MH vs HPS for yield?

[rives]

Should have used a HPS, that's pathetic. Less than a gram a watt.

HPS in the right hands can pull 2 grams a watt

Show me, troll. You are full of shit - a 1000w HPS can very, very rarely approach 2 gpw, but a 400w HPS? Bullshit. And as I pointed out above, my tent was slightly over half full.

 

[blissfest]

Show me, troll. You are full of shit - a 1000w HPS can very, very rarely approach 2 gpw, but a 400w HPS? Bullshit. And as I pointed out above, my tent was slightly over half full.

Sensitive are we, LOL!!!

You need to get out more, have you ever left this site??

And I said in the right hands, there is documented scrogs of guys pulling 2 grams a watt. Or Vert bare bulb tree grows at 2 grams a watt.

I could careless how much you get off your little tent grow, I was just messin with ya.

I only deal with bigger plants, I grow 6-12 oz average and up to 16 oz. plants in 3 gal. Coco Hempy's.

 

[DrFever]

A 315w Agro will out yield a Horti 400 watt Super HPS???? C'mon Mannnnn, LOL!!! Why don't you guys believe the Red spectrum is what plants want in flower???? How much weed have you grown??

And I have no idea who Doc is, but obviously he knows more about growing weed than the MH guys here. Like I said, a simple google search will show where MH in flower stands. If MH was any good growers like Jackmayoffer and many many others here, at the farm, and all the other sites would be using them.

Some like the combo MH and HPS, but no one in their right mind says MH alone, except for a select few that overthink things.

I tried MH and HPS combo for about a year, and my yields went down, imo. Straight HPS wins in the flower room for yield.

I think the problem with you guys is paying your electric bill, you are grasping at whatever might keep your bill lower? Heat scares you too.

Hey Bliss 99 percent of these people that claim mh or cmh out performs HPS are fawking tent growers you ever wonder why other commercial growers you know the big boys on the block that throw away more weed then these people grow in a year sit back and laugh when you come down to it its all a Joke at the end of the day
all these dam stupid threads really do is confuse the new grower
now mixing both mh and hps is a good idea but again the novice grower will tend to use MH for veg and hps for flower
i my self have thrown all my MH bulbs in the garbage and only used hps for veg and flower like lots do
these fan boys of mh / /cmh again always falling back at NASA who the hell is NASA hahaha last time i herd there was no more hell when is next space shuttle launch ???? all US satellites are going up in space from europes space agency so please nix NASA -- it has become a big joke really

 

[acridlab]

^^ gotta good point,, but at the same time,, most of the big grows are producing b grade booty

 

[DrFever]

^^ gotta good point,, but at the same time,, most of the big grows are producing b grade booty

when you think bout it really,???? its becoming a joke you got some people thinking hordilux advertisements market cash cow what ever,,,
know one can say the same for the other midgets trying to get in to he market like CMH bulbs etc its funny really proven over and over and over companies like Hordi spend millions and millions on research to find out which best triggers plants response in veg and in flowering modes and you get small time meat heads going opposite going against the norm

Rives you did good you ran two 315 so 630 watts ??? to make 1 pound + you don't think if you ran a 600 hordi you woild of done better ???? with less power dam i can post many growers here killing it getting better results closer to 2 pounds so in my books you failed

 

[Drek]

Read the "Title" of the thread, Doh!!!!

Here's the actual truth.

MH vs HPS

 

[the gnome]

IMPORTANT IC PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT!

TAKE CAUTION ALL GROWERS USING ANY OF
THE FOLLOWING LITES IN BLOOM:
#1-MH (4000K especially)

#2-CMH

#3-DAYLIGHT FLOURO'S,

#4-STARS HAVING ANY BLUE IN ITS SPECTRUM


YOU ARE AT RISK OF FURTHER INTENSIVE TROLLING BECAUSE OF RECENT BINGE FEEDING OUR RESIDENT TROLL.
HE IS ALREADY SERIOUSLY OVERWEIGHT FROM RECENT TROLLING ACTIVITIES DUE TO BEING NEAR OR IN THE PRESENCE OF:

#1-GNOMES *SPRAYING HATER IN HEAT URINE*

#2-PEOPLE THAT AGREE IN ANY WAY WITH GNOMES WITHIN A 100-MILE RADIUS OF GNOMES *SPRAYING HATER IN HEAT URINE*

#3-ANYONE CONTEMPLATING USING THE ABOVE DESCRIBED METHODS OF LIGHTING IN BLOOM BEFORE-DURING-OR AFTER THE TROLL HAS BEEN:
*SPRAYED WITH HATER IN HEAT URINE

IN THE EVENT YOU ARE USING ANY OF THE LITE SOURCES MENTIONED ABOVE
AND THE TROLL'S ATTENTION IS TURNED TO YOU ACT FAST! AND......
STAND STILL!
SMILE
HIS EGO CANNOT HELP IT'S SELF AND WILL BE ECSTATIC IF YOU NOD AND AGREE WHILE THE TROLL IS TALKING
SLOWLY UNZIP YOUR FLY AND QUICKLY SPRAY HIM WITH YOUR OWN *HATER IN HEAT URINE* AND SAY ITS RAINING
HE WILL BE IN AN EXTREME BEFUDDLED AND ANGRY STATE FOR THE NEXT 24-48HRS
AFTER LAUGHING IT IS IMPORTANT TO USE THIS TIME WISELY TO MAKE YOUR ESCAPE AND POST IN ANOTHER FORUM.

NOTE!
A GNOMES *HATER IN HEAT URINE* IS INTENSELY MORE DEMEANING TO TROLLS, COMPARED TO YOURS.
ITS EFFECTS CAN LAST INFINITELY LONGER SO IT IS MUCH MORE DESIRABLE TO USE ON TROLLS IF HANDY.
USE SPARINGLY.

THIS HAS BEEN AN IC PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT
--------------------------------------------------------------
EDITED!!

INFORMATION JUST RECEIVED INDICATES THAT OUR RESIDENT TROLL IS INSTANTLY AND AGGRESSIVELY AGITATED
WITH BY GROWERS USING SUPER HPS HORTI EYES
AND LISTENING TO BB KING OR OTHER BLUES ARTISTS WILL

 

[Drek]

 

[DrFever]

some scientific data or tests to observe very interesting indeed
http://www.colorado.edu/eeb/courses/1230jbasey/abstracts 2008/42.htm

For our experiment we tested the question, “What is the relative rate of photosynthesis under red, green, and blue light of Juniper needles?” Our hypothesis is that the color of light is directly related to the rate of photosynthesis. A prior experiment has shown that plants absorb the most light in the blue wavelength range while reflecting the green wavelength range. Taking this into account, we predicted blue light to have the highest relative rate of photosynthesis.

To test our hypothesis, we measured the rate of CO2 change in a container with 0.65 grams of juniper needles under blue, red, and green light. We performed 3 trials, designating 10 minutes, to observe the change in the light and dark. We began our experiment with foil around the container to remove the light and eliminate any initial photosynthesis. Knowing that respiration occurs at all times, we manipulated the data to retrieve the rate of photosynthesis by using the equation; (Photosynthesis+Respiration) - (Respiration) which gave us the amount of CO2 depletion and thus the net photosynthesis rate.

After gathering our data and comparing our results with previous experiments and primary sources, we discovered that red light actually had the highest rate of photosynthesis with an average rate of -0.1525 ppm/g/min while blue light had an average rate of -0.0805 ppm/g/min and green light had an average rate of -0.0192 ppm/g/min. It is important to note that the greater the negative value is, the greater the decrease in CO2 content, in turn increasing the rate of photosynthesis. A t-test comparing the rate of photosynthesis between the red and blue light gave us a P-value of 0.976 which is much greater than 0.05, meaning that there is no significant difference in photosynthesis rate between red and blue light.

Our results were not consistent with our hypothesis and prediction. We can see from our results that in fact, red light has a higher rate of photosynthesis on juniper needles. One source of error that could have been avoided was that we went directly from one light color to another without allowing the photosynthesis rate to stop before calculating it for the next wavelength of light. We could have wrapped the container with foil between each light color trial to allow photosynthesis to stop before beginning a new trial. According to the results of Javasankar et al. (2001), the rate of photosynthesis is lower in blue light because the high quantum yield of blue light reduces the content of chlorophyll in many species of Gracilaria. Also, Korbee et al. (2005) believed that the rate of photosynthesis was slowed under blue light with alga Porphyra leucosticta due to the increased number of mycosporine-like amino acids (MAAs) under blue light which act as non-photosynthetic photoreceptors. From the results of these experiments, we believe that the rate of photosynthesis of juniper needles is highest under red light because the excess energy produced by blue light decreases the chlorophyll content in plant pigments, slowing the rate of photosynthesis.

 

[surfguitar]

Got 3k goin right now 2 ushio hps on each side and 4000k mh in middle. Not the best comparison but I've noticed the plants tend to pray towards the mh and the plants under the mh are pretty frosty for day 21, excited to see what happens

 

[Drek]

GReen light ??? WTF is it good for ?? surely not for plants

http://pcp.oxfordjournals.org/content/50/4/684.full

 

[Jhhnn]

Nice, thanks for the update. I will pick one up for a test run.

Ive been using horti's too. What i seemed to notice is the bud structure comes out alot different between different bulbs. I used to run 4x600s back in the day and used to play around a little mainly with sunmaster hps and hortis. 2 of sun in 2 hoods/1side, same for the hortis. Bud structure (same strain/pheno under each hood, whole room actually was so much different i didnt believe it at first and had to do it again (a couple times after too)to make sure. I liked the look of the horti buds better, the other difference were negligible (potency, yield, etc). I think the SM's used to stretch a little more too.

Its funny how the few threads of Gnome's i have followed so far seem to bring out the haters, Lol! Its like Gnome sprays his threads with "hater in heat urine" and they come running in droves. Good stuff Gnome!

Dunno that it's haters but rather strong believers in things to the contrary, whether that belief is right, wrong, or indifferent.

I try to remember that deep down under the discussion the real driving force is life itself. The fact that life exists at all is pretty amazing, anyway, given that the difference between a person and a cadaver is the life forces operating in only one of them. It's utterly different from all other natural forces, being transcendent & ever changing.

It exists because it was born from & has grown from the other forces, changing itself, better adapting itself in an ongoing fashion through evolution over a few billion years, becoming an amazingly complex system of chemical processes. There's nothing else like it, and we understand it & ourselves only poorly. Human intellect pales against the majesty of Life itself.

As growers, we come at it from the other direction, trying to create artificial environments to suit the plants. We're fortunate that they are highly adaptable. Technology limits that, however, particularly wrt light. We can't deny the inverse square law, and we really couldn't mimic the spectrum of sunlight well at all until just recently. We've just made do, that's all. Only human arrogance lets us think that we might actually be doing better.

Billions of years of evolution vs internet know-it-all's. Go figure.

We're not that smart. Plants, in being able to adapt further, to thrive in the artificial light we're able to provide merely prove that. It's stressful, but they make do, just like us.

Real plant scientists understand that. If they could have a spectrum that duplicated sunlight, they'd use it. Which is why I'm intrigued by CMH, it being apparently the least imperfect artificial light source currently available.

 

[DrFever]

Dunno that it's haters but rather strong believers in things to the contrary, whether that belief is right, wrong, or indifferent.

I try to remember that deep down under the discussion the real driving force is life itself. The fact that life exists at all is pretty amazing, anyway, given that the difference between a person and a cadaver is the life forces operating in only one of them. It's utterly different from all other natural forces, being transcendent & ever changing.

It exists because it was born from & has grown from the other forces, changing itself, better adapting itself in an ongoing fashion through evolution over a few billion years, becoming an amazingly complex system of chemical processes. There's nothing else like it, and we understand it & ourselves only poorly. Human intellect pales against the majesty of Life itself.

As growers, we come at it from the other direction, trying to create artificial environments to suit the plants. We're fortunate that they are highly adaptable. Technology limits that, however, particularly wrt light. We can't deny the inverse square law, and we really couldn't mimic the spectrum of sunlight well at all until just recently. We've just made do, that's all. Only human arrogance lets us think that we might actually be doing better.

Billions of years of evolution vs internet know-it-all's. Go figure.

We're not that smart. Plants, in being able to adapt further, to thrive in the artificial light we're able to provide merely prove that. It's stressful, but they make do, just like us.

Real plant scientists understand that. If they could have a spectrum that duplicated sunlight, they'd use it. Which is why I'm intrigued by CMH, it being apparently the least imperfect artificial light source currently available.

You want the best light source look at Gavita lep plasma

 

[Drek]

As growers, we come at it from the other direction, trying to create artificial environments to suit the plants.
Which is why I'm intrigued by CMH, it being apparently the least imperfect artificial light source currently available.

The only thing better imo than the wide-spectral range that current (c)mh offers at 3-4k, is a higher frequency version of it.

The Sun's frequency is approximately 126hz(within the Earth's atmosphere). We all know how computer screens flicker due to low frequency and how 120hz televisions give a more seamless picture. Light at this higher frequency, would be one additional step up imo. It would be more fluid and graceful for acceptance into the plants; less flicker, less rough edges at a higher vibration. Digital ballasts are capable of running full-spectrum lamps at high frequency, at the expense of less lifetime and lower reliability.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sv6fWTMSDAg

 

[blissfest]

Hey Bliss 99 percent of these people that claim mh or cmh out performs HPS are fawking tent growers you ever wonder why other commercial growers you know the big boys on the block that throw away more weed then these people grow in a year sit back and laugh when you come down to it its all a Joke at the end of the day
all these dam stupid threads really do is confuse the new grower
now mixing both mh and hps is a good idea but again the novice grower will tend to use MH for veg and hps for flower
i my self have thrown all my MH bulbs in the garbage and only used hps for veg and flower like lots do
these fan boys of mh / /cmh again always falling back at NASA who the hell is NASA hahaha last time i herd there was no more hell when is next space shuttle launch ???? all US satellites are going up in space from europes space agency so please nix NASA -- it has become a big joke really

This thread is a trip, I realize people been comparing MH vs HPS for over 15 years on weed sites. I just didn't realize some actually believe MH is better???

I don't know anyone that would want to buy over twice the equipment too run 400w CMH's only too still fall short of one 1000w HPS??? Doesn't make any sense to buy 2.5 ballasts too run those bulbs?

 

[the gnome]

Drek 1/2 my bloom room is on hi freq. ballast a
i plan on switching out the rest soon for heat issues.
me and Jhhnn were discussing the 850w CMH when he sent me info on them
and noticed specific labeling not to use a hi freq ballast with it so i am passing.
rethinking that,
if i can get close to as many runs with it as other bulbs on digi ballasts it may be doable.

 

[Drek]

To get the optimal situation happening, a guy would want bulbs designed for high-freq operation. In essence, running low freq bulbs at double the freq, would throw off the power factor, increase the harmonic distortion and other consequences that the bulbs wouldn't really like; increasing heat, shortening life...and imo, increasing the chance of catastrophic failure. It would probably start to wear on the ballasts too. The load and the source need to be designed around each other.

Technically, it would literally shake the shit out of the lamp increasing the chances of physical damage, etc.

Doesn't mean it won't work, tho...for a while.

The Solistek lamps claim to fit the bill nicely, but then again, I'm assuming that their lamps are purpose built around their ballasts.
http://www.solis-tek.com/digital-lamps/index.html

...and then we're into more $$$.

 

[Jhhnn]

You want the best light source look at Gavita lep plasma

Looks great, but I can't justify the upfront expense as a hobby grower. The only way to get my money back is to smoke it back. I don't sell, ever. I'm currently suffering from an embarrassment of riches thanks to my dual arc 1000w. Right now, I'm testing some bargain 330w CMH on salvaged 400w MH industrial ballasts, if that tells you anything.

You realize that recommendation runs entirely counter to the HPS cheerleading, I hope.

 

[the gnome]

Doesn't mean it won't work, tho...for a while.
.

and *awhile* is a very loose definition of time which can also mean---> long enuff

 

[Catatafish]

Bliss, I dont understand why your panties are in a wad. YOU DONT HAVE TO USE MH/CMH bro. Let everyone else "fail" bud and just walk away.