Thanks - since I didn't hear back right away, I used some common sense and diluted it pretty close to your recommendations. Been using it very early in veg as a foliar too. Plants love it.
Cheers V
Another question. I am wondering if anyone has dosed their alfalfa tea with fish meal. I keep eyeing this box of fish meal I bought but never opened and was wondering if anyone has used fish meal to make a tea (bubbled or not) or do they just use as a soil amendment? I figured that if I can mix some with my alfalfa as I let it sit for 4 or 5 days, I can get all the stinky stuff done in one application.
LOL
LOL
J
JackTheGrower
No but Fish Emulsion and fresh brewed hot Coffee seem to work especially with Kelp meal in the brew
I have not red about meal in the soup.. I would imagine that meal would work better as a top dress in a mix obviously.
Just my $0.02
I have not red about meal in the soup.. I would imagine that meal would work better as a top dress in a mix obviously.
Just my $0.02
V
vonforne
I generally use only one N source. I like to folair feed with Alfalfa the most. I have a brand I found for horses that is lightly sprayed with molasses to help with dust particles. That way it will have a touch of molasses every time and will help as a folair also.
V
BORNaSMOKER
Member
make this a sticky!!!
Jack i'm curious about this hot coffee recipe. Could you tell me more about it please? Does the caffeine in the coffee play any positive or negative role on the microbial life? Make them work harder?
I know people use coffee grounds in their compost and worm bins.
I would also advise against using amendments with sodium in them for container or low water environments.
I think, and I am learning and like you have suggested avoiding, that there is sodium in the soil and is a part of the natural system.
I know that our Vegetables have high amounts of sodium in them because I used to do large feed-mill sack sized BSF and was processing all the waste from a grocery store. In that I had the BSF analysed by a lab and discovered that Sodium is one thing they test for.
I assume some sodium is a part of life-processes so not having any is probably not a good thing but I still think it should be on the down-low,
So the bottom line here is that it is a part of the soil scene.
How much is too much I don't know but I am using Guinea Pig feed that has salt and Vit. C + Minerals in it in my current compost batch.
So I'll guess that a little isn't as harmful as a lot.
I still am with you in advising to use just alfalfa and not alfalfa w/salt as the predominate source of pellet but it seems that a little isn't exactly harmful.
This assumes a reasonable volume of material to the amount of pellet and in a compost situation.
I still feel it is wiser to use no salt pellet alfalfa in most applications especially in small containers.
It was interesting to note how salt plays a roll in soil aggregates. Notice that I have "Big Balls" <sorry I couldn't resist> and my pellets have salt in them.
So there is always something to learn I see.
Just an FYI..
Before adding sodium (salts) to soil in the field, we always have a soil analysis done, paying close attention to EC. Probably not cost effective for a home grow (about $125). I've been thinking about having one done on a fresh mix that has "cured" for a month or 2 of my LC#2 with Nute #1. And another test done on a batch of recycled soil. When i get around to it, I will post up the results in the Organics for Beginners forum so we can all discuss it.
In a closed system (a pot or container), I would think without such knowledge, adding sodium would be a crapshoot. Probably would do NO harm, but you wouldn't know for sure until you saw a problem.
My 2 cents.
Hey grape, I definitely will be interested in your results. I have always wanted to do some soil testing up here in my hobby garden - and now that I am fairly stable it makes more sense.
But, for now, I am relying on the "copious amounts of OM" adage. And, the key element of my strategy is compost.
I wonder, when you compost the alfalfa (as I do) obviously you lose N present in the alfalfa. But, do you retain the benefits of the triacontinol?
But, for now, I am relying on the "copious amounts of OM" adage. And, the key element of my strategy is compost.
I wonder, when you compost the alfalfa (as I do) obviously you lose N present in the alfalfa. But, do you retain the benefits of the triacontinol?
Even if the triacontinol is leached from the alfalfa when its being composted, it would most likely still be present through the finished compost, maybe even more available than before. Unless of course this leaching is continuous heavy rain. I still don't think that would manage to get rid of it.
Losing nitrogen to the compost pile is a lot different then Plant growth regulators/hormones. The nitrogen's really what brings the pile to life, where as the PGH is like a trace element, it wouldn't be consumed by the micro life.
Also i usually add fish to my compost tea, a little goes a long way though. I found out recently in the heat of summer, that my normal dose of fish got very nasty in 24 hours. Not something i was about to use, but i regularaly get good results with it. I'm gonna experiment with two gal's, one with fish one without see what happen.
Losing nitrogen to the compost pile is a lot different then Plant growth regulators/hormones. The nitrogen's really what brings the pile to life, where as the PGH is like a trace element, it wouldn't be consumed by the micro life.
Also i usually add fish to my compost tea, a little goes a long way though. I found out recently in the heat of summer, that my normal dose of fish got very nasty in 24 hours. Not something i was about to use, but i regularaly get good results with it. I'm gonna experiment with two gal's, one with fish one without see what happen.
I just found out that triacontanol is insoluble in water so even leaching doesnt present a problem. The only problem i can see while composting it, is the melting point(188*f) since its an alcohol. I dont see a compost going that high though.So far it seems like theres no risk.
A question. Most of us brew EWC tea during our grows. But can someone explain to me why you all are brewing alfalfa? We are not growing microbes in this brew are we?
Seems we are just transferring the nutrient from the alfalfa to the water via leaching. so to what benefit is the air bubbling?
Like I said before, I just have been throwing a cup or 2 in a 5 gal bucket of water with a TBS of epsom salt and let it sit for 5 days or so.
So the bubbling?? Am I missing something?
Seems we are just transferring the nutrient from the alfalfa to the water via leaching. so to what benefit is the air bubbling?
Like I said before, I just have been throwing a cup or 2 in a 5 gal bucket of water with a TBS of epsom salt and let it sit for 5 days or so.
So the bubbling?? Am I missing something?
I'm pretty sure Alfafla would works as a source of food for beneficial fungi. Someone more knowledgable may chime in. I like to use a Epsoma Biotone as food/starter for my AACT and it has treated me well(It has alf. in it). I like the idea of making AACT and than using the left overs as organic matter.
CT guy has posted some info on slurry's he had made and Alfalfa seem to add some diversity to the overall mixture if i recall correctly. Maybe Alf. add's that diversity that we need to bring about others. I believe in his research he found predatory nematodes in a mix with Alf. but none others. Hopefully he can share his information, as i'm just secondhand.
Than again you can always make Fermented Plant Extract's and really get the nutrients out of the Alf.
I feel like I am finding my way around a new room with the lights off here, but I am making aerated "nutrient" teas thinking that they will have less anaerobic bacteria in them, even if their aerobic growth is compromised by too hot a mixture - incorporating guanos and k-mag, for instance. The bad smells that the rose people talk about from alfalfa tea doesn't go well with my intuitive sense. Maybe you can try a side by side?
Ingram talks about putting anaerobic mixes on plants you want to kill, but obviously the rose people aren't killing their roses with their stinky teas.
Ingram talks about putting anaerobic mixes on plants you want to kill, but obviously the rose people aren't killing their roses with their stinky teas.
Anaerboic tea's are typically hot becuase of what thier doing. My best way of thinking on these subjects is the anerobic tea's are typically more nutrient oriented, mainly breaking down nutrients and making them more available, which is one reason why it can burn.
AACT on the other hand brings new microlife to your soil/soilless. This helps when plants are stressed,or maybe the soils dried out too much. You can spray it on leaves to help fight harmful fungi/mildew/mold.
Typically with fermented extract's your gonna have to dilute them or they'll be too hot
AACT on the other hand brings new microlife to your soil/soilless. This helps when plants are stressed,or maybe the soils dried out too much. You can spray it on leaves to help fight harmful fungi/mildew/mold.
Typically with fermented extract's your gonna have to dilute them or they'll be too hot
grapeman, you are right. these are nutrient extractions, not biological teas. and its an anaerobic process so no need for aeration.
that being said, you can add small amounts of alfalfa meal to ACT brews and stimulate the biology in the tea. like 2 teaspoons per 5 gallon brew, nothing serious.
that being said, you can add small amounts of alfalfa meal to ACT brews and stimulate the biology in the tea. like 2 teaspoons per 5 gallon brew, nothing serious.
aerated is what you want when brewing compost or EWC teas for microbes
FPEs made w/ alfalfa (or nettles, comfrey, etc) are done anearobically and for nutrients rather than microbes
alfalfa tea does smell pretty bad (as does my flower FPE) i guess that results from the "fermented" element of the process
