Tony's silver thiosulfate notes

[NIKT]

if changing doses doesn't help ... Additional Ga3 spraying may be ?? . About 50 mg / l _ one week after silver application. Once upon a time a "bonifacy" citizen now appearing as citizen # _ in a different space-time (F #) tried it. It didn't help, but ... you can try.

Male Ga3-induced flowers have a different structure, they are smaller than normal ones, but have real tails, not sitting on the bush like silver ones.

This is potentially a technique for bringing female plants closer to a phenotype that looks more like the real male ones.

I've always been curious about how Ag doses and fertility are related and if they are.

 

[farmer_joe]

My Strawberry Cough clone ended up producing tons of nanners but no pollen. I've kept it around just in case the later nanners end up producing pollen, but I'm not hopeful. I don't want to give up on this, so, my question is, when you guys get a cut that doesn't produce pollen the first time you try this, which direction do you take it next? Should I try lower than 3 mM, or a different dosing regimen? I kind of want to try a single dose of 3 mM next.

If I had the space, I would take multiple cuttings and try a bunch of different strengths and timings. I would definitely include stronger solution such as 5mM and also try spraying with 3mM each day 5 days in a row at flip. Then depending on how much time and space you have and how badly you want to reverse it try many other variations as well.

Good luck, let us know how you get on its all good data!

 

[Tonygreen]

Lower bro, wait it out of you can, chance she drops, can also snip and hang dry a branch to crisp and see if you can get a little out. I’d keep spray schedule same, increase dilution by 50% would be a good next try.

 

[Tonygreen]

Farmer joe, good advice. Especially when trying a new cut first time, beats months setting up for a new try.

 

[Rurumo]

Thank's for the great advice Joe and Tony! I'm going to go that route next time, multiple dosage/schedule. I'll also keep waiting on this one a bit to see what happens.

 

[StickyBandit]

If I was to make seeds of an old female we've had for decades, what would the results likely be? Do the seeds result in offspring of the same strength etc or is there potentially a range of phenos? Cheers

 

[NIKT]

S1? . number of phenotypes, the result depends on how internally genetically varied the mother is.
You will do it and plant a large number of offspring, you will know.

A lot of features depend on polygens, here the results will have a smooth variability, hardly distinguishable classes. Others on single alleles of genes, clearly distinguishable fentotypes.

There are also very complex interactions between many genes influencing the phenotype, traits dependent on several genes that split strangely with sometimes unpredictable results.

You may also have recessive alleles in the starting plant, causing the appearance of any kind of "mutant" in the first generation.

selfing is a nice tool, you can derive some slightly different or very different S lines from this plant. Bring some of them to a high degree of homozygosity.

And even try with two out of a dozen such lines to obtain _ F1 between the lines _ with features very similar to the initial plant. ?? ;]

S inbred lines may show symptoms of depression. There may be fertility problems and others weakening of the yield, shortening the period of vegetative growth. etc.

In S1, depression will not be, at least not observable. It will show up to an undefinable degree with the higher generations of S. This reaches a minimum of inbreeding depression, and beyond a certain generation S it will no longer increase. The more similar lines are derived, the more of them likely to be useful. I have no idea what it looks like exactly. I know there are problems, fertility, seed germination etc. I do not have exact data..., but the data for industrial hemp showing a drop in yield of up to 50%.

The same problem occurs at a 1:1 reproduction with male plants, slower because the homozygosity of the line increases much slower.

selfing is the fastest method of obtaining virtually homozygous lines. the problem is that cannabis is a plant that shows inbreeding depression. therefore it is a technique of preparing components for F1 hybrids rather than a method of creating a variety.

Gw pharma has run and probably continues to run a breeding program based on selfing. Similar to standard breeding programs in maize and other plants where the heterotic F1 hybrids are currently practically the only varieties that are commercially cultivated.

Here is an interesting result. Very old...

IMO. The best answer here is: check what result you will get in this case. The differentiation of S's offspring depends on the mother.

If your clone was selected from F2_Fx with very large genetic variation. The offspring from self-pollination will also be internally diverse as hell. This does not always translate into an easily observable gigantic number of phenotypes.

Have fun

ps: sorry, a lot of digressions instead of answering the question.

 

[StickyBandit]

S1? . number of phenotypes, the result depends on how internally genetically varied the mother is.
You will do it and plant a large number of offspring, you will know.

A lot of features depend on polygens, here the results will have a smooth variability, hardly distinguishable classes. Others on single alleles of genes, clearly distinguishable fentotypes.

There are also very complex interactions between many genes influencing the phenotype, traits dependent on several genes that split strangely with sometimes unpredictable results.

You may also have recessive alleles in the starting plant, causing the appearance of any kind of "mutant" in the first generation.

selfing is a nice tool, you can derive some slightly different or very different S lines from this plant. Bring some of them to a high degree of homozygosity.

And even try with two out of a dozen such lines to obtain _ F1 between the lines _ with features very similar to the initial plant. ?? ;]

S inbred lines may show symptoms of depression. There may be fertility problems and others weakening of the yield, shortening the period of vegetative growth. etc.

selfing is the fastest method of obtaining virtually homozygous lines. the problem is that cannabis is a plant that shows inbreeding depression. therefore it is a technique of preparing components for F1 hybrids rather than a method of creating a variety.

Gw pharma has run and probably continues to run a breeding program based on selfing. Similar to standard breeding programs in maize and other plants where the heterotic F1 hybrids are currently practically the only varieties that are commercially cultivated.

Here is an interesting result. Very old...

IMO. The best answer here is: check what result you will get in this case. The differentiation of S's offspring depends on the mother.

If your clone was selected from F2_Fx with very large genetic variation. The offspring from self-pollination will also be internally diverse as hell. This does not always translate into an easily observable gigantic number of phenotypes.

Have fun

So this is the plant here which we have had for decades and kept going by cloning only so far. I have hundreds of other strains to try and I thought selfing this as a backup plan might be an idea in case we lose it. I have 2 friends with clones of her but we got down to one and nearly lost the strain so I thought at least selfed seeds tucked away will be better than nothing
I really have no idea about it's stability or lineage

 

[NIKT]

I really have no idea about it's stability or lineage

You'll have it when you check it. You can even check to some extent relatedness to other varieties.
You can try to keep the genetic pool from this clone by breeding S1 offspring in the population. A better solution than selecting individual S1s and creating successive generations of S. Unfortunately, the only way to preserve what he hides inside is to keep it indefinitely. :]

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From what I remember, it is enough to send them the stalks.

Phylos Tested Genotype

Mjardin Management: White 99

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sample result. Very high internal gene allele differentiation. And the% specification of the allele's similarity to other varieties in the database. It does not mean that it derives directly from - some may even come from the same origin of the initial varieties still in the form of landrace. I guess . Although it is said that most of the commercial varieties known today are derived from a very small genetic pool, and rather all are closely related to each other. Despite a fairly large variety of varieties. [it depends who and where and when, now there is much more data available than before]

btw : IMO The best way to preserve the genetic pool of this clone would be to do 3-4 backcrosses with a male plant of a different variety ... And the further reproduction of the progeny in the population, the bigger the better.

Feminized seeds are rather a commercial, convenient product. S lines are an excellent method of creating inbred lines to create F1 hybrids. But when it comes to preserving genetic variation, the worst possible method. Here it is always simply a conservative breeding in the population that comes into play.

======================================================================
ps: ;( unfortunately, it is no longer possible .... a pity, it was very interesting.

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The Phylos Plant Sex Test and Genotype Test are no longer accepted for processing as of September 30, 2021. Full customer account access, sex test results, and genotype reports will all remain available through our website for the foreseeable future.

 

[farmer_joe]

If I was to make seeds of an old female we've had for decades, what would the results likely be? Do the seeds result in offspring of the same strength etc or is there potentially a range of phenos? Cheers

If you take cuts of that plant and reverse a few of them and then pollinate the other clones you will capture the entire gene pool of that plant (including recessive traits as there is no outcross). It is the best way to back up the pure line in seed form in case you lose the cut. If you make enough seeds there is every chance you will find a plant very similar to the original clone if thats what you are looking for, or something even better with a bit of luck.

How much variation you get in the S1s will depend on how inbred the plant was to begin with.

Good luck!

 

[RottyRzr]

Just wanted to add to this thread that I tried the 3mM solution on a KA5H clone at -5, 0 and +5 days and it didnt work. Oh, well. It was my first attempt. I guess I'll just toss it out and come up with plan B.

 

[farmer_joe]

Just wanted to add to this thread that I tried the 3mM solution on a KA5H clone at -5, 0 and +5 days and it didnt work. Oh, well. It was my first attempt. I guess I'll just toss it out and come up with plan B.

Bummer, what happened did it reverse ok just no pollen or how did it react?

 

[RottyRzr]

Bummer, what happened did it reverse ok just no pollen or how did it react?

Hey farmer_joe
Nothing happened. The plant simply did not reverse. I was very careful in weighing out the chemicals and water so I know I got the right dilution. This was my first time trying this and I still have plenty solution in the refrigerator. I just need more clones to try again.

 

[NIKT]

how much time since spraying? more than 20 days?

 

[RottyRzr]

how much time since spraying? more than 20 days?

No it hasn't been 20 days yet. Id have to look at my calendar but Im thinking its been 10 days.

 

[Cloneman]

I sprayed with that 3mM, no damage at all.



I sprayed with Farmer Joe's schedule at -5 , 0(flip) , +5 and they reversed (just have to be patient waiting).

This was my post from a while ago.
@RottyRzr 10 days isn't long enough, especially with the early spraying schedule. Like i said be patient......over 20

 

[RottyRzr]

This was my post from a while ago.
@RottyRzr 10 days isn't long enough, especially with the early spraying schedule. Like i said be patient......over 20

Ive still got the plant so I'll give it more time. How long are you thinking?

 

[RottyRzr]

It seems patience is a virtue. Now what?
How long does it take to produce pollen? What are my next steps?
I only sprayed the 2 lower branches so the uppers are ready for pollen. When and how do I gather the pollen to use on the upper flowers?

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

When and how do I gather the pollen to use on the upper flowers?

Good job You can find the method I've used for many years which works quite well. Whatever you do, I strongly recommend properly collecting, drying and storing some of the pollen for later. I have viable pollen from 10+ years ago, and in the future you can too.
Thread with detailed collection, drying and preservation information

 

[RottyRzr]

Thanks. I'll head over there now and read up!

Good job You can find the method I've used for many years which works quite well. Whatever you do, I strongly recommend properly collecting, drying and storing some of the pollen for later. I have viable pollen from 10+ years ago, and in the future you can too.
Thread with detailed collection, drying and preservation information

Good job You can find the method I've used for many years which works quite well. Whatever you do, I strongly recommend properly collecting, drying and storing some of the pollen for later. I have viable pollen from 10+ years ago, and in the future you can too.
Thread with detailed collection, drying and preservation information

Nice read but since this is my first time trying this, how do I know when the pods are almost ready to open? Ive always gotten rid of male plants before they opened in the past. I'd like to collect the pollen, use some on the upper flowers and save the rest.