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"Male hermies arent bad"

GMT

The Tri Guy
Veteran
Hey Crazy Chester, I really tried my best to make it straight forward in post 276, but I'll go through your Q's 1 by one.

"Something about this doesn't make sense to me - it prompts way more questions in me than it answers.".
I felt like that when I saw you running hoses across rooftops lol.

Ok 1st thing to remember here is this, plants don't feel a need, there's no conscious will at work, everything's simply chemistry. The log doesn't decide to burn, nor does it refuse, the chemical reaction simply takes place. Plants aren't making decisions as they have no brain mass.

Is there a genetic difference between a good girl and a naughty one? Yes, absolutely.

If it expresses female parts, it is female. The reverse cannot be said of a plant that expresses male parts. That may also be female.

How do we know that males aren't just woke females? It comes down to a combination of two things, pedigree and population demographics. If you have a line that regularly pops balls here and there, you're in for a tough time there. Getting a home sex testing kit would be a good start. But personally, I don't play with anything that has any relatives popping balls on females. It's like in the olden days where the old women in the village would arrange marriages. They would know the family history of each partner and wouldn't arrange marriages if one family had a history of insanity, or legs falling off or whatever. If you are playing with an active Y determination system, meaning there are true males in the population, there are no intersexed individuals, and a plant is showing solid male, then odds are, it's a male. But remember you're looking at parentage and not siblings.

A male will never express female flowers, reveg or not. A Y will always silence an X.

Males can be revegged, just like females can. It's rare you would ever want to, and it means you fucked something up, but yes, no issues. Remember it's not the flowers that reveg. Reveging new grow is the same principle as topping a plant, branch etc. The new growth comes from behind and to the sides of the flowers, not out of the flowers themselves.

A male plant has no idea, nor a care in the world about passing on it's genes. It doesn't know if it's pollinated a field or girls, or if it's alone in a wardrobe/tent/on a roof 😉 somewhere.

The vast majority of people who are growing anything other than the crazy hazes, Thai's or other mad sativas, can be fairly sure that if the line isn't a known Hermie risk, that their males are true males. And by fairly sure, I mean 99.9% sure.
But if it's an S1 from a female, they can be 100% sure it's a girl with balls. Which may sound contradictory, but it's not.

And yeah, true males are as common as true females. It's only the X to autosome extreme sativas, and lines where something has gone a little wrong along the way, that we need to be concerned about. And then the reports of pigs flying of course, which is simply impossible, and must be called so.
 

Crazy Chester

Well-known member
Hey Crazy Chester, I really tried my best to make it straight forward in post 276, but I'll go through your Q's 1 by one.

"Something about this doesn't make sense to me - it prompts way more questions in me than it answers.".
I felt like that when I saw you running hoses across rooftops lol.

Ok 1st thing to remember here is this, plants don't feel a need, there's no conscious will at work, everything's simply chemistry. The log doesn't decide to burn, nor does it refuse, the chemical reaction simply takes place. Plants aren't making decisions as they have no brain mass.

Is there a genetic difference between a good girl and a naughty one? Yes, absolutely.

If it expresses female parts, it is female. The reverse cannot be said of a plant that expresses male parts. That may also be female.

How do we know that males aren't just woke females? It comes down to a combination of two things, pedigree and population demographics. If you have a line that regularly pops balls here and there, you're in for a tough time there. Getting a home sex testing kit would be a good start. But personally, I don't play with anything that has any relatives popping balls on females. It's like in the olden days where the old women in the village would arrange marriages. They would know the family history of each partner and wouldn't arrange marriages if one family had a history of insanity, or legs falling off or whatever. If you are playing with an active Y determination system, meaning there are true males in the population, there are no intersexed individuals, and a plant is showing solid male, then odds are, it's a male. But remember you're looking at parentage and not siblings.

A male will never express female flowers, reveg or not. A Y will always silence an X.

Males can be revegged, just like females can. It's rare you would ever want to, and it means you fucked something up, but yes, no issues. Remember it's not the flowers that reveg. Reveging new grow is the same principle as topping a plant, branch etc. The new growth comes from behind and to the sides of the flowers, not out of the flowers themselves.

A male plant has no idea, nor a care in the world about passing on it's genes. It doesn't know if it's pollinated a field or girls, or if it's alone in a wardrobe/tent/on a roof 😉 somewhere.

The vast majority of people who are growing anything other than the crazy hazes, Thai's or other mad sativas, can be fairly sure that if the line isn't a known Hermie risk, that their males are true males. And by fairly sure, I mean 99.9% sure.
But if it's an S1 from a female, they can be 100% sure it's a girl with balls. Which may sound contradictory, but it's not.

And yeah, true males are as common as true females. It's only the X to autosome extreme sativas, and lines where something has gone a little wrong along the way, that we need to be concerned about. And then the reports of pigs flying of course, which is simply impossible, and must be called so.
Well - I can definitely agree with you that pigs don't fly. The plants on the roof thing would only make sense if you knew the details of the lay of the land here - so I'm not surprised you'd have a few questions prompted by that. The chemical reversal thing gets me thinking about whether there's a distinction between putting a chemical on a plant and causing a plant to produce that chemical which is already part of its biology that may show up after certain non-chemical stresses are applied to the plant. The rest I'm confused about may just be due to my lack of knowledge about plant biology. The consciousness thing, as far as I know, can't be proven or dis-proven, yet I'm coming from the other side of the spectrum on my beliefs concerning consciousness. I believe the only thing that exists is consciousness - so humans, plants, rocks, etc., are nothing but that.
 

GMT

The Tri Guy
Veteran
A fan of Berkley or the simulation theory, I suppose they are the same thing if you accept the nature of God is unknowable. I go one step further, his existence is unkowable, therefore let's not complicate things. A gold fish is conscious, but does it consider the genetic distribution among its fellow goldfish? I accept plants are alive, that's where I end, you accept they are conscious, do you really think they are plotting survival strategies?


"whether there's a distinction between putting a chemical on a plant and causing a plant to produce that chemical which is already part of its biology that may show up after certain non-chemical stresses are applied to the plant. "

If it reacts to stress, by its chemical composition altering to the point it's sexual morphology changes, personally I don't consider those plants to be genetically solid. I'd refer to such a plant as unstable. However the level of stress required for that to be acceptable, is very much an area of debate rather than scientific doctrine.

When applying a chemical, what you are doing is taking over the role that the inherited sex chromosomes would play. You over-rule the genetics rather than stimulating instability. If instability can be stimulated, the genetics are of debatable value.

Happy to go into stuff, just didn't want to take over the poor guys thread as well as piss on his chips.

Feel free to drop into my thread anytime you want to chat about anything.
 
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numberguy

Member
Confirmed the tall one is female the short one a male. I may not keep the male alive long enough to see if he sprouts female flowers. Still too early for good pics. The plants are from a male that had female flowers and were self pollinated, see previous posts.
Update one female one male sex is stable so far, they are growing good, the stems are large and hollow which they should not be. The one on the left is female the right one is male and stem of each respectively.
 

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LG/

Well-known member
Man all this info, idk... I have a plant that showed Male but threw some white hairs at the top. It had the smell rub that I wanted. Spot on, but do I use it to breed? I took a cut, I may run that and see what happens with it. But I know I probably shouldnt.....
 

acespicoli

Well-known member
Man all this info, idk... I have a plant that showed Male but threw some white hairs at the top. It had the smell rub that I wanted. Spot on, but do I use it to breed? I took a cut, I may run that and see what happens with it. But I know I probably shouldnt.....
Theres two kinds of breeding one is for preservation the other is for quality,
For preservation you keep everything
For quality there can only be one that is the best
hermies can be dealt with but require checking for opening flowers twice daily

:huggg:
 
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exoticrobotic

Well-known member
Does anyone see full blown hermies in the wild or is it more just a bit of late flowering reversal to keep the species alive?

I have a plant that showed Male but threw some white hairs at the top. It had the smell rub that I wanted. Spot on, but do I use it to breed? I took a cut, I may run that and see what happens with it. But I know I probably shouldnt..

I'd use it :biggrin: Show that ladyboy some love.

i've read "it's fire but hermies a little"

and "Three mythical magic beans were found in that amphitheater bud"

...It was fire, i looked for seed but only 1 seed per ounce...

SD i've run showed little male flowers at the main stalk before flowering out female

i've personally never seen a full 50:50 hermie.

I'm sure i've read somewhere that males with slight female herm tendencies are desirable.
 
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exoticrobotic

Well-known member
An Hermie could ruin a field of seedless plants one day.
It sure has the potential but do you know that this is actually what happens?

I've never used hermies but am not adverse to using them at all.

Do hermie parents actually cause unacceptable hermie offspring?
 

troutman

Seed Whore
It sure has the potential but do you know that this is actually what happens?

I would be willing to bet some breeders have overlooked Hermies and sold seeds which have
hurt somebody's elses garden at one point. If you don't sell seeds and keep Hermie genetic for
yourself then so be it. But don't be the person who sells them unannounced.

That being said, I'm sure some Hermies can be potent though.
 

Normannen

Anne enn Normal
Veteran
I would be willing to bet some breeders have overlooked Hermies and sold seeds which have
hurt somebody's elses garden at one point. If you don't sell seeds and keep Hermie genetic for
yourself then so be it. But don't be the person who sells them unannounced.

That being said, I'm sure some Hermies can be potent though.
To anyone smoking moroccan hash rn: "(cue Morpheus) Do you think that's True Female you're smoking?"
 

LG/

Well-known member
It isn't a male.
I may run with it just to see if this is true. Earlier in the thread someone was saying if it shows any pistils then it's a female herm. Then all seeds would be fem. Idk if I buy this...but I honestly don't know.
I have a small cab I could commit to this experiment. Or maybe even a tiny tent I've been using for seed starting. It's a very short tent but I can make it work I think.

Thanks everyone for your input! I appreciate all the perspectives.

Troutman, I generally agree. I'd usually get rid of anything that has intersex traits.

Exoticrobotic, I hear you as well. Fair points.

Acespicoli, thanks for that info.


So I did snap pics of said plant. Here they are. Worth noting is that I think it was immature when I put it in flower, I am often rushing to get the next project moving and clear veg space. Also, the environment isn't perfect, but I don't think that's a factor. Plant didn't show any signs of stress or issue other than the intersex stuff.
I do have two clones of it. And a female of the same line. Worth noting as well, and honestly probably far more important now that I remembered this detail, is that the Female also had some male parts on the lowers. I removed them and it looks fine now.
They are underlit, 33 w/sq ft led. I havent had issues before tho.
This strain is an older cut crossed with an ibl. I dont want to say specifically because the breeder is active on here.
Sorry for so many pics. I won't put them full size. The white spots are sulpher.
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Normannen

Anne enn Normal
Veteran
I may run with it just to see if this is true. Earlier in the thread someone was saying if it shows any pistils then it's a female herm. Then all seeds would be fem. Idk if I buy this...but I honestly don't know.
I have a small cab I could commit to this experiment. Or maybe even a tiny tent I've been using for seed starting. It's a very short tent but I can make it work I think.

Thanks everyone for your input! I appreciate all the perspectives.

Troutman, I generally agree. I'd usually get rid of anything that has intersex traits.

Exoticrobotic, I hear you as well. Fair points.

Acespicoli, thanks for that info.


So I did snap pics of said plant. Here they are. Worth noting is that I think it was immature when I put it in flower, I am often rushing to get the next project moving and clear veg space. Also, the environment isn't perfect, but I don't think that's a factor. Plant didn't show any signs of stress or issue other than the intersex stuff.
I do have two clones of it. And a female of the same line. Worth noting as well, and honestly probably far more important now that I remembered this detail, is that the Female also had some male parts on the lowers. I removed them and it looks fine now.
They are underlit, 33 w/sq ft led. I havent had issues before tho.
This strain is an older cut crossed with an ibl. I dont want to say specifically because the breeder is active on here.
Sorry for so many pics. I won't put them full size. The white spots are sulpher.
View attachment 18917622 View attachment 18917623 View attachment 18917624 View attachment 18917625 View attachment 18917626 View attachment 18917627 View attachment 18917628 View attachment 18917629 View attachment 18917630 View attachment 18917631
Another thing to look out for is those hermies that won't produce viable pollen. I lost a clone that way, I thought I had successfully turned a female into a male, however the pollen turned out to be sterile and got duds instead of viable seeds. None sprouted. The female by then could not be reveged. So, make sure those male flowers produce fertile pollen before using them in your breeding projects. Again, the pictures are really good, but we souls be able to observe the whole development to draw realistic conclusions. What do you want to do with this strain? Because using hermies to save it, means down the line you will have to put some active work in removing hermies if they're an unwanted trait.
 

Ecor1

Active member
Man all this info, idk... I have a plant that showed Male but threw some white hairs at the top. It had the smell rub that I wanted. Spot on, but do I use it to breed? I took a cut, I may run that and see what happens with it. But I know I probably shouldnt.....
Well if you get any seeds I will take a run at them, females are the ones that you try to keep stable. I would not be in a hurry to get rid of something that might be good?
 
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