Turning 4 1k Lights on at once @ 220 volt risky to do

[SumDumGuy]

he brought the black wire he has a huge roll thing i bought the rest of the stuff that is the 12/2 and the receptacles the blue box sub panel and the 20 amp breakers and that time switch intermatic.

now in order to be perfect i need to change just that black wire from the main box to sub panel ? if so then by getting a #6 would solve the issue?

also he said he would be back to plug the receptacles and test and make my holes for my venting. not sure if he gonna help me setup all my hardware and ducting etc...

how can i make sure i only get 80% of load usage? and the ? to the black wire

By black cable you are referring to the outer sheath of the #8 right? Yes then that would be making that connection perfect

 

[gus738]

yes im talking about the the wire that goes from 50 amp breaker from the main box to the sub panel where the (6) 20 amp breakers are. if i only need to replace that much black wire for a 6 it wont be an issue its a regular cost nothing major right? also another question about those 6 breakers in the sub panel which im scratching my head why is their 6 and only 4 are plug on both top and bottom but the last 2 to the right are only plug from the bottom

 

[SumDumGuy]

yes im talking about the the wire that goes from 50 amp breaker from the main box to the sub panel where the (6) 20 amp breakers are. if i only need to replace that much black wire for a 6 it wont be an issue its a regular cost nothing major right? also another question about those 6 breakers in the sub panel which im scratching my head why is their 6 and only 4 are plug on both top and bottom but the last 2 to the right are only plug from the bottom

If you're referring to your neutral bus then I've counted 6 terminations which adds up to your 6 outlets. Live feeds are feeding into breaker from behind on the hot bus bar.

Also make sure your electrician does this. Watch him as most don't mind if you'd like to see this upgrade performed but please do not try and DIY this.. It's quite a small job yes depending on where the service entrance is coming from.. Hopefully a short cable run.

 

[gus738]

ok now what are you taking about which ground bus the one on the sub panel or the main panel? what i mean is on the sub panel theirs 20 amp breakers 6 of those, only 4 are connected both on the top and the bottom of the breaker where the last 2 towards the right are only plug into the bottom

an update he says "the rooms are wired 110 if you want 240 then you need to rewire the grow room from the sub panel" ok so he says 110 and icmag are saying 120 so which is it?

 

[SumDumGuy]

ok now what are you taking about which ground bus the one on the sub panel or the main panel? what i mean is on the sub panel theirs 20 amp breakers 6 of those, only 4 are connected both on the top and the bottom of the breaker where the last 2 towards the right are only plug into the bottom

an update he says "the rooms are wired 110 if you want 240 then you need to rewire the grow room from the sub panel" ok so he says 110 and icmag are saying 120 so which is it?

Those are definitely 120 circuits. This is why I was a bit confused with the title of your initial post. They are ALL connected. Each breaker is connected to the sub panel via a small positively charged blade that slides into the breaker (Hot Bus Bar). This is why you see the black wire connected to the bottom of each breaker (which goes out to your outlets).

120 volts is the nominal "delivery voltage" at the connection point (e.g. the meter) between the utility network and your house. 110 volt is the standard "utilization voltage" for most household appliances in North America. The 10 volt difference is for voltage drops through the interior wiring of the house. In North America, many domestic electrical appliances have a “nominal” voltage of 115 volts with a tolerance of +/-10%.

 

[SumDumGuy]

You will only be able to fit 3 double throw 240v breakers in that sub panel. Just wondering did you tell the electrician that you needed a 240v circuit in the room?

 

[ganjaments]

you should be able to run your 220v lights off 2 double throw (aka 2pole, aka 240v) breakers, which would leave 2 120v breakers to run the rest of your room(s). Will that be sufficient?

Also, regarding the 8guage vs 6guage issue. This is just a matter of extra precaution. The wire you have is at the absolute limit of what is safe, but, it is technically ok to use. However, you always want to err on the side of caution, and go with larger wire if it is borderline. Thicker wire = Safer. Your electrician should share your concern, and, if he's worth his salt, won't try to talk you out of being extra safe here. Furthermore, if you have any plans of adding more lights, a thicker wire will often give you that freedom.

 

[gus738]

thanks guys for the reply's

so at some point he said that panel is a 50a @ 250v but then he also said another txt that the rooms he wired them for 110v so is it possible for the panel to be 50a @250v despite he saying he wired the room for 110v or what?

also you are saying is that regardless 110 or 120 i should not be worried about 110 or 120v

also i never told my guy to do 240 but then again i dont know why he didnt do that from the get go. so disregard the 240

also i'll stop you guys about the 240 because if have i have to rewire the 12/2 in the grow room then its not worth it.

so brings me back to is the electricity set up safely with the exception of the 8 awg black wire, and despite the fact that it is 110v and the fact that he said the 50a of 250v or is something fishy here?

 

[ganjaments]

what he said is accurate. The subpanel is 240v, but the outlets are wired for 120v. If you want to change some of your outlets to 240v, you don't have to replace the yellow wire, you just need to replace the breakers and the outlets. You could do this at a later time without tearing into your walls.

don't get hung up on the 110v vs 120v issue. There is a slight difference between the voltage at the panel and the voltage at the outlet, and because of this people mix up the two numbers. It has no bearing on your wiring project though. You're dealing with 120v circuits (even though it might only be 100v-115v at the outlets).

 

[ajc0k]

fucK! you guys are all saying the mlc4xt sucks? i bought the one with the timer yea i plan on only doing one grow at this particular location, think it'll last 3 months without the timer crapping out?

 

[gus738]

ok im a bit on ease now as long as the 110v isnt an isssue despite the outlet plug capable of reaching 125v?

also i got 15amp outlet plugs at 60 cents each where the 20 amp outlet are $7 each do i need to get 20amp outlet for all my stuff or does 15 amp cut it? because i got 5 20a outlet plugs pro rated levtion for the lights but for the rest theirs a dozen of the 15a outlet

so only thing i gotta replace before starting is the black #8 wire that leads from the main box to the sub panel which is black red white and copper ?

 

[ganjaments]

do i need to get 20amp outlet for all my stuff or does 15 amp cut it?

Your outlets need to be rated at least equivalent to the breakers. Many people will use 15a outlets on 20a breakers, but it really isn't safe. The breaker is what will stop the wires and outlets from overheating from to much current. The breaker should be matched to the weakest (lowest rated) device. So if you have ANY 15 amp wire, recipticles, or relays on a circut, then you need to have a 15a breaker. You could replace your recipticles with 20a ones, but that shouldn't be necesary for accessories and fans. The easier solution is to return some of the breakers and get 15a breakers for the circuits you don't need a ton of current. Any circuits that need 20a breakers need to have receptacles rated for 20a.

so only thing i gotta replace before starting is the black #8 wire that leads from the main box to the sub panel which is black red white and copper ?

The ground might have a green sheathing, but yeah. Discuss this with your electrician, and explain you want to be extra, super safe and he shouldn't have a problem doing this for you.

 

[SumDumGuy]

fucK! you guys are all saying the mlc4xt sucks? i bought the one with the timer yea i plan on only doing one grow at this particular location, think it'll last 3 months without the timer crapping out?

I think you will be fine with the unit. Should last you quite a few grows without a hitch.

 

[SumDumGuy]

Your outlets need to be rated at least equivalent to the breakers. Many people will use 15a outlets on 20a breakers, but it really isn't safe. The breaker is what will stop the wires and outlets from overheating from to much current. The breaker should be matched to the weakest (lowest rated) device. So if you have ANY 15 amp wire, recipticles, or relays on a circut, then you need to have a 15a breaker. You could replace your recipticles with 20a ones, but that shouldn't be necesary for accessories and fans. The easier solution is to return some of the breakers and get 15a breakers for the circuits you don't need a ton of current. Any circuits that need 20a breakers need to have receptacles rated for 20a.

++REP!!!!

 

[gus738]

plus rep? huh hey my guy said something i got confused about

"the #8 wire going to breaker #1, 3 and 5 will carry at least 50 amps.

the #8 wire going to breaker # 2, 4 and 6 will carry at least 50 more 50amps that gives you over 100 amps to work with that is MORE power then you need for a grow room that size.

so whta he is talking about is the amp load rating is high ?

but what you guys seem to be talking about is the #8 awg black wire not safely handling 80% - full load

so has this have anything to do with what you guys said or its something else that my guy is talking about.

 

[SumDumGuy]

plus rep? huh hey my guy said something i got confused about

"the #8 wire going to breaker #1, 3 and 5 will carry at least 50 amps.

the #8 wire going to breaker # 2, 4 and 6 will carry at least 50 more 50amps that gives you over 100 amps to work with that is MORE power then you need for a grow room that size.

so whta he is talking about is the amp load rating is high ?

but what you guys seem to be talking about is the #8 awg black wire not safely handling 80% - full load

so has this have anything to do with what you guys said or its something else that my guy is talking about.

I saw only (1) 50AMP breaker. A double throw you showed in the pic. There is only (1) #8 feeding the sub-panel. I figured he would talk you out. Compliment his work and let him know that you would like a number 6.

Picture this: you have (60) amps in your sub panel being fed by (50)A in the main panel. He should have gone over on the main panel but thats just me. Aside from you popping the main breaker if your panel reaches (50)A that #8 will get VERY hot. A #6 will stay in the minimal range.

I gave the previous poster a ++rep because if you exceed the rated amperage on your sockets which is 15A then the sub panel breaker "will never get the memo" to pop! There will be an immediate fire at the outlet terminal because it is not rated over 15A. This is why he mentioned you should match accordingly. I felt that is was great advice to I +rep'ed him.

I wish you the best of luck on this project and hope you get what you require.

 

[andl]

just curious, timer is one of those heavy duty ones from home depot - spot isnt that big

your fuse has to be bigger than 20A because a 600W draws 3A and a 1000W draws 5A so youre @ 5x4A=20A

the 1,5mm cable is just for maximum of 16A and about 3600watts.


you will need a fuse which is greater than 20A (25A) will be fine and get some 2,5mm or even 4mm cable to the fuse also the timer isnt strong enough (if you want to power all 4 at same time) you need to use a relais.

 

[gus738]

so your saying he made up the part about having A total of (2) 50 amp breaker? also i highlighted in bold what i didnt understand he got the black wire from the main panel. after he left from doing his work he said he would be back to install the outlet plugs so when he shows up i just mention to him to put a #6?

how much does it cost or how much of a big deal is it? its just a short cable run going my my main box which is in front of the sub panel (2ft away)

so do i replace the 15a outlet plugs with 20a outlets?

I saw only (1) 50AMP breaker. A double throw you showed in the pic. There is only (1) #8 feeding the sub-panel. I figured he would talk you out. Compliment his work and let him know that you would like a number 6.

Picture this: you have (60) amps in your sub panel being fed by (50)A in the main panel. He should have gone over on the main panel but thats just me. Aside from you popping the main breaker if your panel reaches (50)A that #8 will get VERY hot. A #6 will stay in the minimal range.

I gave the previous poster a ++rep because if you exceed the rated amperage on your sockets which is 15A then the sub panel breaker "will never get the memo" to pop! There will be an immediate fire at the outlet terminal because it is not rated over 15A. This is why he mentioned you should match accordingly. I felt that is was great advice to I +rep'ed him.

I wish you the best of luck on this project and hope you get what you require.

 

[carpster]

plans for 4 or 8 if you want on one 120 timerruns 240

plans for 4 or 8 if you want on one 120 timerruns 240

Here is the link someone poste excelent DIY device for using 1 timer 120 to control up to 30 amps so abot 5 lights on 1 relay if you want more ad mor relays and your on...I believe this is as safe as any device and you cant beat the price abot 75 bucks and your on...

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=3641683#poststop

 

[ganjaments]

so your saying he made up the part about having A total of (2) 50 amp breaker

He was kinda right, but not totally accurate. Lets set asside the issue of #6 and #8 wire for a moment, and assume the wire you have is sufficient for 50a service. You have two hot wires going to your subpanel, each capable of carrying 50a. So, yeah, you could technically pull 100a off the two hot wires, but that would be at 120v. However, there are some problems with that. First, you can't find 50a 120v breakers. Second, even if you could find single pole 50a breakers, I'm pretty sure you'd have to have a separate subpanel for each one to be safe. e.g. 2x 120v subpanels, rather than 1x 240v subpanel as you have now.

If you want a 50a+ subpanel, it's going to have to be at 240v. At 240v, the two #8 wires TOGETHER are rated at 50a. So, basically, while he's sorta right that you could pull 50a off each wire, it is ONLY at 120v, and thus not applicable to you because you have a 240v subpanel.

Now were back to the issue of whether #8 is sufficent for 50a service. I am not an electrician so I cannot quote the National Electric Code (NEC), but all of my wiring books, and online research say that (at minimum) #8 should be used for 40a circuits, and #6 should be used for 50a circuits. I suggest you do some online digging yourself, as installing 50a sub panels is VERY common, and lots of people have already had this exact discussion. Also, if you get to the point that you feel you need to upgrade to #6, but your electrician is telling you that you don't need it, just tell him you want to be able to upgrade your service later if needed. He won't be able to argue his way out of that one