Noobin up a PPK

[DaveTheNewbie]

well guys ive worked out what im doing wrong. Following in the steps of Bobbles et al, ive been adding cat fur for extra potency.

I think i overdid it

 

[Mister_D]

well guys ive worked out what im doing wrong. Following in the steps of Bobbles et al, ive been adding cat fur for extra potency.

View Image

I think i overdid it

It's mega's weed that is super potent due to it's famed cat hair content. Bobble just grows moldy shit, oh wait, that was the last house . He's now pretending to make "teas" to cover for the over abundance of bacteria taking over his new spot

 

[DaveTheNewbie]

ahh shit i always get mega and bobbles confused just like i get Anti artimus and itchybob confused, or HL45 and silverhawiian. My brain just works that way.

As an aside, while hunting for an answer to why my PH skyrockets from 5 to 7 in the supply res over a few days I found this :

http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/hydro/msg0511120511283.html

I have read a few posts (MJ growers that use this stuff) on other forums saying that they observed what they assumed was a magnesium deficiency while using the Grow formula.

this backs up what people here are guessing at. I still cant get my head around how much PH down i use and its still too high a day later. Im going to sit buckets of water with 1 nute each and see which one is pushing it up and just remove that one item.

 

[DaveTheNewbie]

Officially Confused.

Officially Confused.

ok im officially confused.

1) i take 4 clean pint glasses and fill them with tap water : PH 7.6
2) all glases get 4 drops of PH down : PH 6.2
3.1) one glass gets a dose of GH MaxiGrow : PH 2.6
3.2) one glass gets a dose of Budlink silica : PH 3.4
3.3) one glass gets a dose of GH CaMg+ : PH 4.0
3.4) one glass gets a dose of GH Floralicious+ : PH 3.2
4) i then PH test on a PH 7 calibrating solution : PH 7.2
5) i then retest all these samples and get the same numbers again consistently

The only answer i can come up with is that my PH pen is buggered in a fairly unique way. This in itself would account for many varied and ugly problems.

EDIT : this just isnt right. 4 drops of PH down in a pint of water should be overkill, not PH 6.2. Thats the first problem right there, even tho i measured all 4 glasses after adding. Doing again without PH-

1) i take 4 clean pint glasses and fill them with tap water : PH 7.6
2) do nothing
3.1) one glass gets a dose of GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9
3.2) one glass gets a dose of Budlink silica : PH 8.9
3.3) one glass gets a dose of GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8
3.4) one glass gets a dose of GH Floralicious+ : PH 6.5
4) wait a week to retest
5) see what happens

Im hoping that one of them will rise up substantially over that time, and thats the culprit. In the meantime im sick and tired of chasing PH all over the place.

 

[SecondAttempt]

Did you recalibrate after getting 7.2 out of solution that should clearly be 7.0? Then got the same numbers? Maybe your low range (4.0) was on target and your high range wasn't?

I've never used or heard of budlink silica but any silica I've used drove ph way up so 3.4 with silica doesn't seem right to me.

Anyone else?

 

[SRGB]

DaveTheNewbie:


EDIT : this just isnt right. 4 drops of PH down in a pint of water should be overkill, not PH 6.2. Thats the first problem right there, even tho i measured all 4 glasses after adding. Doing again without PH-

1) i take 4 clean pint glasses and fill them with tap water : PH 7.6
2) do nothing
3.1) one glass gets a dose of GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9
3.2) one glass gets a dose of Budlink silica : PH 8.9
3.3) one glass gets a dose of GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8
3.4) one glass gets a dose of GH Floralicious+ : PH 6.5
4) wait a week to retest
5) see what happens

Im hoping that one of them will rise up substantially over that time, and thats the culprit. In the meantime im sick and tired of chasing PH all over the place.


Hi, DaveTheNewbie.

It appears from your numbers that deletion of `3.2` might provide you with a solution within pH range commonly referenced as being employed, at least on this board.

What type of pH `pen` are you using? Is it calibrated? Or, re-calibrated, as was mentioned above?

Have you tried measuring pH with a basic `dropper-shake` type unit, too? To corroborate readings?

Ideally, MaxiGro could be delivered standalone. F+ only requires 1/2 teaspoon per 5 gallon bucket, which also could be delivered by itself. CaMg could also be delivered by itself, when required, or only every other or third watering. The issue might be the combination of the listed ingredients reacting with each other in a tank, over a given period.

Best,
/SRGB/

 

[DaveTheNewbie]

1) i take 4 clean pint glasses and fill them with tap water : PH 7.6
2.1) one glass gets a dose of GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9
2.2) one glass gets a dose of Budlink silica : PH 8.9
2.3) one glass gets a dose of GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8
2.4) one glass gets a dose of GH Floralicious+ : PH 6.5

1 day later and i have

2.1) one glass gets a dose of GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9 => 6.2
2.2) one glass gets a dose of Budlink silica : PH 8.9 => 8.4
2.3) one glass gets a dose of GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8 => 6.4
2.4) one glass gets a dose of GH Floralicious+ : PH 6.5 => 7.3

I should have had a pint of plain water for reference too in hindsight.

so the silica lowers but all the others raise. Because i was lazy i used plain tap water so i can believe the general raising may be at least partially due to evaporation of chlorine, so i am not jumping at these numbers. Interesting tho.

The PH pen has been calibrated repeatedly and regularly because ive been having PH issues for some time now. No i havent used a second reference to corroborate. Im of the opinion that at least one of my ingredients is raising alot over time tho, we shall see soon.

EDIT : oh yeah : i foliar fed plants with epsoms, and im adding 5g to each 30l of RO water going in now too.

 

[bobblehead]

Did you agitate the solution in the glasses before measuring pH again? If the ions settled to the bottom, this would skew your results. Not that they sound abnormal. I just want to make sure you're getting the right readings.

 

[SRGB]

Hi, DaveTheNewbie.

It might be helpful to maintain the same numbers that indicate an entry at your ordered list. At #525, the silica is listed as `3.2`, above it is listed as `2.2`. You could alternatively list them as `A`, `B`, `C`, etc. The `.#` might tend to indicate that the entry is a subset of a single heading, instead of an independent entry.

We did not notice that `3.2/2.2` was silica, until presently. Silica can be used to `pH up` solutions. It does not pH down easily. That might be the issue with pH fluctuations.

A glass of pure water for a `control` might also be an addition that you could read from as a reference.

Silica might generally raise the pH of a solution. It might interfere with lowering of the pH when mixed with other compounds, as its pH might be naturally slightly alkaline. It too, can be applied through foliar spray, without further pH adjustment.

As we alluded to in a previous post, the mixing and storage of various reactive compounds in a single tank might be the cause of your concerns.

Is it possible for you to mix each of your input variables, four total, in four separate vessels? And apply them individually?

The two middle supplements do not necessarily require application at every watering (silica and calcium with magnesium). F+ can be applied at each watering, and only requires drops per 5 gallons to deliver its benefits.

We are not certain how we missed the listing of the inclusion of silica into the mix in previous posts. Please do excuse our omission. That supplement might tend to keep pH higher in a given tank; as it can be used, to an appreciable degree, as a pH `up` in a solution.

Also, how much silica were you applying? From our recollections, the effective rate of silica was only 50 parts per million. Or, perhaps a couple drops per 1 liter spray bottle, or perhaps a half teaspoon per gallon of water, if that; drops per gallon work well, too. Not necessarily required at every watering. It might help to strengthen celluar walls and branches, and moderately repel insects. If we recollect accurately, it remains in the vascular system of the specimen after application, similar to calcium; only requiring a few applications per season. This might be further explored by the soilless gardener.

In any event, if your pH was `rising`, or increasing, over a given period, and silica was in the reservoir tank in a large enough dosage, that might be the cause of the pH rise.

The base 10-15-14 can be applied standalone. Each supplement could be applied standalone, in moderation. The base nutrient might actually provide all required for plant or tree sustenance. The supplements could be applied sparingly, from their own individual containers - if isolation of a potentially reactive compound is the goal.

We hope that this post might be helpful.

Best,
/SRGB/

 

[DaveTheNewbie]

Did you agitate the solution in the glasses before measuring pH again? If the ions settled to the bottom, this would skew your results. Not that they sound abnormal. I just want to make sure you're getting the right readings.

yup and im going to remeasure every day for a week to get a pattern

It might be helpful to maintain the same numbers that indicate an entry at your ordered list. At #525, the silica is listed as `3.2`, above it is listed as `2.2`. You could alternatively list them as `A`, `B`, `C`, etc. The `.#` might tend to indicate that the entry is a subset of a single heading, instead of an independent entry.

lol i really didnt think anyone would notice that

We did not notice that `3.2/2.2` was silica, until presently. Silica can be used to `pH up` solutions. It does not pH down easily. That might be the issue with pH fluctuations.

its not a 1 off raise thats the problem, its a continious raise over time thats bothering me. If silica does that then i will remove it.

A glass of pure water for a `control` might also be an addition that you could read from as a reference.

yeah i recognise that already.

As we alluded to in a previous post, the mixing and storage of various reactive compounds in a single tank might be the cause of your concerns.

Is it possible for you to mix each of your input variables, four total, in four separate vessels? And apply them individually?

im really trying to avoid this. I want a large res that i can walk away from for a week or 2 and not worry about.

Also, how much silica were you applying? From our recollections, the effective rate of silica was only 50 parts per million. Or, perhaps a couple drops per 1 liter spray bottle, or perhaps a half teaspoon per gallon of water, if that; drops per gallon work well, too.

the brand of silica i use is Budlink which is much milder than others such as Silikamagic. Im using 1ml/l where the bottle recommends 2.5 ml/l

We hope that this post might be helpful.

always

 

[DaveTheNewbie]

WTF

WTF

day 3 PH measurements

1) one glass gets a dose of GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9 => 6.2 =>5.8
2) one glass gets a dose of Budlink silica : PH 8.9 => 8.4 => 8.4
3) one glass gets a dose of GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8 => 6.4 => 6.4
4) one glass gets a dose of GH Floralicious+ : PH 6.5 => 7.3 => 7.4
5) one glass of "pure RO water" from my system (PPM 193) : PH 7.1

It would seem that my tap water (no matter the nute) jumps PH in the first 24 hours massively, and then sits pretty stable.
Im no chemist, but i believe its the chlorine evaporating in the first 24 hours.
In theory RO water shouldnt have any chlorine, and shouldnt need 24 hours of sitting. Im thinking my RO water is still full of chlorine, and thats my problem.

Its interesting to note that the silica is a strong PH+ but it starts to drop over time the first 24 hours while the water it sits in is supposedly rising. And the Maxigrow starts to drop after day 2. If i didnt have water causing a PH+ these would actually drop PH over time.

I will keep this test going another few days, but im starting a new test of my pure RO water to see what happens as a semi-control.

The epsom salts sure helped the leaf colour come back. One thing i had was a Mg deficiency.

 

[Mister_D]

5) one glass of "pure RO water" from my system (PPM 193) : PH 7.1

I highlighted your ph issue. That "RO water" is harder than most peoples tap. It's not the chlorine causing an issue. More than likely you just have a lot of calcium in your tap, and clearly your r/o filters are needing replaced. Solution is to either get some new RO filters, or just do like I do and learn to use your tap (cannabis loves calcium ). My strategy for dealing with hard water (mine comes out of the tap around 0.6 EC or 300ppm @ .5!) is to adjust ph lower than I would normally set it knowing it will rise over then next 24 hours. Trick is to figure out where it needs to be set so it settles at the desired ph after the rise. In my case when I mix nutes I ph to 5.3-5.5, knowing it will over a few days rise to between 5.8-6. I then readjust, if necessary, after 2-3 days and it will stay where ever I put it. This gives my plants the advantage of better nute uptake due to the ph moving through the entire ideal range.

I strongly suggest everyone at some point go to the hydro subforum right here on the mag, and read the sticky "big toke's basic water chemistry" It's the best explanation of how your water works, in laymans terms, that I've come across yet .

 

[bobblehead]

D is right, that is some hard ass RO water... how old are the filters? My tap water is way better than that. Even at the lake house my water was .9 EC and I got it down to .1 EC.

 

[DamnUglyDogE]

Thank god for jacks. ..

Jacks hydro or bust. ...

Don't think I'm ever going to try my Age old Nuit-Line from my soil adventure ..

Not if I gotz to deal with all this. ..

Great input guys. . Damn technical though...

​

.

 

[ozzieAI]

yep i am confused as well dave...

any silica I've used drove ph way up so 3.4 with silica doesn't seem right to me.

i concur...

how are the plants anyway?

 

[DaveTheNewbie]

day 4 PH measurements

1) one glass gets a dose of GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9 => 6.2 =>5.8 => 6.0
2) one glass gets a dose of Budlink silica : PH 8.9 => 8.4 => 8.4 => 8.2
3) one glass gets a dose of GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8 => 6.4 => 6.4 => 6.8
4) one glass gets a dose of GH Floralicious+ : PH 6.5 => 7.3 => 7.4 => 7.4
5) one glass of "pure RO water" from my system (PPM 193) : PH 7.1 => 7.4

i am having trouble trusting my PH pen.
GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9 => 6.2 =>5.8 => 6.0. Thats all over the shop
"pure RO water" : PH 7.1 => 7.4. I expected a bigger rise here.
GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8 => 6.4 => 6.4 => 6.8. Thats starting to rise again. This is what i was really looking for, something that starts to rise after a few days. This is the one im going to keep an eye on.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=23357 EPIC READ. Makes me want to use bio buckets

plants are looking nicer thanks to the epsoms.

ps WTF is it with crocs and stupid people sleeping with them? Dont you people know they are classified under the category of "bitey bitey"?

 

[Big John]

day 4 PH measurements

1) one glass gets a dose of GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9 => 6.2 =>5.8 => 6.0
2) one glass gets a dose of Budlink silica : PH 8.9 => 8.4 => 8.4 => 8.2
3) one glass gets a dose of GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8 => 6.4 => 6.4 => 6.8
4) one glass gets a dose of GH Floralicious+ : PH 6.5 => 7.3 => 7.4 => 7.4
5) one glass of "pure RO water" from my system (PPM 193) : PH 7.1 => 7.4

i am having trouble trusting my PH pen.
GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9 => 6.2 =>5.8 => 6.0. Thats all over the shop
"pure RO water" : PH 7.1 => 7.4. I expected a bigger rise here.
GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8 => 6.4 => 6.4 => 6.8. Thats starting to rise again. This is what i was really looking for, something that starts to rise after a few days. This is the one im going to keep an eye on.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=23357 EPIC READ. Makes me want to use bio buckets

plants are looking nicer thanks to the epsoms.

ps WTF is it with crocs and stupid people sleeping with them? Dont you people know they are classified under the category of "bitey bitey"?

Also, that is a great link! Thanks Dave and Mister D.

That epsom salts really greens em up huh?

 

[DaveTheNewbie]

That epsom salts really greens em up huh?

Sure does if they are short of magnesium. Wont do shit if they arent.

 

[DaveTheNewbie]

day 5 PH measurements

1) one glass gets a dose of GH MaxiGrow : PH 5.9 => 6.2 =>5.8 => 6.0 => 6.5
2) one glass gets a dose of Budlink silica : PH 8.9 => 8.4 => 8.4 => 8.2 => 8.0
3) one glass gets a dose of GH CaMg+ : PH 5.8 => 6.4 => 6.4 => 6.8 => 7.6
4) one glass gets a dose of GH Floralicious+ : PH 6.5 => 7.3 => 7.4 => 7.4 => 7.7
5) one glass of "pure RO water" from my system (PPM 193) : PH 7.1 => 7.4 => 7.8

Well it seems as well as a Mg deficiency It seems i have a P deficiency as well. Im over trying to make MaxiGrow work. I never had these problems with MaxiBloom so im going back. The MaxiGrow also is starting to show a serious PH rise over time now. This is what i was looking for. Not using that shit any more.
The GH CaMg+ product seems to be settling down to the bottom of the glass causing a sludge so thats one product that im not using any more. It also has a serious PH rise over time.

Hell everything seems to rise over time still.

for what its worth my tap water is 430 ppm, so the filter taking it down to 193 ppm is helping

 

[bobblehead]

Dave, imo you should strongly consider running a light base nutrient of maxibloom, and apply everything else including maxibloom as a foliar spray. I said in another post that plants can absorb 10% of nutes applied to to the roots, and 90% of what's applied to the leaves. Its both more economical and efficient to apply a foliar spray. You should be able to mix everything up and spray it, or separate the CaMg from everything else if you're concerned about it reacting with the other nutes.

I've started applying foliar sprays on a weekly basis, and I'm very happy with the results.