2012 Legalization Effort Starts

[Rednick]

You are dead wrong, I only bred and produced seeds, not Cannabis to sell at a profit.
What is the difference, you are producing a product for sale. And plant full of seeds is worth more than one full of dank. Or is there an inheirent value of 'intellectual property' for getting two plants to 'do it'.

BTW I have nothing against anyone making a profit with their Cannabis work, my objection is of those that would keep Cannabis illegal so they can protect their profits.
We are not talking about full legalization here. We are talking about quasi-legalization. For a variety of reasons (public stigma/perception, established market makers, hedge funds with $$$ in their eyes, Dick Lee, Matt Brown (here in Colo), and most importantly growers/stoners) these laws get fuckkkked. Super fucked. Infact it is business as usual in the good ol' USA. Hire a lobbyist, get big money in (relatively speaking), and pass 'Regulations' that make nooo sense to your average logical person.
Did you read Prop 19.
How about Colorado:
Amendment 20
HB 10-1284
And Now HB 11-1043
http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/cli...600583CE4?Open

My view is that legalization is much more important then protecting the profits of the growers and sellers of the illegal Cannabis. What I care about is all the people busted for illegal Cannabis in California, the USA, and the world. And I would like to see prices fall for consumers to a reasonable return on capital and labor, which is not now the situation. The reason prices were so high was because of the risk of being caught and put in jail. Make it legal, grow outdoors and the price will drop radically.
BTW I have zero plans to capitalize on legalization in California, you are dead wrong again.
How is that legalization thing going on in Holland? Last I heard, same old shit, back and forth. Your name didn't show up in the article though, funny?
-SamS

I think any of us here would be fine with a 'full legalization' across the board, treat it like it's a tomato.
But that just isn't the case.
People get pissed off when someone sitting at a computer thousands of miles away gets on his high horse and preaches the gospel at the soldiers.

Remember, this is America. We'd rather have 1,000 tyrants one mile away, than 1 tyrant 1,000 miles away. That is why we had to break with the crown.
No taxation without equal geting fuck-presentation.

 

[Rednick]

Didn't know you came up with the bubble bags.
Thanx. Sorry you got fucked on it, but MMJ is kinda like your bubble bags...do you see the parallel?

People have devoted their life and soul to this, just to see it uprooted by money. Why do you think Hedge Funds are so interested in this. Five million is nothing to them. If they can turn that around 500% in a year, so be it. Lobbyist, paid. City/County/State officials, paid. Real Estate, paid. Equipement, paid. Grower on hard times, paid shit.
Not saying the brighter stoners and better craft growers won't join together and make it work out...
But in the meantime, this is how it is going to play out for the small guy:

State: 'Oh, you DON'T have 223K to give us, just to get your foot in the door???', 'Well then, I don't think I can allow you to LEGALLY grow this plant'

Grower 007: 'But, I kept reinvesting that money into new equipement and to help out friends and the community...surely that money must have helped the local economy and will continue to do so'

State: 'Sorry, but we want our fucking money. And thanks for popping your head out, we had no idea you existed, and since we now know where you live, expect regular visits by the Department of Marijuana Enforcement'.

Grower 007: 'Maybe the old model was better?'

I'm sure you could never have accomplished what you have if you had these economic barriers to entry.
Inheirently growing a plant has little more investment than: the plant, light, medium, food and love.
In an un(de)regulated market, these are the only economic barriers to trade...all others are ancillary (prosecution, time, stress, ect.) and highly subjective based on the individual.
In a regulated market, the barriers to free trade are numerous...and you can refer to my earlier instances in Colorado for that.
Most importantly, one must wonder why Zoning Laws were the first/ and most numerous/frequent laws to be introduced in Colorado?

You have been out of these shoes sometime, and now that things are heating up you wish to walk in them. You can't. You left it remember, why don't you spearhead the Dutch legalization campaign?

 

[dagnabit]

So if my quality is better shouldn't I be able to charge more for it? People pay more for quality and brand name everyday. Less for store brands more for name brands. If people can't afford the higher cost name brand there's always a lower priced option. Therefore I set my price. You may not want to pay it but Joe down the block will.
For instance. I know 2 growers here that produce the same strain. 1 gets just over 3K/lb for his the other get over 5k/lb for his. Different market different economic class of clients. Both are happy with what they get as are their customers. Not as much of what you're selling as to who you're selling it to.
This is not CA btw.

but this IS the market dictating the price (our confused friend thinks the most basic principle of capitalism is somehow communism)
but the example you just listed is the market dictating price.
if the manufacturer were to set the price the two growers aforementioned would collude to set the price as a standard and the consumer would have no option.

the problem with the example of grower A and grower B is the false manipulation of the market of prohibition.
grower b's clientèle are forced to pay his exorbitant rate because the do not have access to grower A.
remove prohibition and allow grower a and b to compete?
the market sets the price...
as the market sets the price for cars and ballasts...
they are priced at the maximum the market will bear with additions for luxuries,quality,durability and availability.
the "socialist" and "subsidy" comes in NOW whereas the GOVERNMENT puts restrictions on the means of production (in the form of prohibition) which artificially inflates the price of the product...
and 215 benefits from that government subsidy.
like anyone on welfare if you threaten their government handout they get to shouting.

 

[MadBuddhaAbuser]

This is why I will be happy when Cannabis is legalized and produced outdoors by the ton, I am pretty tired of all the folks that say they can't make a profit selling Cannabis at today prices. Maybe they need to learn to farm outdoors so they an make a profit? If you think that the very best Cannabis can't be grown outdoors you should have nothing to fear.
If you are wrong and I am right that the very best Cannabis can be grown outdoors or in a greenhouse then you are correct, the days of indoor grown Cannabis are coming to an end. Either way it will not be me doing the work, I am getting ready to retire and spend time with my grandchildren.
I have fought for 40+ years for full legalization, and I still will, until it happens. Patients are waiting, pot prisoners are waiting, so am I.
-SamS

Seriously, the sun is free, there goes most of your bill right there. If you could really be growing pretty much anywhere, that little closet grow wont seem like such a big deal anymore. and you would be producing much more at a fraction of the cost.

I've noticed a few comments here that "if you're not from Cali then it's really none of your business...". I've also read comments that all these great strains come from Cali....

First of all, I don't think any of the strains being grown in Cali are landrace strains or indiginous to Cali... They are strains from other parts of the world that have been worked on by people all over the world.....

Secondly, if you don't want other people commenting then maybe you all should be keeping your crops within the State of Cali..... But you know if you did that the price in Cali would be around a grand a bow, if not a lot less..... You want to be able to grow as much as you want legally and ship it anywhere you want. I don't quite see that as fair. Do you? People in other parts of the Country that are gambling their freedom are seeing their prices knocked down because of the influx of legally grown Cali herb......

And while I'm on my rant I'll tell you now that the quality of the Cali weed is no better than what I've had anywhere else.... I think people are starting to see that a lot of it is nothing but hype. There's great Cannabis all over the Country, and the world for that matter.....

So if you guys want the rest of the Country to stay out of your business, don't you think it would be a good idea for you to stay out of theirs and keep all your stuff at home? I don't think you'd like that though, now would you?

as a fellow tri-stater . I completely agree. The bud around here is phenomenal. "cali bud" is not the end all and be all. Turns out amazing weed can be grown anywhere. I know this may come as a shock to many of you. But seriously, we are all not free, this is a very real thing that would concern all of us. The world is bigger than california.

And good point about the black market in less legal areas being squeezed by imported cali bud. Those people are the ones taking the hit right now, and still have their freedom to lose.

HahAaH!

 

[Rednick]

So if you guys want the rest of the Country to stay out of your business, don't you think it would be a good idea for you to stay out of theirs and keep all your stuff at home? I don't think you'd like that though, now would you?

You know what would happen if they did that JJ?
Your prices would be sooooo hiiigghh, you would be flooded with Californians in no time.
What people are trying to tell you is:
"Whatever your vision of what life is like for us, it is waaaayy off.", "These 'growing pains' with legalization don't help either", "Because the reality is, this is America. Every asshole from every corner of the Union comes here to strike it rich...and these aren't the people who give a fuck who they step on", "Not all are assholes by the way, many come to learn the way", "But it only takes so many assholes to make an asshole soup."

I hope that clears up your visions of our fair states, and MAYBE, you can empathize with us and our predicament, instead of bitching about life being unfair and we are all evil war-mongering profiteers.

Also, your dollar is worth about 40% more to us as it is to you...So maybe you shouldn't directly translate prices. Your cost of living is higher, which translates into higher wages (trickle down theory). Which means every dollar you spend is worth less to you than every dollar we spend.

 

[dagnabit]

you guys are commies just admit it

hmmmm
commies who believe the government should stop influencing the price by making production illegal?

that makes as much sense as tits on a boar.

no sir you benefit from the influence of government...
i just want a free market...
you want the government controlled status quo.

 

[Rednick]

i just want a free market...
you want the government controlled status quo.

The government status quo is more of a free market than most of these legalization initiatives.
Because they are only in name only 'Legalization', they are really regulation (which should read "barriers to free trade").
This is why all of you people saying: PROP 19, PROP 19, PROP 19...YEAAAAA!!!
Get so fucking annoying!
What would Prop 19 really have done for you? Not shit.

What did the liberals say when Bush was in power?
Regime change begins at home!

Well I say it to you now.
Regime change begins at home! You want change, pass medical laws of your own (just not ones like New Jersey)

I'm done sticking up for Cali at the moment, we got problems of our own. Namely all the hacks that couldn't cut it out there and rode in our their white horses with big bank accounts.

 

[Anti]

HEY I WANT A BRAND NEW CHEVY TAHOE FOR 10k. IM A CONSUMER I SET THE PRICE RIGHT? AND WHILE WE ARE AT IT, I WANT MY PHANTOM 1k BALLASTS FOR 100 BUCKS EACH, and my BLOCKBUSTER HOODS FOR 50 BUCKS EACH!!

how the FUCK can you say a business CANT SET THE PRICE, unless you are a damn communist. the business has to at least have some control over what they can sell it for OR THEY GO OUT OF BUSINESS.

Business does NOT set the price. You sell apples for $40 each.. Walmart sells them for a nickel each. Unless you have a gun, nobody is going to buy your apples. They're going to go to walmart for the apples at a 39.95 discount.

If target buys out several apple orchards and lowers the price down to 0.03 a piece, guess what? Walmart is gonna drop their price to 0.03 a piece or they're not gonna be in the apple business anymore.

Supply and demand are controlled by desire and availability, not the whims of the producers.

I think you missed the point.

 

[dagnabit]

free market principles = communism
prohibition = deregulation
down = up


the public schools have succeeded.
how far have we gone?!?!?

did someone just type

The government status quo is more of a free market than most of these legalization initiatives.

really?
so anyone being allowed to posses,grow,process and transport without a doctors note is somehow less restrictive than prohibition?!?!?
explain please?

 

[JJScorpio]

I'm not empathizing in any way with the most of the legal growers in Cali. They forgot what it's like for the State boys watching everything they do. They grow legally and then ship their extra off and cost other people in other States money. It works both ways here folks....

How nice to get that card and grow all those plants and only have to worry about losing the bud in shipments. And drive down the price to those having to worry about growing where it's not legal. And if all those Cali folks want to relocate and take the chance of doing a decade in the pen, have at it. It wouldn't be long before they'd want things legal when that happened.....

This Cali fighting for legalization is getting old..... And to be honest I've had it...... You folks are doing to other States what you're worrying big biz is going to do to you..... Sucks with the shoe on the other foot. I wish Cali was their own nation and kept what they are doing within their own boundaries. But you're growing legal and beginning to affect other growers in other States.....

Wanting that cake and being able to eat it to......

You know what would happen if they did that JJ?
Your prices would be sooooo hiiigghh, you would be flooded with Californians in no time.
What people are trying to tell you is:
"Whatever your vision of what life is like for us, it is waaaayy off.", "These 'growing pains' with legalization don't help either", "Because the reality is, this is America. Every asshole from every corner of the Union comes here to strike it rich...and these aren't the people who give a fuck who they step on", "Not all are assholes by the way, many come to learn the way", "But it only takes so many assholes to make an asshole soup."

I hope that clears up your visions of our fair states, and MAYBE, you can empathize with us and our predicament, instead of bitching about life being unfair and we are all evil war-mongering profiteers.

Also, your dollar is worth about 40% more to us as it is to you...So maybe you shouldn't directly translate prices. Your cost of living is higher, which translates into higher wages (trickle down theory). Which means every dollar you spend is worth less to you than every dollar we spend.

 

[resinryder]

But everybody likes cake JJ. hehe
Edited to add---In the whole scheme of sales and supply, it totally has amazed me over the years just how much CA weed, mainly at this time of year, makes it to damn near every state. Even as far away as South Carolina prices drop due to imports of Cali weed. Not because of quality but because of the pounds available. I have "friends" there that have to lower prices for a few months but make it up later when that chronic supply dwindles to the bottom of the bag.

 

[thelaughingman]

yes on 19

 

[41hope]

Where can you grow outdoors that will consistantly generate bud equal or better than indoor? The outdoor stuff from norcal seems to be lacking? I'm thinking its not due to the growers or strains but the weather. Futhermore why don't I ever hear about the business environment as an important factor when choosing a state or city to grow? What is the highest expense for a greenhouse? the labor! California will be too expensive to operate in! Water, taxes, land, power, rent etc... Way too costly to compare to other states. Look at our produce farmers they are getting there asses kick by the china ever since china built that dam.

 

[Rednick]

A person with a machine can manicure up to a kilo+ per hour,

Any pictures of the finished product.
I would love to know the name of that trimming machine.

 

[Rednick]

. But you're growing legal and beginning to affect other growers in other States.....

Wanting that cake and being able to eat it to......

Don't just blame the West man!
Fucking Novia Scotia up in this shit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAYMJnO9LBQ
Blame Canada, yo!

And how many California growers are from not California? A fuck-ton.
If you are soooo pissed off why don't you move, this is America, no passport checked between state lines.

 

[JJScorpio]

I don't live in Cali and have no urge to. Don't grow and sell either.....

Just giving my 2 cents regarding all this Cali legalization fighting...... And what these big, legal Cali grows are doing to people in other States.... I just find it humerous that the guys growing a few hundred pounds outside in Cali and shipping out to other states are complaining about "big biz" doing large grows and competing against them in Cali, lol....

Pot........ Meet kettle........

 

[dagnabit]

Any pictures of the finished product.
I would love to know the name of that trimming machine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CNlgMpE5k0 <<<<<
not a bad one..
first youtube hit.

 

[pimpjuice]

2012 Legalization Effort Starts

It is most definitely a buyers market. Anyone could come out here and buy for under 2k easily in the emerald triangle.

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

Don't just blame the West man!
Fucking Novia Scotia up in this shit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAYMJnO9LBQ
Blame Canada, yo!

And how many California growers are from not California? A fuck-ton.
If you are soooo pissed off why don't you move, this is America, no passport checked between state lines.

Great post. If you don't like it in your state come here. JJ, you can crash in my guest room starting tonight until you find something acceptable for your family. Everyone else, good luck, lol.

I won't say its the best state or this or that, it's all opinion. But the fact is this is a great place to grow. Our outdoor weather is ideal, again terroir. My top soil is 7 feet deep. The summers are warm and the winters are mild. Our laws are lax. I moved here... like everyone else I know. Don't blame CA JJ, it seems anger is clouding your emotions. I can understand tho, fighting that troll war has to be tiring.

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

I just find it humerous that the guys growing a few hundred pounds outside in Cali and shipping out to other states are complaining about "big biz" doing large grows and competing against them in Cali

BS AND I CALL. The majority of these folks have less than 6,000 watts. The 100+ pound guys don't say anything. Let's try to keep it real please. JJ, I rock 2400 watts and have no veg room. If I could pull 100+ pounds per year, well... you'd have to give me my own sub-forum because that would be some revolutionary organic growing.