-tjo with 6 super lemon haze in RDWC-

tjo · Nov 23, 2010

il see what i can do with my ph meters..
right now i dont have money 2 spend..if i had money i will go to the streets for some weed.i dont have weed also..fuckin life
any ways im waiting..i have patience and i know slh is a good strain.

some reading before few minutes was

ph 5,9 with the milwakee-that i think work better then other-
ec 1.

the strange is i never go with such low ec and my plants has not any signs of def..
also i believe 1. is a bit low for that stage..dont you?

and some photos..

DUGG · Nov 23, 2010

you have a problem and correcting the EC to 1.0 is a starting point to correct the problem and stabilise the PH ... your plants are showing signs that something is wrong you can see it in the leaves as they are clawing downwards and if left longer will wrinkle and distort until you get root lockout and your plants will get worse and die

have a look here at this thread he had a similar problem i helped him to fix

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=181164&page=10

tjo · Nov 23, 2010

DUGG said:
you have a problem and correcting the EC to 1.0 is a starting point to correct the problem and stabilise the PH ... your plants are showing signs that something is wrong you can see it in the leaves as they are clawing downwards and if left longer will wrinkle and distort until you get root lockout and your plants will get worse and die

have a look here at this thread he had a similar problem i helped him to fix

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=181164&page=10

that clawing dowwards was from wrong ph??

maybe was overwatering??

are not all the plants with clawing, some are from the genetics

Scrogerman · Nov 23, 2010

PH meter problems earlier, sorry i missed the conversation...

I would recommend the Hydrogarden Essentials PH Pen, nice little meter, auto temp con, low battery alarm etc, ive been using it 3-4 months now & for under £30 a pop you cant go wrong. It doesnt need calibrating every 2 weeks, maybe loses 0.1 in 4 weeks of everyday use, im impressed.
OK the digital readout units are nice, but the probes can cost over £50 a pop, need to be changed every year or two, & the little Hydrogarden PH Pen under £30, think i paid £28, (super accurate & im buying another) lasts 1-3 years, just cal solution 7 is required.
Nice little accurate meter man!

(could prolly buy 2 of these PH pens for the price of a single probe-its a no_brainer!)
With this i always test against my 'GH-PH Liquid test kit, test against 6.0(yellow).
Meter reads 6.0, & the PH liquid test says yellow, im good to go(.

Tjo, yes mate, RO water is supposed to have a neutral PH 7.0

Has your PH started going back UP now? should be doing that by now.? New growth seems to look OK. PK?

Whats the recommended EC for the SLH in this stage of growth?(look in other grow diarys) i think hazes are usually light feeders anyway? whats your waters starting EC man?(Just H2o)

depending on the Nute Line you use & your water etc, EC 1.0 isnt really weak for DWC anyway & id be looking for an EC of 1.0-1.2 at this stage anyway in DWC. If i was doing E&F or NFT it would be alot higher at 1.6 -1.8+. Funnily enough my plants are on 1.0 now in DWC & Loving it wk 6 12/12. I grew a Chiesel & EC1.0 would of killed it & liked 0.6 mid bloom, didnt want or ask for it any stronger. so it depends on the strain too.

darko_G · Nov 23, 2010

for the low ec. k.i.s.s man if they are happy with that ec then its fine aint it..... im a true beleiver in less is more with nutes...they will let you know when their hungry or thirsty and if they dont let you know they dont need it right? oh and i checked out ur last post last night but must have been really stoned cuz i dont remember much about em.. looking real good though bro... a friend of mine grew some slh... brought my a q round... was amazing.. his first grow (spent dough on it) bus were large but sooo dense.. much densewr than i had imagined being so hazey.... but turns out there aint much haze in slh atall is mainly inidca... anyway tastey shit man cant wait to see yopur buds progress man

oh as far as ph meter are concernd... i jus calibrated my aqua pal ph pen for the first time... iv had it a year... was .1 out and did my mates thesame time was .2 out these pens are brilliant iv dropped mine in loads of buckets and its going strong

Scrogerman · Nov 23, 2010

Auqa Pals bloody good meter! they dont last 2 mins if you drop those in water(need hair-dryer on hand), but i'll say they really are a good meter too, used the 'Orange One' for years, swear by them, but this time the cheaper Hydrogarden Essentials PH Pen takes first prize for me, cant go wrong on the £28 but thumbs up to the Aqua Pal too £40+ though usually.(ive seen them at £30 once ever) & the batteries run out faster with them too. (Im getting double the battery life out of the HydrogardenPHP, more water resistant too)

Sill have an AuqaPal & its still good after 2 grows, its there as back up! & im saving on batteries. reading the same numbers both meters, exactly. in fact its helped identify the other as a good meter!

Tip to the wise: If you own an AuqaPal PH Pen then please dont try to adjust PH when drunk or semi-drunk, your bound to lose the meter in the res one of these days! Dont bother! lol-use a cup

tjo · Nov 24, 2010

Scrogerman said:
Has your PH started going back UP now? should be doing that by now.? New growth seems to look OK. PK?

--my water has lower ph again..ph drop 0,1 per day..also the ec..
new growth has some crawling.

Whats the recommended EC for the SLH in this stage of growth?(look in other grow diarys) i think hazes are usually light feeders anyway? whats your waters starting EC man?(Just H2o)

--if i know that i would be happy..i dont know the ideal ec level
for slh..i searched but nothing..
my water has 0,3 ec but with the RO has 0.

depending on the Nute Line you use & your water etc, EC 1.0 isnt really weak for DWC anyway & id be looking for an EC of 1.0-1.2 at this stage anyway in DWC. If i was doing E&F or NFT it would be alot higher at 1.6 -1.8+. Funnily enough my plants are on 1.0 now in DWC & Loving it wk 6 12/12. I grew a Chiesel & EC1.0 would of killed it & liked 0.6 mid bloom, didnt want or ask for it any stronger. so it depends on the strain too.
now my ec is 0,8.. today i change the water and my target
is 1,-1,2.

--what are your ec levels in dwc??? from clone to harvest.

darko_G said:
for the low ec. k.i.s.s man if they are happy with that ec then its fine aint it..... im a true beleiver in less is more with nutes...they will let you know when their hungry or thirsty and if they dont let you know they dont need it right? oh and i checked out ur last post last night but must have been really stoned cuz i dont remember much about em.. looking real good though bro... a friend of mine grew some slh... brought my a q round... was amazing.. his first grow (spent dough on it) bus were large but sooo dense.. much densewr than i had imagined being so hazey.... but turns out there aint much haze in slh atall is mainly inidca... anyway tastey shit man cant wait to see yopur buds progress man

oh as far as ph meter are concernd... i jus calibrated my aqua pal ph pen for the first time... iv had it a year... was .1 out and did my mates thesame time was .2 out these pens are brilliant iv dropped mine in loads of buckets and its going strong

less is more..i know.. but, how much is less??
you really believe that 1. ec is ok for that stage of growth?

I HAVE NO MONEY FOR PH METER..IM A VICTIM OF CRISIS..

cheers

erwingruber · Nov 24, 2010

Hey tjo your girls start buding soon , i think that they will start later than my shivas but they are buding together.

come on tjo liquid ph testers are everywhere for 10 euros.

i know you have see this lot of times but Blazeonup in his Rdwc tutorial recommneds this as a guide for sativas.

sativa's
seedlings and clones 250-350ppm 5.3-5.5 ph
early vegg 300-500ppm 5.3-5.6 ph
middle vegg 500-700ppm 5.4-5.6 ph
late vegg 700-900ppm 5.5-5.7 ph
early flower 1000-1100ppm 5.5-5.7 ph
middle flower 1100-1300ppm 5.5-5.8 ph
late flower 800-1000ppm 5.5-5.7 ph
ripening 300-500ppm 5.4-5.6 ph

Keep it up you have the better bud in the world coming for you !!

Scrogerman · Nov 24, 2010

tjo said:
less is more..i know.. but, how much is less??
you really believe that 1. ec is ok for that stage of growth?
yeah 1.0EC, depends what EC & PH say! EC Up PH Down = EC too High id say but its not by much & some people make it this way too.
If your PH is going down 0.1 a day, id say your EC is just a little too high, but its nearly there. Ill bet dropping it to 0.8 / 0.9 & your PH would start going up again. If it was a bacterial problem not only would you smell it in your res but your PH would Dive much harder & further down than 0.1EC in one day, DWC run plants seem to like lower EC's compared to other grow systems/styles like NFT for example. if you try to drop the EC a little & your PH starts to drift back up slowly, you'll know where you were going wrong & better understand the needs of the plant, if EC is going down 0.1 a day, id say you are ok & right up to where the plant wants the EC to be, just back it off a point & watch what happens. i cant see doing what i sugest as a negative action, it'll just show you what happens when the balance is right. Unless of course you understand why that PH goes down, then none of what i say matters & youve already cracked it.

I HAVE NO MONEY FOR PH METER..IM A VICTIM OF CRISIS..

cheers

Id beg for the money to get a liquid PH test kit if i had to, its imperitive you get something sorted so you are able to accurately read your PH, im not quite getting how all this is stringing together.
best of luck bro!

btw, my EC levels in DWC from clone to harvest vary according to strain, i just read the numbers(PH&EC) & adjust accordingly. EC Down & PH Up= too weak etc. Generally start with EC0.4 & see where the numbers go, then i know what the plant requires.! it depends!

erwingruber · Nov 24, 2010

@ Scrogerman.

I totaly agree with you and what you say is exactly what i read and learn around here , i have read basic water chemistry 3 or 4 times and i need to read it somemore but i think that the rules don't work everytime.
In my grow form sprout to now (3 weeks flowering) my ph keeps going up by .5 a day without looking Ec movements what i mean is that i saw my ec going down and my ph going up , this is normal but i see also my ec going up and my ph still going up .5 a day
and i also see my ec stable and my ph going up .5 a day and all this with my plants looking 100% healthy.
In the beggining i start yelling around here for help and try to control my ph but everything i do din't work my ph likes to updrift .5 a day no matter what and cause my plants look happy and i am tired chasing ph updrifts i let my system run like this my ph going up .5 a day and i put some ph down every day , of course i am making res changes to avoid P build up.i am runninf R/O water and in the next res change i will mix it with some aerated tap water to bring it at 100ppm just to see if this will stabilize my ph.

Can you please explain this ?

Scrogerman · Nov 24, 2010

erwingruber said:
@ Scrogerman.

.i am runninf R/O water and in the next res change i will mix it with some aerated tap water to bring it at 100ppm just to see if this will stabilize my ph.

Can you please explain this ?

It'll help, RO has no buffering capacity that i know of(why your PH is all over the place i think), the key with your healthy upward drift is in the Alkalinity of your water imo, i prolly have this mixed up again, but i know water with a higher carbonate hardness(Kh) has a better buffering cap than RO which has none. like Bigtoke says in his thread(basic water chemistry), filtering water de-stabilises/removes its alkalinity & hence its ability to buffer PH due to Kh. Im still trying to get my head stright on this issue lol, its only been 2 decades, we will get there in the end, but now i think your barking up the right tree. Do you add Cal-Mag to your RO before adding nutes? if you had the correct ppms of carbonates to begin with in your water it would be much more PH stable imo! No Kh no Buffer, is how i see it.
G'Luck man!

Spurr never did answer my q's on this issue!?!?

Its the Alkalinity that forms the buffer & what makes up alkalinity, its carbonates~! take the carbonates away, what have you got=no buffer! get it? its also why RO has a neutral PH & is niether acid nor base, (i think, im stoned)
But from what i can gather only part of the carbonates total ppm value in the water form its ppm in alkalinity. now i start getting my knickers in a twist! wish spurr would be unbanned!

no doubt ive seen people do 50/50 RO to tap & their PH problems were over!

tjo · Nov 24, 2010

lately i saw many growers with the same problem..maybe because i have it but,

no one knows really why the ph drops within the ec???

scrogerman has give the most logical answer but none of us with that problem has anerobic bacteria....

before few minutes i was reading zuma s thread..hi have the same problem..also i saw threads without any specific answer..

Scrogerman · Nov 24, 2010

hey matey!
Right Tjo yeah, your answer lies in your EC imo, if you lower it your PH will start to rise. My Swisscheese are still on EC1.0 in my DWC Tote, 0.8 & my PH drifts up 1.1 & it drifts down. if i saw it diving for no reason id think either EC(first) then if i found it wasnt EC, i would know its Anerobic bacteria, one of a few reasons why PH dives downward. its usually one of the 2. i think atmospheric Co2 another reason(could be wrong on that?), but its unlikely to be that anyway.

My swisscheese have been upto EC1.0-1.2, this was the highest they asked for bro! this is Wk6-7 of 12/12, so at their peak & ill be reducing EC now untill flush. if anything they are perfect health wise, maybe a little N rich but nothing a good flush wont fix. some strains are nute hogs anyway, but others like the BBChiesel i grew like it really light, like EC0.6 Maximum strength, any stronger & i got Tip Burn & downward PH drift. Overfetilisation has a negitive affect on the plants & will surely reduce yields too, why i see overfeeding as bad & like to run my nutes slightly light anyway, PH up a bit each day is healthy imo, as long as its just a couple of points a day, 0.5 is about the limit but 0.2-0.3 up-drifts over 2-3 days i look for, happy plants! Not to mention that drifts of 0.5++ in 24hours & is known to cause unessasary stress too, why when adjusting PH its better to do it gradually & not just plonk-6.2-5.4 etc, this is stressfull.

noreason · Nov 24, 2010

Scrogerman said:
i think atmospheric Co2 another reason(could be wrong on that?), but its unlikely to be that anyway.

I think you're right SM.A part of the CO2 pumped in the water trough air pump will react with water turn into carbonic acid.
This stuff is used by acquarium enthusiast to keep the right pH for plants\fishes.

However,it's not this case.Tjo don't use extra CO2 so the water should not be affected from this.

Btw...I'm using extra CO2 and I'm noting a little pH drop...0.1 per day or so...I think CO2 is the reason.

Good luck tjo...I'm following your grow

Scrogerman · Nov 25, 2010

interesting observations noreason bro, Thanks for the feedback!

I know its not Co2 in Tjo's, i ddint mean it like i meant him, i was just trying to say atmospheric Co2 is known to drop PH(i think), but i said it wouldnt be that in his case, thats what i meant, if you read what i said back you will understand me bro. its no problems anyway. just taken wrong. 3 things i can think of to drop PH or make it 'dive' as apposed to 'climb', that was just one. EC & bacteria being the other 2.
Best of luck!

Q; does anyone know another reason that causes PH to 'dive'-(drift down)? apart from the ones mentioned!

noreason · Nov 25, 2010

Scrogerman,maybe my words let understand this,but I didn't want to tell you was referring to Tjo's grow

It was only to reassure Tjo this is not the case,so to don't take it in consideration

Peace bro

Sorry tjo for the little ot :wave:

Scrogerman · Nov 25, 2010

noreason said:
Scrogerman,maybe my words let understand this,but I didn't want to tell you was referring to Tjo's grow It was only to reassure Tjo this is not the case,so to don't take it in consideration
Peace bro

Sorry tjo for the little ot

Cool bro, i know you must have to translate etc, dont worry about it, its cool, your the man!

darko_G · Nov 25, 2010

dude this thread is moving quick lol... when the next pix coming?

tjo · Nov 27, 2010

hi all...

23 days of flower today.. today i have work to do..i have 2 change the water.
i was thinkink to raise my EC to 1,4..
before 3 days i raise the ec from 0,8 to 1,-1,2 and today my
ec is 0,8..plants are hungry! also my ph from 5,9 goes to 4,5 in 3 days..
i dont like the flower growth...flower getting bigger very slow..