Opinions on veganics?

[supermanlives]

callit what you want its delicious LOL. i help a few older folks and they like kiss.and organics. to each their own . i wish i had room for growing more beneficial plants to use in fpe. but my space is real limited . but when farmtek gets my pond liner for my garage to me . i will have a nice area with full sun all day long. for now i scavange what i can get. luckilly i can drive to an old local organic nursery and get most common stuff.discovered karanja meal last trip.

 

[stak]

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[FunTimesIndeed]

or anyone who doesnt want to keep 10 garbage cans full of composting medium around

Common misconception. I live a couple of stories up in small condo in the city and still manage to keep it all contained. Worm bin under the sink, cooking soil , a bail of peat, and a few amendments in a closet over here, a couple of plants in a closet over there---I imagine it is not unlike being a cook aboard submarine.

I would be willing to give guano a try if I saw any other gardeners using it, outside from the hydro shop crowd.

 

[FunTimesIndeed]

Here's a question I have for someone who really knows their veganics:

I've got a couple of phalaenopsis and tillandsia plants---epiphytes. Since they won't ever be ingested and grow on a mix of large bark bits, charcoal, and whole pieces of fresh peat, I wouldn't even be opposed to using synthetic "nutes" except that all I am finding use urea as a nitrogen source and I don't think it will convert into plant usable nitrates without the work of soil microbes. Because I already have a couple of homemade FPEs around the house and don't want to make more shopping trips for house plants, I would prefer to just whip something up out of the local flora or a plant that could be grown on the patio. What sort of veganic bottled product would have nitrogen available in an ionic form and what exact plants would said bottle be derived from?

 

[ixnay007]

Alfalfa or Nettles are the two classics for N in fermented extracts.

 

[SeaMaiden]

He pushes the veganic products because that's what he uses, that's what he likes, and he knows how to use it. It's the same with all grow shop employees, they push what they use because they think their way is the right way. You can bet if he was using AN or the lucas formula then he would be pushing those products on customers and using whatever "reasons" to justify it.

I feel that's fallacious reasoning, because if we go by that reasoning, then it's probably safe to say that the shop he works at sells a plethora of products, chemical salt-based, organics, 'naturals', almost organics, and the 'veganic' lines. Just because someone works at a shop doesn't automatically impugn their input for me, nor does it devalue that input. And based on his descriptions, coupled with my own experiences with older folks, his words ring true.

Now, let's go with your argument, that the only reason he pushes it is because he uses it and likes it. So what? How is that different from anyone else pushing any other regimen or method they happen to like? He's in the shop to make a living, not for charity.

See, there are many scenarios I can equate this to, and none of them are really so significantly different from this that I can agree that what he's saying should be ignored simply because he's working in a hydro shop. People are willing to pay for convenience, but mostly when they're new growers, they want to be sure they can pull off a harvest.

Perhaps it's odd that I'm arguing in favor of giving someone who has something different to say, since I don't use hydroponic shops or similar sources. But my family does, despite my best efforts.

 

[unclefishstick]

He pushes the veganic products because that's what he uses, that's what he likes, and he knows how to use it. It's the same with all grow shop employees, they push what they use because they think their way is the right way. You can bet if he was using AN or the lucas formula then he would be pushing those products on customers and using whatever "reasons" to justify it.

just like all grow shop customers have their heads up there asses right? cause i can tell you from my side of the counter less than 10% of the people who come into the shop where i work have the slightest clue what they are doing,and of those 10 % i doubt even a single percent have any real knowledge of plant and soil biology,so i push way more people to go buy some books and learn first than try and get them on any one product line,for that matter i spend way more time advocating getting their environments dialed in rather than look for some miracle in a bottle.

and is it really that sinister that i might recommend a product line i used for almost two years before i started working in a shop? that i have actual real world experience with? crop after crop of success?

 

[unclefishstick]

Here's a question I have for someone who really knows their veganics:

I've got a couple of phalaenopsis and tillandsia plants---epiphytes. Since they won't ever be ingested and grow on a mix of large bark bits, charcoal, and whole pieces of fresh peat, I wouldn't even be opposed to using synthetic "nutes" except that all I am finding use urea as a nitrogen source and I don't think it will convert into plant usable nitrates without the work of soil microbes. Because I already have a couple of homemade FPEs around the house and don't want to make more shopping trips for house plants, I would prefer to just whip something up out of the local flora or a plant that could be grown on the patio. What sort of veganic bottled product would have nitrogen available in an ionic form and what exact plants would said bottle be derived from?

the tillandsia love a foliar feed of compost tea,they really dont need much in the way of nutes,kelp products are a good choice

 

[dank.frank]

Thats why I was teaching classes about organics at local compassion clubs far before I ever started bagging a mix....it was only due to encouragement and many people telling me I should, that I did.

To me....veganics still needs measured out, still has many various bottles....still not much different than anything else. You don't need a pH pen with a bit of dolo lime mixed in the soil either....so it all goes grower preference...

My issue is not in using plant based nutrients....it's in the white wash of information that comes with the whole "veganic" construct.

Unc, I know your a great dude who is full of passion and loves his garden. At least you aren't preaching chem ferts and pesticides... - hope you know it isn't malicious, but in pursuit of lively conversation. Cheers, buddy!



dank.Frank

 

[unclefishstick]

Thats why I was teaching classes about organics at local compassion clubs far before I ever started bagging a mix....it was only due to encouragement and many people telling me I should, that I did.

To me....veganics still needs measured out, still has many various bottles....still not much different than anything else. You don't need a pH pen with a bit of dolo lime mixed in the soil either....so it all goes grower preference...

My issue is not in using plant based nutrients....it's in the white wash of information that comes with the whole "veganic" construct.

Unc, I know your a great dude who is full of passion and loves his garden. At least you aren't preaching chem ferts and pesticides... - hope you know it isn't malicious, but in pursuit of lively conversation. Cheers, buddy!



dank.Frank

oh yeah,i know that DF,no disrespect is intended on my side either,my comments about your mix were meant to encourage,i think its awesome all the choices growers have as far as methods these days,and any shift away from synthetic nutes is to be applauded.i admit,i want easy in my garden,im crushingly lazy and have very little free time,so "veganics" works for me..(you will like this,the GO line is labeled "Vganics",even they know they are full of bs)

i guess what im trying to say is "caveat emptor" let the buyer beware...i know im getting bottles of fancy yeast poop,but heck,it does work for me...

 

[FunTimesIndeed]

the tillandsia love a foliar feed...

Is there some other way?

 

[ClackamasCootz]

i can tell you from my side of the counter less than 10% of the people who come into the shop where i work have the slightest clue what they are doing, and of those 10 % i doubt even a single percent have any real knowledge of plant and soil biology

**chuckle**

 

[dank.frank]

Just for laughs.



dank.Frank

 

[sunnydog]

Veganics?

Veganics?

Why do human beings always need to have an ideology about everything? Veganics? Nonsense.

 

[unclefishstick]

Is there some other way?

yes,try some veganic nutes!,every type of plant i have used them on has thrived,even cactus like it,just use very mild doses,you need to be careful feeding them since they are epyphytes

 

[FunTimesIndeed]

I guess that was a lame tillandsia joke.

I went with a very light dose of kudzu and dandelion extracts, fish hydrolysate, and potassium silicate for all of the phalaenopsis and tillandsia. So far it's been great, but maybe not veganic.

 

[hope2toke]

i'm growing veganically, besides the crab shell that's my only liming agent beside the calcium and metals in rock dusts, plant meals, etc.

 

[Trewarin]

a vegan diet kills more sentient animals than my carnivorous one.

enjoy your fad.

 

[jay-toker]

.

 

[unclefishstick]

a vegan diet kills more sentient animals than my carnivorous one.

enjoy your fad.

enjoy your clogged arteries!