Legalize MJ ! Really? No I mean REALLY?

[igrowone]

Where does all this trust in government come from anyway?

If you doubt me, google on how the Kennedy family made their money during prohibition.

Didn't you people learn anything in school? No wonder this country sucks ass with 50% of the people living off the other 50%.

curious about the conclusion you seem to have about the Kennedy family and prohibition, but haven't detailed
for those not familiar with this bit of history, Joe Kennedy(family patriarch) had a rep for having made his money in the illegal booze business back in the day
so what? it wasn't like he was part of regulating the liquor industry after prohibition ended

 

[Anti]

Sorry, but you are wrong. Moonshining is illegal because the federal government does not get their TAX dollar for HOME MADE LIQUOR. That is what moonshining is.... liquor. Not beer or wine. See the little red sticker on a bottle of booze? That is the federal tax stamp guaranteeing that that bottle is legal and has had taxes paid to the feds.

If that's true, then why aren't homemade BEER and WINE illegal also?

Not going to insult your intelligence or education, notice.

Expect the same for MJ in the future.

I'd be happy to pay a tax on any MJ that I sell in the future when it's legal. Or I'd be happy to keep what I grow and smoke it myself without fear of gestapo kicking my door down.

Where does all this trust in government come from anyway?

I don't trust the government. Never claimed I did.

If you doubt me, google on how the Kennedy family made their money during prohibition.

Yeah, I know. They were in the booze biz. Wow! Thanks for the history lesson! What's that got to do with why moonshine is illegal to make in your kitchen, but beer and wine are not?

Didn't you people learn anything in school? No wonder this country sucks ass with 50% of the people living off the other 50%.

It's closer to 3% living off the other 97%. Go back to school.

 

[SmilinBob]

Can we come to the conclusion that until federal law is changed there won't be any federal funded agency governing cannabis?

 

[grapeman]

your mixing state and federal YET AGAIN!!!!
im not sure if this is ignorance or underhanded tactics.

lets shed some light.

firstly when it comes to distillation you are referencing federal statute. federal statutes concerning marijuana will remain unchanged when T.C.2010 passes.

the usda/fda WILL NOT change federal policy and begin to regulate cannabis when T.C.2010 passes. this is nothing more than another prohibitionist scare tactic like the disproven bullshit about phillip morris buying up tracts of land in norcal or that somehow Richard Lee is going to monopolize the entire marijuana market in california and patent all the genes and have his r.lee stormtroopers pollinate your plants black ops style in the middle of the night.

I know the difference between feds and state. I am not trying to scare anyone (most here are too stoned to be scared). But what I am telling you is a fact. The USDA will be involved in the future, along with the FDA.

I've spent 35 years growing crops in California and we adhere to state rules and laws and are inspected by the usda (the feds). Since this product came to legalization via the backdoor that is Medical, bet your ass that the FDA will be involved.

To continue to deny that or accuse me of not knowing more then you on how this relationship works between the states and feds when it comes to agriculture is STUPID on your part.

Also go back and re-read my posts. I dont tell anyone on how to vote. I just point out that there are unintended consequences to the way this process is coming to fruition.

I personally don't see a problem the way it is today in california. anyone who lives here knows you can get a script for the product at the drop of a hat. So whats the problem?

You do know that this is a state law coming up in Nov.? I'll bet the majority of the folks posting in this thread don't even live in California. No one is going to jail in California anymore for pot.

Unless they are fucking stupid. So where the fuck is the emergency? We have time to write the law correctly.

The people in this thread crying about going to jail don't even live in this state. Are these morons going to be bused into california by the unions to vote in favor of this bill like in most elections anymore?

NO ONE GOES TO JAIL FOR POT IN CALIFORNIA ANYMORE UNLESS THEY ARE FUCKING STUPID.

So if they are in jail, maybe it's a good place for them to be.

 

[SmilinBob]

grapeman what part(s) of the bill concerns you?

As you already know anytime anything is made with the intent of selling on a mass scale to the general public there will be rules. Otherwise where is the concern for consumer safety?

You seem to not want the USDA or any other agency interfering with cannabis.. That's great, but where is your concern for the public?

 

[Hash Zeppelin]

I think it is more likely to fall under the realm of the ATF if it is legalized. It will be the ATMF

......maybe led by the ATHF lol (aqua teen hunger force)

 

[grapeman]

If that's true, then why aren't homemade BEER and WINE illegal also?

Not going to insult your intelligence or education, notice.



I'd be happy to pay a tax on any MJ that I sell in the future when it's legal. Or I'd be happy to keep what I grow and smoke it myself without fear of gestapo kicking my door down.



I don't trust the government. Never claimed I did.



Yeah, I know. They were in the booze biz. Wow! Thanks for the history lesson! What's that got to do with why moonshine is illegal to make in your kitchen, but beer and wine are not?



It's closer to 3% living off the other 97%. Go back to school.

Why are you asking me? I'M JUST TELLING YOU THAT LIQUOR IS TAXED DIFFERENTLY THEN BEER OR WINE. You seem to have a computer so google it and learn something. Everything I said in my above post is 100% true. You seem to keep coming back with this beer & wine shit. WTF. beer or wine is not liquor. There is a red tax stamp on all liquor. Also, if you think only 3% of our worthless population is living off the other 97%, then you are part of the problem. It is just about 50% - 50%.

And for DAGNABIT, I'm not mixing feds or state regulations. If you had read from the beginning of the thread, you would know my contention here is that we are inviting federal regulation once this crop is legalized. All produce is inspected by the USDA before being sold to any grocery store chain and since this crop came into commerce via the back door that is "medical", expect the FDA to involve itself in this product also. It doesn't matter if the crop is grown in California and also sold in California, never once crossing the state line. Feds are involved.

This is the 4th time I have stated this and your sophomoric posts that I am confusing state and federal is just demonstrating your ignorance. If you think the feds will NOT involve themselves in the sale, inspection and distribution of this product, then set forth your argument as to why they will not do so. Otherwise, find another thread where you can make the same stupid post over and over again due to the fact you are too dense to understand the premise of which I offer my experience and 35+ years of knowledge of growing products that come under the scrutiny of the FEDS on a daily fucking basis.

You think the feds, who won't let you buy an apple unless they inspect and approve the product won't involve themselves in a product making medical claims??? Tell us why you think that.

 

[BiG H3rB Tr3E]

Feds inspect every piece of fruit in America????? Then how come we get so many sour grapes LoLOllOLL

 

[dagnabit]

If you think the feds will NOT involve themselves in the sale, inspection and distribution of this product, then set forth your argument as to why they will not do so. Otherwise, find another thread where you can make the same stupid post over and over again due to the fact you are too dense to understand the premise of which I offer my experience and 35+ years of knowledge of growing products that come under the scrutiny of the FEDS on a daily fucking basis.

You think the feds, who won't let you buy an apple unless they inspect and approve the product won't involve themselves in a product making medical claims??? Tell us why you think that.

its simple really...

the feds do not and will not classify marijuana as "produce" they also do not classify marijuana as "medicine" which is why in the entire history of medical marijuana law you have not seen the F.D.A. attempt to regulate marijuana in any way.
the federal government is just like any other unadaptable bureaucracy. they operate based on definitions and semantics. if they acknowledge marijuana as "produce" and regulate and inspect it in the entities of the U.S.D.A. or the F.D.A. then the classification by the F.D.A. as schedule I becomes irrelevant.
if you think the federal government is going to reclassify marijuana because T.C.2010 passes when they did not do so with 215 or 420 or any other state medical legislation then your thinking must be the "sophomoric" type.

riddle me this ohh wise one...

why has the FDA waited 15 years to reclassify marijuana and begin to regulate it in california?

following your reasoning they should have stepped in the day after 215?

i guess T.C. 2010 will change the feds minds...

but i hope your absolutely correct!!! i hope the usda and fda get involved..FEDERAL LEGALIZTION!!!!!!! but your nightmare is a pipedream

 

[dagnabit]

Feds inspect every piece of fruit in America????? Then how come we get so many sour grapes LoLOllOLL

like the cherries i bought from a roadside stand run by a 10 year old girl today
i think she was a union thug...but she needed to strike for dental...

 

[grapeman]

Feds inspect every piece of fruit in America????? Then how come we get so many sour grapes LoLOllOLL

Because I know how to work the system. LOL

 

[grapeman]

its simple really...

the feds do not and will not classify marijuana as "produce" they also do not classify marijuana as "medicine" which is why in the entire history of medical marijuana law you have not seen the F.D.A. attempt to regulate marijuana in any way.
the federal government is just like any other unadaptable bureaucracy. they operate based on definitions and semantics. if they acknowledge marijuana as "produce" and regulate and inspect it in the entities of the U.S.D.A. or the F.D.A. then the classification by the F.D.A. as schedule I becomes irrelevant.
if you think the federal government is going to reclassify marijuana because T.C.2010 passes when they did not do so with 215 or 420 or any other state medical legislation then your thinking must be the "sophomoric" type.

riddle me this ohh wise one...

why has the FDA waited 15 years to reclassify marijuana and begin to regulate it in california?

following your reasoning they should have stepped in the day after 215?

i guess T.C. 2010 will change the feds minds...

but i hope your absolutely correct!!! i hope the usda and fda get involved..FEDERAL LEGALIZTION!!!!!!! but your nightmare is a pipedream

Wrong again. Any crop grown (once legalized) that takes fertilizer, pesticides, fungicides or growth hormones, falls to the USDA and local county Ag Inspectors to obtain the above mentioned products. Everything grown commercially falls to that category. Unless you intend to do a large scale stealth grow and buy your nutrients etc at the local hydro store (and make your cost of growing 5 times that of mine where I buy bulk at the local Ag store ie. calcium nitrate in a hydro bottle is say $20/quart when I can but it pure from the local Ag store and pay the same amount for 5 gallons... they do custom mixes too), you are mistaken. And if you want to sell to a dispensary, you will have to keep records to show, and submit monthly to CDFA (California Department of food and Ag) your spraying and fertilizing records. The CDFA will then cross reference your reports with the amount of product you buy at the local Ag store. That's what they do now for ALL PRODUCE grown in the California and the USA. Do you think they will do less for MJ? We have a full time secretary who's job it is to just do this paperwork and submit to the government all day long. I report down to the pound of sulfur, the amount I use per acre. Date, time of day, weather conditions at time of application, method of application, applicators name and S.S.N.. Everything. Miss a report and you are in trouble. Oh, and don't forget to hold monthly training sessions for your employees and document all classes given. Oh, and to give a class to your employees, you need to be first certified by the state. You know... just in case some employee claims you applied sulfur and they got sick from it. Pay attention to your re-entry periods and days before harvest on all applications. And more.

Oh, and don't forget to obtain your PCA or PCO license, or you can't grow the produce or buy the chemicals at the Ag store.

Growing organic???? Then you need to deal with a whole other set of paperwork to prove you are growing organic. Using sulfur in your grow room organically? You still need to report the use of sulfur, neem etc. to the government. Same shit. All of the above.

Unless you think they are going to treat MJ that you claim has medical qualities and you inhale into your lungs more leniently then an apple. I don't think so.

So when I said in my first post that this law is the tip of the iceberg, and that it favors already existing dispensaries, I meant it. When I said that big Ag and existing dispensaries have an advantage over you I meant it. This law will do more to allow the existing folks to grow their business while you forever watch from the outside looking in.

Anything else you want to know? IMO only.

 

[dagnabit]

Anything else you want to know? IMO only.

sure something besides what products are used in shitty comercial cultivation...

like how you expect the federal government to deal with internal juxtaposition relating to classification by the FDA?

i notice you completely glossed over the meat of my previous post just to explain how farming and inspection of federally LEGAL produce. but your comparing apples to marijuana (literally).

i am saying (as slowly and simply as possible) the federal government will not view ANY marijuana farmer as a farmer and will not view marijuana as produce. the farmer is considered an illicit drug manufacturer and the produce is "narcotics"
these definitions changing for the federal government to inspect cannabis is tantamount to federal legalization.
it is my feverent hope that this worse case scenario comes true...
it has been my mission in life since the first time i saw the inside of a state prison because of the prohibition of this plant that it be treated like any other plant.
if that means the feds inspect huge commercial farmers then so be it.
i grow the best melons and heirloom tomatoes you ever did eat and sell them every weekend (no inspection needed) i can do the exact same with this here SSHxBK as well...
so let the feds reclassify from schedule I and start the inspection process!

and btw you never did answer the question as to why the FDA is not inspecting MMJ?

medicine is maybe the only thing more regulated than food yet 15 years later no federal inspectors..

your henny penny sky has not fallen yet and i dont see T.C.2010 as the catalyst for marijuana Armageddon.

 

[grapeman]

sure something besides what products are used in shitty comercial cultivation...

like how you expect the federal government to deal with internal juxtaposition relating to classification by the FDA?

i notice you completely glossed over the meat of my previous post just to explain how farming and inspection of federally LEGAL produce. but your comparing apples to marijuana (literally).

i am saying (as slowly and simply as possible) the federal government will not view ANY marijuana farmer as a farmer and will not view marijuana as produce. the farmer is considered an illicit drug manufacturer and the produce is "narcotics"
these definitions changing for the federal government to inspect cannabis is tantamount to federal legalization.
it is my feverent hope that this worse case scenario comes true...
it has been my mission in life since the first time i saw the inside of a state prison because of the prohibition of this plant that it be treated like any other plant.
if that means the feds inspect huge commercial farmers then so be it.
i grow the best melons and heirloom tomatoes you ever did eat and sell them every weekend (no inspection needed) i can do the exact same with this here SSHxBK as well...
so let the feds reclassify from schedule I and start the inspection process!

and btw you never did answer the question as to why the FDA is not inspecting MMJ?

medicine is maybe the only thing more regulated than food yet 15 years later no federal inspectors..

your henny penny sky has not fallen yet and i dont see T.C.2010 as the catalyst for marijuana Armageddon.

When the pharmaceutical companies figure out how to grow MJ in a fermentation vat then "farming" Mj won't be necessary. In the meantime, as Mj becomes more and more mainstream, you will see the USDA AND the FDA set their standards. I can't say it any slower for you either. Government will begin to set minimum standards, like they do for everything else that is grown.... from flowers to produce. Strain standards, thc standards, labeling standards, etc etc.

The first post of this thread seems to be lost with the ADD folks. It was just an observation that this type of standardization will be forthcoming. If you don't think it will, you are entitled to your opinion. But in few years, after Mj becomes very mainstream, what I am saying will become reality.

I don't know how much more boneheaded you can be to keep thinking that I am comparing apples to MJ. It is moronic to believe that apples deserve a closer inspection then MJ. They are both grown or farmed. They are both distributed to the public at large.

This is the type of regulations our government thrives upon. Sorry you are too ignorant or blind to see this simple fact that I live with day to day and you refuse to understand. next time you are in the supermarket and the grocery boy is putting out any produce, look at the container as he unloads the fruits/veggies. See the USDA inspection stamp for yourself. It even has the date of inspection within the stamp. It changes every day.

So just say it here and be done with it. You think that it is more important that the government inspects your veggies then your meds and you will convince the government that you are correct.

Phfft. good luck.

 

[dagnabit]

When the pharmaceutical companies figure out how to grow MJ in a fermentation vat then "farming" Mj won't be necessary. In the meantime, as Mj becomes more and more mainstream, you will see the USDA AND the FDA set their standards. I can't say it any slower for you either. Government will begin to set minimum standards, like they do for everything else that is grown.... from flowers to produce. Strain standards, thc standards, labeling standards, etc etc.

you are right all this can happen as soon as the federal government reclassifies marijuana as a non schedule one drug until then the federal government WILL NOT BE INSPECTING ILLEGAL NARCOTICS LIKE IT'S FUCKING APPLES!

The first post of this thread seems to be lost with the ADD folks. It was just an observation that this type of standardization will be forthcoming. If you don't think it will, you are entitled to your opinion. But in few years, after Mj becomes very mainstream, what I am saying will become reality.

god i hope so!!!!

I don't know how much more boneheaded you can be to keep thinking that I am comparing apples to MJ. It is moronic to believe that apples deserve a closer inspection then MJ. They are both grown or farmed. They are both distributed to the public at large.

in the same sentence you ad hominem me as a bonehead for suggesting you were comparing apples to marijuana...then compare apples to marijuana again!!!

This is the type of regulations our government thrives upon. Sorry you are too ignorant or blind to see this simple fact that I live with day to day and you refuse to understand. next time you are in the supermarket and the grocery boy is putting out any produce, look at the container as he unloads the fruits/veggies. See the USDA inspection stamp for yourself. It even has the date of inspection within the stamp. It changes every day.

Sorry you are too ignorant or blind to see this simple fact that the federal government views marijuana the EXACT same as crack rolled in meth and dipped in heroin. there are no FDA inspection stickers on crack vials or heroin bags for the exact same reason there are no inspection stickers on buds being sold as medicine in the several states doing so...

So just say it here and be done with it. You think that it is more important that the government inspects your veggies then your meds and you will convince the government that you are correct.

Phfft. good luck.

wow you are either purposefully missing the point or are just that slow.

i am saying (plainly) the comparisons you make to federally legal produce are false. the federal government will not be inspecting marijuana the way they inspect produce because the federal government does not consider marijuana produce. when the feds do consider marijuana produce that will be a cause for celebration!!! that will mean no more humans imprisoned for marijuana!!!!!

ill ask again (not that i expect an answer) if you believe that state legislation will cause government inspection/regulation why has the FDA not set "their standards" for this prescription medication being dispensed?

the answer is simple...the federal government can not acknowledge marijuana as medicine and continue to classify it a schedule one drug.
nor can they consider marijuana produce and a schedule one drug

so lets say it here and be done.
the inspection/regulation of marijuana by the FDA or the USDA can not happen without reclassification away from schedule one. that means federal legalization!!! no more prison for possession!!!!! FUCK YES BRING IT ON!!!!!

 

[Anti]

the inspection/regulation of marijuana by the FDA or the USDA can not happen without reclassification away from schedule one. that means federal legalization!!! no more prison for possession!!!!! FUCK YES BRING IT ON!!!!!

Let's repeat it one more time for those who are slow.

UNTIL the "narcotic" marijuana is removed from schedule 1, it CANNOT be regulated by the FDA or the USDA.

REMOVING marijuana from schedule 1 effectively DECRIMINALIZES it!

(Which is a good thing for everyone in the world, not just the citizens of california.)

 

[igrowone]

When the pharmaceutical companies figure out how to grow MJ in a fermentation vat then farming Mj won't be necessary. In the meantime, as Mj becomes more and more mainstream, you will see the USDA AND the FDA set their standards. I can't say it any slower for you either. Government will begin to set minimum standards, like they do for everything else that is grown.... from flowers to produce. Strain standards, thc standards, labeling standards, etc etc.

if you're convinced this is in the works, what effect will any state law have?
what would you need to see in a state legalization bill that changes this course of events?
given your hypotheses, i doubt any likely legalization legislation would satisfy you

 

[SmilinBob]

If he's right and they set standards it will only be for what is selling in stores etc.

You'll still be able to grow it any way you want.

 

[dagnabit]

Let's repeat it one more time for those who are slow.

UNTIL the "narcotic" marijuana is removed from schedule 1, it CANNOT be regulated by the FDA or the USDA.

REMOVING marijuana from schedule 1 effectively DECRIMINALIZES it!

(Which is a good thing for everyone in the world, not just the citizens of california.)

holy shit there is still reading comprehension still left in the world...

i thought my point was simple but it sure seemed to confuse the hoople heads

 

[grapeman]

holy shit there is still reading comprehension still left in the world...

i thought my point was simple but it sure seemed to confuse the hoople heads

See - there it is. You are talking what is effective today and I am telling you the way it will probably work in the future. I understand what you are saying now, and I keep pointing out what is coming.... not in november, but someday, as old people die and the youth turn middle age. And when it happens, it will be regulated by several branches of the government.

I know it was too much to ask, but I did so several times.... for you to go back and read the OP so you would have context. But you don't.

But you are smarter then most posters..... at least you think you are. Dangerous thinking.

Anyway, if you grow a plant or 2 at home, NP. Intend to sell to a club or start your own club, you better understand what is coming. Because it is coming.