Undocumented?

[FatherEarth]

I dont think its harming anything, or maybe it is and things could be better. Just cant say for sure.


Day 29 flowering

 

[SeaMaiden]

That's wild. It wouldn't fall under the definition of fasciation, would it?

The view from the topside is specTACular.

 

[FatherEarth]

That's wild. It wouldn't fall under the definition of fasciation, would it?

The view from the topside is specTACular.

from what I read about it Id say maybe.
After looking at the pics documented here Id say no, and if so it does not appear to be typical fasciation. If indeed it is, Im sure glad its not in my flowers...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fasciation

http://www.hort.purdue.edu/ext/fascinatingfasciation.html

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=251782

 

[SeaMaiden]

Reading your links, it very well could be fasciation. Fascinating!

 

[gtotoys1]

Have you considered an RO Water filtration system? They are inexpensive.

 

[DuckDuckGoose]

you took clones right? are all the affected plants from the same mom? could it be genetic?
xmen plants?

DDG

 

[FatherEarth]

no its not genetic. I just acquired some cherry pie and hit them twice with a mix I prolly shouldnt have not thinking about it...they too are showing the same thing. Im thinking now its possible it could be the kelp xtract? Im going to take a couple plants and experiment with them to see whats really going on. Hit em with the same single thing over and over til something happens. Im tired of guessing.

 

[YosemiteSam]

What I find fascinating is that your brix is holding that high. I would think that rules out copper toxicity...or any other serious imbalance in cations/anions. Do you have a sap pH meter?

If it was too much kelp you would think some kind of toxicity. Process of elimination sure points to too much Silica.

 

[YosemiteSam]

One more comment...there is a whole bunch of N (as protein but still N) in that mix plus the adds. I would try some plants with the mix but minus Silica entirely just to make sure you aren't overdoing N.

I am guessing very little of it gets into the plant as nitrate. Are you insect free?

 

[TribalSeeds]

Ive read that a plant wont absorb excess si.
Too much si in your nutrient solution can still cause imbalances like too much K.

 

[Coba]

by the way the leaf looks cut, it looks like insect damage to me... I don't know much though.

I've always thought... chlorosis---> necrosis are signs of internal tissue damage. just in different patterns, like circles for fungus, spots for bacteria, or leaf margins, interveinal, or tips from nutrients and so forth. I don't associate an internally damaged plant with losing tissue into thin air.

I would chalk it up to too much silica and move on... from your canopy pics, nothing is detrimentally wrong.

new cut, new ferts, new additives, new bulb... I tell my buddies... "don't try too many new things all at one time." ... all the time.

 

[FatherEarth]

One more comment...there is a whole bunch of N (as protein but still N) in that mix plus the adds. I would try some plants with the mix but minus Silica entirely just to make sure you aren't overdoing N.

I am guessing very little of it gets into the plant as nitrate. Are you insect free?

Totally insect free. Minus the soil mites that is... I would think that if I had too much N my buds would be more leafy. At least last run when I hit a few plants with too much N within a few days the bud structure changed and they did not form tight colas. These are tight and forming better than I have had previously. Anything is possible though... Any thoughts on the stem issues? To be honest the stem thing seems like a benefit more than a problem. They are super strong where those growths are mostly around the where they connect to the main stem. I noticed at first its just a small ball, Im sure that is from the silicates. Never had that until I used protekt for the first time...



Thanks for the advice, much appreciated,

FE

 

[Coba]

" I would think that if I had too much N my buds would be more leafy."


dark, dark green leafs would be an N over dose dead give away.

 

[FatherEarth]

LOL, thanks Coba

 

[FatherEarth]

new cut, new ferts, new additives, new bulb... I tell my buddies... "don't try too many new things all at one time." .

The new 'ferts' arent the culprit because I had it last run and didnt use the new stuff. I stated that earlier in the thread. New bulbs I get every run. New cut is not in the canopy at all. I just got it a week or two ago. You are mixing facts around and getting things muddled. Thanks for your help.

 

[c-ray]

it has the appearance of a Cu deficiency

check the pic towards the bottom of this page
http://asktheplant.com/?p=842

 

[SeaMaiden]

Good catch, c-ray. Always offering up new information, MUCH appreciated!

Totally insect free. Minus the soil mites that is... I would think that if I had too much N my buds would be more leafy. At least last run when I hit a few plants with too much N within a few days the bud structure changed and they did not form tight colas. These are tight and forming better than I have had previously. Anything is possible though... Any thoughts on the stem issues? To be honest the stem thing seems like a benefit more than a problem. They are super strong where those growths are mostly around the where they connect to the main stem. I noticed at first its just a small ball, Im sure that is from the silicates. Never had that until I used protekt for the first time...



Thanks for the advice, much appreciated,

FE

" I would think that if I had too much N my buds would be more leafy."


dark, dark green leafs would be an N over dose dead give away.

My experience is like Father Earth's--too much N (depending on phase of growth, obviously) has caused the buds to become larfy and leafy, lose density. I haven't pushed to the point of dark green leaves, only to the point of slightly burnt leaf tips.

 

[FatherEarth]

Thanks C- Ray nice link. Im not sure how I could be deficient in Cu though? I was under the impression it was a rarity in cannabis to see Cu deficiency.. Maybe something is locking it out? What would I give them for Cu? Got the researcher awake now, thanks again C-ray.

With Respect,

FE

 

[SeaMaiden]

I don't know, either, but this is the best Mulder's chart I've found to date.

http://www.criticalelements.com.au/mineral_wheel.gif

Unfortunately I cannot see that Cu is either synergistic or antagonistic with Si.
(this is why I wish the chart were BIGGER)

 

[c-ray]

more questions:

at what height on the plants are you seeing the cannibalized leaves?

how are the roots looking, do they look normal or what?

what is the plant sap pH?

what is the soil runoff pH?

you might find some more clues here:
http://books.google.ca/books?id=5k0afN5UZ4IC&pg=PA310&dq=handbook+of+plant+nutrition+uptake+and+metabolism+of+copper&hl=en&sa=X&ei=bQotUbAEyaaqAaulgeAI&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=handbook%20of%20plant%20nutrition%20uptake%20and%20metabolism%20of%20copper&f=false

if you think there is plenty of Cu coming into your soil, perhaps something like humic acid, biozome and activated effective microorganisms would be useful to release copper that is present?

you could try minimal applications of soluble copper sulfate but personally I would try giving the plants some sea-crop, and an application or 2 of homeopathic copper sulfate and homeopathic silica (pm for specifics if you are curious) since you are in mid-flower and who knows what the copper sulfate will do and if it is really needed..

your plants are also looking a bit sulfur deficient I would say..