Mosaic Virus in Cannabis pics

[vince514]

well albertine those pics of verticillium wilt look pretty messed up espcially the large tree with half of it burnt....wow..

but the veggies dont look bad their producing like crazy i have some yellowing/browning on the lower leaf's of the cucumbers but thier 6+ feet tall and their in 8Inch pots...lol
Advanced nutrients have a product called scorpion juice . it apparently helps with "systemic acquired resistance,viral inhibitor"
its supposed to give boosted resistance towards pathogens ,insects , stress and more......i might pick it up but this run is almost over so im gonna tear down and rebuild...hopefully have a clean room by then..


Olsmokey- "There is also Tom mosaic, cucumber mosaic, and alfalfa..plus Hemp streak, and they go to other plants...not all plants, but they do cross over...

OK, heres the good bit: from my reading the virus is unable to replicate outside the cell, but in the plant cell, the theory goes, the low calcium in the cell makes the virus proteins or summat repel each other, they burst away and infect the cell.."

makes sense but i give my plants barricade . "it increases cell wall stability and increases nutrient absorption and resistance to stress/drought" but as the run hits week 6 after stripping all the infected plant tissue and triple neem application things are balancing out but im still going to clean the place from top to bottom when things are done.....


funkervogt- it really sucks this stuff is on your plants but you gotta just keep going.. good idea removing the infected plants its better to be safe than sorry...



michaeljordan- well i had ph issues when i first started growing almost 10 years ago when i watered with straight tap water(i was a noob) but this dosen't look like ph issues to me how about you?


Love2herb- like i said i really never had this problem in the past i did hower run the gambit of problems , ph problems , toxicity issues , spider mites ,powdery mildew , heat stress , thrips , having to cut down everything and move with in 2 days due to rats(the people kind)......

I had alot of issues in the past 10 years but for the last 2 of them were pretty good , but now i need to clean up my act and set things right in my garden..... i'm going to be popping some new beans soon but i haven't decided what to pop....white russian or williams wonder??

thanks for everybody's posts and ideas its helpful to read about other people and thier issues and how their dealing with them...

 

[BagseedSamurai]

I really can't hold my tongue much longer on this issue. I see what the issue here is, and it gives a gardener every right to be paranoid but I think this has gone overboard. If you go simply by the pictures and warnings of the thread, I would estimate that over 90% of the plants we have all grown would be diagnosed with TMV (in error), ripped up and discarded. I am wondering how many people posting pictures of their supposed Mosaic infection have actually gone to a lab and had it tested, or even gotten a home test to see if their gardens are actually infected. Most of what I have seen while looking closely at the pictures on this thread are deficiencies, pests or something other than TMV that is usually curable or at least treatable.

So not only do I think a lot of posters here are misdiagnosing, but I think this thread itself is going to scare every new grower we get here into thinking their microdeficiency or pH foible is a case of Tobacco Mosaic in which they tear up and restart. I even got cought up in it, thinking my Applejack had it.

We need to look more clearly at this issue and focus on actual data that we have which, at this point, is very little. We have data on TMV and how it effects tomatos and tobacco and perhaps a few other plants, but species to species, a virus not only can change M.O. but probably has due to the irregularities in DNA. So what do we know? Not much, obviously, or we wouldn't have this mob mentality "zOMG TMV!" currently existing.

We know the virus exists, and can infect a variety of plantlife, including cannabis. We do not, however, understand the vectors enough to figure out how a cannabis plant might actually acquire the virus. This is plain from the idea that a plant can catch a virus from simple contact. Even smoking in the same room with cannabis is a vector, so says the thread. This is not the case. Normally, life on this planet carries defenses which help stop infections such as bacterium or virii. The most common and often most powerful defense is a simple "sheath" around the squishy parts that protect them from harm. In humans, we call this skin. Plants have similar defenses which indicate to me that simple contact with an infectious organism would not be enough for a plant, under normal conditions, to become infected. If this were the case, human beings could get AIDS from hugging. As we know, we cannot. I suggest a more accurate assessment that vectors must pierce these defenses somehow in order to become infectious. Plants do not have mucous membranes like we do, so I would say root mass is vulnerable under some conditions, and open wounds such as those caused by insects could invite an infection. Granted, direct contact may be a vector but there is evidence on this very thread of such things being tested and found wanting.

So does smoking around a cannabis plant give it TMV? Probably not. Not unless you are smoking around a mother you just took cuttings from. The reason why it is said not to smoke around them is the fact that the smoke is carcinogenic, and that it chokes stomata which would slow growth. I am a smoker, and every time I smoke a cigarette, I wash my hands. Mainly for cleanliness but also to keep from putting nicotine on my plants. If someone can successfully prove a vector as simply as tobacco smoke, I would like to see that and I think the cannabis community would do well with some real, solid data on this.

I don't know, I just think that this is blowing out of proportion. I swear if I see another fucking epidemic, I might check out. Haha..

 

[vince514]

^^^^^^^\

good rant BagseedSamurai .lol you carry a good point about the individual testing of the "infected plant/plants" ..i'd test my plants but at this point im so fuckin broke even the extra 50$ isn't an option as i previously mentioned in a previous post......i also never said that they indeed have Tmv but a "virus" that could of been cross contaminated from a veggie garden i have in back ......

you mentioned that alot of the pics you see are micro deficiencies? , it is quite possible that what i have is a micro def? im not cretain on that one my veg area would have the same symptoms merely for the fact that my bottle of micro feeds all the plants under my roof.........

you seem to know what your saying... its just there's just not enough data backing up many if not all claims of marijuana with TMV .. i certainly don't, i haven't done any testing and for that i cant be 100% sure but what i do know is i haven't ever had this shit before and its a little unnerving , espcially when your counting on those plants for financial assistance....

but for people to call it a epidemic is a little much...imho
all i know is that real good clean up around my parts will help out when this run is over..

 

[audioaddict]

Thanks for this, just spotted it now, I do think I have possibly been affected by this in the past and put it down to my novice growing skills.

I think I also have cucumber mosaic in my courgettes, which is completely irrelevant, but really annoying me so I thought I'd mention it!

 

[Adhokk]

Hey guys! I have some input, most of my 2 week old cuts (now rooted in rockwool) have their new growth "painted" with this bleached pattern. These cuts are along with my clones and mothers in my veg room.

No other plants in my veg room show the pattern, however all plants are suffering from a slight to moderate Cal deficiency (brown tips, and necrosis). My veg room is hand watered with a nutrient solution I prepare in a 5 gal plastic drum, and I only check the PH after I dose because it's used in ~2 days. I'll keep a close eye on the PH of the veg water from now on and dose with 25ml/5gal of calmag instead of 20ml/5gal.

The pics I attached show a 2 week old's leaves, both with the supposed mosaic virus and an odd bending to the fans of the leaf. Any cause for the bending? I'll update u guys with the proggression of my symptoms. BTW this is my first grow, so the nute thing is a nub mistake.




leaf is flat, no curling up, curves to the side.

 

[The_Grim_Reefer]

I'm not here to debate whether the mosaic virus affects cannabis or not, but i thought i'd just chime in with TMV is NOT spread in the smoke of burning tobacco.

http://www.ppath.cas.psu.edu/extens...owers/Tobacco Mosaic Virus in Greenhouses.pdf

Theres a paper from Pennsylvania State University on the topic of TMV, the sentence related to smoke is the third paragraph from the bottom on the first page, last line.

Another interesting part is "TMV diseases cannot be diagnosed on the basis of symptoms alone"

 

[vince514]

hey Adhokk
the pics you posted looks alot like cal-mag deficiency creeping its way through your plant..ive had strains before like jack herer that just craved more Ca-Mg than my other plants different plants require different attention sometimes......hope it corrects itself with your dosing of Cal_Mg....

--The_Grim_Reefer--

i've smoked cigs since i was a teenager and i've always smoked in my rooms while i was working ,i havent seen any transmission of that sort on any plants..as a previous member posted you'd pretty much have to bring infected tobacco leaves into the room itself for that to occur......

good read from those guys at penn state......
and your right tmv cannot be diagnosed just by symptoms ,testing needs to be done to be certain...

 

[buddyJesus]

had it once from spraying the plants with nicotine tea as a pesticide spray. As for smoking it, it is possible so just avoid it! plants accumulate carbon monoxide just like our heme does. differentiated from other problems by history. adding calmag doesn't help the problem if it is viral. It looks less damaging than it does on tobacco, but the same pattern.

hey Adhokk
the pics you posted looks alot like cal-mag deficiency creeping its way through your plant..ive had strains before like jack herer that just craved more Ca-Mg than my other plants different plants require different attention sometimes......hope it corrects itself with your dosing of Cal_Mg....

--The_Grim_Reefer--

i've smoked cigs since i was a teenager and i've always smoked in my rooms while i was working ,i havent seen any transmission of that sort on any plants..as a previous member posted you'd pretty much have to bring infected tobacco leaves into the room itself for that to occur......

good read from those guys at penn state......
and your right tmv cannot be diagnosed just by symptoms ,testing needs to be done to be certain...

 

[BagseedSamurai]

Also. Virii like TMV enter rna into the genetic code of the cell in order to replicate and in so doing, changed the dna of the cell. What this means is that if TMV is effecting cannabis in such a vast way, then every offspring seed or clone of lines infected will also be infected.

lol

 

[vince514]

had it once from spraying the plants with nicotine tea as a pesticide spray. As for smoking it, it is possible so just avoid it! plants accumulate carbon monoxide just like our heme does. differentiated from other problems by history. adding calmag doesn't help the problem if it is viral. It looks less damaging than it does on tobacco, but the same pattern.

if you sprayed your plants with infected tobacco then maybe its possible to get it that way....adhokk's pic looks like a cal-mg def he even mentioned he has that problem ......the only way we could for sure find out is through testing the infected plant tissue , with out that everyone's pretty much guessing


Bagseedsamurai--
Also. Virii like TMV enter rna into the genetic code of the cell in order to replicate and in so doing, changed the dna of the cell. What this means is that if TMV is effecting cannabis in such a vast way, then every offspring seed or clone of lines infected will also be infected.

for sure but didn't someone post that earlier???

 

[BagseedSamurai]

Bagseedsamurai--
Also. Virii like TMV enter rna into the genetic code of the cell in order to replicate and in so doing, changed the dna of the cell. What this means is that if TMV is effecting cannabis in such a vast way, then every offspring seed or clone of lines infected will also be infected.

for sure but didn't someone post that earlier???

Probably.

 

[Organnabis]

I have yet to hear of a case of TMV in cannabis, but from what I've read it sounds like CMV...and I'm probably wrong. TRSV (Tobacco Ringspot), TomRSV (Tomato ringspot), CMV (Cucmber Mosiac Virus) and TSV (Tobacco Streak) have all been proven to infect cannabis. I would say these are more likely the cause then TMV, for the simple fact it's never infected cannabis before, to my knowledge.

 

[rebelweed]

I have this in one plant, it shows basically all the different symptoms on different leaves. I think i got it from store-bought soil, I never saw it before i planted my mother in soil (took a new cutting from my original mom in hydro that became the new mom). All cuttings from the new mom now show the symptoms, to varying degrees.

The cuttings and the mother don't seem to mind much at all though, it grows as vigourously as before, with like 10% of the leaves affected.

I suggest that until we can actually establish what this is, call it for mosaic syndrome or hooked-leaf syndrome or something like that.

 

[Ganja baba]

this is an interesting thread , i have used systemic spray for powdery mildew , it worked 100% with no noticable bad effects to the strains of cannabis that were sprayed .

thing is , i also noticed , that after spraying the plants , they get even more healthy than before , all most like they had another unseen problem that i never really noticed , this thread make me think , there could be many virusus that are lurking around and our plants handle them ,

all i know is , all the mentioned effects of the viruses talked about in this thread all went away after spraying with the systemic spray , i dont have the slightly twisted leaf here and there , and in general one would not have thought any thing was wrong past the powdery mildew , but now i am convinced there were other baddies hidding in my plants ,

here is the type of spray i used , i did control tests and it worked well , this is not the exact bottle but they all ways change the packaging , not to be sprayed on flowering plants

http://www.comparestoreprices.co.uk...anded-westland-fungus-attack-rtu--1-litre.asp

 

[Bulldog501]

scary stuff
so your actually that if i fight spider mites with home brewed insect soap with nicotine from cigarettes and chili extract, than im then in danger og getting this virus from the tobacco extract ?

 

[DimeBag65]

Virus?

Virus?



for some reason i couldnt get the other picture i snapped in here, just wanted a few opinions on what you guys thought about this leaf on my ak47, it was started as a soilless plant, than gifted to me to put in the ground... it had extremely slow growth, blotchy leaves, and curves ... i dont know much about TMV or the other virus's, but this plant had some of the characteristics that were listed...

could be as simple as the ph was off for it, deficient on nutrients, or locked out, and or over fertilized(i used something i havnt worked with) either way the rest of the garden is healthy and looking great and this plant has been very slow and sick looking... thanks for your thoughts and opinions

 

[the_extremist]

According to this link, soaking seeds in a 10% solution of trisodium phosphate for 15 minutes will kill the virus. Food for thought. Not exactly an organic solution though, lol.

 

[oldog]

Good link Extreemist. I recommend that everyone read it.
(But not take it totally as the final word)
She talks about seed heat sterilization as well as the TSP solution.

I had always believed that there had to be a cut in the plant
(broken or cut off leaf, insect bites etc.) for the infection to enter.
She claims: "TMV is spread readily by touch. The virus can survive on clothing, in bits of plant debris for about two years, and can easily enter a new plant from a brief contact with a worker's contaminated hands "
I am sceptical.I posted on my huge infection and now I'm 15 weeks into a new grow with no infection. Good thing I didnt see this and burn all my clothes.

 

[the_extremist]

Well, again, what we may be experiencing in the cannabis growing world may not be TMV but some other virus. Who knows?

I'm dealing with this crap right now, burnt out lower buds and the crazy hook leaf too. I'm gonna shut down this winter and start new beans. I'm gonna try and set a few clones of my Jack the Ripper keeper in my dad's sauna and set it to 110*F and see if that fixes them. If so, I will be soooo happy because I really don't wanna lose the Pink Lemonade.

Does anyone know how long you need to expose a plant to 110* heat to effectively kill TMV?

 

[oldog]

That university lady was talking about 158 degrees for the
seed sterilization. 110 F is not very hot. I dont think you could
penetrate to the center of the main stalk ie completely overheat
and kill the virus everywhere in the plant, roots and all and not kill the plant at the same time.
Where did you hear that you could do that? Seeds maybe.
Nobody knows. Try it and see. I lost all my room to virus.
Thread here somewhere. Good luck.

Cheers