B.C. receives exemption to decriminalize possession of some illegal drugs for personal use

[Tynehead Tom]

@moose eater , thankyou for your posts.
While our viewpoints are different I certainly respect where you are coming from.
Let;s all hope that this plan of the government's works.
I pray it does, but I will remain a skeptic for now.

 

[moose eater]

So is there a safe supply aspect to this experiment?

In a quick search last night, there are at least 3 organizations in the Vancouver and Victoria British Columbia areas listed that test drug purity for free; no cost or risk to the person presenting the samples, from what I read, similar to 'Dance Safe,' but more broad in what they test, from the reading..

How many will use those services is another question.

When I was a youngster, there was Pharm Chem Laboratories, and the laws were not nearly as enlightened then. But people could place a sample of whatever substance they wished to be tested into an envelope or package, and make up their own 'code' or serial #/identifier of X number of letters and numbers, based on the instructions at the lab's phone recording, then call in after x amount of time and get a report.

Not sure of others use of that service, but the only time I/we contemplated using it was when there was already existing suspicions re. a substance's purity or content.

Marijuana kills ZERO people every year.

True, but not everyone can or will refrain from other substances, and not everyone can use cannabis.

As stated, laws criminalizing other substances have often had the opposite effect of what was intended. Markets become more lucrative, etc.

 

[moose eater]

Substance Drug Checking

Substance Drug Checking offers free, confidential drug checking at harm reduction agencies in Victoria BC; our team uses multiple instruments to determine a samples main active ingredients, fillers, or cutting agents, and the presence of Fentanyl.

substance.uvic.ca

Main Page - Get Your Drugs Tested

getyourdrugstested.com

Harm reduction | Vancouver Coastal Health

Keeping individuals and communities safe and healthy by preventing infections, illness and injury related to drug use and sexual practices.

www.vch.ca

And in the Toronto area:

Piloting and evaluating drug checking services in Toronto, Ontario - CDPE

cdpe.org

A 2022 report issued relative to drugs testing in BC:

https://drugcheckingbc.ca/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2022/07/BCCSU_Implementation_Guide_2022.pdf

and

Drug Checking

Drug Checking

www.bccsu.ca

A report from NIH re. similar:

Drug checking services for people who use drugs: a systematic review

Drug checking services provide people who use drugs with chemical analysis results of their drug samples while simultaneously monitoring the unregulated drug market. We sought to identify and synthesize literature on the following domains: (a) the influence ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Edit: My family member's clinic provides free Fentanyl test strips, as do other harm reduction orgs/clinics as well. Note that at the embedded link above, at the bottom of the list of testing orgs, it's reported that people who tested their substances and discovered traces of Fentanyl, (presumably primarily in re. to heroin testing, but Fentanyl can be found in all sorts of drugs today) were 10 times more likely to reduce their dosage. So I'd say this approach is having some degree of positive result.

And I was pleased to find that 'Dance Safe' is still out there keeping our kids safe at festivals, raves, concerts, etc. They've got history and courage!!

 

[Rider420]

So is there a safe supply aspect to this experiment?

Yes as I posted earlier the Federal government is moving ahead with a safe supply after decriminalization because NARCS still bust people and seize thier drugs when leaving the office where you get your safe supply from.
Already the Conservatives are fearmongering over safe supply for thier own political aspirations of winning the next election even if thousands of lives are at stake. Ya Republicans and Conservatives are the same shit just different nations.

Here is proof that Narcs like this guy would rather see users dead then allow them a safe drug supply.

Adam Zivo: The silencing of drug addiction experts who criticize 'safe supply'

B.C. professor says provincial government is censoring him

nationalpost.com

Anthony believes safe supply is poorly researched and “consigns the addict to be a slave forever,”

This fucking son of a bitch "NARC" would rather watch thousands die rather then let users have a safe supply becuase it might lead to more healthy users.

A total of 3,556 apparent opioid toxicity deaths occurred so far in 2022 (January – June). This is approximately 20 deaths per day. FYI 100 people die each day from tobacco use.

And the propaganda is just insane!

"He told me that at least 10 of his colleagues have privately messaged him to express similar concerns about the potential harms of flooding communities with free opioids."

 

[moose eater]

Yes as I posted earlier the Federal government is moving ahead with a safe supply after decriminalization because NARCS still bust people and seize thier drugs when leaving the office where you get your safe supply from.
Already the Conservatives are fearmongering over safe supply for thier own political aspirations of winning the next election even if thousands of lives are at stake. Ya Republicans and Conservatives are the same shit just different nations.

How are they implementing 'safe supply'? And are you, goingrey, and I all meaning the same thing when we refer to 'safe supply'?

Are you meaning that Health Canada is going to be providing gov-sourced synthesized clean drugs, such as occurred in Liverpool with heroin and coke, or something different?

 

[moose eater]

Yes as I posted earlier the Federal government is moving ahead with a safe supply after decriminalization because NARCS still bust people and seize thier drugs when leaving the office where you get your safe supply from.
Already the Conservatives are fearmongering over safe supply for thier own political aspirations of winning the next election even if thousands of lives are at stake. Ya Republicans and Conservatives are the same shit just different nations.

One reason for my question is that Fentanyl is now being found in all sorts of drugs, not just opiates; it's found in coke, meth/crank, counterfeit/home-pressed pills, etc.

 

[armedoldhippy]

moose eater - "and certainly not at twenty dollars a bulb."

bulbs for wifes car are between $80 & $135...

 

[armedoldhippy]

the date rape drugging at raves going on all too often via GHB

penalty for possession/selling these drugs should be equal to, if not greater than, the jail terms they hand out for forcible rape. JMHO it's like selling a gun to someone that you KNOW is going to shoot & kill somebody. put them both in the same jail cell & leave them there...

 

[RobFromTX]

Yes as I posted earlier the Federal government is moving ahead with a safe supply after decriminalization because NARCS still bust people and seize thier drugs when leaving the office where you get your safe supply from.
Already the Conservatives are fearmongering over safe supply for thier own political aspirations of winning the next election even if thousands of lives are at stake. Ya Republicans and Conservatives are the same shit just different nations.

If you could take a minute and please elaborate on who exactly these "Narcs" are? I mean are you referring to narcotics police units? I really need closure. I know im 40 now but when i was younger a Narc was that one douchebag at the music festival that was tipping off cops to drug transactions. Times have obviously changed. Please update me so i can be on the lookout for them

 

[moose eater]

One reason for my question is that Fentanyl is now being found in all sorts of drugs, not just opiates; it's found in coke, meth/crank, counterfeit/home-pressed pills, etc.

Based on my reading, it seems as though 'safe supply' in BC will amount to a prescribing-type of process, especially for drugs commonly regarded as illegal, for which the market has previously shown risk for contamination.

But again, these days, with the relatively inexpensive cost of Fentanyl on the black market, Fentanyl is being found in all sorts of drugs that most wouldn't think it belongs in, due to contradictory highs; coke and Fentanyl, as an example.

So for the Canadian Gov. to truly be providing for a 'safe supply', even via prescription processes, that, in theory, means providing a legal, clean source for nearly every substance that might currently contain Fentanyl on the street market, no?

That becomes pretty broad. And a bit mind-boggling.

 

[armedoldhippy]

If you could take a minute and please elaborate on who exactly these "Narcs" are?

pretty good question. he swings a wide brush at times...

 

[goingrey]

Years ago, with the date rape drugging at raves going on all too often via GHB, there were non-profits like 'Dance Safe'' and others who took some heat, but would set up at shows, raves, etc., and test ecstacy for purity for free to make sure folks weren't getting a mickey.

Are you sure this is true?

It is my understanding that the testing was to look for drugs like PMA which have ecstasy-like effects but are much more dangerous (several people have died taking doses that would be reasonable with MDMA).

It's certainly not true for GHB. There is only one report ever on drugsdata.org about GHB in a pill and they specifically say "GHB in tablet form is unlikely to have much effect since the maximum dose that a tablet can contain is around half the tablet mass, in this case around .1gram, a tenth of a minimum recreational dose".

 

[moose eater]

Are you sure this is true?

It is my understanding that the testing was to look for drugs like PMA which have ecstasy-like effects but are much more dangerous (several people have died taking doses that would be reasonable with MDMA).

It's certainly not true for GHB. There is only one report ever on drugsdata.org about GHB in a pill and they specifically say "GHB in tablet form is unlikely to have much effect since the maximum dose that a tablet can contain is around half the tablet mass, in this case around .1gram, a tenth of a minimum recreational dose".

You may be correct. Dance Safe was specifically testing for date-rape drugs and other contaminants at raves and events. Purity in general, back in the day.

Drug Checking | DanceSafe

Drug checking is a lifesaving tool that gives consumers more information about what they're putting in their bodies. DanceSafe sells reagents and test strips.

dancesafe.org

 

[moose eater]

Are you sure this is true?

It is my understanding that the testing was to look for drugs like PMA which have ecstasy-like effects but are much more dangerous (several people have died taking doses that would be reasonable with MDMA).

It's certainly not true for GHB. There is only one report ever on drugsdata.org about GHB in a pill and they specifically say "GHB in tablet form is unlikely to have much effect since the maximum dose that a tablet can contain is around half the tablet mass, in this case around .1gram, a tenth of a minimum recreational dose".

A quick search led to this, near the top of the results.

I can go back in and find better or more professional links. This was apparently from a project that Sutter Health did with youth.

Club and Date Rape Drugs | Sutter Health

Drug use at parties and other social situations is risky. Protect yourself from harm and possible sexual assault caused by club and date rape drugs.

www.sutterhealth.org

 

[moose eater]

Drug-Facilitated Sexual Assault | RAINN

In cases of drug-facilitated sexual assault, survivors often blame themselves. Remember—you are not to blame. You are the only one allowed to make choices for your body. Using drugs or alcohol is never an excuse for assault and does not mean that it was your fault.

www.rainn.org

Ecstasy (MDMA), methamphetamine, and date rape (drug-facilitated sexual assault): a consideration of the issues - PubMed

The term "date rape drug" has traditionally been applied by the media to powerful sedatives, such as gamma hydroxybutyrate (GHB) and flunitrazepam (Rohypnol), which can render a person unconscious and hence unable to resist and/or recall an assault. However, some law enforcement agents and...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Students Need to Be Aware of Drugs Used in Sexual Assault – Test Smartly Labs

With high school and college parties happening everywhere around the country and news stories about sexual assaults in the media, it's frightening to ...

testsmartlylabs.com

The next link my system states isn't secure, so be forewarned.... Have a good security system and firewall. I do, but I don't enter any vulnerable information when at such a site, either. In and out. Quickly

Facts about Date-Rape Drugs

There's lots more links to view/confirm, so you may or may not wish to go to the 'unsecure' link above this.

 

[moose eater]

Again, and unrelated to the question, turning back the clock to yesteryear, many of these programs, whether needle exchanges or drug testing outfits, that worked on-site at events, in the barrios or ghettos, etc., and tested folks' drugs, or gave out clean needles, took -lots- of heat back then; harassment, arrest, physical abuse, etc., for being seen as facilitating illicit drug use, rather than keeping people safe, especially our kids.

Mobile needle-exchangers in places like Rhode Island and Baltimore sometimes would be arrested, have their clients followed home and busted, and more.

We've come a LONG way now. And it's really quite an emotional thing for some of us. Really. Many of these folks were heroes in their time, and still are.

 

[goingrey]

The only date rape drug testing I'm aware of are tests that let you test if your drink has been spiked with another sedative in addition to alcohol. And that makes sense.

But how would it work the other way, if you are doing the drugs on purpose? Do they test if your GHB has been spiked with alcohol? Well actually maybe that's not a bad idea!

Or the disinhibition and sexual arousal from drugs.. Testing that your meth is meth won't remove that quality. It's more an education thing were people need to be aware of what kind of effects the drugs they are taking have, and what kind of company to take them in. And not letting your drugged out friends run off to do something they'll regret, maybe..

 

[moose eater]

The only date rape drug testing I'm aware of are tests that let you test if your drink has been spiked with another sedative in addition to alcohol. And that makes sense.

But how would it work the other way, if you are doing the drugs on purpose? Do they test if your GHB has been spiked with alcohol? Well actually maybe that's not a bad idea!

Or the disinhibition and sexual arousal from drugs.. Testing that your meth is meth won't remove that quality. It's more an education thing were people need to be aware of what kind of effects the drugs they are taking have, and what kind of company to take them in. And not letting your drugged out friends run off to do something they'll regret, maybe..

Paramount at many sites it's emphasized that folks shouldn't accept or buy drugs from anyone they don't know.

Ever been to a Dead show parking lot back in the day?

But the services offered by the various orgs, to include Dance Safe, were to check for adulterants, contaminants, etc., typically on-site. With greater tech, they can even test to see how much of the drug you thought you had remains after removing the adulterants/contaminants.

 

[goingrey]

Paramount at many sites it's emphasized that folks shouldn't accept or buy drugs from anyone they don't know.

Ever been to a Dead show parking lot back in the day?

But the services offered by the various orgs, to include Dance Safe, were to check for adulterants, contaminants, etc., typically on-site. With greater tech, they can even test to see how much of the drug you thought you had remains after removing the adulterants/contaminants.

Oh yes knowing what you're taking and how much of it is the only kind of responsible drug use.

Letting volunteers in a club test something you bought literally in the toilet, well... it's better than nothing (but not better than taking nothing).

 

[moose eater]

Oh yes knowing what you're taking and how much of it is the only kind of responsible drug use.

Letting volunteers in a club test something you bought literally in the toilet, well... it's better than nothing (but not better than taking nothing).

I think most of us in our youth were 10-feet tall and bulletproof. Weren't you?