First grow, want to grow in coco.

[DHF]

Posting absolutes like coco is a "Hydro" medium which is an "inert medium" like hydroton instead of what it actually is as a "soilless medium" with "hydro-like" results once and IF dialed , PLUS saying coco can`t be over-watered is just 1 more reason why I`ve gotta step up and ask you to PLEASE quit spewin and spreadin mis-information Retro......

You OUGHTA know better.....Papa`s not trying to provoke you dewd , he`s merely pointing out what you yourself posted and was questioning your post as most folks do in a thread for it`s validity.....

I`d appreciate you doin some more homework on coco before giving advice to new folks since it`s ABSOLUTELY clear you have very little experience with coco except the "Canna" brand that most folks can`t afford or don`t have enough knowledge to save up till they can....IOW....

MANY things happen with coco setups using the other 90% of the market YOU have no clue about like Cal/Mag issues , CEC , overwatering , PH imbalances and lockouts , Hell.....EVERYTHING that fucks up with coco except in your lil dialed world....so lastly.....

I ask again respectfully......Stop posting absolutes that`re no more true than the man in the moon , and take the blinders off your tunnelvision "coco`s the easiest medium there is and ever was" , and look around at what`s happening with folks that don`t have your knowledge and experience.......now.....

Coco IS easy if you know the rules and have grow knowledge and experience as I , you , and Papaduc have , but we`re tryin to help new folks Retro , and you slingin dick tryin to be the man claimin all this other shit AIN`T the way ta help folks , and.....

I`m sorry you`re not seeing how you`re actually coming across with this "I`ve been to prison" like the founder of this site and we all need to have thicker skin cuz this is a weedsite , and allow you to say what the fuck to who the fuck ever however you want to and swallow it.....so , personally I....

Just can`t do it ....A lil respect and open minded-ness goes a WHOLE lot further with helpin folks than startin shit when OTHER knowledgeable and evidently "more" experienced growers question your motives , responses , and attitude ....anyways....I`m done....

Good luck DR B.....Go read my last post in Jnugg`s thread for some insight into ways to help dial coco and holler in pm if I can help , and again....do your homework and don`t take no wooden nickels ......

Peace....DHF..........

 

[RetroGrow]

Um....coco IS a hydro medium. That said, I am not "dick slingin", looking for a fight/argument or trying to be disrespectful. I am only relating MY experiences with it, just as you do, and I am trying to help with the "newbie" in mind, hence my recommendation of simple approaches that have worked for me and many others, ie., K.I.S.S. and Hempys. Why that confronts you, I don't know. Don't judge me man. I am trying to help, just as you are. I don't question your motives, and I don't think you should be questioning mine. We are both trying to be helpful. If my opinion/advice differs from yours in some small way, that is no reason to get confrontational. As you know, there is more than one way to skin a cat, and I am not posting "absolutes", just my opinions based on my experience, and the experiences of MANY others. Not shoving it down anyone's throat as you alleged, anymore than you are shoving your approach down anyone's throat. Just laying it out there, same as you lay out your take on things. Free speech & all. I don't jump on you when you do, and I don't think you should be jumping on me. There is plenty of room for different approaches. I don't know why you can't see that. I'm not here stepping on your toes, yet you seem to take it that way. I am not knocking any of your suggestions. Canna nutes are fine. Used them for years, but now I've switched to Maxibloom. Why would that confront you? I'm not saying you should use them. Use/recommend what you like, just as I do. You said, "you have very little experience with coco except the "Canna" brand", which is not the case. How do you know what experience I have with other brands? You don't. I have tried several different brands of coco, and found Canna to be to my liking, so that's what I personally stick with. I'm also aware that there are other "good" brands, and that there are plenty of inferior brands, so I recommend what I know.
As far as my assertion that coco is a hydro medium, I am not just pulling that statement out of the air. A simple Google search backs me up:
" Firstly, let me dispel a common myth and say that coco substrate is a hydroponic medium (largely inert)".
http://www.manicbotanix.com/hydroponic-grow-guide/coco-growing.html

"Coco coir is quickly becoming a favorite among hydroponic gardeners. It’s made from ground up coconut husks and represents a giant leap in hydroponic growing media."
http://www.epicgardening.com/hydroponic-growing-media/

http://glandorehydro.com/Why-Coco-and-Run-to-Waste.html

"Over the years using coco (sometimes called coir) in pots as a hydroponic media has become an increasingly popular way to grow plants."
http://www.growell.co.uk/blog/2011/04/hydro-organics-the-coco-alternative

http://www.igrowhydro.com/info2-growingmedia.aspx

http://www.rosebudmag.com/growers/hydroponic-supplies
"The hottest medium on the market right now is definitely coconut fiber. This medium is made from coconut husks. It is a totally organic growing medium that offers excellent performance and benefits to a hydroponic system."

"Coconut Fiber contains root stimulating hormones, plus it offers natural protection against root diseases, including multiple types of fungus."
http://www.fullbloomhydroponics.net/growing-media/#ixzz2tMTYkUao
There are many, many more, but I'm not going to bludgeon you with more professionals who call coco a hydroponic medium.

As far as if you can or cannot over water coco, I'm sure you are aware that this has been an ongoing debate. I can say, ABSOLUTELY, that in Hempy buckets, you cannot over water coco. You can water it once a day, twice a day, 10 times a day, or continuously with a drip system, and it cannot be over watered, provided the root system is developed, and the coco has not been re-used so many times that it has broken down. In other containers, using premium coco (Canna, Bcuzz (developed by same person who developed Canna), Royal Gold, House & Garden, Botanicaire), you cannot over water, again, provided you have adequate drainage, and the coco has not broken down due to being re-used too much. 3 times seems to be the consensus as to the maximum times you should re-use it, although I personally don't re-use it.
In all cases, bagged coco is superior to pressed, IMO, and pre-washed coco is the only choice, unless for some reason you cannot find any of those brands of bagged coco, which I find unlikely, but don't dismiss.
There is a thread right here which discusses this:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=130893

Also, a good, short video on YouTube explaining how to use/water coco:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiCBKb6SknQ

Now, all of this has been posted with respect and political correctness, and good faith, and with links and opinions backing up my own. I'm not making this stuff up. I do my homework, and I also base it on my own experience.

 

[DrBagseed]

Good luck DR B.....Go read my last post in Jnugg`s thread for some insight into ways to help dial coco and holler in pm if I can help , and again....do your homework and don`t take no wooden nickels ......

Peace....DHF..........

Thanks for your support you, papaduc and retro have been of much help.

The seeds are about to sprout now, would you guys place it in rockwool or coco plugs or just let it start in a little cup of coco?

And I will have to order a PH/EC meter asap, was having a hard time controlling my PH when testing my water with ph drops and ph down, it seems to above 8 or maybe 9 in ph.

 

[DHF]

There`s no such thing as a "hydroponic" medium that has a CEC/cation exchange capacity Retro , regardless of the text you`re quoting by folks stating things out of context as in it being used in hydroponic systems.....Just ain`t so......won`t ever be...

Hydroponic mediums are "inert" and hold onto minimal to NO residual nutrients in their make up like hydroton , perlite , vermiculite , lavarocks , pea gravel , hydrocorn , grow rocks , etc , etc , etc...period....and I totally agree with you on not being able to over water Hempy buckets with the "right consistency" coco and replenishing O2 to the rootzone while ALL extra juice runs out the containers and re-mixes with the residual in the bottom rez so as to not form "stagnant solution"....but...

As I said above , new folks don`t know all these things that you were "generalizing" on across the board claiming all things were as such the way you were stating em , and that`s what I took offense to and tried to reason with you about , but to no avail....

"Coffee grounds mushy" coco watered frequently will starve and drown your plants guaranteed and I`ve witnessed it many many times , thus my point again about you generalizing and not being specific , now.....

All I`ve EVER cared about was the new folks getting SOLID info that`s time tested and proven by any and all means necessary , and coco has WAAAAY too many variables involved for it to just be slung out there like you did screamin "coco`s the easiest shit there ever was and is to grow in" , and it may be for you , but.....

That statement`s as false as false can be , and all you gotta do is go next door and read some of the posts in the salty coco thread to see that you`re wrong in saying that to new folks that don`t have a clue....and lastly....

I`ll say this again , I`ve always had respect for your knowledge and experience , but I couldn`t stand by and let new folks read misleading information , and I DID try and be nice from the get , but you chose not to see things as such....anyways.....

How bout help Dr B figure out his ph issues while I go sling hay for cows and slop the hawgs....

Peace....DHF........

 

[Jnugg]

Fred,would you recommend adding a 10% to 20% amount if perlite to my coco next time instead of just in the bottom?

Check my thread,new info/ideas going on.

 

[RetroGrow]

Thanks for your support you, papaduc and retro have been of much help.

The seeds are about to sprout now, would you guys place it in rockwool or coco plugs or just let it start in a little cup of coco?

And I will have to order a PH/EC meter asap, was having a hard time controlling my PH when testing my water with ph drops and ph down, it seems to above 8 or maybe 9 in ph.

In coco, your PH needs to be 5.8, give or take a little. A PH pen/meter is not really optional. You NEED it. PH is critical in coco.
As far as starting seedlings, I have had best results in Foxfarms Seed Starter Mix, or Miracle Gro Seed Starter Mix, in transparent solo cups, so you can see the root development. When the cups are full of roots, transplant to coco and go to full strength feeding. Since you are new at this, this method is foolproof, and you don't have to worry about burning the seedlings or worry about the EC of your coco nutes. The starter mix has exactly what seedlings need, with no guesswork or measuring EC needed. Not only that, but it gives me better starts. You can start in coco, of course, but you will need to figure out the amount to feed, and without any kind of meters, that's going to be a potential problem area, so especially for newbies, I recommend the starter mix. Whichever way you do it, I recommend germing in paper towels. Tear towel in half, place seeds on it, wet with water, and fold over & place in ziplock bag. Then place that in a warm, dark area. If you keep them warm, they will germ faster, in 24 hours or less. Then put those cracked seedlings in your starter mix, without touching the roots with your hands. Use a plastic spoon or something to pick them up.
http://foxfarmfertilizer.com/index.php/item/light-warrior-agro-ponic-grow-medium.html

http://www.scotts.com/smg/goprod/miracle-gro-seed-starter-potting-soil/prod70340/
The Miracle Grow is available everywhere. Foxfarms in hydro stores or online.
You need a PH pen anyway, which means going to a hydro store or ordering online. Anyplace that sells pens will have the Light Warrior too.
I wouldn't start anything, though, until you get that PH meter. You are going to have to get used to using it, and when you get it, get some calibration solution also, as that's how you check if the pen stays calibrated. The pens go off at times, and then your PH will be off, and then you will have problems.
You can start in plain coco without worrying about feeding for the first week anyway, as the seedling has it's own food in the cotyledon. Or get an EC meter and feed very lightly after a couple of days. The idea is not to burn them with too much food at the start. Seed starter mix eliminates that possibility, and inoculates the seedlings with beneficial fungi.

 

[papaduc]

Yes start your seedlings straight into the coco Dr.B.
Feed them plain water at Ph anywhere between 5.6 - 6.2

By the time you get your ec pen, your seedlings will have put out two little leaves. Start feeding at 0.8ec at that point. Simple as that.

Keep us updated with pictures and I'll be able to explain what to do at each stage.

You OUGHTA know better.....Papa`s not trying to provoke you dewd , he`s merely pointing out what you yourself posted and was questioning your post as most folks do in a thread for it`s validity.....

That genuinely is all I'm doing.

You say you've done your research Retro, but some of the stuff you're suggesting is not good advice my friend.

Buying starter mix, then feeding full strength nutes is not the way to do things and belies what you say about having a lot of experience with coco.

First of all, using any starter mix to grow seeds is just an avoidance of learning to use coco in a vitally important stage. In itself it's not really advice that can have much of a detrimental effect on the grow... so it's not really that big a deal other than it delays the recipient from learning how to use coco properly from the start.

But... using "full strength" nutes afterwards?
That's just not the way to approach things in any form of media.
It might get you by with the maxibloom teaspoon and forget system... but you're on borrowed time if you think you can get away with that with every nute every time.

It's not a case of there being more than one way to achieve a goal, it's a case of right and wrong based on the facts of science, nature, and horticulture.

There is a genetic biological reason that plants like cannabis feed well on 1.0ec of base feed from a background of 0.2, and it does not change from coast to coast, or country to country. It's a constant. It's a fact.

When you start your feeds at 1.0 ec. what you've got is a baseline. From there you should only ever have to go up or down by 0.2ec.

Whether you go up or down is dependent on whether the plant's hungry or overfed. To know that you've got to know the basic signs of deficiency and excess.

These are the basics of reading a plant and they're the underpinning foundations of growing anything in any medium ever.

Half strength full strength etc etc etc... they're terms used by people who haven't embraced the exact nature of growing in hydro or semi/passive hydro culture. That's another fact and not an opinion, whether people want to dispute it or not, that's up to them. All they're doing is arguing already long since proven facts.

In any form of hydroponics, the appearance of the plants and the EC pen are the only things you need to determine what to feed.

I've always offered my opinions in a matter of fact way and I have never been confrontational. I won't change my opinion on the things you say until the things you say are more sound from a methodological point of view.

Like anyone who learns to get by doing anything a certain way, you develop bad habits. You might make those habits work for you but that doesn't mean they are technically sound, and they shouldn't be the methods a beginner follows when learning to do this for the first time.

 

[RetroGrow]

Buying starter mix, then feeding full strength nutes is not the way to do things

In your world. In my world, it works PERFECTLY, EVERY TIME. But since you've NEVER tried it, of course you know "better". And, AGAIN, you're twisting my words. I said, when the solo cup is FILLED with roots, then transplant and feed FULL strength. Notice I didn't say "you're" method doesn't work. There are different ways of doing things, and I plainly stated that he could start in coco if he wanted, but, since he has no meter/pen, and is a beginner, I am giving him an easier way of doing it without having a pen/meter, not to mention a faster start. It's his choice/his plants/his money. As far as your derogatory comments about my experience, it doesn't phase me at all. I understand you are trolling/baiting me, and are going to disagree with whatever I post, no matter what it is. So knock yourself out. Doesn't confront me at all. I find it laughable, actually. Sadly, I am never going to do it "your" way. Been there, done that. I am going to continue using K.I.S.S. method, 'cause I just love simplicity, and I love Maxibloom, just as thousands (millions) of others do.

In any form of hydroponics, the appearance of the plants and the EC pen are the only things you need to determine what to feed.

Again, in YOUR world. Remember, OP doesn't have an EC pen, and being a beginner, probably doesn't know how to read plants, so I provided him with a simpler, foolproof OPTION to start seedlings, and provided him with the link which explains why that method works so well. I'm pretty sure he can make up his own mind after reading. I didn't say it was the ONLY way to do it, as you do, just that it's my preferred method, and has given me better results, just as Hempy buckets have given me better results than "smart" pots. And remember, DHF says it's NOT hydroponics, so I guess you are agreeing with me on that, or maybe you just got confused, and forgot to disagree.

 

[mojave green]

if coco's so simple, whyzit take this many pages to explain it?

 

[DrBagseed]

In coco, your PH needs to be 5.8, give or take a little. A PH pen/meter is not really optional. You NEED it. PH is critical in coco.
As far as starting seedlings, I have had best results in Foxfarms Seed Starter Mix, or Miracle Gro Seed Starter Mix, in transparent solo cups, so you can see the root development. When the cups are full of roots, transplant to coco and go to full strength feeding. Since you are new at this, this method is foolproof, and you don't have to worry about burning the seedlings or worry about the EC of your coco nutes. The starter mix has exactly what seedlings need, with no guesswork or measuring EC needed. Not only that, but it gives me better starts. You can start in coco, of course, but you will need to figure out the amount to feed, and without any kind of meters, that's going to be a potential problem area, so especially for newbies, I recommend the starter mix. Whichever way you do it, I recommend germing in paper towels. Tear towel in half, place seeds on it, wet with water, and fold over & place in ziplock bag. Then place that in a warm, dark area. If you keep them warm, they will germ faster, in 24 hours or less. Then put those cracked seedlings in your starter mix, without touching the roots with your hands. Use a plastic spoon or something to pick them up.
http://foxfarmfertilizer.com/index.php/item/light-warrior-agro-ponic-grow-medium.html

http://www.scotts.com/smg/goprod/miracle-gro-seed-starter-potting-soil/prod70340/
The Miracle Grow is available everywhere. Foxfarms in hydro stores or online.
You need a PH pen anyway, which means going to a hydro store or ordering online. Anyplace that sells pens will have the Light Warrior too.
I wouldn't start anything, though, until you get that PH meter. You are going to have to get used to using it, and when you get it, get some calibration solution also, as that's how you check if the pen stays calibrated. The pens go off at times, and then your PH will be off, and then you will have problems.
You can start in plain coco without worrying about feeding for the first week anyway, as the seedling has it's own food in the cotyledon. Or get an EC meter and feed very lightly after a couple of days. The idea is not to burn them with too much food at the start. Seed starter mix eliminates that possibility, and inoculates the seedlings with beneficial fungi.

Yeah.. It should have been the first thing I bought in hindsight.
I dont have access to the starter mix and as I had already put the seeds in water there was no turning back. I started the black cream in coco plugs already, but the mazari's are in paper towels at the moment. I will put them in solo cups tomorrow.

I guess I will just have to try mixing the nutes at 1/4 strength or something to avoid burning them untill I can measure the EC. What is your opinion on that? I got rhizotonic, enzym and coco a+b, thinking about just adding rhizo but I dont know. Thinking about just buying the ph/ec meter domestically, but im at around $1500 spent already so I want to save the money buying of ebay overseas.. Anyways.. You said I could do 1 week without any nutes so thats probably the best in my case?

 

[DrBagseed]

Yes start your seedlings straight into the coco Dr.B.
Feed them plain water at Ph anywhere between 5.6 - 6.2

By the time you get your ec pen, your seedlings will have put out two little leaves. Start feeding at 0.8ec at that point. Simple as that.

Keep us updated with pictures and I'll be able to explain what to do at each stage.
.

I started them in the coco plugs, but thats just pure coco I assume anyways. I had a hard time getting the ph to right levels and reading the colors of my ph drops. Sucks but no way im getting buy without a ph/ec meter, been busy to so haven't gotten around to ordering them yet, but tomorrow!

I will start a journal as soon as I can see plant in the cups so that will be very helpfull for me.

Have a good night guys, peace

 

[DrBagseed]

Retro, you think a bucket like this is okay for hempy? 10L

https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/...U-m2z_i8Ahg7Smw6rWIMN02ffoImAav-0aTHw48tFxe_a

 

[RetroGrow]

Retro, you think a bucket like this is okay for hempy? 10L

https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/...U-m2z_i8Ahg7Smw6rWIMN02ffoImAav-0aTHw48tFxe_a

That's perfect. You will get HUGE plants in that. Just take the handles off, and try to get some kind of saucer to put under it to catch the runoff. Watering/feeding daily gives best results. Read Hempy's thread, and as much of the Hempy bucket thread that you can.
Re: Rhizotonic-yes, always use it if you've got it, right from the start. Follow Canna's chart on their website.
And, yes, mother nature designed the seedlings to survive. That first set of "leaves" is really a cotyledon. It has the food which nourishes the seedling until it gets it's first sets of real leaves, and then photosynthesis provides nourishment, as with most plants. Better to err on the side of caution, rather than to take a chance on burning them. They can go a week or more with no feeding whatsoever. There's a dozen different ways of germing and starting seedlings, and all of them work. I was just giving you my SUGGESTION, based on the way I like to do it. Check out the % of nutes on the Lightwarrior link I posted. Notice it is a miniscule amount of nutrients. Two most common mistakes beginners make are over watering and over feeding. Just don't over feed.

 

[papaduc]

Get a Ph and EC pen as soon as you can. Then 0.6 - 0.8ec feed on top of your tap water and you're good to go. There's no way of overfeeding seedlings if you know what parameters you're working within. Canna, fed at 1.0ec, will be either dead on, or within 0.2 ec of lush green growth. You'll see

 

[stoned40yrs]

I started them in the coco plugs, but thats just pure coco I assume anyways. I had a hard time getting the ph to right levels and reading the colors of my ph drops. Sucks but no way im getting buy without a ph/ec meter, been busy to so haven't gotten around to ordering them yet, but tomorrow!

I will start a journal as soon as I can see plant in the cups so that will be very helpfull for me.

Have a good night guys, peace

What did you have in mind as far a pens. They be spendy for a como ph/ec pen. Bluelab makes high quality ones. Someone gave me a bluelab truncheon for ec which I like a lot and I bought a Hanna for ph. Which ones have you been looking at?

 

[papaduc]

In your world. In my world, it works PERFECTLY, EVERY TIME. But since you've NEVER tried it.....

It seems I've got to choose my words carefully.

This is a quote from the hand watering coco thread on october 30th last year... The question asked was

I have a bunch of babies in happyfrog soil can I transplant in to coco or will that cause problems?

My answer:

Yes you can. If they're babies in small pots of compost then just pot them up into straight coco and make a seamless transition straight away. No extra measures to be taken. Buy coco nutes and start feeding them from the get go and you're off.

When I first made the switch from compost years ago, I still used the seed and cutting mix I used to get from the builders yard to start them off in. It was good mix and guaranteed a good start from the babies. Then I naturally just graduated into coco start to finish. But yea, going from seed cup of compost into coco is fine.

I hope that makes things a little clearer. I have never once said it doesn't work. Not once. The above quote proves it.

The point I made on the previous page is that it's the wrong way to approach things if you want to learn how to use coco properly from the very beginning.

When I grew organic I made my own mixes from scratch. I know about incoculants and aerobic and anaerobic bacteria, compost teas... I've got a comfrey patch in the back which I use to make a liquid organic feed and mulch.. and last year I had buckets of tomatoes, 10kg butternut squashes and massive pumpkins. I love gardening and I hope to get some pictures up this year in the fruit and veg thread.

Later on this month I'll be starting over 100 seeds of all different types. Some will takes days to germinate, some weeks. I also use a heat mat to start certain ones; the assumption I have never used one I can only assume you have literally plucked out of thin air.

So, I hope that goes some way to allaying your concerns that I've never seen things like sphagnum moss, worm casts, horse manure, perlite, fytocell, heat mats, seeds...

You're making assumptions that I don't know about these things.
That I need to do a side by side test in foxfarms starter mix to gain some kind of knowledge of how quickly it grows seedlings.

I don't.

I've posted pictures on previous pages of the growth rates in coco fed 1.0ec of starter feed under fluorescent light.

I've watched countless seed plants grow in all different mixes. I know for a guaranteed fact that there is no way whatsoever that your starter mix achieves better growth rates than that to the point where you could be justified in saying it "blows coco out of the water"If it did you would be the first to prove me wrong.

That tells me you haven't figured out how to achieve those growth rates using coco. That's not my opinion, it's a fact based on your own admission. For your results in starter mix to have "blown away" your results in coco, must mean your results in coco were very clearly behind.

If you want to be ignorant to what I'm saying, fair enough. But don't pass off the results of your own mistakes as gospel knowledge.

I said, when the solo cup is FILLED with roots, then transplant and feed FULL strength.

I know that's what you said. And it's still wrong. Never blindly follow the recommended full strength guide amount at any stage of growth, let alone when you've just transplanted from the seed cup. Gauge your feeds by reading your plants and using the ec pen.

but, since he has no meter/pen

This is the whole point of buying an ec pen. It's a more sound investment for anyone in any form of hydro than a bag of starter mix, every day of every week of every year.

The fact is, you've chosen to stick with methods which don't stand you in good stead to adapt well to anything outside your comfort zone of a teaspoon of maxibloom.

being a beginner, probably doesn't know how to read plants

So, when to start? Or, If you go with the maxibloom system do you ever have to?

What kind of methods are you promoting? Simplicity? Or the avoidance of gaining actual practical hands on skills that will last you a lifetime and enable you to use whatever nute you want with equally good results?

Reading and understanding your plants is what makes you a gardener, and not a mindless slave to a nutrient system.

There are too many people who buy into too many things because they don't have an underpinning knowledge of the very thing they're buying it for.

I'd have no problem whatsoever if you had said "buy starter mix, because it guarantees you a good healthy start... But you're promoting as a fact that starter mix is not just easier, but better, faster, that coco is somehow inferior to it - and it's that which I'm challenging. Coco wasn't responsible for your starter mix blowing it away... You were! You might be too proud to accept that, but it changes nothing whatsoever about the fact.

I realise I'm banging my head on a wall trying to get this through to you. It doesn't mean I'm trolling you, or deliberately trying to pick holes in the things you say.

And remember, DHF says it's NOT hydroponics so I guess you are agreeing with me on that, or maybe you just got confused, and forgot to disagree.

What DHF was referring to is that coco is a semi-hydro or passive hydro medium. It's not full hydroponic system and shares much more in common with soil culture than water culture.

I don't want to argue these things, but for some reason you've put a complete block on anything I'm trying to explain to you.

 

[RetroGrow]

You just can't stop beating that dead horse.
Not promoting anything, just my suggestions according to what works best for me. I have nothing to prove to you, and really am not interested in how you do things. You do what works for you, and I'll do what I know works for me. What interests you most is arguing on the internet and being "right". So, enjoy yourself. Like I told you in OVO's thread, I'm not here to debate you, and I really don't care what you think about my methods. So, now I'm going to check my Hempy passive hydro system, and make sure my hydro medium is fully saturated. You're just going to have to find someone else to argue with. So sorry.

 

[Jnugg]

We've all given our suggestions...no need to continue shoving them down OP's throat...Jesus!

 

[RetroGrow]

What did you have in mind as far a pens. They be spendy for a como ph/ec pen. Bluelab makes high quality ones. Someone gave me a bluelab truncheon for ec which I like a lot and I bought a Hanna for ph. Which ones have you been looking at?

Bluelabs are the best, but expensive. I have a couple of cheap PPM meters, by Hanna, and they work fine. They are the blue ones and cost only $15. Keep one as a backup, but neither has failed yet. As far as PH meters, I have the Oakton Waterproof pH1 EcoTster Solution. It hasn't given me any problems and has lasted. $54 @ Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/Oakton-Waterproof-pH1-EcoTster-Solution/dp/B00FZSUN68/ref=zg_bs_393271011_6
Don't forget the calibration solution.

 

[DrBagseed]

I have been watching this because its the closest/cheapest to my location i can find.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SET-S-EC-Co...K_Swimming_Pools_Hot_Tubs&hash=item56375ff945
Looks cheap ass but im guessing its good enough, I havent placed an order yet though so up for opinions