The Perfect Vape
- Thread starter sandawg
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T
Truthman
Konradzuse, I liked your VAPORIZATION 101 THREAD but I have to correct you on two things. First, the flash point is different from the boiling point. A flash point is when enough of the vaporized substance is in the air and can combust. Boiling point is just the substance boiling off at a certain temperature.
Second, those temperatures are wrong specifically thc and cbd. They are way too low. Think about it if thc was that low when people cook with cannabis and make brownies they wouldn't even get that high because most would be vaporized. Or when people vaporize they would get higher than they would at higher temperatures. It makes no sense. Plus the merck index has thc boiling at 200C. You will have a little vaping but that is no where near the amount that would be if you get near the boiling point which brings me to another point.
A lot of vaporizers fluctuate in temperatures, even the volcano classic goes up and down 9 degrees and so far the only ones that I know that keep the temperature stable around 2 degrees are the Aromed, volcano digital, and the upcoming vapexhale. So I think you should write about this in the thread because having an accurate temperature and knowing the proper temperature to vape at for certain substances is very important if you want the best experience.
Aromed has a webpage that can help when it comes to actual plants but not certain substances within the plant:
http://www.aromed.com/en/medical-plants.html
Second, those temperatures are wrong specifically thc and cbd. They are way too low. Think about it if thc was that low when people cook with cannabis and make brownies they wouldn't even get that high because most would be vaporized. Or when people vaporize they would get higher than they would at higher temperatures. It makes no sense. Plus the merck index has thc boiling at 200C. You will have a little vaping but that is no where near the amount that would be if you get near the boiling point which brings me to another point.
A lot of vaporizers fluctuate in temperatures, even the volcano classic goes up and down 9 degrees and so far the only ones that I know that keep the temperature stable around 2 degrees are the Aromed, volcano digital, and the upcoming vapexhale. So I think you should write about this in the thread because having an accurate temperature and knowing the proper temperature to vape at for certain substances is very important if you want the best experience.
Aromed has a webpage that can help when it comes to actual plants but not certain substances within the plant:
http://www.aromed.com/en/medical-plants.html
KonradZuse
Active member
I know the flash point is different from a boiling point. The Flash point is the point in which it begins to vaporize, it isn't the temp when it combusts, because if it was then everyone would be combusting at 300F. I posted boiling points to show when a good temp to vape them at is, as that's usually what you see when you research actives.
None of my temps are wrong. THC's Flashpoint is 149.3C(300.2F) and the boiling point is 157C(315F). CBD's boiling point is 165C(325F). As I said in the vape 101 you get HIGHER at LOWER temps and STONED at HIGHER TEMPS. I know people who just vape at 300-320 and get the THC they need, but they are lacking other cannabinoids. I don't know what the MERCK Index is, but it's wrong. NORML states THC's boiling point is 157C and the flash point is 149.3C. 200C-392F is the point in which you will begin to release combustion carcinogens like Benzene, so if you really want to start there, go for it, but that's not where THC boils at all.
If you want to argue about it try to vape at a lower temp, and take it higher. You will feel just high(head high) then you will go into a (body stoned). The thing here is that you think THC is the only thing that effects your state of being, which is not true. Cannabinoids begin vaping at 70C-150F and stop at about 226C about 430F. Combustion occurs at 230C(446F).
As for brownies why wouldn't you want to cook your bud to activation? You want to combust the bud in your brownies? What the flash point does it begin activation of a chemical.
As for stable temps, my Extreme was always stable, my SV is torch powered so stability is an issue, and my VHW was always stable. Any good vape out there is stable. There can be a fluctuation as you said with the cano, it's usually +/- 5*, but that's doubtful, and it will correct itself instantly.
Last thing if you read the bottom of my 101 thread you would see a decent sized lists of actives, their effects, and their boiling points(Maybe flashpoints also, not 100% need to look).
Also Aromed's site is quite a joke. 190-210C for ALL CANANBINOIDS? That's completely false since cannabinoids vape as low as 70C, and go ALL THE WAY to 226C, which is far out of range of what they say. They also list very few effects and it seems like they are talking about it causing discomfort and pain, which is something cannabis prevents.
KonradZuse
Active member
185 is a great temp.
ImO the best bong vape would be my Supreme. Biggest hits in the game, but it takes a lot of user error.
The VHW is great also, but since mine just broke after a few months use, my friend's just broke after a year, I would say that the VHW is on my off list for now. You can repair it for 40$, but that's shitty if you already spent 250 on it.
I've heard great things about the SSV, as well, but haven't used one.
IT seems the best bong vape that is coming out will be the Vape Xhale Cloud so you might want to wait for that.
KonradZuse
Active member
Konrad,
Buddy, I assumed you're European because you referred to all temps in Celsius.
I wasn't trying to engage in class warfare. I just don't have the money to buy a new vape atm. And I'm pissed off I couldn't consolidate this one student loan that is beating my fucking door down. Just sayin'.
Regarding the gummy screens: if you are overheating, your screens won't get gummy. I hope I don't have to explain that further, although I never realized it until I lowered the temp. Do you see? When I was overheating, my screen never got gummy because I was burning the shit out of the weed. Now that I'm vaping at a proper temp, the screen gums up. Shouldn't be that mind blowing.
Yes, my element only has one side. Its a knob that gets hot, and I place the bowl with the weed over it. So only one side of the weed is facing the heating element. After each toke, I pull off the bowl and rotate the bud. The irritation in your tone plus the lame attempt at braggadocio tells me you were falling for my troll bait. Relax, I was going easy on you. I'm a damn good troll, actually, but I love these forums, so I try to keep my troll proclivities in check. I do enjoy fucking with you though.
People like you aren't the target audience. I was reaching out to people who don't know everything. I actually learned a lot, by the way, mostly from people who also don't know everything, like me. I feel everything is a continual learning process. It must be nice to reach a point where you feel you've learned it all. Grats
As I said before when you read everything online and it's in C you tend to stick with it, and I put the F conversions as well, some I just didn't know.
Yeah loans suck, but this is about vaping.
If you combust you will get ash and shit and will be destroying actives losing out of the good vapor/resin production. I was just saying my screens are used for awhile before replacing.
You enjoy fucking with me? This forum is supposed to be about vaporization, but it seems like you just like to talk shit to people who don't have your views, and to people who are proving you wrong.
I'm not the target audience, I'm the targeter. I'm here to make people enjoy vaping, not give them pseudo-science crap. As for the point of learning everything, I'm not there yet, no one is. I enjoy learning every day and I enjoy sharing my knowledge with others. If you cannot take the heat, get out of the kitchen.
Also I'm not bragging, if I was I would say I vape .02 in my vape and get higher than most, but then again this isn't about me, it's about vaping, educating, and learning about the plant.
and honestly if you aren't going to talk to me and have a civil debate without trying to throw out insults and all those little things you added into your post, I'm pretty much done with you.
I'll continue to talk to those who want to learn, not those who are trying to convert people based on their own experiences with ONE vape.
Happy vaping,
~KZ
T
Truthman
No, the flash point is when enough substances are in the air and are able to combust which creates a flash hence the name flash point. Decarboxylation is activating a chemical not flash point and you can use heat to do it or you can use vitamin b6 to do it if you eat your bud raw but you still need fat to dissolve the cannabinoids and carry them to different parts of the body efficiently.
Those temperatures are recent numbers that someone started spreading around the net about 2-3 years ago but before that it was known and told that thc boils at 392f/200c and good vaporizes delt with that temperature. This is why the de Verdamper Vaporizer is so good because it starts vaporizing at 200c and if you cover the top it can get hotter for quicker and more extraction of other cannabinoids.
The merck index is widely known and is used by scientist. Here's more info:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merck_Index
It is essential oils that are giving the high that you speak of and just a little of the thc and cbn but the other cannabinoids are of a higher temperature. Dr. hornby did a test proving this with the volcano. Also, the reason why benzene and other carcinogenics are created at high temperatures that thc begins boiling at is because the lower temperature essential oils which give flavor burn when the temperature is started at a high rate such as when thc start to vaporize at. This is why you start low then go high until around 400f-435f depending on how accurate your vaporizer is. The reason why you get the body stone with higher temperature is because more thc and other thc is released and some goes to the lymphatic system because thc does goes to the lymphatic system although not as efficient as cbd and carophyllene which is why eating cannabis with a good fat is more of an affect, the monounsaturated fat goes to the lymphatic system through the gut which has the highest amount of entrances to the lymphatic system.
It is well know that the temperature the extreme shows is not the accurate temperature all the time and the vhw doesn't show temperature show that doesn't count. Volcano states on there site that the classic fluctuates up and down 9 degrees Fahrenheit.
Aromed is such a good vaporizer that it can be insured in Europe and they work with physicians and in fact has done studies with it so I wouldn't call them or their site a joke.
Dr.Hornby's temperature experiment:
http://www.treatingyourself.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=35191
"We can see from our before and after sample, that CBN is virtually all gone at setting 6, leaving
only residual amounts. The THC, however, all remains at this setting. As does the CBD.
At setting 7.5 the THC is fully de-carboxylated, but still present to roughly 95% of its original value.
Interestingly, at this setting the CBD is only half de-carboxylated.
At setting 9, all three are fully de-carboxylated and have moved to the vapor state.
A small amount of CBD remains as does some THC.
We can conclude from these very preliminary experiments that with the Volcano at setting
6 all the CBN is gone along with the more volatile terpenes and aromatics. Yet at this
setting, although the THC and CBD are being activated they have still not received enough heat
to enter the vapor state. In addition, at setting 7.5, similar conditions hold, with the THC still
not evaporated. It's only at setting 9 that THC receives sufficient energy to become volatile."
T
Truthman
I also wanted to state that I think a lot of people are using way more cannabis than they need to do because they vape at such low temperatures that they don't release as much as they can if they went higher in increments due to no degradation and more extraction. I think what is happening is that they are lowering their tolerance as time goes on due to not getting as much thc as they can and when they raise the temperature they take in so much thc that it is too much for their nervous system and gets them stoned. It's not because of cbd because a lot of strains are not that high in cbd and they don't go high enough to release beta-carophyllene which vaporizes efficiently at around 465f.
When done right you only need around .01-.05 grams to be blasted.
When done right you only need around .01-.05 grams to be blasted.
blank85
Member
when it's done ... there will be no Cloud before it's time. Check on fuckcombustion.com for details.
thanks! it seems there's always one last design gotcha to overcome before it can become a real product --- but i think i'm really close now --- i see a path forward but i need to do a little more prototyping to make sure this last bit (design of the battery case) works okay.
G
guest8905
has anybody tried the vapir n02
i am gonna get one in a few weeks, ill post a review
i am gonna get one in a few weeks, ill post a review
G
guest8905
well I just got one yesterday...the vapir NO2
first off the reviews of this thing were good to great.
I give it so far a 8.5 out of 10. With volcano getting a 9. So its not bad at all
works great, fast, efficient....very efficient
taste is all there
overall I give this a great reccomendation for a portable vape you can use anywhere
oh and the battery (rechargable) ran all day today on one single charge...about 5 or 6 sessions
first off the reviews of this thing were good to great.
I give it so far a 8.5 out of 10. With volcano getting a 9. So its not bad at all
works great, fast, efficient....very efficient
taste is all there
overall I give this a great reccomendation for a portable vape you can use anywhere
oh and the battery (rechargable) ran all day today on one single charge...about 5 or 6 sessions
Iv just started vapour bonging and think its the best stoner experience iv had. Some one said that it dont work so good on the volcano which is the vape that I have, yet I think it works great hooked up to my RooR bong. So truthman your saying that it is best to start vaping at 200. ?
T
Truthman
No, I'm stating it's best to start at a much lower temperature around 335f or lower if you have time because this preserves the essential oils that give the taste of the herb and adds to the high as well as prevent them from burning which causes tars and carcinogenic substances to be made. This is really important if you want all the health benefits from vaporizing. Slowly raise the temperature until you get to 410f or you can go higher if you want more of the immune system enhancing cannabinoids but to get most if not all of the thc you need to get to at least 392f. Just because you don't have a good taste doesn't mean that the bowl is done because thc is odorless meaning you can't taste it and the green turning brown is just chlorophyll being broken down from the high heat.
You can still get thc to be released at lower temperatures but it won't be as much and as quick as if you raised the temperature at least if using a precise temperature vaporizer like the volcano digital or aromed or using techniques to lower the atmospheric pressure inside the bowl like grinding to a fine, almost powder and spreading evenly which allows substances to be released at lower than normal temperatures which is why I think using whips or vapor bonging is more effective than using bags because the suction will lower the pressure while using a bag won't really do that but packing the bowl like I stated will still do a little something. This technique is one of the reasons why the vapexhale is so good at vaping at low temperatures, the ezbowl allows this method to be done easily.
The water is also another reason why bongs are good for vaporizing. It helps you keep your inhalation consistent as well filter particulate matter and moisturize some of the saponins that irritate the respiratory system due to them taking some moisture away from your lungs if the herb/hash was dry. This is what the lung burn is. It also helps your lungs do it's job by pulling more air than you would normally do because it is heavier than air but not so heavy that YOU can't pull it with your lung power. The bubbles are little pulls that the water help you get. It's hard to explain it but it's basically becoming a second lung. Look at it as a pulley system. Diffusion enhances this process. The bong also helps you take in deep inhalations which takes the vapor deep into the lungs so you can hold more vapor while the suction forced more blood to the lungs for more absorption and this gives a much stronger high that just inhaling to fill up the upper portion of the lungs. The only thing is the water takes away some of the taste and the more water you use the slower you need to inhale but you get more vapor faster this is why adding more water should be done when all the flavor has left the bud and you want to get the thc and other cannabinoids out.
Using something like the iolite will release the thc but at a slower rate because even though the air temperature is around 374f the herb is still being heated while sitting on the hot aluminum and plant fibers hold heat so it will be hot enough to release the thc off the plant. It's sort of like leaving a frozen pizza in an oven that's set at 375f for an hour. The pizza will burn due to the moisture being evaporated and the tray holding heat consistently heating the pizza. The iolite works in the exact same way but it also adds convection to it so the process can happen faster due to hot air going through and around the herb but it won't happen faster than using exact temperatures.
Thanks allot for that truthman, I wanted to know why I felt higher vaping through a bong I knew I wasn't imagining it lol. It seems to me that a vape session isn't something that can be rushed I start at higher temps like 195c so that the session finishes quicker I shall start lower and take my time next session. Cheers Clive.
T
Truthman
No problem. I forgot to mention that if a bong isn't around you can cough(do a strong cough) before you inhale to bring more blood to the lungs for more vapor absorption. Also inhale some fresh air after you fill the lungs 80% to force all of the vapor deep into the lungs, hold for as long as you want and SLOWLY exhale.
Hi Truthman just wanted to say that I tried the temps you gave me on my vape and they worked an absolute treat. When I first bought the volcano digit I thought it would make my weed go further but it never really did until you gave me those new temps, now I understand when people say that vaping makes you weed go twice as far. Just out of curiosity Truthman how many bongs does it take you to feel high form vapor bonging. ? Thanks allot Clive.
