Occupy Wall Street: Not on major media but worth watching!

[The iD]

F&F are still sucking @ the tax payers' tit. uh, that is a tit...right? http://consumerist.com/2011/11/fann...it-lost-its-fanny-betting-on-derivatives.htmlFannie Mae Needs $7.8 Billion Because It Lost Its Fanny Betting On Derivatives



-iD

 

[dramamine]

Oh, I see....you guys think the protesters are freeloaders asking for a handout. Your government is composed of freeloaders, getting rich and richer (see congressional insider stock trading, practiced across the board, for one example among way too many). Do you disagree?

Why can't this movement be about stopping massive injustice, trying to keep it from becoming (more) institutionalized? Does your position in life make this too hard to accept?

 

[grozzef]

fuckin old people they're freeloaders too, assholes need to fucking get back to work. then the handicapped, oh boy those mother fuckers, don't even get me started...

 

[In~Plain~Site]

Oh, I see....you guys think the protesters are freeloaders asking for a handout. Your government is composed of freeloaders, getting rich and richer (see congressional insider stock trading, practiced across the board, for one example among way too many). Do you disagree?

Why can't this movement be about stopping massive injustice, trying to keep it from becoming (more) institutionalized? Does your position in life make this too hard to accept?

Who the hell said anything about all the protestors?

fuckin old people they're freeloaders too, assholes need to fucking get back to work. then the handicapped, oh boy those mother fuckers, don't even get me started...

GTFO, you maroon.

 

[dagnabit]

don't blame F&F they got confused...

 

[grozzef]

i'm sooooo sorry if my sarcasm offended your delicate sensibilities.

 

[dramamine]

Who the hell said anything about all the protestors?

My question: why do you have anything at all bad to say about those who are standing up to vast injustice? Because you think they're hippies, hipsters, etc.? It comes off as very petty and self-satisfied, sorry to say. Who are the freeloaders,and from whose perspective?

 

[In~Plain~Site]

If you're not retarded or somehow or another infirmed,and still not contributing to that which you take from....I'm afraid I have some bad news for you.

Simple enough for you sarcastic guy?

 

[dagnabit]

My question: why do you have anything at all bad to say about those who are standing up to vast injustice?

because they are not.
they are bitching about issues with no cohesion or direction much less offering solutions.

 

[SpasticGramps]

F&F are still sucking @ the tax payers' tit. uh, that is a tit...right? Fannie Mae Needs $7.8 Billion Because It Lost Its Fanny Betting On Derivatives
-iD

Shit man they have to pay out those multi-million $$$ bonuses to keep their top notch executives. Takes money to recruit the top talent so they can keep looting from the tax payer. Their debt isn't counted on the government's books anyway so it's all good. Unicorns and tooth fairies.

You'd think they could at least give the tax serfs the courtesy of a reach around while fucking us.

 

[juicepuddle]

they are bitching about issues with no cohesion or direction much less offering solutions.

So lets bitch about them bitching about issues with no cohesion or direction......

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

partly why the thread's so long

 

[dagnabit]

So lets bitch about them bitching about issues with no cohesion or direction......

im much more a fan of discussing solutions(i've tried several times in this thread) but someone asked "why do you have anything at all bad to say about those who are standing up to vast injustice?"
to which i replied "they are not"

now for solutions?
make it known there will be no bailouts.
reestablish the firewall.
tougher lending standards including credit,employment and down payment standards.
original lenders must retain paper for at least 5 years.
tax incentives for every year a lender holds paper.
eliminate corporate and personal income taxes and replace with a prebated consumption tax.

but people are much more inclined to bitch,blame and whine than to discuss solutions...

 

[dagnabit]

partly why the thread's so long

here i thought the incessant partisan bullshit was why this thread has 30 whole pages....

 

[Anti]

The thread gets off topic and people get a little sand in their panties from time to time, but at least we aren't having huge "fuck you" fests.

This sort of conversation is exactly why Occupy is having so much trouble looking organised. You don't have to subscribe to any set of beliefs in order to go down and participate in the general assemblies.

To me, that seems beautiful.

I see the reason that some would be doubtful about its current effectiveness, but why are we in such a hurry to change everything overnight? I mean, we know there are problems. So lets get together and put some time and effort into first identifying the problems and then work together to devise a system to correct these problems and then work together to implement these solutions.

Why does it have to be now or never?

The fact that so many people have paid attention (including all of us) and still have strong opinions about it all gives me hope for humanity.

Things change when WE change, not before.

Door's open.

 

[dramamine]

because they are not.
they are bitching about issues with no cohesion or direction much less offering solutions.

It's possible that you're so accustomed to packaged, branded ideas that you don't recognize an actual organic movement when you see one. The fact that the Occupy stuff isn't spearheaded by a charismatic leader with a past to dig up doesn't make it less valid. So far these people are just meeting up and sharing their grave concerns with each other and the rest of the country. Bitching about issues? How dare they...

If you're on the Titantic, you don't bitch about someone rocking the boat.

 

[In~Plain~Site]

Most Americans have a world view attention span of the 24 hour news cycle.

Two words - Kim Kardashian

 

[dagnabit]

If you're on the Titantic, you don't bitch about someone rocking the boat.

if you are on a sinking ship that CAN be fixed there will be those who say
"nothings wrong the ship will right itself."
there will be those who pitch tents on the foredeck to bitch about the hole in the boat and figure out who to blame for the hole.
there will be those who work to find a way to fix the hull.

the OWS protesters had an opportunity to be the latter but chose to be one of the former.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Fannie Mae taps $7.8 billion from Treasury, loss widens



By Margaret Chadbourn
WASHINGTON | Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:53am EST


(Reuters) - Fannie Mae (FNMA.OB), the biggest source of money for U.S. home loans, on Tuesday said it needed a further $7.8 billion in federal aid to stay afloat as a shaky housing market widened its third-quarter loss to $5.1 billion.

The government-controlled firm also attributed the deeper cash drain to losses on derivatives used to hedge its exposure to interest-rate swings and on expenses related to home loans made prior to the 2008 financial collapse. In the year-earlier quarter it had a loss of a $1.3 billion.

Fannie Mae has now drawn $112.6 billion in bailout funds from the Treasury Department since being seized by the government in 2008 as mortgage losses mounted, and it has returned $17.2 billion to taxpayers in the form of dividends.

"There is certainly a lot of pre-2009 loans that we need to work through and that is certainly driving the credit losses you saw in this quarter and over the last several years," Fannie Mae Chief Financial Officer Susan McFarland told Reuters.

She said the company was "working to reduce losses" on those legacy loans and "limit taxpayer exposure."

The mortgage finance company and its smaller rival Freddie Mac (FMCC.OB) were taken over during the financial crisis as losses on subprime mortgages threatened insolvency.

Given the crucial role the two play in U.S. housing finance, owning or guaranteeing about half of all mortgages, the government has pledged unlimited funds to keep the firms afloat through the end of 2012. Combined, they have cost taxpayers around $169 billion.

The plan to put them into a government conservatorship was meant to be temporary, although it is likely to be years before a long-term replacement structure takes shape. Both the Obama administration and Congress want to eventually wind them down.

Their regulator estimates that the bailout could reach about $193 billion through 2014, with dividend payments taken into account.

Fannie Mae said credit losses, which include expenses related to the foreclosed properties it holds on its books as well as on its derivatives, increased in the third quarter to $4.5 billion from $3.9 billion in the second quarter.

Freddie Mac, the second-largest source of U.S. mortgage finance, said last week it lost $4.4 billion in the third quarter and needed to borrow an extra $6 billion from the federal government.

Fannie Mae has now reported losses in 16 of the last 17 quarters. It reported a profit of $73 million in the fourth quarter of last year, but that was largely attributed to a one-time payment from Bank of America.

Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were created by Congress to encourage homeownership. They buy mortgages from lenders and repackage them as securities for investors, with a guarantee, to ensure a steady source of home loan funds.

The two firms, along with the Federal Housing Administration, now back about nine out of 10 new home loans.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/11/us-usa-housing-fanniemae-f-idUSTRE7AA44J20111111

Looks like they're victims of Gramm Leach Bliley - just like the private sector.

I think an interesting aspect would be to compare private to GSE bailouts. It might bring factual perspective to rhetoric.

There's no agency funding GSE salaries. Where would one expect to find managers and executives for the corporate side? The same pool that eats caviar three times a day. The more top executives and managers pay themselves, the more GSEs will have to pay to maintain staff. Pretty self explanatory.

And for the link that references bonuses. Is it for 10 executives or 10,000? These are giant institutions. Alas, the number of executives isn't a component of rhetoric.

 

[dramamine]

if you are on a sinking ship that CAN be fixed there will be those who say
"nothings wrong the ship will right itself."
there will be those who pitch tents on the foredeck to bitch about the hole in the boat and figure out who to blame for the hole.
there will be those who work to find a way to fix the hull.

the OWS protesters had an opportunity to be the latter but chose to be one of the former.

OccupyWallStreet: There's a big fucking hole in the boat! Spread the word!