What does the word outsourcing mean to you?

[CrumpleZone]

Outsourcing is the corporate equivalent of bargain hunting. If a corporation finds out that it can close down it's United States manufacturing facilities, and re-open them in China and save 40 percent on it's costs, they are gonna do it.

This is the the same mentality that has you shopping for tube socks at Wal-Mart instead of the men's store on Main St. which, incidentally, is going out of business soon.

How can we expect corporations to continue doing business in the US when the price of doing business here is prohibitive? Who should we blame? Unions? Government? Capitalism? What's the difference. It is happening. The question is what in the world can be done to change the situation.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I'm not sure the answer lies in blame but we're defenseless when we ignore history. We also need balance. We've had too much movement to the right, the most poor per capita since the 1920s and the rich have enough cash to keep things the way they are.

 

[Classy@Home]

Let's outsource the polits and CEOs that vote to outsource...

Walmart could save a shit load of $$$ by paying Chinese to be on their board of directors, and Canadian polits could be replaced by Indo/Pako folks who'd work for a ton less $$$ than already being paid.

Golden pension w/ indexing? Cheaper to pay in rupees, w/ no pension. Ceo sends jobs to Mexico? Hire Mexican ceo that lives IN Mexico, pay HIM 1/10th of fukall...

Think they'd be so quick to can the N. American worker, if their jobs could go too?

 

[pearlemae]

Outsourcing is now being replace but the new and latest gimmick that the corporate minds of greed have come up with. It's called insourcing what the hell? you say. Its prison labor, brought to you by prisons for profit. The new move is to insource manufacturing and call centers operated with prison labor. No minimum wages! no health insurance, or any other kind of benefit. Google it. Oregon has a law making prison labor mandatory and they make blue jeans among other things.

 

[CrumpleZone]

Insourcing?

Insourcing?

I have never heard the word used in the way you define it. Could you be confusing the word Insourcing with the word Slavery?

The definition you give sounds suspiciously like slavery to me. Indentured servitude, maybe?

Capitalism is all about finding an underclass and exploiting it. Prisoners are the only politically viable underclass we have available for exploitation any more. Those incarcerated for more than a year can't even vote. "Fuck 'em" say the politicians, the private prison owners and shareholders.

 

[SpasticGramps]

It means goodbye middle class and we get to be a third world country. Coming soon....

 

[Greensub]

Outsourcing is the corporate equivalent of bargain hunting. If a corporation finds out that it can close down it's United States manufacturing facilities, and re-open them in China and save 40 percent on it's costs, they are gonna do it.

This is the the same mentality that has you shopping for tube socks at Wal-Mart instead of the men's store on Main St. which, incidentally, is going out of business soon.

How can we expect corporations to continue doing business in the US when the price of doing business here is prohibitive? Who should we blame? Unions? Government? Capitalism? What's the difference. It is happening. The question is what in the world can be done to change the situation.

It's interesting that you mention the figure 40%... That's the % I recently saw as the amount by which the Chinese government manipulates their currency to be undervalued by.

When I think of outsourcing I think of tax breaks to corporations who do so by us. We essentially pay money to companies to employ other countries citizen's (thanks big business).

Back to the 40% figure... It's NOT just cheap labor! I used to be involved in the wire & cable business, you run a wire factory with about 3 guys... the WHOLE factory, commodities (copper/silver... etc... raw materials) are the SAME price. The same wire that sells for about $200 from china costs almost $700 from here.

IT'S FREE TRADE!!! (or rather it's non-free trade as the case is)

See... we've become all whoopee! Freee Trade! Yahoo! here in the states (even the democrats... Bill Clinton, who I do like... and he admits it was a mistake now). While the Chinese are all BWAAHAHAHA!!! Let's undervalue our currency so all are products are dirt cheap and put the mom & pop shops (in this case the USA) out of business.

So... we're just paying money for big business & china to bend us over and have their way with us (no lube).

 

[D.S. Toker. MD]

Outsourcing is the act of choosing profit and wealth over and above patriotism and national loyalty. Outsourcers dont care about the well being of their communities or their nation. Nor do they care about the mistreatment and exploitation of the poor people and children in other countries being forced to work a 72 hr work week for 85 cents per hr. with no protections or benefits

Money, money, money,money. Outsourcers worship money above patriotism, benevolence, fairness, morality or any other consideration. Greed and exploitation are the foundations of outsourcing.

In Obama's recent tax cut bill are huge tax incentives for the financial and insurance industries to outsource. They willl recieve a tax credit for the entire cost of outsourcing and a significant tax reduction on profits brought back into the US. It raises taxes on those making less than 40,000 per year.

 

[ibjamming]

Outsourcing is the corporate equivalent of bargain hunting. If a corporation finds out that it can close down it's United States manufacturing facilities, and re-open them in China and save 40 percent on it's costs, they are gonna do it.

This is the the same mentality that has you shopping for tube socks at Wal-Mart instead of the men's store on Main St. which, incidentally, is going out of business soon.

How can we expect corporations to continue doing business in the US when the price of doing business here is prohibitive? Who should we blame? Unions? Government? Capitalism? What's the difference. It is happening. The question is what in the world can be done to change the situation.

Yup...make it cheaper if you want them to stay.

I'm not sure the answer lies in blame but we're defenseless when we ignore history. We also need balance. We've had too much movement to the right, the most poor per capita since the 1920s and the rich have enough cash to keep things the way they are.

What history? You mean the lies the winners tell?

Too much to the RIGHT??? Are you kidding me? Entitlements are half or more of the federal budget!!! We're WAY to far left! Government shouldn't be doing 90% of what they do. We have the most poor...because we don't EXPECT a thing fro people...what do you expect? Who WANTS to work hard when they can get a fee lunch without doing a thing? We have 99 week unemployment!

Sure, the rich have money...it's time the poor EARNED some themselves!

Outsourcing is the act of choosing profit and wealth over and above patriotism and national loyalty. Outsourcers dont care about the well being of their communities or their nation. Nor do they care about the mistreatment and exploitation of the poor people and children in other countries being forced to work a 72 hr work week for 85 cents per hr. with no protections or benefits

Money, money, money,money. Outsourcers worship money above patriotism, benevolence, fairness, morality or any other consideration. Greed and exploitation are the foundations of outsourcing.

In Obama's recent tax cut bill are huge tax incentives for the financial and insurance industries to outsource. They willl recieve a tax credit for the entire cost of outsourcing and a significant tax reduction on profits brought back into the US. It raises taxes on those making less than 40,000 per year.

Multinationals have no loyalty...why should they. In fact THEY are the ones pushing for the "one global government"...they want a level playing field and the same rules everywhere.

The huge tax incentives are there so they SURVIVE. When people stopped paying their mortgages...the banks got fucked up! The government is in essence...making the deadbeats mortgage payments...keeping the system moving.

Outsourcing was the natural effect of too high a tax rate and people expecting to be paid too much.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

What history? You mean the lies the winners tell?

You get 'em, Glen. Let's see, "the lies winners tell". Since income disparity is greater than the 1932 depression, I'd say the winners are the top 2%.

You may think they're liers, I just think they're greedy.

Lets take a look at your lies.

Government shouldn't be doing 90% of what they do.

How exactly would you give massive tax breaks to the rich worth hundreds of billions? How would you preempt 2 trillion dollar global war? How would you manage a 750 billion dollar bank bailout, 800 billion unfunded medical benefits, (I could go on) with one dollar in ten?

You wouldn't, you'd watch the deficit balloon and say something like Darth Cheney, "deficits don't matter".

As long as it's for tax cuts and war, you could care less how big that debt gets. We spend nearly as much as the rest of the world on our defense and preemptive war.

How much war spending is enough for you, 2x... how about 3x? Maybe well need to preemptively attack the entire world some day?

We have the most poor...because we don't EXPECT a thing fro people...what do you expect? Who WANTS to work hard when they can get a fee lunch without doing a thing? We have 99 week unemployment!

Yep, I've got a job but I'd be much better off on unemployment. That way...

I could make about 60% of what I made 11 months previous.

I could pay 100% of my health care.

I could wave goodbye to paid sick leave and paid vacation.

I couldn't contribute to my 401k or my pension.

I think I'll do like IBJ suggests. I'll get laid off and join the largest demographic ("We have the most poor")

I might lose everything I listed above but I'll get a free lunch.

US business is sitting on close to two trillion dollars and won't hire , most money they've ever accumulated and won't hire. (More of your winners?)

Sure, the rich have money...it's time the poor EARNED some themselves!

Yep, they've got so much we had to bail 'em out in '08. Somebody's gonna have to bail out your poor debating skills.

Multinationals have no loyalty...why should they. In fact THEY are the ones pushing for the "one global government"...they want a level playing field and the same rules everywhere.

Now that would be real disaster. Imagine if China didn't devaluate their currency. Imagine what we'd be in for if products from China cost as much or nearly as much as domestic?

I imagine you sitting their listening to Alex Jones. While our trade negotiators fail at their jobs because countries like China flout trade agreements, ol' Alex is paranoid about NWO. You too.

The huge tax incentives are there so they SURVIVE.

Yep, forget we were the arsenal of democracy, the world's leading manufacturer, the world's greatest economy, most innovative, most productive, (I could go on)...

...with a top tax rate of 91%.

When people stopped paying their mortgages...the banks got fucked up! The government is in essence...making the deadbeats mortgage payments...keeping the system moving.

Please buy a subscription to a newspaper. Fox and Alex are rotting your brain.

Outsourcing was the natural effect of too high a tax rate and people expecting to be paid too much.

35% income, 15% capital gains...

but if I make enough, I don't pay one dime. If I make even more, I can get back millions and keep the same dime to pinch.

 

[ibjamming]

You get 'em, Glen. Let's see, "the lies winners tell". Since income disparity is greater than the 1932 depression, I'd say the winners are the top 2%.

You may think they're liers, I just think they're greedy.

Lets take a look at your lies.

How exactly would you give massive tax breaks to the rich worth hundreds of billions? How would you preempt 2 trillion dollar global war? How would you manage a 750 billion dollar bank bailout, 800 billion unfunded medical benefits, (I could go on) with one dollar in ten?

You wouldn't, you'd watch the deficit balloon and say something like Darth Cheney, "deficits don't matter".

As long as it's for tax cuts and war, you could care less how big that debt gets. We spend nearly as much as the rest of the world on our defense and preemptive war.

How much war spending is enough for you, 2x... how about 3x? Maybe well need to preemptively attack the entire world some day?

Yep, I've got a job but I'd be much better off on unemployment. That way...

I could make about 60% of what I made 11 months previous.

I could pay 100% of my health care.

I could wave goodbye to paid sick leave and paid vacation.

I couldn't contribute to my 401k or my pension.

I think I'll do like IBJ suggests. I'll get laid off and join the largest demographic ("We have the most poor")

I might lose everything I listed above but I'll get a free lunch.

US business is sitting on close to two trillion dollars and won't hire , most money they've ever accumulated and won't hire. (More of your winners?)

Yep, they've got so much we had to bail 'em out in '08. Somebody's gonna have to bail out your poor debating skills.

Now that would be real disaster. Imagine if China didn't devaluate their currency. Imagine what we'd be in for if products from China cost as much or nearly as much as domestic?

I imagine you sitting their listening to Alex Jones. While our trade negotiators fail at their jobs because countries like China flout trade agreements, ol' Alex is paranoid about NWO. You too.

Yep, forget we were the arsenal of democracy, the world's leading manufacturer, the world's greatest economy, most innovative, most productive, (I could go on)...

...with a top tax rate of 91%.

Please buy a subscription to a newspaper. Fox and Alex are rotting your brain.

35% income, 15% capital gains...

but if I make enough, I don't pay one dime. If I make even more, I can get back millions and keep the same dime to pinch.

They're greedy liars...did I ever say I was on their side?

I wouldn't give them tax breaks...I wouldn't have started the war, I wouldn't bail out the banks, fund medicare...you see I SAID "government shouldn't be doing 90% of the things they do. I'll ADD to that...welfare, unemployment, free education. Let ME take care of myself. You are responsible for YOU...I'm not!

The rest is mindless drivel because you don't like me personally I guess...

Wake up! Your a government drone...

Oh...I can't stand Glen Beck...he's just as corrupt up as the rest of them. He wants a Christian Taliban here in America...no thanks.

My opinions are MY opinions...I get ideas from others...but NEVER rely completely on another's interpretation.

Incredible how strong the conditioning can be!

Edit:

One more thing... China?!? China is your bastion of everything right? Censorship, one child limit, 90% of the population VERY (like $2 a day) poor...China couldn't get any buyers for their 3 month treasury auction last week! China is steps away from the PIIGS...familiar with them? Portugal, Italy, Ireland, Greece, and Spain...soon to be added Belgium and others... EVERYONE is going bankrupt...slowly...steadily... I just hope to God that Bernake is RIGHT! Otherwise it's a global depression the likes of which ONLY God has seen!

Don't work so hard...the truth is out there you just have to figure it out...make time for it. NOBODY is going to tell you the straight scoop. That's something ONLY you can do.

Did you see the POMO schedule after someone called "bullshit" in another thread? The Federal Reserve...right now, today in fact...is busy buying up treasury bonds in a deal where the banks have to invest the money...including stocks. That's the ONLY reason you're starting to see "credit" ads on TV again...getting credit card applications again. They've SAID IT. Their goal is to print us out of a global depression. Everything else is fluff...a distraction.

Like the other things I bring up...who knows the right or wrong of it...I just want people to know the truth...what's really going on...how it really works...to the BEST of my knowledge.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I got your PM, ibj. I guess you can't see my posts but I can still see yours.

They're greedy liars...did I ever say I was on their side?

I would assume you're talking about Beck and Jones. So now, everybody lies except you?

I wouldn't give them tax breaks...I wouldn't have started the war, I wouldn't bail out the banks, fund medicare...you see I SAID "government shouldn't be doing 90% of the things they do. I'll ADD to that...welfare, unemployment, free education. Let ME take care of myself. You are responsible for YOU...I'm not!

You don't take care of me, ibj. My state gets less than they give. Check your state. If you get back more from the feds than you give, I'm partly responsible for you!

I'd like to see you pay for everything out of pocket. That's what peeps did in the 20s but you say it's a lie. My pop was born in 1924 and his dad 1882. My other gramps was born in 1901. All three like to laugh, they'd get a belly full reading your comments.

The rest is mindless drivel because you don't like me personally I guess...

Wake up! Your a government drone...

I neither like nor dislike you. You're disgruntled.

Wake up! You're misinformed...

Oh...I can't stand Glen Beck...he's just as corrupt up as the rest of them. He wants a Christian Taliban here in America...no thanks.

Glen Beck wants money, that's all. He could care less about the rage he foments with oversimplifications, subjective reasoning and plain old lies.

My opinions are MY opinions...I get ideas from others...but NEVER rely completely on another's interpretation.

Doesn't matter if the interpretation is more educated, professional and objective than yourself?

Incredible how strong the conditioning can be!

On that note I would agree, you seem to be indoctrinated.

One more thing... China?!? China is your bastion of everything right? Censorship, one child limit, 90% of the population VERY (like $2 a day) poor...China couldn't get any buyers for their 3 month treasury auction last week!

And we owe them a tril.

China is steps away from the PIIGS...familiar with them? Portugal, Italy, Ireland, Greece, and Spain...soon to be added Belgium and others... EVERYONE is going bankrupt...slowly...steadily... I just hope to God that Bernake is RIGHT! Otherwise it's a global depression the likes of which ONLY God has seen!

We've already seen world depression, bro. Remember your so-called "lies" of the 1920s, 1930s and 1940s? I didn't know God was depressed but it's not surprising.

Don't work so hard...the truth is out there you just have to figure it out...make time for it. NOBODY is going to tell you the straight scoop. That's something ONLY you can do.

Well, we're certainly not going to get the straight scoop from whoever you're listening to.

Did you see the POMO schedule after someone called "bullshit" in another thread? The Federal Reserve...right now, today in fact...is busy buying up treasury bonds in a deal where the banks have to invest the money...including stocks. That's the ONLY reason you're starting to see "credit" ads on TV again...getting credit card applications again. They've SAID IT. Their goal is to print us out of a global depression. Everything else is fluff...a distraction.

If you're interested in what the fed is doing, check out Dylan Ratigan.

Like the other things I bring up...who knows the right or wrong of it...I just want people to know the truth...what's really going on...how it really works...to the BEST of my knowledge.

All you post is misinterpretations of what takes place. Your solutions are talking point generalizations from Frank Luntz, parroted by Beck and Jones et al.


Can we go back to the subject? Political generalizations aren't welcome at IC.

 

[Greensub]

It seems to me that I see a correlation in some peoples arguments here. A lot of people complain that government is too big and at the same time espouse that all politicians are on the take from business. (not that I disagree with that)

Why aren't the same people saying that businesses are too big? Big multinationals are responsible for most of the outsourcing I believe (I don't know that for sure, but it seems plausible), we've let them grow bigger than countries in some ways.

Whatever happened to the Sherman Anti-trust act? Was it Reagan? Or the courts?

(I'll second the Dylan Ratigan plug - he's good)

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I'm all for big business. I'm all for government big enough to reign em in when needed. When history shows we've already reeled em in, then gave em slack, they almost dragged us off the cliff again. For these and more instances, don't let the crooks write the bills. Politicians have to compete with money to be reelected. Competition means they have to spend too much of their time campaigning. So business sends in lobbies, writes bills offered as substitute and contributes to the campaigns of lawmakers who vote yes.

We can fix the system but we can't fix people. We'll always elements of corruption in business and in government. We have to address these individuals with fines and prison. When wholesale corruption takes place, we have to address the fallout and solution. We can't get rid of government any more than we can get rid of commerce. It's a balance, best for everybody when both work together.

 

[Greensub]

I'm all for big business. I'm all for government big enough to reign em in when needed. When history shows we've already reeled em in, then gave em slack, they almost dragged us off the cliff again. For these and more instances, don't let the crooks write the bills. Politicians have to compete with money to be reelected. Competition means they have to spend too much of their time campaigning. So business sends in lobbies, writes bills offered as substitute and contributes to the campaigns of lawmakers who vote yes.

We can fix the system but we can't fix people. We'll always elements of corruption in business and in government. When wholesale corruption takes place, we have to address the fallout and solution. We can get rid of government no more than we can get rid of commerce. It's a balance.

Ya... I didn't necessarily want to veer off to election finance reform in this thread though. I almost brought up citizen's united earlier as an example of businesses being too big also (although I guess it's really a complaint that they aren't human and shouldn't have those rights)

 

[HighDesertJoe]

Here's what I do when I call a company and get a call center in a foreign country.

I don't even say Hello I tell them I need to speak to someone in America," sure they try to say well I can help you what's the problem?" and I say " I can't understand you I need someone in America Please, we usually go round and round but they'll pass you on.

But you have to be careful cause I have had them pass me on to a better English speaking person and so then I'll ask them where they are located?, then I ask them a questions about that area this catches them every time...I always only speak to Americans or Canadians there not so bad..

 

[SpasticGramps]

The state is supposed to balance the power of big business. However, when big business becomes the state the system must be scrapped and reborn. We're at that point IMO. I'm normally an optimist, but I don't see a workable solution within the current system we have.

We are way too corrupted at this point. Been that way since the inception of the FED IMO. In the military they call this situation FUBAR.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

I agree with much of your concern, Gramps. I'm not sure the current system can be fixed. But we've been at (maybe over) the brink before. That doesn't mean we'll take the right path or have the right decision makers in place. With any luck, maybe we can back away from the edge if we can't right the ship altogether.

I'm watching Glen Beck show us the way right now.

 

[Greensub]

I'm watching Glen Beck show us the way right now.

Amen! HAHAHAHAHA!!!

What's up with him lately... is it political commentary or the old time gospel hour?

 

[SpasticGramps]

I know I probably sound a lot like him, but I can't stand that POS. I can't even watch MSM anymore. CNBC and Bloomberg is about all I watch anymore.