong ,the cannabis genetic pool

[Sforza]

I stand by my mentor:

77F/25c is the best temperature to grow

fall below 50% (33f/12c) the plants falls DORMANT (little growth)

likewise too hot the plant falls DORMANT or goes to sleep

as for genetic markers ...?

Gee! dna is all over the plant just as it is all over you and me,

vip:

a cutting is a cloned plant with no roots

as is a clone is a cutting until its got roots..?

I pity you trying to grow in chilly temps for 28 years

do you ever see any mature plants, do they ever finish..?

I agree to the fact, that there is far less (N) in those lower laterals

and perhaps more in the line of excess Gibberellins or even general hormone activity

sorry to diss you, I just find it hard to accept a grower of 28 years could 'discover' such a feat..?

perhaps you have a peer?

I smoked a lot of good weed in Jamaica and Colombia and it was a lot hotter than 77 degrees there.

 

[gorilla ganja]

u can grow at lower temps, But why ???
It's a common known fact that plants grow faster at higher temps up to a point. Providing there are no limiting factors such as CO2, water, fertilizer,light, ect.
Having said that my plants are subjected to frost most years and chilly nights are the norm at the end of flower.

Peace GG

 

[stoned40yrs]

ha, a disciple of that idiot Abducted. A case study of what meth does to the human brain at -10 degrees.

 

[Lester Beans]

I seem to be misunderstood lately. I am not being a dick, just questioning these broad claims.

You have to expect some questioning when you make a thread like this.

Have fun with your projects, peace

 

[Boyd Crowder]

im confruseded - can you edit for conciseness op? wait lemme try....
im getting you grow cold, that you believe the lowest 2 laterals are the most important branches on the plant. and that any clones from elsewhere on the girl are somehow inferior and not worthy for breeding plants that can survive 0*-58* in bloom. you believe the gene pool is being watered down breeding to clones from anywhere on the plant except the first two branches.

Is this what you meant? No offense, Im just trying to condense this theory in a slighty better english for myself.

 

[tazz11]

" the things we learn were once unknown !"

 

[tazz11]

Steven Hawkins was correct , the world as we know it is soon going to change and humanity will come to a end ...smart man ...

stay safe stay free

 

[Boyd Crowder]

Steven Hawkins was correct , the world as we know it is soon going to change and humanity will come to a end ...smart man ...

stay safe stay free

ok then
man i wanna see some sub zero pics my dood
show me some of your sub 58 work bro..
dont misundertake me-pics or it dint happen......
post us some of your epic galleries bro
for reals

 

[_tessarecting]

I want to see too please

 

[VerdantGreen]

Hi tazz

NO ,all of those 14 clones were cloned from C99 #1 there were 3 C99 mothers I have pics of the 3 mothers from seed to harvest ,but I also have over 70,000 pics for that year alone and I have over 10 years on record ...

the 3 mothers were grown from seed ,the plant in the pic is

C99#1

Mosca did some good work on that strain . I read he had created the strain from 3 different examples of C99,the monster clones are of the pineapple pheno ,I compared his strain with other strains and his won out for qualities and taste ...

if the 3 mothers were from different seed plants then they would not have been genetically identical - so your conclusion that

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]those cut away clones are causing the effects on the rest of the plant .. no other logical possible answer ... [/FONT]

is a seriously flawed conclusion. a logical fallacy
even in a so called 'true breeding line' every plant from a different seed will still be genetically different to a greater or lesser extent.

so what you have probably found, if all the clones from one mum survived and the rest died, is a C99 mum that is more cold resistant than the other two mums - so hey if you like growing in cold temps then thats a good thing right?

as for the lower branches on a plant, i never remove them myself because occasionally they can come in very useful to take a late clone and save a plant that is worth saving - so on the point of leaving them on i am with you.

cheers

VG

 

[tazz11]

u can grow at lower temps, But why ???
It's a common known fact that plants grow faster at higher temps up to a point. Providing there are no limiting factors such as CO2, water, fertilizer,light, ect.
Having said that my plants are subjected to frost most years and chilly nights are the norm at the end of flower.

Peace GG

u can grow at lower temps, But why ???here is the logic behind growing at cold temps . simple ("survival of the fittest")

"if there is no war we will create one ..!"

in our simple minded grow rooms are plants and strains are babied and pampered ,,they have no reason to defend them self ..

so I create war and the wounded.. many fall those that don't are the fittest !my point when I started the plants would fight the cold . now they enjoy it ,they are stronger and healthier...once a year ,one grow out of my year cycle and I have the best breeding stock I can get .I can make strains stronger by doing the cut away clones un like other clones they spend longer in cold temps because they never die ...

they do not re -root

the host plants root system feeds them there is no reason to cut them and slow their growth rates .. the large root system takes over and they grow faster and stronger each time ....

"It's a common known fact that plants grow faster at higher temps "

very true, and like the race horse running down the track . when given its freedom to run after being held back . it will run it self to death if you don't slow it down ...I hold them back make them stronger and then let the free and as the temps get warmer they grow faster and faster stronger and stronger ....

you have to build good breeding stock ...why cut your clone if you don't need to ?

Having said that my plants are subjected to frost most years and chilly nights are the norm at the end of flower.

but you cut your plants and harvest them don't you .. and then you have already cut clones at some point ?. I don't cut the clones for clones . I cut clones only to force growth to the harvest and to help build the plants root system so it can feed the cut away clones ...

my whole breeding op is based on those cold temp cut away clones

 

[tazz11]

ha, a disciple of that idiot Abducted. A case study of what meth does to the human brain at -10 degrees.

sorry I do any hard drugs at all , bad heart ...

 

[tazz11]

Hi tazz



if the 3 mothers were from different seed plants then they would not have been genetically identical - so your conclusion that
is a seriously flawed conclusion. a logical fallacy
even in a so called 'true breeding line' every plant from a different seed will still be genetically different to a greater or lesser extent.

so what you have probably found, if all the clones from one mum survived and the rest died, is a C99 mum that is more cold resistant than the other two mums - so hey if you like growing in cold temps then thats a good thing right?

as for the lower branches on a plant, i never remove them myself because occasionally they can come in very useful to take a late clone and save a plant that is worth saving - so on the point of leaving them on i am with you.

cheers

VG

no all 3 mothers had clones cut and then taken to cold temps as clones some did better then others and when those clones reach full harvest size the plants from each were tested .. having cut clones as well as cut away clones ...only a small number of those over all clones became breeder stock . the cut away clone won the race by about 82 %

how I tested this was by taking 3 of the clones and cutting the cut away clones off the mother root system at different times of growth . this told me the grow strength of the clones was in fact a effect caused by the cut away system ..and not just the rate of growth of the mother's root system ..so not only do you get stronger and faster growth rates in your clones .not cutting them the strain becomes a never ending un cut loop of that genetic strain ...my full harvested plant becomes much like the clones everyone else cuts . I am in fact cutting away the plant so it dose not slow my cut away clones down ...

I have no need to kill a root system that gets bigger stronger , healthier and better each time I use it ...

you leave those cut away clones on your plant ,I would say your strains are most likely stronger then other growers or breeders near you that don't keep them on the plants

when i cut them off a plant I can taste the difference and see the difference in the end product

I started with a few strains down around 50 now I can take the whole grow down to 30 and have spikes in to 0 degrees with very few fails , 5% or less , what really kicks me is the Abducted strain dose this normally ...I have no idea how it dose it ...how dose a strain adapted to a condition it has never seen ...? , I can only guess it has some conditioning to temps we don't under stand ...maybe by the vine rooting across the ground it has in some way build these traits of cut away clones normally as a result of its environment .

 

[tazz11]

let me show one of the test plants I am working with ...the first cut away clone plant is a tangerine dream the tall stalk plant is a Skywalker OG Kush that did not want to create good clones ...

now look at it ...

the point is I can control and change the growth rates of different parts of the plant and any clones it cast by under standing how this cut away clone system works .. now I have 5 or 6 nice clones of Skywalker

and if I cut a clone to give to someone . I know what those clones are going to do when they hit another growers warmer temps .. ..

let me try to explain ..

by it self the cut away clone system works great . but run it as a 3 part system ..


1. cold temps
2. cut away clones
3. monster cloning

 

[Coba]

If I may... more from the EB.

The control of the developmental rate by temperature is especially evident in many herbaceous plants of temperate climates. These plants, as indicated earlier, often must experience cold, either as seeds or as young plants, before they can begin flower production; otherwise they undergo an excessively long period of leafy, or vegetative, growth. After the cold experience, which can be given artificially, the plant is said to have been vernalized, or brought to the spring condition. Again the response is akin to a determination, because the condition attained is transmitted through subsequent cell divisions. Furthermore, there are indications that vernalization induces a persistent modification in the metabolism of apical cells and their derivatives.

^I don't think cannabis falls into this category but, I quoted for reference.

here's what I think is going on in the OP's garden...

...changes occur in herbaceous plants, in which the preparation for winter may involve the dying back of aerial parts altogether, leaving protected organs at or below the soil surface.

It may just be that growing in such cold conditions the plant sends it's "genetic markers" down to the "cut away clones" where, if I may quote the OP, "...like a piggy bank the plant keeps a record of its genetic ID in those little clones "..trapped in those "insufficient clones ".

 

[MJPassion]

don't cut the two lower clones .. they are the best breeding stock for that plant !

( "they are effecting the whole rest of the plants life cycle and any seeds or clones made from it ...!" )

How did you come to this conclusion?

Observation is good but where's your repeatable experiment that shows this is absolute truth?

None of what you are saying makes much logical sense to me.

 

[stoned-trout]

what u smoking?????? yeehaw

 

[VerdantGreen]

tazz, you told me that the 3 mothers you started with were from different seeds, and therefore they would not be genetically identical - so any phenomena you observe from clones from different seed mothers (or clones of clones from different seed mothers) are most likely because of those genetic differences.
the only way to prove your theory would be to do the grow with clones that are all from the same seed mother - then they will be genetically identical and differences in growth rate etc can be reliably attributed to different factors.

clones from the same plant are genetically identical - whether they come from the top or the bottom of the plant. that is known.
BUT the lower down the plant you take your clones, the more starch the stems contain - and it is this starch that is converted to sugar to provide energy for the rooting process
so it would not be unusual to find that clones from further down the plant will root and take off more quickly - its not a genetic difference
also, if you are taking clones from plants that are flowering, the lower down the plant you take them, the less advanced the flowering process is on those clones - so again the lower clones would likely root, revert to veg, and then start growing away quicker.

just re-growing a plant from the bottom two nodes isnt really cloning, but yes it works.

VG

 

[Jericho Mile]

...allow this guy a pass to grow in the freeze and believe whatever he needs to believe. forsake rationality

 

[Betterhaff]

DNA markers are just that…DNA markers. They do not change or move within an individual. And the DNA is consistent throughout most cells in the individual (some cells are anucleate). Sounds like the OP is basically selecting for cold tolerance.