What's going wrong? 4th run in a row is scr*wed :(

[smirnoff420]

Well, I thought I knew how to grow weed.

Grew weed for the first time in late 2019. At first pretty ghetto-like in a kitchen cabinet with some e27 LED bulbs, then a little improved in a different cabinet with LM301H one stripes but still nothing fancy.

Always used BioBizz Allmix soil and Grow and Bloom fertilizer. Eventually figured out that the rust brown spots on the leaves mean I need 'CalMag' too. Since then everything went just fine, almost too easy, basically just following the nutrient schedule plus Calmag 0.5-1ml per Liter. Had four consecutive grows go great, lots of good weed.

Then I tried outdoor in 2021. Went very well also, had some big ass plants with lots of nice weed harvested.

Now in early 2022 I went back to indoor, pimped up some cabinets with LED stripes, reflective walls, extra vertical LEDs, air intake filtration, carbon filter on the air output, yada yada. Thought: Now I'm going to get even better weed.

But since then, every single grow went wrong. It's always the same, usually after 3-5 weeks, growth is stunted, leaves show light green spots between the leaf veins and the stems get purple stripes, then later turn completely purple and then its over more or less.

I'm using the same soil and fertilizer as in all the successful 2019/2020 grows and apparently havent really changed anything.

I've tried adjusting ph to 6.5 with phosporous acid, tried less and more calmag, tried different temperatures, more light, less light, bought new BioBizz bottles as well as soil (just to make sure I didnt have a bad batch or something). Also tried 'diluting' the Allmix with Plagron organic soil that contains almost no nutes because I had the feeling they were too darkly green sometimes.

But, whatever I do, it ends with purple stems and plants that don't grow anymore.

From looking at pics on the net I thought it could be not enough magnesium, so I've sprayed them with a 2% epsom salt dilution twice yesterday in hope that this will improve things.

But they dont really look better, I have the feeling it's going downhill again. Plants are about 33 days old now. I've also repotted them into larger pots 3-5 days ago, but no improvement since then.

Please help, what can I do? And why doesn't it work anymore although I didnt really change anything?


Cabinet 1:



Cabinet 2:

 

[tdlf!]

hi
environment factors may be the issue?
if running leds, keep the temps up day26-28c, night20-22c, also get the rh up around 60% and ensure good airflow.
your containers are quite small, one single trough/bed style container may be easier to manage and allow better growth.
also top earlier to encourage lateral growth
good luck

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Cut a 1"+ thick slice of potato and put it on the top of your soil. Check the underside of it after 3-4 days.

Either take a minute long video or just stare at it and wait. If it's root aphids you'll see them moving after a little bit.

 

[Crooked8]

My guess is over watering. You also have thripps in cabinet 2 i think.

 

[jwm]

I’m thinking environmental as well. They don’t look terrible, just a bit weak.
You’ve got sufficient air exchange and movement?

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Environmental does not put spots on the leaf from root damage.

Root damage shows up as spots on the leaf, and aphid damage usually becomes most active around weeks 3-5 of flower. Been there, had that, got bunny manure and they left.

 

[Creeperpark]

Stop! Quit flipping because there's not anything major wrong with those plants. The damage is from struggling and trying to fix things when they are not broken yet. Take a breath and follow your fertilizer chart with 1/2 or 1/3 the manufactures recommendation. Don't add anything else or you may cause a crash. Your plants are ready to flip into flowering due to space. The plants will change during the flower so be patient go to flowering and keep us posted. .

 

[William76]

Did u bring anything inside from outside,plantwise?,76

 

[revegeta666]

The main problem is indeed a magnesium deficiency, but the spots on the leaves indicate root problems. So are they lacking Mg, or is there a problem preventing the plants from absorbing it?

Either way you can fix the Mg deficiency with Epsom salts, but not twice a day. Use 1 tablespoon of epsom salts in a gallon of water, make sure the water is warm so the salts will dilute correctly, then let the water go down to room temp. Spray the plants once every 3 days until the leaves look dark and shiny. It's hard to overdo it with these salts really.

Now is there a problem in the rootball? I think there must be, and if you say you are measuring your pH I'm gonna bet on overwatering.

 

[Creeperpark]

As long as you always used BioBizz Allmix soil and Grow and Bloom fertilizer there's no reason to have any kind of deficiency. The manufacturers didn't forget to put the nutrients in the bottle or soil mix. You don't have a deficiency. If one of the nutrients were locked out due to pH it would still be there and just locked out.

 

[revegeta666]

As long as you always used BioBizz Allmix soil and Grow and Bloom fertilizer there's no reason to have any kind of deficiency. The manufacturers didn't forget to put the nutrients in the bottle or soil mix. You don't have a deficiency. If one of the nutrients were locked out due to pH it would still be there and just locked out.

Nutrients being there and just locked out still causes a deficiency, as you can tell from the advanced magnesium deficiency in the pictures If the roots are damaged or rotting, spraying via foliar is a way to recover them without causing further damage to the roots with correctives. A deficiency doesn't mean the soil is lacking nutrients, it means the plant is lacking nutrients

Edit - By the way, OP: for the growers new to LEDs, another way to cause a magnesium deficiency is by having the lights too close or not dimmed enough. Don0t know if this is your case but I have seen it many times, including myself when I first switched to LEDs. I spray epsom salts twice a week until the 2nd week of flower and this has prevented further magnesium issues for me. Along with adding 5 g/L of dolomite lime to take care of the Calcium. But better to be conservative with these lights.

 

[shiva82]

is there no drainage on the tubs they are growing from? hempy style with soil? over watering i think also. when using organic feeds , and having low oxygen areas where the soil is most saturated will cause undesireable anaerobic bacterias to flurish and cause a bit of root rot and then effect uptake of nutrients

 

[Mudballs2.0]

These plants absolutely hate cold wet weather...if ur environ duplicates that ur screwed...by that i mean little to no air movement, which means the water doesn't move. No transpiration means the plant is in stasis...it's not dormancy, this is worse. I think ur cabinets air capacity and exchange can only support plants up to that size they are. You will need bigger cabs or mess with the environ factors such as cfm exchange, vpd, humidity, etc...

 

[Creeperpark]

With all due respect, I don't recommend using Epsom salts. .

Adding Epsom salts to a soil that already has sufficient magnesium can actually harm your soil and plants, such as by inhibiting calcium uptake. Spraying Epsom salt solutions on plant leaves can cause leaf scorch. Excess magnesium can increase mineral contamination in water that percolates through soil. Google

When using too much Epsom salt, you could cause an imbalance in your soil. This imbalance can lead to stunted growth in your plants, dark foliage, burned roots, and can also make it difficult for your plants to absorb calcium. Therefore, before you start adding Epsom salt to your garden, be sure to test your soil. Google

 

[LouDog420]

Check root growth, if it's lacking and weak, my guess is a root pathogen (fungus/bacteria)

Root issues can a lot of the time be solved or at the very least prevented with a beneficial tea. Earthworm castings, some mycos, and beneficial bacteria (great white, oregonism, etc.), and brew it for 36-48 hours, then water it in at the ratio of 1/10 tea/feed if you're actively fighting problems, down to 1/100 for just preventative.

Pythium/fusarium root pathogens will cause a similar issue. I went through it about 6 years ago where I thought I forgot how to grow. Bene tea fixed it right up after trying all sorts of shit to get my feed straightened out, altered lighting, etc..

LEDs require increased nutrients due to light intensity, so my guess it's a combo of root pathogens and underfeeding or the roots have been damaged and can't absorb nutrients properly.

 

[revegeta666]

With all due respect, I don't recommend using Epsom salts. .

Adding Epsom salts to a soil that already has sufficient magnesium can actually harm your soil and plants, such as by inhibiting calcium uptake. Spraying Epsom salt solutions on plant leaves can cause leaf scorch. Excess magnesium can increase mineral contamination in water that percolates through soil. Google

When using too much Epsom salt, you could cause an imbalance in your soil. This imbalance can lead to stunted growth in your plants, dark foliage, burned roots, and can also make it difficult for your plants to absorb calcium. Therefore, before you start adding Epsom salt to your garden, be sure to test your soil. Google

No one ever said anything about adding Epsom salts to the soil, much less when there is a possible lockout, you are putting words in my mouth there friend. We can argue if you want, but at least try to be fair.

Leaf scorch by spraying Epsom salts, you REALLY would have to overdo it. I will take your word for it but I have never seen it in my life, and most growers I know do use them often. These pck plants were sprayed with Epsom salts twice a week, every week since they were born. They may not be perfect but one thing they don't have is a Magnesium deficiency

To the OP: spraying epsom salts will help prevent the magnesium deficiency go further while you try solving the root issue if there is indeed one.

 

[smirnoff420]

Thanks for all the help guys. I will try to answer in more detail when I have more time tomorrow.

I think the plants in cabinet 2 look a bit better today. Cabinet 1 not so much.

I think it's not overwatering, I always wait until the soil is dry and there is a gap between pot and soil. But I noticed when they start going bad, they don't drink much anymore. Right now they're still drinking, but it already has gotten less I think.

Took some quick pics of the roots in cabinet 2, look fine to me.





View attachment 18784671

 

[moose eater]

With all due respect, I don't recommend using Epsom salts. .

Adding Epsom salts to a soil that already has sufficient magnesium can actually harm your soil and plants, such as by inhibiting calcium uptake. Spraying Epsom salt solutions on plant leaves can cause leaf scorch. Excess magnesium can increase mineral contamination in water that percolates through soil. Google

When using too much Epsom salt, you could cause an imbalance in your soil. This imbalance can lead to stunted growth in your plants, dark foliage, burned roots, and can also make it difficult for your plants to absorb calcium. Therefore, before you start adding Epsom salt to your garden, be sure to test your soil. Google

I use them rarely, but in decreased amount (1/8 to 1/4 tsp/gallon liquid), and only later in the cycle if deficiency is visible.

Less is more... except in my writing... Still working on that.

 

[revegeta666]

Thanks for all the help guys. I will try to answer in more detail when I have more time tomorrow.

I think the plants in cabinet 1 look a bit better today. Cabinet 2 not so much.

I think it's not overwatering, I always wait until the soil is dry and there is a gap between pot and soil. But I noticed when they start going bad, they don't drink much anymore. Right now they're still drinking, but it already has gotten less I think.

Took some quick pics of the roots in cabinet 1, look fine to me.





View attachment 18784663 View attachment 18784664 View attachment 18784665 View attachment 18784666 View attachment 18784667 View attachment 18784668 View attachment 18784669 View attachment 18784670 View attachment 18784671 View attachment 18784672

There shouldn't be a gap between the soil and the pot. Is the soil very compact? If it is, it would be holding more water than needed which could also cause overwatering symptoms, as it would be the lack of oxygen damaging the roots in that case.

If you have a EC meter you can measure the EC of the runoff water next time you water them, to check if there is a salt buildup causing a lockout.

What about the leds? How many watts are you using, what size is the cabinet and how close are they to the plants?

 

[Creeperpark]

rev you and I can disagree and still be friends. Just because we may do things differently doesn't mean we can't learn from one another.