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midwest growers unite
- Thread starter Dr. G
- Start date
i know what you mean koopa, i got the same thing happening with the last 2 g13 x burms, been in 3 weeks and has new growth but no roots poking out.
They say that drying out the medium (rockwool cube, peat pellet) encourages rooting, so maybe overmisting could retard rooting? Still, you would think you'd see roots after 3 days [EDIT: weeks] ... 
I put a bed of vermiculite in the bottom of my dome and throw a cup or two of water into the vermiculite also. With that as a bed for your clones, roots will actually grow into the verm. I don't know if that will help you or not, I don't know that it even helps me all that much, but might want to give it a try.
The only times I didn't root successfully in peat pellets was when the cutting I took was too small... after not seeing roots for a couple weeks and already having as many clones as i needed, I just threw those away. Maybe they would have eventually rooted though...
Good luck, koopa, abita. Save those cuts!!!
One note on peat pellets: They're great for rooting, but I was putting the entire pellet (in a Jiffy pot) in my dwc tubs, and I'm pretty sure they were retarding the growth of my plants (the root growth never really got going). I know that they're safe to use if you transplant into soil (from reading other posts on icmag), but if you're going hydro, or at least DWC (only hydro method ive used) then I would strongly recommend transplanting them to netpots and hydroton. I was wondering why my newest tubs were so far behind my other tubs, and then I realized the newest tubs had peat pellets. So I transplanted those plants into netpots. Sucks that I have to tear apart the peat pellet, cause you do lose some roots that way, but I really strongly believe that was the reason. There's a small chance it could be something else, but I doubt it, although I should know for sure later on....
DKmonk: For good bud shots, where you can see individual trichs, I believe you need an SLR (single lens reflex) camera and a macro lens. An expensive setup, probably 500+ for that, although maybe buying used (ebay, craigslist) is an option? But I've seen people on icmag use a cheap digi camera and a homemade macro lens and get decent trich shots. I think there's a couple threads on it somewhere on icmag, I just did a quick search but couldn't really come up with anything but I know it's there. I know what you mean, without a good camera setup you'll never be able to show the true beauty of your buds...
I put a bed of vermiculite in the bottom of my dome and throw a cup or two of water into the vermiculite also. With that as a bed for your clones, roots will actually grow into the verm. I don't know if that will help you or not, I don't know that it even helps me all that much, but might want to give it a try.
The only times I didn't root successfully in peat pellets was when the cutting I took was too small... after not seeing roots for a couple weeks and already having as many clones as i needed, I just threw those away. Maybe they would have eventually rooted though...
Good luck, koopa, abita. Save those cuts!!!
One note on peat pellets: They're great for rooting, but I was putting the entire pellet (in a Jiffy pot) in my dwc tubs, and I'm pretty sure they were retarding the growth of my plants (the root growth never really got going). I know that they're safe to use if you transplant into soil (from reading other posts on icmag), but if you're going hydro, or at least DWC (only hydro method ive used) then I would strongly recommend transplanting them to netpots and hydroton. I was wondering why my newest tubs were so far behind my other tubs, and then I realized the newest tubs had peat pellets. So I transplanted those plants into netpots. Sucks that I have to tear apart the peat pellet, cause you do lose some roots that way, but I really strongly believe that was the reason. There's a small chance it could be something else, but I doubt it, although I should know for sure later on....
DKmonk: For good bud shots, where you can see individual trichs, I believe you need an SLR (single lens reflex) camera and a macro lens. An expensive setup, probably 500+ for that, although maybe buying used (ebay, craigslist) is an option? But I've seen people on icmag use a cheap digi camera and a homemade macro lens and get decent trich shots. I think there's a couple threads on it somewhere on icmag, I just did a quick search but couldn't really come up with anything but I know it's there. I know what you mean, without a good camera setup you'll never be able to show the true beauty of your buds...
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Doesn't sound like all bad news koopa and bird. At least they aren't starting to rot, right. I agree with astartes though too much moisture can be bad. i learned that by adding an airstone and water to the bottom of my float trays to promote fast roots to early in rooting. I have had some luck hitting stubborn cuts with root promoters like root juice when misting or watering the cuts. i've never liked the pucks for some reason, maybe the plastic netting, maybe the density of the peat...I don't know. However, years back i remember getting cuts to root in under a week with FF light warrior followed by explosive growth. In reality, most mediums work fine for rooting cuts once you are used to them. It's a matter of what you are confident with and meets your style or technique for rooting cuts. I finally made it to my favorite stomping grounds over the weekend. I love to look for mushrooms there as they are the hidden beauties. Alot of the flora remains the same throughout the summer. Here's one I'd never seen before. When I found it all the dots or circles on the sponge had spheres of raspberry jelly looking stuff sweating out of the holes, it had retreated by the time I snapped these the next day. I hope ya'll had a nice Labor Day weekend!
Retardo: I agree, there are many ways to clone (soil, rockwool, peat pellets, rapid rooters, bubblers, etc) and you have to go with whatever works the best. For me and a few others, because of temp issues during the summer, peat pellets gave the best results. That may change though when it gets cold; if colder room temps hinder the pellets (assuming I dont get a heat mat) then I might have to go back to the bubbler...
Those mushroom shots are freaky, like looking at an alien. I thought that was a pic of a magic mushroom, but it turns out it's just a mushroom. Weird but cool hobby you got there. If you had a macro lens, I bet you could take some SUPER freaky pics...
Sven: some nice looking kushes you got there. I wonder how similar they'll be to the kushes from california? Although I hear they're not really kushes,and anyway any really good weed is called kush nowadays.
As far as flushing in an ebb and flow, well I've been reading up on flushing threads here, and seems like there's two camps: those who swear by it and those who say it doesn't make any difference.
I suppose if YOU can taste and smell the difference in unflushed weed, then you should try to find a second (maybe smaller) tray (and pump and reservoir, etc) to flush your clones for the last week.
But many say they can't really tell any difference. Also there's research saying you're losing out on yield, maybe even potency if you flush. If anything, maybe ease off on the nitrogen towards the end of flowering, because excess N supposedly really affects taste. Besides, I think the 3 part formula cuts out the N towards the end anyway...
They say that what really affects the taste is a proper 2+month cure; people that smoke harsh bud may really only be smoking uncured bud, not unflushed bud.
I plan on watercuring, which leaches most of the chlorophyll out in a week: it's like a 6 month cure packed into a week. But with watercuring, you lose most of the taste and smell, but that could be a good thing if you want it as a stealth stash (edibles made with it will have hardly any mj taste, joints smoked with it wont smell like weed, etc)
But I'm also gonna save some and cure it traditionally; it's just i gotta have something to smoke while i wait for the rest of the stuff to cure.
DK: I hear ya on the peat pellets. I think they're basically the same thing as the rapid rooters you can buy at the hydro store, only for like 1/5 of the price.
At $2 for a pack of 25, you can't really beat the price. Only thing is you might have to stock up during the summer, cause I don't know if HD carries these things during the winter. I can barely find them anymore now, as it is...
I'm going to post some paraphernalia shots later this weed once I get off my lazy ass. We gotta show everyone how we smoke it up in the midwest!
Those mushroom shots are freaky, like looking at an alien. I thought that was a pic of a magic mushroom, but it turns out it's just a mushroom. Weird but cool hobby you got there. If you had a macro lens, I bet you could take some SUPER freaky pics...
Sven: some nice looking kushes you got there. I wonder how similar they'll be to the kushes from california? Although I hear they're not really kushes,and anyway any really good weed is called kush nowadays.
As far as flushing in an ebb and flow, well I've been reading up on flushing threads here, and seems like there's two camps: those who swear by it and those who say it doesn't make any difference.
I suppose if YOU can taste and smell the difference in unflushed weed, then you should try to find a second (maybe smaller) tray (and pump and reservoir, etc) to flush your clones for the last week.
But many say they can't really tell any difference. Also there's research saying you're losing out on yield, maybe even potency if you flush. If anything, maybe ease off on the nitrogen towards the end of flowering, because excess N supposedly really affects taste. Besides, I think the 3 part formula cuts out the N towards the end anyway...
They say that what really affects the taste is a proper 2+month cure; people that smoke harsh bud may really only be smoking uncured bud, not unflushed bud.
I plan on watercuring, which leaches most of the chlorophyll out in a week: it's like a 6 month cure packed into a week. But with watercuring, you lose most of the taste and smell, but that could be a good thing if you want it as a stealth stash (edibles made with it will have hardly any mj taste, joints smoked with it wont smell like weed, etc)
But I'm also gonna save some and cure it traditionally; it's just i gotta have something to smoke while i wait for the rest of the stuff to cure.
DK: I hear ya on the peat pellets. I think they're basically the same thing as the rapid rooters you can buy at the hydro store, only for like 1/5 of the price.
At $2 for a pack of 25, you can't really beat the price. Only thing is you might have to stock up during the summer, cause I don't know if HD carries these things during the winter. I can barely find them anymore now, as it is...
I'm going to post some paraphernalia shots later this weed once I get off my lazy ass. We gotta show everyone how we smoke it up in the midwest!
orion6324
Member
lil update
lil update
Ok so i've ran into my first problem[maybe it's a problem]. I hit the girls with phosphoload [first time i've used it] last week and wow does this stuff work. All stretch stopped immediatly and they really started packin on the flowers. BUT one plant really did'nt like it to well. Got some weird leaf curl where the buds are forming. Other leaves remain unaffected. It's just plain weird i think.
lil update
Ok so i've ran into my first problem[maybe it's a problem]. I hit the girls with phosphoload [first time i've used it] last week and wow does this stuff work. All stretch stopped immediatly and they really started packin on the flowers. BUT one plant really did'nt like it to well. Got some weird leaf curl where the buds are forming. Other leaves remain unaffected. It's just plain weird i think.
Orion, thanks on the weird shroom. Actually those were shot wth a macro lens(105mm 1:1 F2.8 lens on a Nikon DSLR). It's just handheld with low light and no tripod. Your leaf curl must be a little sensitivity to the phosphoload, i agree with you, my F13 plants did the same thing when given too much food. I'm glad to see your screen filling in for you. BTW, I had no intentions of stirring up trouble with rooting mediums, sorry to knock the pucks, maybe i just miss playing hockey and take it out on those lil pucks, who knows! Really I just hope everyone can kick it root down and get 'em growing! Any medium works when you dial in the method, some cuts are just more fussy than others. Hell I used to use sand trays and a mister on them with fine results.
orion6324
Member
RETARDO: No man why do i care if you dont like pucks.. no biggie. And i agree with you when you say''some cuts are more fussy than others''. I think thats what holds some people back when cloning. Ive never had a bit of trouble so im lucky i guess.
Oh and some people were talking about misting or not misting clones. I mist mine 3 times a day and the dome. Which works great[never had any trouble 100% success]. But it just goes to show you that what works for some does'nt work for others.
I HATE LEAF CURL
Oh and another thing retardo. when you say you had your f13s do the same thing. Was it exactly the same...I.E. leaf curl just at the buds and no where else?
P.S. Who's up for a meet and smoke out here in the midwest group
Oh and some people were talking about misting or not misting clones. I mist mine 3 times a day and the dome. Which works great[never had any trouble 100% success]. But it just goes to show you that what works for some does'nt work for others.
I HATE LEAF CURL
Oh and another thing retardo. when you say you had your f13s do the same thing. Was it exactly the same...I.E. leaf curl just at the buds and no where else?
P.S. Who's up for a meet and smoke out here in the midwest group
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Orion, here's an extreme case of curl. This F13 didn't want any food other than what came in the promix.
Here's an F13 top without the overnute leaf curl:
Here's an F13 top without the overnute leaf curl:
Retardo ---
That's one purty F13 there. Did that end up being a keeper pheno for you?
And, geez, no worries about the peat pucks! The whole point of this thread imho is to share our ideas and experiences with others around us. Just like how some of us are soil, some coco, some hydro. Just gotta do what works best for each person's situation.
Just glad that you're sharing your wealth of experience with us in this thread my man!
astartes
That's one purty F13 there. Did that end up being a keeper pheno for you?
And, geez, no worries about the peat pucks! The whole point of this thread imho is to share our ideas and experiences with others around us. Just like how some of us are soil, some coco, some hydro. Just gotta do what works best for each person's situation.
Just glad that you're sharing your wealth of experience with us in this thread my man!
astartes
Retardo: No problem, it's not like we're trying to protect the peat pucks. Some of us just like to promote them as a cheap, quick and effective way of cloning; especially when other methods we've used did not work. I've used rockwool cubes and because i didn't use ph corrected water failed at cloning - ive never tried it with ph corrected water so i don't know if that was the problem, but there's plenty of people who are successful at cloning in rockwool so i think that was the problem. Then I was using one of those aerogardens you see on tv as a bubble cloner (i bought it used, it was thrown in with some other stuff i was buying, i didnt actually pay 150 for it cause thats a huge ripoff) and that worked in the winter for a bit but when it got warmer and my room temps rose i couldn't get cuts to root. So that's when i turned to peat pucks. And I get roots in 7-8 days (using rooting hormone, squeezing out the excess water from the pellet), so long as i take a big enough cutting, like almost on the verge of what you would say is almost too big a cutting.
But like I said, the aerogarden worked as a cloner, just not when it was too warm. I'm sure come november, maybe even october i can start using it again. Heck, I can probably use it even now because now i have an ac running in that room, whereas before i didnt.
I just like peat pellets cause you can get them at home depot, unlike rockwool or rapid rooters, and limiting exposure to hydro stores is a good idea because cops sometimes stake them out (buying online can accomplish the same thing, for stuff i cant get at home depot i go online).
Orion: Sorry about the jinx!
j/k
Something had to go wrong with your grow eventually. Using an additive you've never used before sometimes comes with side effects. But it looks like it worked, if it pretty much just stopped flowering completely. It'll help with stretchiness, especially with my damn thai stick
Keep those buds stout and compact and oh so dense....
I tried looking up info on it online, seems like it's almost pure phosphorous, P, very little K, no N and that it's basically the same thing as SuperBud from Dutchmaster. I guess your little curler is just overloaded on P now, hopefully as it gets used up it'll come back around. If the buds are continuing to get fat at the usual rate I wouldn't worry about it too much, but if they start falling behind the other girls then maybe cut out the phosphoload?
And I get roots in 7-8 days (using rooting hormone, squeezing out the excess water from the pellet), so long as i take a big enough cutting, like almost on the verge of what you would say is almost too big a cutting. But like I said, the aerogarden worked as a cloner, just not when it was too warm. I'm sure come november, maybe even october i can start using it again. Heck, I can probably use it even now because now i have an ac running in that room, whereas before i didnt.
I just like peat pellets cause you can get them at home depot, unlike rockwool or rapid rooters, and limiting exposure to hydro stores is a good idea because cops sometimes stake them out (buying online can accomplish the same thing, for stuff i cant get at home depot i go online).
Orion: Sorry about the jinx!
j/kSomething had to go wrong with your grow eventually. Using an additive you've never used before sometimes comes with side effects. But it looks like it worked, if it pretty much just stopped flowering completely. It'll help with stretchiness, especially with my damn thai stick
Keep those buds stout and compact and oh so dense....
I tried looking up info on it online, seems like it's almost pure phosphorous, P, very little K, no N and that it's basically the same thing as SuperBud from Dutchmaster. I guess your little curler is just overloaded on P now, hopefully as it gets used up it'll come back around. If the buds are continuing to get fat at the usual rate I wouldn't worry about it too much, but if they start falling behind the other girls then maybe cut out the phosphoload?
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orion6324
Member
BABA: Ya i only ran the LOAD at 2ml per gallon for 2 days and then changed rez out. That seemed to be the general consensus cause that shit is oh so powerfull. And ya it does what it says. Stopped stretch in its tracks and the buds ,for a mere 33 days are hard and compact to the touch. Might get that pound after all.
I can't even describe the smell of this strain. If i give em a rub and then smell my fingers i almost wanna puke..lol. Really stinks like nothing i've ever smelled. I so hope thier gonna live up to the hype. Someone told me that it ruled the coffe shops in the dam for 10 yrs for a reason. I sure hope so
And ya dutch master just changed the bottle. Its superbud just another label . No change in the ingredients at all.
I can't even describe the smell of this strain. If i give em a rub and then smell my fingers i almost wanna puke..lol. Really stinks like nothing i've ever smelled. I so hope thier gonna live up to the hype. Someone told me that it ruled the coffe shops in the dam for 10 yrs for a reason. I sure hope so
And ya dutch master just changed the bottle. Its superbud just another label . No change in the ingredients at all.
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Orion: I looked up phosphoload/superbud because I was thinking of trying it out for my girls. Then I see that it's ridiculously expensive, like $100 or more for a liter! Then I'm thinking, that's pretty steep, but you don't need much and if it's worth it...
So then I see that phosphoload/superbud has basically been discontinued by Dutchmaster (probably explains why it's so freaking expensive now). And then I read posts that it was discontinued because it contains paclobutrazol, a chemical that stops the stretch in plants:
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=6678
But then there's information that the chemical is harmless:
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=6020&page=5&pp=15&highlight=Paclobutrazol
Did you know about this before you started using phosphoload? If you did, I guess you decided that the risk was nonexistent and forged ahead. They use paclobutrazol in agricultural crops, don't they?
So then I see that phosphoload/superbud has basically been discontinued by Dutchmaster (probably explains why it's so freaking expensive now). And then I read posts that it was discontinued because it contains paclobutrazol, a chemical that stops the stretch in plants:
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=6678
But then there's information that the chemical is harmless:
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=6020&page=5&pp=15&highlight=Paclobutrazol
Did you know about this before you started using phosphoload? If you did, I guess you decided that the risk was nonexistent and forged ahead. They use paclobutrazol in agricultural crops, don't they?
orion6324
Member
BABA: Ya i read up on it alot before i got it. That's nonsence that it's harmfull. It's used on corn here every spring and lots of other crops. And it's used in alot hier doses than what we would use it at[2ml per gallon for 2 days]. That doseage is almost non existant but its just enough for the PGR to do it's thing. Bushmaster and all the others contain the same stuff. I picked mine up on ebay. It's the big bottle for about 60$. And at the rate we use it it's gonna last for yrs and yrs.
And now for the news
I got the widows goin and they are 4-5 weeks before they are done. I have 6 good clones from the 3 girls[2 each]. So depending on the best one of the 3 ill clone the shit out of it for next run. And i started thinking that i might try SOG next run and would need more clones. So my long term plan is to have 3 good mothers of diff strains. So i thought fuck it. Im gonna start my AK too.
... 11 seeds in the 10 pack here...thx serious
They hit the paper towel about 2 hours ago. I got 4-5 weeks to sex em and get some clones rdy for an SOG run of WW and AK. Should work out just about right. Wish me luck. Im pumped WW and AK in SOG next run. Just can't hardly wait..lol
I don't know anything about SoG. What to prune and all that so if someone can give me a link or explain a little i'd appreciate it...thx
And now for the news
I got the widows goin and they are 4-5 weeks before they are done. I have 6 good clones from the 3 girls[2 each]. So depending on the best one of the 3 ill clone the shit out of it for next run. And i started thinking that i might try SOG next run and would need more clones. So my long term plan is to have 3 good mothers of diff strains. So i thought fuck it. Im gonna start my AK too.
... 11 seeds in the 10 pack here...thx seriousThey hit the paper towel about 2 hours ago. I got 4-5 weeks to sex em and get some clones rdy for an SOG run of WW and AK. Should work out just about right. Wish me luck. Im pumped WW and AK in SOG next run. Just can't hardly wait..lol
I don't know anything about SoG. What to prune and all that so if someone can give me a link or explain a little i'd appreciate it...thx
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