Growers are just saying NO to pot legalization

[Shcrews]

**waits for another Sam post that doesn't address this...**

Who has the best herb in the world?
Not that I smoke herb, I prefer Dry Sift Resin....

-SamS

LOL nice.

so who has lead the Legalization movement more than Jack Herer?

and why is he not a credible source in your opinion?

 

[Smoke Buddy]

I think if we had real liberty, there would be no taxes on any of these items, muchless people holding that up as what is right about government. When you grow an herb and sell it to someone who will pay for it, thats supply and demand. I would support the legalization bill if it didn't have provision to turn it over to Philip Morris by issuing licenses only to those that they deem big enough to create a solid tax basis and if it didnt add $50/oz shakedown. So I aint buying into this idea that its just like any other sin item where government exploits it. Incidentally, Im ok with the price going down with fair competition. This bill will make unfair competition for the cottage grower. The laws need to be changed to total decriminalization of possesion and cultivation but with no special government rules where they take over with big biz.

If you make and sell beer and wine would you expect to pay taxes on it?

No chance of me running for office, I am way to busy growing, and I don't believe in politics much except to achieve Cannabis reform. I never met a politician I liked, ever.

-SamS

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

There is no one person as stars have risen and fallen with the passage of time.
From early groups like AMORPHIA IN 1969 with Dr. Michael Aldrich to Dr. Tod Mikuriya for his work with medical Cannabis for decades before the passage of 215.
There are too many to list, but Jack is not the most important for sure, I would say that Dennis did much more then Jack, but it my personal opinion, that is all. I knew all of these people well as I have been involved in Cannabis reform for many decades.

I didn't answer your question about Jack because I don't want to speak badly about the dead, plain and simple.

I am still wondering about the best herb in the world, what is it and who has it?
I want to grind it up and make resin..... Ummmm the worlds best resin....
Somebody tell me.....

-SamS

 

[krunchbubble]

Do you even understand that Prop 19 will not affect 215 or 420?

"with just enough grey area to still make a decent living out of it on a small level. im not a big commercial grower by any means and i still like the current way it works..."

So the reason to vote NO on Prop 19 is to keep your income coming in? And hell with the 800,000+ Cannabis arrests as they are "mostly commercial growers who took the risk and got popped....not little old granny smoking in her bedroom getting the door kicked down like you say."

Wrong, 847,863 last year in the USA, of those, 754,224 people were arrested for marijuana possession alone. You really need to get your facts straight if you are going to use these "facts" to decide to vote NO on Prop 19.

But as long as you are safe and numb, I gets everything is fine, for YOU.

-SamS

I never ever said 800,000+ in California, I did say the way to change the 800,000+ arrests in the USA is for California to lead the nation and world in Cannabis reform, and pass Prop 19, it will start a landslide of reform nationwide and worldwide, we have waited long enough.
As for fear mongering to me it is the people yelling Prop 19 will destroy 215 & 420. Without a shred of proof, only their fears that maybe it could happen....
One thing is for sure, prices will fall under a passed Prop 19, and that is the real concern of most of the NO voters. Be honest.

-SamS

as i said , this is about California voters. sry, but the 800k US arrests, they don't even slightly factor in any of these arguments, or even in the whole subject.

have your ever got in trouble with cultivation in California? im talking from experience....

fear mongering........

 

[Shcrews]

There is no one person as stars have risen and fallen with the passage of time.
From early groups like AMORPHIA IN 1969 with Dr. Michael Aldrich to Dr. Tod Mikuriya for his work with medical Cannabis for decades before the passage of 215.
There are too many to list, but Jack is not the most important for sure, I would say that Dennis did much more then Jack, but it my personal opinion, that is all. I knew all of these people well as I have been involved in Cannabis reform for many decades.

I didn't answer your question about Jack because I don't want to speak badly about the dead, plain and simple.

I am still wondering about the best herb in the world, what is it and who has it?
I want to grind it up and make resin..... Ummmm the worlds best resin....
Somebody tell me.....

-SamS

are any of the above mentioned ppl still alive, or commenting on the current bill? cuz jack was/did. I haven't heard from the rest of them. Jack, however, was very vocal about his oppostion to this bill, and his reasons are sound IMO

 

[krunchbubble]

krunch- i only jump on peoples shit who i dont like! haha...youdaman....
and let me ask a specific question...maybe it will help me understand where the oppsition is coming from....
---what is the issue w paying taxes on cannabis? cuz jack said he didnt think we should? do people think that because canna users have been persecuted for years, that as payback we should be the only ag crop that doesnt get taxed?shit, maybe im wrong...do other ag products not get taxed? is this where the brunt of the tax problem comes from? and im not being my usual smart ass self...i really am curious as i have gotten a number of remarks in private, visitor messages etc saying this was the main sticking point from some peeps perspective...

i have zero issues paying taxes. i am a CEO of a collective.......

im against the new rules and regulations. and fear what will come ahead when big companies get involved.....


and no one can say that big companies wont get involved, they already are......

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

I think if we had real liberty, there would be no taxes on any of these items, muchless people holding that up as what is right about government. When you grow an herb and sell it to someone who will pay for it, thats supply and demand. I would support the legalization bill if it didn't have provision to turn it over to Philip Morris by issuing licenses only to those that they deem big enough to create a solid tax basis and if it didnt add $50/oz shakedown. So I aint buying into this idea that its just like any other sin item where government exploits it. Incidentally, Im ok with the price going down with fair competition. This bill will make unfair competition for the cottage grower. The laws need to be changed to total decriminalization of possesion and cultivation but with no special government rules where they take over with big biz.

Do you think you could compete with making your own beer or wine and selling to compete with Budweiser or Gallo? Good luck.

I understand your fear though, you are selling a product for many times what it could cost to grow legally outdoors by professional farmers. The future is clear, the only question is how much more time will be wasted getting there, and how many more Americans will be arrested until Cannabis is legalized for recreational use also.

-SamS

 

[subrob]

I have never said they wouldnt become involved bro...matter a fact you can search my posts for the last few months saying legalization without commercialization is not ever going to happen....
...the one thing i cannot wrap my mind around is oppositions insistence that cali legalizing herb, in whatever form, will have no implication for the rest of the country. is there anyone here, one single person, who thinks prop 215 didnt pave the way for other states? had no influence at all? and what exactly is wrong w looking at this issue as a platform for national change?

 

[Shcrews]

subrob, maybe Cali could set a national example by legalizing and NOT TAXING Herb, and then set another example by cutting unneccessary spending, which would solve the budget deficit crisis. ... The town i live in just spent $4 million adding more police to the force, meanwhile they just sit around and fuck with the homeless...

do we want to give them more money to blow? pay for freedom?

oh wait, i forgot that's the only reason this bill even exists.... so government/business (they are the same ppl now) can get bigger.

 

[CARE giver]

I didn't mean to come off like he wasn't a good grower, just that he (and the vast majority of those that supply dispensaries) are not experienced agriculturalists which , if cannabis was on a level with other cash crops, should be the people supplying the market.

I'm interested in this.

It's pretty simple to grow marijuana. And any information that you might need could easily be found somewhere on this site.

But is there technical, scientifical information that sets agriculturalists apart from your average grower.

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

as i said , this is about California voters. sry, but the 800k US arrests, they don't even slightly factor in any of these arguments, or even in the whole subject.

have your ever got in trouble with cultivation in California? im talking from experience....

fear mongering........

To you they may not factor in, but you can't decide what is important to me or others.
The thread was started by DIGITALHIPPY who said nothing about only California voters posting. Or not counting the over 800,000 annual Cannabis arrests as unimportant to this issue. You say it.
Yes I know a little bit about people being arrested in California, from neighbors to family, and friends to many to count, and you have no idea of what you speak of. Or even in your own case did you say you have been arrested 4 times so far for Cannabis? What bullshit, sounds like 215 is no good to prevent arrest, and 420 is not much defense against over zealous LEO's as many have found out. But as long as YOU are chilling, that is all that is really important, hey dude?

-SamS

 

[subrob]

subrob, maybe Cali could set a national example by legalizing and NOT TAXING Herb, and then set another example by cutting unneccessary spending, which would solve the budget deficit crisis. ... The town i live in just spent $4 million adding more police to the force, meanwhile they just sit around and fuck with the homeless...

do we want to give them more money to blow? pay for freedom?

oh wait, i forgot that's the only reason this bill even exists.... so government/business (they are the same ppl now) can get bigger.

there is absolutely no way, that i can see, for herb to be legal without the government getting a cut. i cant imagine it. im not condoning it....bet i have more reason to DESPISE my federal government then anyone on these boards...believe that...but that is another, very long story....but its the way it is nowadays...now, anyone here wanna start a revolution? sign me the fuck up. im down...but using this issue to rebel against the way things get done in this country by voting no seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face to me. and ya, i will pay for freedom. without question or hesitation. its better than not having the chance at all. we pay for every godamn thing else, why not?

 

[krunchbubble]

To you they may not factor in, but you can't decide what is important to me or others.
The thread was started by DIGITALHIPPY who said nothing about only California voters posting. Or not counting the over 800,000 annual Cannabis arrests as unimportant to this issue. You say it.
Yes I know a little bit about people being arrested in California, from neighbors to family, and friends to many to count, and you have no idea of what you speak of. Or even in your own case did you say you have been arrested 4 times so far for Cannabis? What bullshit, sounds like 215 is no good to prevent arrest, and 420 is not much defense against over zealous LEO's as many have found out. But as long as YOU are chilling, that is all that is really important, hey dude?

-SamS

this thread was started by digitalhippie, quoting a grower from California. this thread IS ABOUT California growers, voters saying no to pot legalization.

i said i was busted 4 times, arrested once, because they had to, they raided me with reporters, just to let me go 72 hours later with no charges.....

your not even from here or live here, why are you in this thread?

 

[subrob]

Subrob I can teach you how to pay all the taxes you want now on herb. Pay em so good that the irs cashes the check knowing it for herb.

problem is i dont make money off of cannabis...but if i ever do...i will look you up

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

Why can't anyone tell me what the best herb in the world is? According to 215forLife???
He won't answer my question, why I don't know.

-SamS

 

[Yes4Prop215]

It is beyond ridiculous to say that a law that allows people to grow 99 plants should be considered adequate. You are really missing the point, 50 an eighth is that bad, why should we pay twice the price of the best truffles or four times the price of the best caviar for a plant that can be grown by just about anyone just about anywhere? How hard is it to understand the situation in California in regards to supply and price is still heavily influenced by prohibition.



BOLD = What a load of drivel, I cant believe you wrote that, you are basically saying why bother legalizing its better for people to live in fear of arrest. We are sacrificing growers like you so real commercial growers can take your place.

first off you are way off in your generalization of me and others here as profiteering growers..blah blah.... face it...alot of people wont want to grow their weed anyways..shit i almost gave up growing several times because i know so many good growers its almost pointless. i know a bunch of folk who have tried growing to get rich and failed..."anyone" just cant do it it takes alot of investment and time...

i am not a big time grower like you assume..i run small closets for personal consumption mostly..im not profiteering off the sick so stop that nonsense. i broker sometimes because i know so many growers that i might as well. if anything i should be advocating for 19 because i can lowball my growers more and bring cheaper prices to the street.

but i can see the long term aspect of this destroying our counterculture and how this bill 19 itself is a bad bill that gives too much power to too few people.... nowehere did i say anywhere i didnt want it legalized and people to go to jail. i want a certain form of legalization that is not in the 19 bill, and I find that 215 is plenty enough for my idea of legalization. with my card i can grow all i want, smoke all i want, and be stress free from arrest.

Sam you keep bringing up the 80k arrested in CA but rsearch those arrests. how many were for guys trying to break down weight or growing way over limits? those guys who got arrested arent your average Joes, they were profiteers who will stll get arrested under 19...maybe we will see the number drop, maybe we will see it rise as more people try to illegaly grow, who knows.

all i know is that under current 215 law...YOU CAN GROW AND SMOKE PRETTY MUCH ALL YOU WANT WITH LITTLE REGULATION. you might pay a tax at the local club buying some concentrates or a nice 8th, but thats where it should stop.

 

[krunchbubble]

will be back to continue..........

have to go water my other house..........

good discussion today..........

 

[Yes4Prop215]

What bullshit, sounds like 215 is no good to prevent arrest, and 420 is not much defense against over zealous LEO's as many have found out. But as long as YOU are chilling, that is all that is really important, hey dude?

-SamS

Only to growers and profiteerers...215 and 420sb PROTECT SMALL TIME GROWERS, RECREATIONAL SMOKERS, ETC. If you are just doing your own personal thing, UNDER CURRENT LAWS WITH YOUR MED CARD...YOU ARE FREE FROM PROSECUTION. even the feds dont mess with it.

Now, if you are a big time grower...doing more than 100 plants, you face risk of being arrested. however i know people caught with big numbers and still, here in cali, with our overflooded system, they face little time. Under 19, those people would still be arrested and might face addiotional charges now like tax evasion, growing without a license..basically a bunch of nice enhancements that prosecutors want to see because they want to nail commercial growers to the wall. only big business moguls like richard lee can afford the commercial permits and pay all their taxes, and they will run game and push the rest of us out.

you keep saying that we are selfish for putting people in jail...but maybe yall are selfish for killing a counterculture that enables people to make a living just so you can be lazy and not play cat and mouse with the cops. no ones kicking down grannys door as she puffs up a bowl...no ones kicking down peoples doors for 5x5 grows and oz possession here in cali...go get your med card and stop worrying about the cops..or take risks and play the game the way thousands have before you.

people will still be getting arrested under 19 stop fooling yourselves....the average smoker is NOT going to jail under current laws...so basicallly 19 changes nothing except to add more limits to commercial growers

 

[subrob]

Why can't anyone tell me what the best herb in the world is? According to 215forLife???
He won't answer my question, why I don't know.

-SamS

alright, im busted...its me...i grow the best...cmon over and you can teach me to make the best dry sift in the world out of it!

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

this thread was started by digitalhippie, quoting a grower from California. this thread IS ABOUT California growers, voters saying no to pot legalization.

i said i was busted 4 times, arrested once, because they had to, they raided me with reporters, just to let me go 72 hours later with no charges.....

your not even from here or live here, why are you in this thread?

I own a home in California and have been a California voter for almost 40 years, does that count at all to you?
I grew my first Cannabis plant in 1965 in California, does that count? When did you start?
I have grown more Cannabis in California then you does that count?

Do you think I really care about the opinion of anyone who will vote NO on Prop 19? I am pretty sure that will not count.

-SamS