Ace Purple Old Timer's Haze x Meao Thai

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

thaibliss,

They all took a beating from the light snafu with pure purple haze getting the worst of it, PHT3b being effected to a lesser degree and PHT 4b getting the least effect. Here's some new pictures of 3b and 4b.

3b. You can see the elongation and new flower formation even after hacking it back quite a bit.

Some more coloration and resin output on 3b

The aroma is like musty...almost rotten fruit with an incense back note mingling in the nose.

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

A couple shots of 4b. The copious amounts of wider meao thai dominant leaves kind of hide the beauty underneath.

The aroma on this one is a little more towards the green line. Less of the fermenting berry but quite nice and 'refreshing'. The calyxes are much smaller, but I am starting to see nice glandular resin production and the flowers are very copious (looks to be a nice yielder). I finally got a cut to take and it is reverting from flower to growth as I type.

Now here is where things get interesting (or insane depending on how you look at it).

Remember that F-13 male I mentioned earlier. Well, it is not quite the plant I had originally conceived.

That's right, it is producing female flowers late in it's cycle. A "backward hermaphrodite" - as DJ Short would describe. Now his claim is that these rare plants can make for some very nice out-crosses with some of the most resinous male specimens having this unique trait. Many examples are not viable.

This plant is indeed resinous with stalked and glandular stalked trichomes on the stems and various male/female flowering parts. The aroma is hashy berry and musk in line with the F-13 offer.

I have just let this thing explode in the flowering chamber given my crop is pretty twisted already from the light snafu. And you know what, I'm seeing shriveling pistils today which means I may have a viable male donor for these Ace plants. Of course, much testing would need to occur to determine if the resulting progeny are worth keeping, but DJ stated that often, viable backward hermaphrodites produced high F/M ratios, so this one could be a valuable breeder for the future. Trying to root clones now. I will save some pollen for the future as well once removed from the cabinet tomorrow.

 

[dubi]

Hi Ur Humbl Nr8tor

I like the traits of your 3b Purple Haze Thai, compact plant, good flower leaf ratio and she is showing the very resinous purple ovaries from the Purple Haze.

The 4b looks a strange pheno, the expression reminds me of the very long flowering SE asian sativa phenos, leafy but voluminous flowers, this kind of expressions are quite slow to flower and my experience tells me they are usually not the best ones at the end.

Regarding breeding with hermie males ... i deeply respect DJ's opinion but is not something i will consider if i have desirable firm males to choose from. If you are preserving a landrace and you can not find pure males, then is ok to use hermie males to preserve the genetics in pure form and select against hermie traits in future generations but i dont think is a good idea to breed hybrids with hermie males (or females).

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

dubi,

I agree, the 3b is a very desirable plant. The elongation you are seeing due to my timer getting stuck in lights on for several days while I was out of town. It is very resinous with a strong aroma of rotting and fermented fruits. You can also smell the incense (even more floral/spice than woody) in the background. I will be running this one again with hopefully no light issues and may try a plant outdoors this year.

4b is an interesting plant. For most of the grow, I've not been overly impressed, but the flowers are beginning to take on a nice form and so, I will let it go to completion to see what the final outcome is. Much smaller ovaries, very slight lavender purple on some and resin output is finally starting to show.

The DJ F-13 line is full of intersex genetics, it seems. I have looked at historical grows and true viable male plants are difficult to come by. That's why I will hold onto this one just to see what sort of offspring it makes (assuming it makes viable seed sets). I agree, I would prefer to have a pure male to work with. The general consensus is the resulting F1's will be predominantly female, but the question being what level of hermaphrodite expression will get passed on to offspring. It could be scant (0.1%) or extremely high (50%) and the only way to tell will be through growing out its progeny. These F1's will be tested with the pure understanding that undesirable traits may be present or could become apparent in F2's and so on.

I have a few more F13 seeds to play with and if I can find the elusive pure viable male, I will be certain to keep it. If not, then I will likely make F6's from the seed stock using the hermi male and select against that trait for future preservation as this line is no longer being produced and any remaining seed stock is getting old.

Thanks for the advice.

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

My 3a PHT plant put into flower is a male. It was difficult to clone, a slow and somewhat spindly example, so I will likely cull and look for a stronger male for future use.

 

[martian313]

Hey there UR....

Wow this is a nice thread. Still not started my P Haze x Thai although this thread is pushing me closer. That F-13 he she...You know I totally respect Dubi and also DJ and I am by no means an expert but I would totally give that sticky reverse hermie a whirl for the hell of it. Could be an amazing surprise ! The PHT x F-13 was my reason for getting on board with the PHT so extremely excited to see how that turns out for you, seems like a dynamite combination !
I have a question too...I gather from the info on here the PHT doesn't have such long duration (compared to F-13 for example) but is that off a single hit ? Have you tested her ceiling at all ? How high can she go ?

Anyway much respect to you and Dubi .

peace M313

 

[crazyfool*]

hey man, congrats on the plants, they look lovely, i´m sorry, i didn´t read the whole thread, could you tell me how many whats you running on these sativas indoor? and how many weeks usually takes them to finish? ....and another question \I have, if you don´t mind answering is, do these haze strains finish to full ripness under artificial lights? ... thanks for the attention, and good job!

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

Hey there UR....

Wow this is a nice thread. Still not started my P Haze x Thai although this thread is pushing me closer. That F-13 he she...You know I totally respect Dubi and also DJ and I am by no means an expert but I would totally give that sticky reverse hermie a whirl for the hell of it. Could be an amazing surprise !

If I get viable seeds, I will give them a looking at. I'm not opposed to it, but I tend to view this in caution. I'm betting DJ used a reverse hermaphrodite somewhere in breeding the F-13 and quite possibly recently in the line (F4 or F5 - current). I say that from limited hands on experience, but coupled with other grow reports, there are a lot of inter sex traits to be found.

I can gather that is why dubi suggests not using these rev. hermis in producing F1's...too strong a chance of passing those traits on.

Only one way to find a diamond in the rough and that is to go looking for it.

The PHT x F-13 was my reason for getting on board with the PHT so extremely excited to see how that turns out for you, seems like a dynamite combination !

Agreed. I think if I can find the right F-13 male, this 3b plant I am growing right now would be a dynamite donor for some pollen. That's why I will look at it first with the he/she (assuming again, I get viable seeds.)

I have a question too...I gather from the info on here the PHT doesn't have such long duration (compared to F-13 for example) but is that off a single hit ? Have you tested her ceiling at all ? How high can she go ?

Anyway much respect to you and Dubi .

peace M313

It seems DJ bred for a very euphoric, long lasting high and there are certain specimens baring that trait...and some have been much less so.

Having said that, I think the right specimen of PHT can give you a very lengthy high...but the high in definition is quite different from my experience. PHT (and pure OTH) effects are multi fold. I get waves of energy, euphoria (and more towards the purple side) ethnogen like response. There is very little body effect, so you may be happily plodding along an hour or so later thinking nothing of much and all of a sudden have a flashy tachycardic type response.

There is very little ceiling from what I've seen...meaning higher than I care to fly.

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

hey man, congrats on the plants, they look lovely, i´m sorry, i didn´t read the whole thread, could you tell me how many whats you running on these sativas indoor? and how many weeks usually takes them to finish? ....and another question \I have, if you don´t mind answering is, do these haze strains finish to full ripness under artificial lights? ... thanks for the attention, and good job!

crazyfool,

the thread is mainly about Purple Haze Thai with a little bit of pure haze and casual reference to some other purple strains like DJ's F-13.

I've only really run the pure OTH to my satisfactory conclusion outdoors and it was 20+ weeks to finish from clone. I am running a pure purple haze indoors right now, but it won't finish as well as if grown outdoors. That plus a timer mishap for a few days during flowering and it is a bushy beast. 20+ weeks for sure to finish.

I've grown F1's and the new F1/F3's of Ace PHT indoors. The PHT is mixed but usually around 18 weeks (17-20) and it can finish indoors correctly. You would want to flower starting around 11.5/12.5 and taper to 11/13 (or even 10.5/13.5) towards end of cycle. They can finish at 11.5/12.5, but I notice some elongation of the bud tips towards the end if you don't slowly decrease light.

I highly recommend PHT for indoor grows. Look for the plants more like my 3b (or Terpene's grows) as they exhibit manageable indoor stretch and stack trichomes on lovely large purple and mauve ovaries. This particular 3b plant has the largest calyx I've personally seen in the line so far.

Don't worry about length of flower. If you can put a plant into 8-10 gallons of good quality organic soil, you can nearly water it without much addition, though I like to add the occasional botanical tea or organic boost here and there. The 3b is a dark green with slightly crispy tips, so I know I'm pushing it as hard as I should and that's not pushing very hard. They practically grow themselves and will for sure outdoors in a rich sunny space under 35deg.

Scrogging, at least through start of flower, has kept my 3b very manageable.

Good luck.

For indoors in organic soil, I highly recommend Ace Purple Haze Thai.

 

[crazyfool*]

thanks for your excelent answer!

I drooled over your Haze, I´m quite familiar with long flowering sativas, I´ve grown a few from arround the world, mexicans, Haze, thai, colombians, brazilians paraguaians, bolivians, african .... but all of them outdoor, most pure sativas don´t like heavy feeding, when I grew outdoors, I would dig a 70 cm deep 10m x 10 meters square, and fill it with worm castings, normal soil, a bit of chicken poop, and a bit o coconut fiber, and plants would stay nice and happy throuot the entire cycle... only water ..... but now I´ve gone indoors, and for about 4 years I´ve been only running heavy indicas and indica sativa hybrids... and I miss sooooooo much that clear up high that only pure sativas and landrace hybrids give to you.... I´ve talked to ace about good sativas to grow indoor, and I was highly tempted on bringing uin some golden tiger beans.... but thats jast not gonna cut it...i think besides the golden tiger, i´m gonna be obligated to bring some PHT as well!!

good luck on everithing man, and thanks again for your kind answer!

 

[ThaiBliss]

Greetings,

I have bad news. My beautiful Purple Haze x Meao Thai (PHT) is definately male, as I suspected.

The good news is... it is male. Since I suspected this, I put it in a pot with a SAGE cutting that I have had for years. This particular SAGE is not particularly potent, but a great high and premier aroma and physical structure. I have seen this SAGE cut be a translucent red/purple, or be so dark purple that it looks black, depending on conditions. I'm sure it will be a good mate for purple color traits.

I have already pollinated a previous run of SAGE with Golden Tiger pollen. Now I can pollinate with the PHT. If either of these males increase potency without degrading the quality of the high, I'll be very pleased.

Here are some pics of the male PHT:




From here out, I should probably take my postings to a SAGE thread. I found one here:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=162281&page=3

I hope they will be even half as gracious and positive as Ur Humbl Nr8tor, Dubi, and the rest of the good people here on this thread. I'll still be following this one, so keep up the good work.

All the Best,

ThaiBliss

 

[kamyo]

Finally got some pictures of my phaze/Thai girl. She was in the ground, but in mostly sandy soil. Didn't want to flower. I took several cuttings and literally cut the mom off at the stump/ground level. A few roots came up, but not much. A few weeks later, she's doing fine and about a week into flowering. Sorry if the pics are too big. Uploaded from my phone.

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

ThaiBliss,

ThaiBliss, Sorry it's a male, but spread that pollen for the future.

Kamyo, you will have a lovely little flowering girl in no time at all.


I am returning from a week of EU travel. Enjoyed some nice Moroccan pressed sift in Copenhagen. A gram was less than $20 US and the quality was very good. Kept me going for the week while I was away from my jars. I'm cautiously optimistic that the plants are all ok. I loaded them with water and set a timed drip line, so we will see tomorrow morning. Hope to have some more pictures next week.
Best,

 

[ThaiBliss]

Greetings,

I just can't help myself. Even though this Purple Haze x Thai (PHT) is male, I can't help sharing pictures of it in this thread. Please indulge me.



This plant is so beautiful with it's yellow green color and its thin long leaves. It looks like there is not a lick of indica in it. I'd love to see a plant like this in its full majesty growing in soil outdoors, especially the Meao Thai side of it. Dubi?

I'm going to get me a greenhouse one day.

These pictures don't do it justice, but they are all I got:




I'd carry it outside to take better pics, but it has filled the cabinet and would get damaged. I'd also be afraid of bringing pests back in.

I cut this plant back to one bottom branch, and it exploded in growth and stretched incredibly. So, I bent it over the top of the SAGE female and now it completely covers it. I'm going to have a lot of seeds!

In the second pic almost dead center at the bottom, take a look at one of the nodes on the thick stem. Usually, way down the stem like that there is only one single pollen sac on each side of the base of a leaf petiole. This has bunches in some places.

I love this beauty! My cutting of it took root, so as soon as I notice some seeds forming, I'll cut it out of the cabinet.

Cheers,

ThaiBliss

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

He is a beautiful male, ThaiBliss.

My female PHT's are fully impregnated by the F-13 donor. Seeds are swelling in their calyzes. I will be flowering a new clone of PHT 3b starting in the next week or so. I am hoping to do it justice this time without the lighting issues and letting it flower to full sativa completion. It is a lovely plant full of purple and green swollen calyx on fox tail runs. The resin coverage is the heaviest I have seen in this line from personal grows and the smell is sickly sweet and metal with incense back notes. I'm loving it!

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

The PHT 3b is fully impregnated with the little hermi DJ F-13 plant. Not sure if the seed stock will be worth anything, but I'm going to have plenty of seeds, that's for sure.

3b is a lovely plant and I can't wait to run it again without the lighting issues. I'm cloning it right now and will veg for a couple weeks after root and then get her right back into the flowering cab. In the meantime, I took a number of photos to show off her beauty. Expect the next run to be a little more compact in flower as the light snafu caused elongation likely not seen in a normal flower cycle.

She is falling over from the weight of the seeded buds. I may be switching my set up to a more vertical arrangement. Regardless, these PHT's need good fan movement early on to develop thick stems and/or support through flowering as they produce a lot of flower.

You can see the resin content is extremely high with stalked trichomes covering every mm of gland surface as well as the tops (and bottoms) of the surrounding leaves.

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

The smell of rotting and fermented berries, must, spice and rubber is strong on 3b. I'm curious as hell to how she will smell and taste in the final cure.

I need a macro lens. The trichomes are calling me...

I'll be popping some 3b/F-13(he/she) in a few months to see what might come out of these seeds. In the meantime, I will be finishing this plant off over the next couple of weeks and getting a replacement 3b clone into flower once that's done.

Fantastic plant, dubi!

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

A few shots of the impregnated 4b PHT. Not nearly the stunner that 3b is. As dubi suggested, she is a weird one and I'm not sure I will be working with this one into the future.

Smell is lighter and fresher. More fruit forward with no fermented funk accompanying it. The glands are much smaller and resin output is significantly less. Very voluminous flowers, though. I had some powdery mildew on the leaves in veg, so I'm making sure humidity levels stay reasonable in case of mold attack. Lots and lots of 4b/F-13(he/she) beans in her belly, but this particular plant doesn't hold the crossing interest I have in 3b.

The pure purple haze is a wreck. The lighting issues during flower caused her to go wild and I don't think I will take her to completion as I could use the space more effectively.

Does this look like a 15+ week flowering plant? I'm guessing it could flower for another 10 weeks, easy. There are a few seed sites from the F-13 (he/she) exposure, but I'm not likely to get a whole lot of seeds out of her. Maybe I can move this to another area and let it flower for a little while longer. Still unsure of her fate.

 

[Terpene]

Does this look like a 15+ week flowering plant? I'm guessing it could flower for another 10 weeks, easy. There are a few seed sites from the F-13 (he/she) exposure, but I'm not likely to get a whole lot of seeds out of her. Maybe I can move this to another area and let it flower for a little while longer. Still unsure of her fate.

My pure purple didn't START flowering until like 11 weeks in. After that finally happens, theres another 15 week wait before you get to the good stuff. I would tough it out, probably run 27-28 weeks because of the timer, but you've got time right?

 

[Ur Humbl Nr8tor]

My pure purple didn't START flowering until like 11 weeks in. After that finally happens, theres another 15 week wait before you get to the good stuff. I would tough it out, probably run 27-28 weeks because of the timer, but you've got time right?

I'm in no hurry to be hasty. It will be another week or so for the few seeds on her to set. After that, I'll make the call. Thanks for the rep!