If you don't believe in freedom of speech for those you disagree with, you don't believe in freedom of speech at all.
(paraphrasing Noam Chomsky)
What can we do about Climate Change?
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If you don't believe in freedom of speech for those you disagree with, you don't believe in freedom of speech at all.
(paraphrasing Noam Chomsky)
SacredTHCRitual
Member
organize community food gardens and people who want to plant foods and trees in random parking lots and parks...rip up parking lots and plant gardens...use unused spaces....
flushing urine down the toilet adds up...it takes a lot to neutralize to safely release again
don't use air conditioning like it's no big thing even if u can afford the bill
no running hot water for too long..
stop watering lawns..they look stupid and they do nothing..fuck your lawn, grow some food niggah. Some associations require a lawn that is green..this is bullshit..move somewhere where you can grow something useful or change those rules because they damn stupid
hate seeing so much water go to waste with nothing to show for it...I wish I could salt the golf courses so they would use an artificial grass...fucking retarded management of resources right there..and I like golf!!
red meat is a big one...that corn goes to feeding them instead of gassing your car
...red meat shouldn't be as big as it is.. and the red meat should be grass fed..hemp seeds are even a good source of protein.
Hydrogen is in water...learn how to make water into a fuel
People of the west need to drill it into their brains that just because we can DOES NOT mean we always should...and this goes down from buying food goods to invading countries...paper of plastic either way you are paying for it..
flushing urine down the toilet adds up...it takes a lot to neutralize to safely release again
don't use air conditioning like it's no big thing even if u can afford the bill
no running hot water for too long..
stop watering lawns..they look stupid and they do nothing..fuck your lawn, grow some food niggah. Some associations require a lawn that is green..this is bullshit..move somewhere where you can grow something useful or change those rules because they damn stupid
hate seeing so much water go to waste with nothing to show for it...I wish I could salt the golf courses so they would use an artificial grass...fucking retarded management of resources right there..and I like golf!!
red meat is a big one...that corn goes to feeding them instead of gassing your car
...red meat shouldn't be as big as it is.. and the red meat should be grass fed..hemp seeds are even a good source of protein.
Hydrogen is in water...learn how to make water into a fuel
People of the west need to drill it into their brains that just because we can DOES NOT mean we always should...and this goes down from buying food goods to invading countries...paper of plastic either way you are paying for it..
it is not the population, it is the actions of the population.
The earth can sustain the current population just fine.
Education is needed to curb population growth, and
education is needed to change people's actions.
The current population is only unsustainable if said population insists on a gluttonous existence, and refuses to invest in alternative sources of energy.
The earth can sustain the current population just fine.
Education is needed to curb population growth, and
education is needed to change people's actions.
The current population is only unsustainable if said population insists on a gluttonous existence, and refuses to invest in alternative sources of energy.
i dont believe in governing in prejudice
to solve our problems they should make old people (65 +) fight young people (9-12) to the death in gladiatorial combat to earn social security and retirement
the pay per revenue will stimulate the economy and the old vs young will cull out the weak and worthless
but with equality
signed
pre 98' balzeebubba
to solve our problems they should make old people (65 +) fight young people (9-12) to the death in gladiatorial combat to earn social security and retirement
the pay per revenue will stimulate the economy and the old vs young will cull out the weak and worthless
but with equality
signed
pre 98' balzeebubba
To answer your question, you're damn skippy. We've got everyday greedsters who are satisfied with going after the throats of other common greedsters, i.e. Wall Street.
We've got uber greedsters that "hostile takover" those who once measured success in the collective, not just the bottom line. i.e. large (and often) multi-national corporations.
Here we have an example of apex greed. This kind of greed requires spending hundreds of millions in cash in attempts to convince you, me and others that they didn't take the last sandwich. Not only that, the crumbs they promised will fall since the 1980s actually went to shareholders... wait, that just means more sandwiches for these two.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/brendan-demelle/koch-industries-donates-1_b_705129.html
Here's something I'll agree on. Making a point. If you're misunderstood and or taken out of context, enlighten.
The comments I can do without are ones I'll paraphrase as "no need for discussion, accept the status quot." Especially the ones who's creativity is void, accepting the pejorative sense.
sac beh
Member
That's a hilariously deceptive reference to Chomsky. You should quote Chomsky while asking the IC administration why they have guidelines against off-topic and offensive posts. If you're lucky, they'll know nothing about free speech or Chomsky and remove discussion rules based on your argument.
I've had no problem with any opposing views in this thread, and I often applaud them when they are well thought out, nor do I use negative Rep. Saying I don't believe in free speech because I'm requesting that people remain on topic and respectful is like saying I think the US should turn into Jamaica because I quoted a study that ranked Jamaica high on a list of environmentally friendly countries. What's so hard to understand about a specific thread having a specific topic, and if you want to discuss another topic, you create another thread?
The non sequiturs and strawmen around here are a disease.
The Population Control Argument
Look folks, this all started because someone posted their view that the world's population being cut in half would solve climate change problems.
I responded with demographic and environmental studies which prove this wrong.
The poster of the population control argument did not respond to my presentation of evidence against his argument, but began a series of posts responding to strawman arguments he imagined in his head, distracting comments about races and genders and general superiority of his kind, and merely repeating his original opinion with no change or further evidence.
So, one more time for the sake of clarity (if you're going to respond to my post, respond to the evidence and data I posted above, which I am summarizing here):
1. In several studies measuring the environmental footprint of countries as a whole and per capita, it results that many under-developed countries are the most environmentally friendly.
2. Many of these same countries are the ones that have been accused of being poor, lazy, useless, overpopulated and expendable in a population control solution.
3. If we were to remove all of the people of these countries in an immediate attempt to control population and reduce damage to the planet's climate, we would remove a huge number of people, true.
4. But given their insignificantly small environmental footprint compared to the countries that the population control advocate would like to keep around, there would be no significant change to the climate.
5. Rather, having kept the populations which are responsible for many times the environmental damage, you have only encouraged the bad actions to continue and increase and have eliminated from the planet many of the populations which had been practicing less damaging activities.
This is in response to ibjamming's particularly bigoted brand of population control--obviously not a rational solution, and at times off topic as the arguments he gave were based on race and other stereotypes of groups of people, contrary to the factual evidence.
Giving the benefit of the doubt to anyone else who would like to advocate a less bigoted brand of population control in order to solve the problem, I say this:
1. Population growth certainly exacerbates the problem.
2. But there is no clear, efficient, and and humane way to rid the planet of the numbers of people that would be required to curb the problem.
3. Educating people on parenthood options, contraceptives, the problems of population growth, reasons for thinking twice before having that 4th child, etc. are great, and I wholly encourage them.
4. But education efforts must respect the humanity of each person. No one should be forced to give their life or the life of their children.
5. Finally, even given these education efforts, it would take an exponentially large amount of time to curb the problem if other solutions involving life style, energy use, consumer habits, new technology, etc. are not implemented.
6. And the science is saying that there are many of these other solutions possible which can curb the problem and in less time than the solution presented by the population control advocates.
7. It logically follows, then, that we should really put our efforts into these solutions as it is the most effective, science-based, and humane path, which puts the responsibility into each of our hands proportional to each's contribution to the problem.
Overpopulation is a very convenient scapegoat, as it puts responsibility for the problem in a statistic (the number of people), rather than in the hands of each of our actions, and it puts the responsibility for the solution in the hands of natural disasters or human-made disasters to merely eliminate numbers of people, rather than in the hands of each of us whose actions contribute and could be modified in ways to make the overall difference.
There are very rational views on the problem of overpopulation and its relation to climate change here (posted before):
http://www.thebulletin.org/web-edition/roundtables/population-and-climate-change
But no one has yet brought anything but the extreme ("direct cause") or bigoted (remove the poor, lazy half) argument.
Fart in Balloons.
http://www.breathingearth.net/
http://www.breathingearth.net/
I think that we've already seen that leaving it up to individuals to make a change doesn't work.
Humans (and other animals) are selfish.
They are not going to do the right thing in this regard.
They are, in most cases, going to do what they like and what they see as best for them in the short term.
And so, if you have billions more people "looking out for number one", the problem is exacerbated geometrically.
We did not have these problems at population 3 billion.
But we do have them at population 6-7 billion.
What does that tell you?
It tells me that those "extra" 3-4 billions of people are the fundamental problem, and when you add corporate greed to that equation, you get the mess we find ourselves in now. Corporations want more people to sell things to, and to provide cheap labor. Politicians want more people to vote for them, so they are not inclined to address the real problem.
I am all for doing what we can on an individual basis to mitigate the problem, but I also see that this is not nearly enough.
You plug one hole in the dyke, and another one springs up to take it's place. For example, I quit red meat to try to do my part. But, I don't think I have convinced a single other person to do the same. People are going to continue with their same habits unless something really drastic happens.
Things are getting worse, not better, so these stopgap measures are largely ineffective, IMO.
Until we address the root cause, we are only spinning our wheels.
localhero
Member
wow theres some forward thinking ideas in this thread. i especially like the hitler styled final solution to overpopulation. genius. makes me proud to call myself an american knowing that we both salute for the same national anthem.
gosh imagine how overpopulated the world would be right now if those wretched jews werent murdered, or stalin hadnt built his gulags? guarantee you some woman wasnt behind those gems of ideas.
too bad the TOU doesnt allow meet ups, or you patriots could organize up some death squads or something. yeah, gonna go to jamaica and smoke some fatties, then head to the hills to find some poor village kids to push daggers into their brain cavities through their eyeballs. we have to right? i mean SOMETHING must be done about this over population problem.
gosh imagine how overpopulated the world would be right now if those wretched jews werent murdered, or stalin hadnt built his gulags? guarantee you some woman wasnt behind those gems of ideas.
too bad the TOU doesnt allow meet ups, or you patriots could organize up some death squads or something. yeah, gonna go to jamaica and smoke some fatties, then head to the hills to find some poor village kids to push daggers into their brain cavities through their eyeballs. we have to right? i mean SOMETHING must be done about this over population problem.
sac beh
Member
Indigenous peoples are trying to actively use their ancient traditions based on respect for the environment and the community to fight climate change and not let their ideals be reduced to just talk, native groups said at the World People´s Conference on Climate Change and the Rights of Mother Earth in Cochabamba, Bolivia, April 19-23.
Native peoples are some of the most affected by climate change, as extreme temperatures and abnormal weather destroy their lands and vital resources like water. The melting of tropical glaciers, torrential rains, frosts, droughts are a major problem in the region. One of flagship cases is in the summit´s host nation, where the Chacaltaya glacier, near La Paz, disappeared last year.
“By just recovering and revaluing our roots, strengthening our cultural practices, our ways of life and our forms of collective organization for the sustainable use of natural resources ... we could contribute to humanity to steer the future of the planet,” a document at the end of the meeting said.
Peru´s Miguel Palacín, president of the Andean Coordinating Group of Indigenous Organizations, said that “Buen Vivir” or Living Well, a concept that stresses quality of life instead of economic profits, “is not just a theory or a discourse ... it´s the practice of peoples to maintain balance between human beings with Mother Nature.”
Participants said their traditional knowledge and customs should not only be strengthened but incorporated into climate change research and public policies.
...
http://www.lapress.org/articles.asp?art=6120
Native peoples are some of the most affected by climate change, as extreme temperatures and abnormal weather destroy their lands and vital resources like water. The melting of tropical glaciers, torrential rains, frosts, droughts are a major problem in the region. One of flagship cases is in the summit´s host nation, where the Chacaltaya glacier, near La Paz, disappeared last year.
“By just recovering and revaluing our roots, strengthening our cultural practices, our ways of life and our forms of collective organization for the sustainable use of natural resources ... we could contribute to humanity to steer the future of the planet,” a document at the end of the meeting said.
Peru´s Miguel Palacín, president of the Andean Coordinating Group of Indigenous Organizations, said that “Buen Vivir” or Living Well, a concept that stresses quality of life instead of economic profits, “is not just a theory or a discourse ... it´s the practice of peoples to maintain balance between human beings with Mother Nature.”
Participants said their traditional knowledge and customs should not only be strengthened but incorporated into climate change research and public policies.
...
http://www.lapress.org/articles.asp?art=6120
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