Tutorial Organics for Beginners

[pop pop]

Thanks, scrappy, for the very helpful post. Is there a tutorial that says how to sub, give a rep, bump---that kind of stuff? I'm trying to learn about this whole online forum thing.

Based on what you wrote, I'll get a 25% balance of perlite simply by adding one part from each of the four bags, including the perlte. The actual percentage of perlite in the mix will be north of 25% as the LW lists perlite as its second ingredient---so it will be in a good ratio.

Once I get an answer to my second question (start the seedling in LW only versus staring it in the mix with the ferts) and then buy the POM 343, I'll be ready to mix. I have everything else. I can let it stew for a few weeks. Humus is a main ingredient in 2 of the 3 FF bags so that seems to be covered.

Thanks for answering the question on storage too. I have a new 18 gal rubbermaid tote. I can drill some holes in the lid and use it for the mix. I'll be sure to keep it moist and turn it occasionally as you suggested. If it likes to be damp all I have to do is keep it in my basement and the microbes should be very happy.

I have a couple more questions but will hold off until I know what to plant the seedling in as that has a bearing on what I'll be asking next.

PP

 

[pop pop]

Thanks, scrappy, for the very helpful post. Is there a tutorial that says how to sub, give a rep, bump---that kind of stuff? I'm trying to learn about this whole online forum thing.

Based on what you wrote, I'll get a 25% balance of perlite simply by adding one part from each of the four bags, including the perlte. The actual percentage of perlite in the mix will be north of 25% as the LW lists perlite as its second ingredient---so it will be in a good ratio.

Once I get an answer to my second question (start the seedling in LW only versus staring it in the mix with the ferts) and then buy the POM 343, I'll be ready to mix. I have everything else. I can let it stew for a few weeks. Humus is a main ingredient in 2 of the 3 FF bags so that seems to be covered.

Thanks for answering the question on storage too. I have a new 18 gal rubbermaid tote. I can drill some holes in the lid and use it for the mix. I'll be sure to keep it moist and turn it occasionally as you suggested. If it likes to be damp all I have to do is keep it in my basement and the microbes should be very happy.

I have a couple more questions but will hold off until I know what to plant the seedling in as that has a bearing on what I'll be asking next.

PP

 

[Scrappy4]

I'd start the shorties in the lightest choice you have. I use straight pro mix and earth worm castings (ewc). And again that comes back to the humic content. You need to get the best you can. I don't know anything about FF as far as what the content is, and the quality of that content. But, I'm always skeptical of bagged store bought stuff, so I would add ewc and or thermo compost. It is very important for several reasons. It provides the bulk of the microbes to the mix, those microbes are crucial for the living soil to work, it will self adjust the ph, it will help keep diseases at bay, makes nutrients available, drainage water retention, on and on, you get my point, quality ewc/compost matters and will separate OK grows from epic grows......scrappy

 

[pop pop]

Thanks again for the help, scrappy. Believe me it IS appreciated!

Ok then, I'll sprout with just the Light Warrior as that's the lightest choice, if I understand what you mean. It is specifically designed for seedlings and is organic.

I've seen the moonshineman mix (msm) sometimes referred to as an "organic supersoil." Here is a link to the msm mix. If you'd like to see the ingredients just check post #5.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=23970

I'd be real hesitant to experiment with changing anything about msm mix since it reportedly works so well, is relatively easy to use, and I have no idea what I'm doing really. But I can follow directions if they are clear and that's how I'm going about this whole thing.

 

[Scrappy4]

I think it's smart to start with a proven mix before going off in different directions. And another reason to take good notes so when you do make changes you can always come back to what works and figure out what did not work. I think you will do fine bro.......scrappy

 

[pop pop]

Thanks for the vote of confidence, scrappy, it means a lot to me to know I'm on the right track! I tried to up your 'rep' by pressing some button so hopefully that worked.

I have a few more questions that specifically relate to the msman mix and so I posted on that sticky thread. So after I get the answer to those I think I"ll be ready to mix
and get my remaining supplies.

All the best,
PP

 

[Scrappy4]

Hey don't worry about repping me, while it's thoughtful, I guess my satisfaction is felt when you don't make the same mistakes I have. I learned the same way you have, and I'm sure you will pass on your knowledge too. Also I find it refreshing to find someone willing to read and listen, that's puts you at the head of the class.

I went a year or more without even knowing about reps and likes and such, and I guess I survived my ignorance well, lol. Even now I don't give it much thought....scrappy

 

[pop pop]

Thanks, scrappy, and I'll remember your tip to write things down for the future.

-------------

There isn't much (any) activity on the sticky msman thread yet where I posted early this morning. Two of those questions are of a general nature not related to the mix itself, so if anyone can help answer either of these that would be great.

1. What's the right way to transplant/up-pot so as to minimize stress?

2. What are the pros/cons of distilled water vs. Ph'd+bubbled tap? I have read about this but it is still unclear. Especially in organics, we don't want chems killing our wee lil beasties, so isn't distilled the easiest and safest way to go, especially for only a 1-3 plant micro grow like mine?

 

[rockfish]

Hey pop pop!

You'll be in good shape starting your seeds in plain FFLW. Try not to stress the small stuff too much. Everything will become clearer once you get started.

Transplant when the roots have invaded their current medium enough that the root ball won't fall apart when the container is removed. I like to wait until the roots begin to congregate on the bottom of the container. I prefer to up-pot as little as possible, only once or twice tops.

With MSM you really don't need to worry too much about the water so much. You definitely want dechlorinated water. You can leave a bucket of tap water sitting open for ~24 hours and it will be ready to go. I use aquarium water dechlorinator in a pinch and have never had any problems. pH is a non-issue with a good organic medium. I have never checked my tap water... oh, and I don't intend to start now ;-)

I know NOTHING about micro growing, but if you want to finish up in a very small container, you may end up needing to provide supplemental feedings. Check out the fertilizer mixes at the beginning of this thread and you will be right on track.

Best of luck to you!

~rock~

 

[pop pop]

Thanks a bunch for your help, rockfish. I can't tell you how much it really helps to have your feedback, especially given that you just did a nice run with the msman mix.

I'll start in the FFLW as you suggested and top feed the POM ferts when the time comes. MSman gave the actual doses and weeks in the life-cycle to do it so I should be set with the nutes as long as I keep to the directions.

I'll follow your advice on the up-pottings too and only do it once. Maybe start out in a 9oz or 16oz for the first two weeks or so and by then the roots should be how you described and I can put the lady in her perm home which will be a 3/4 gal container
in my growbox.

As far as the water, I'm leaning towards just going with distilled since it is already PHd to around neutral from what I've read and I don't know what (besides chlorene) is in my tap. And until I find out I probably will just use the distilled. I'll only be watering 1 or 2 plants so it won't set me back moneywise even if I do it the whole grow with distilled.

And yeah, I hear you about not stressing the small stuff. It's hard though as I want to do it all right the first time. I know one thing for sure, and that is I'm about to learn a lot doing it, like scrappy had said, and I'm looking forward to it all even more now that I'm a part of this community.

Thanks again! As the kids today say "You Rock!"

 

[pop pop]

BurnOne, this is your department though someone else may also know---------

I have a bag of "granular" lime that I could pulverize but need to know if it is good or not since it is a few years old. Also, it doesn't say "dolomite" on the bag.

Is lime like perlite in that it never goes bad? If it is could I use it in the mix even though it doesn't say dolomite on the bag?

If not, no big deal. I'll just track some down somewhere but I thought I'd ask here first since it's hard to find.

PP

 

[mad librettist]

does the bag list properties like Ca and Mg content?


lime does not go bad.

 

[pop pop]

Yes, in min %.

cal 22
mag 1.2
cal oxide 31
mag oxide 2

other #'s for cal/mag carbonates too

And thanks for responding to my question!

 

[h.h.]

I wouldn't stress over the water. Any chlorine at the user end will dissipate pretty quickly and any residue is quickly overcome by a healthy microbe population.
Spraying the water will help chlorine dissipate, while citric acid will react with it. Molasses will give the bacteria an energy boost in fighting it, while a handful of compost will give them a place to hide.Not just compost, any organic material. Straw, newspaper... An air pump again will help it dissipate. IOW make some ACT. While ACT isn't necessary every watering for soil life, it does insure your water quality to a certain extent.
While I do use a water filter as well. I wouldn't use distilled. I want the mineral content. Keeping a little compost and molasses is easier than storing water, which I always seemed to run out of.

 

[pop pop]

h.h. thanks for sharing your knowledge with me on the water.

I installed a whole house carbon sediment filter (not RO, but better than nothing I guess) and have a Brita filter for the kitchen tap. My wife cleans it regularly and she swears it helps take out some chlorene.

I PH tested the filtered tap using a cheap aquarium kit (only thing I have) and it was in a good range. I should be able to use it after letting it sit out and bubbling. I can get some blackstrap mollasses as you suggest too.

- - - - - - -

mad librettist, I took a photo of the lime bag ingredients and found the "insert image button" but don't have a url since it is only sitting on my desktop. Is there some other way I can just upload it to ICmag directly from my desktop? If you need more complete information about the ingredients I'll just post them.

 

[h.h.]

I think dolomite has a higher mag content and doesn't break down as quickly as the pellets, which depend on a clay coating.
Crushed with the inert clay, the amounts needed are different as well as the rate of release.
While an usable alternative, you really should seek out the dolomite, especially when following a recipe.

 

[pop pop]

Ok, will do. I'm a big believer in following directions so if this lime isn't exactly what is called for in msm mix, then I won't use it.

Thanks again for your help. I really appreciate it!

PP

 

[pop pop]

I found one store that said they had powdered dolomite, drove there, but it turned out
they didn't have it after all. BurnOne wasn't kidding about it being harder to find. I'll keep trying.

The bag I have says "granular limestone"---smaller than pellets but not powdered I guess, though there's probably a few cups or more of powder laying on the bottom of the bag. I only need 8 TBL for my 4gal mix.

Don't know the difference between regular lime and that labeled dolomite. The search for the dolomite continues.

- - - - - - - -

Not related to this thread, but if I decide to start a grow thread where posters comment and help out, what is the best forum to use: the organic soil forum, micro, auto flowers, or new growers? I fit all of them!

 

[Durdy]

Hey just mixed up a new soil with some stuff I had laying around the house

Does anyone see any red flags?

10 Gallons used soil

7 Gallons Compost (plant material only)

2.5 gallons vermiculite

1 cup alfalfa meal

1 cup bone meal

1 cup kelp meal

1 cup dolomite lime

3/4 bag foxfarm ocean forest

What do you guys think? See anything horribly wrong with this concoction?

Think I should add more dolomite lime since it's not powdered? just small pebble sized pieces.....

Thanks

 

[BurnOne]

Does anyone see any red flags?

Yes... Here...

some stuff I had laying around the house

Isn't your grow important enough to follow the recipe???