Tutorial Organics for Beginners
- Thread starter BurnOne
- Start date
Calcium. So what would the gurus suggest as a quick foliar and soil application for added calcium?
We have lots of options in farming for quick calcium, few if none are organic.
For soil, the only thing I can think of off the top of my head would be a bit of gypsum in the water. What else could one use? Foliar?
We have lots of options in farming for quick calcium, few if none are organic.
For soil, the only thing I can think of off the top of my head would be a bit of gypsum in the water. What else could one use? Foliar?
V
vonforne
Compost tea made with EWC is what I would use. It is usually about 8 % calcium if I remember correctly.
or a slurry made with EWC and top dressed.
C
M
mugenbao
Assuming that you have a $0 budget (yes, seriously) but do have epsom salts and dolomite on hand, and you know that your soil is under-limed, is there a good way to address the lack of dolomite in the soil that won't take a month or more to become effective?
FWIW, I do have another batch of soil properly mixed with adequate ammendments and ready for the next cycle, but do not have any larger pots that could be used to up-pot, and don't know if that would be effective anyways with only approximately four weeks to go. I'm not seeing any dramatic signs of problems yet, but it bothers me knowing that I messed up.
FWIW, I do have another batch of soil properly mixed with adequate ammendments and ready for the next cycle, but do not have any larger pots that could be used to up-pot, and don't know if that would be effective anyways with only approximately four weeks to go. I'm not seeing any dramatic signs of problems yet, but it bothers me knowing that I messed up.
V
vonforne
0 € budget......that is me!!
just 4 weeks.......I would not worry. Just get it right the next round.
V
Interesting. I always look at my ewc tea as a sort of tonic for the soil. Didn't know it had calcium infused in that worm shit too!
After playing around here for the last year or so, I'm going to start using some products that I regularly use on the grapes for my hobby too.
So next is humic acid that we buy in larger quantities. Below is the label.
It's 5% humic with a bit of potash.
Any suggestions as to rate per gallon on the humic? Probably just under the rate for store bought humic products is my guess.
I'm sure CC knows the answer.
So next is humic acid that we buy in larger quantities. Below is the label.
It's 5% humic with a bit of potash.
Any suggestions as to rate per gallon on the humic? Probably just under the rate for store bought humic products is my guess.
I'm sure CC knows the answer.
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grapeman
In the process of moving material through the worm's digestive system, the castings are literally covered with a slime that contains Calcium Carbonate (CaCO3) - it's the worm that 'carbon-ates' the castings.
Strong viable Calcium profile - a point often missed in discussing EWC in general.
HTH
CC
V
vonforne
Hard to imaging one simple organism is so important.
grapeman- look at an analysis of castings......you will be amazed.
V
M
mugenbao
Wow. Inspired by this thread, I did just that. There's obviously going to be a lot of variation that's dependent on the inputs, but of four analysis summaries I looked at, calcium was on average 2.3% (pretty high in relation to everything else).
ICMag's organics forum has inspired me to start my own worm bin recently, and it's stuff like this that gets me more excited each time I read about it
V
vonforne
Watered twice with EWC teas. It didn't seem to hurt, but also didn't slow down the speed the leaves yellow. Anything else I should try or should I just keep hitting it with teas?
What strain are you running? And I think if it is not strain related then those stems are might purple.
Keep giving them EWC and you might make a slurry and pour onto the soil surface and then scratch it in.
V
V
vonforne
Some observations using my organic soils.
I have come to several conclusions that may or may not jive with the gurus here.
1. Growing with the organic soils (or variants) herein could not be easier. I have been an absentee hobby grower since july and leaving directions for my underpaid helper could not be simpler.
2. Fresh air (as always) is critical. Although difficult for me to obtain in the hottest months, I have no desire to implement a closed co2 system. It's just not that important to me even though I can obviously see a decrease in yield/quality during these months. Now that fall is here, I can bring in outside air and all the plants are visually happier (hard to bring in outside air when the ambient air temps are over 100 degrees F until 10pm).
3. I've needed to re-think my lighting system. With a proper hydro grow, I was able to lower my lights to increase the usable radiation to max out growth. With organic soil, it seems when similarly pushed, deficiencies were easily observed. It just seems that the plants metabolism can not keep up with a very agressive lighting system when grown in soil. Once I raised my lights above where I maintained them in hydro, growth normalized and deficiencies disappeared and the end product was as good if not better then hydro.
4. I think Pro-Mix HP is a better base then Sunshine #4. Since making that change, I've noticed happier plants.
Tell me where I am wrong.
I have come to several conclusions that may or may not jive with the gurus here.
1. Growing with the organic soils (or variants) herein could not be easier. I have been an absentee hobby grower since july and leaving directions for my underpaid helper could not be simpler.
2. Fresh air (as always) is critical. Although difficult for me to obtain in the hottest months, I have no desire to implement a closed co2 system. It's just not that important to me even though I can obviously see a decrease in yield/quality during these months. Now that fall is here, I can bring in outside air and all the plants are visually happier (hard to bring in outside air when the ambient air temps are over 100 degrees F until 10pm).
3. I've needed to re-think my lighting system. With a proper hydro grow, I was able to lower my lights to increase the usable radiation to max out growth. With organic soil, it seems when similarly pushed, deficiencies were easily observed. It just seems that the plants metabolism can not keep up with a very agressive lighting system when grown in soil. Once I raised my lights above where I maintained them in hydro, growth normalized and deficiencies disappeared and the end product was as good if not better then hydro.
4. I think Pro-Mix HP is a better base then Sunshine #4. Since making that change, I've noticed happier plants.
Tell me where I am wrong.
grapeman
My experience is the very same on #1 & #2. I have no experience with hydro so I can't really comment on your observations other than to say that I found them interesting.
Pro-Mix is a very fine line of products and now that they're packing on the West Coast their pricing is inline with the overwhelming giant - Sun Gro Horticulture. Sun-Gro packs more peat in Canada than all of their competitors combined. Their dominance hasn't always benefitted their customers. That's the reason that I went with their 'organic' mix(es) for a long time. Look - all peat is 'organic' under any certifying agency. Same with pumice & perlite. Vermiculite is another story that doesn't need retelling here. But my point is that for sh*ts and grins - any 'blank soil' is going to be 'organic' - it's what you add to those blank soil bases that will be either organic or conventional.
But the reason that I went with their organic mixes was, in part, to take advantage of Oregon's rules on what is and what is not organic. When Sun Gro packs any of their organic mixes (including their Black Gold Organic Line), the mixing machines are required to be cleaned out completely before the 'organic' components are added to the hopper and this benefits the customer in that the quality control processes/standards are much stricter - not that any of the ingredients are any better (or worse) than their conventional lines. Sun Gro wanted a certified organic mix and they were wiling to pay the licensing fees and go through the certification process. Still - per cubic foot it's the same price as their conventional lines. Weird but telling.
MicrobeMan was kind enough to test out a straight Canadian Sphagnum peat moss called Alaska Peat with very good results! What separates this specific product from Pro-Mix Premier Peat or any of the Sun Gro straight peat products is this product is from a single source - northern Alberta whereas the other players have multiple production areas spread across several provinces. It runs about $12.50 for 3.8 cubic feet, compressed bales like the other commercial products. Sequoia Horticulture in Dinuba, California carries this product.
On another thread you mentioned using yucca extract as a wetting agent which is an outstanding choice. Sun Gro uses yucca extract as a wetting agent in their organic lines as well as some of their conventional mixes. Another good choice is aloe vera juice - get the pure stuff. It contains 5% saponins and 22 amino acids as well as the usual mineral and nutrient profile of most plant-based products. Trader Joe's carries 1 gallon jugs of this for $7.99 and I've been adding 2 oz. per gallon for irrigating. Just for your consideration or entertainment!
CC
I agree with all 4 points.
1. is why so many people use organics.
2. my summer months here are brutal and CO2 is too much of a PITA not to mention suspicious to wheel in the tanks.
3. Hydro usually makes alot more humidity in the room in the for of mist from right below the plant, my guess is the extra humidity helps them handles the extra heat, IMO lower humidity conditions make it more difficult for water uptake water and as suck nutrient uptake is affected (this is a guess).
My bubbler buckets could handlles the harsh environment of my passive air ventilated closet with a 400W much better.
4. I used both and Promix HP was the clear winner.
I must admit that when I do spray my plants (at least once a week or more often) I only use a surfactant when spraying neem or something important. I use (yikes - a non organic product) called "Pro 90". I have a ton on hand and have used this product, or a like product for years in my day job. I did recommend in the post you saw yucca extract to a guy looking for an organic spreader only because I read somewhere you used it and recommend it.
Question CC, do you use the aloe vera juice in your fertigation water when you water your plants? Why? Does it make irrigation more effective in a closed system such as a pot?
If so, I'll have to give that a try.
