this is what we need.
http://www.allergybuyersclubshopping.com/ebac-cd425-dehumidifier.html?psysVid=0apd4b2l
http://www.allergybuyersclubshopping.com/ebac-cd425-dehumidifier.html?psysVid=0apd4b2l
G
Guest
Man pico I wish I had your problem with the water.....
Man pico I wish I had your problem with the water.....
As you all know I have issues getting good water. But thanks to this thread I have collectors for all the water that comes off the roof. This is going to be an immense help and decrease of exposure. Thanks again for all the input.
If I had picos issues it would all take care of itself except that fuse..... electrical problems are always a worry. Even a small fire could bring some very unwanted guests. Keep an ABC extenguisher right next to my room.
Peace
Man pico I wish I had your problem with the water.....
As you all know I have issues getting good water. But thanks to this thread I have collectors for all the water that comes off the roof. This is going to be an immense help and decrease of exposure. Thanks again for all the input.
If I had picos issues it would all take care of itself except that fuse..... electrical problems are always a worry. Even a small fire could bring some very unwanted guests. Keep an ABC extenguisher right next to my room.
Peace
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Yep. I just installed smoke and carbon monoxide detectors. A few fire extenguishers.
No problem with water here. They don't measure usage here so I can have all the water I want for 30 bucks a month. Very clean water too.
The fuse was on a 1 foot heavy duty outlet multiplier. The just just started to pop when using the dehumidifier so I stopped using that cord. Works fine on another one and it never actually tripped the circuit breaker.
No problem with water here. They don't measure usage here so I can have all the water I want for 30 bucks a month. Very clean water too.
The fuse was on a 1 foot heavy duty outlet multiplier. The just just started to pop when using the dehumidifier so I stopped using that cord. Works fine on another one and it never actually tripped the circuit breaker.
G
Guest
hey neptune, id check to see if the A/C's dehumidifing functions working, my split system A/C (used) to suck the guts (so to speak) from my room, bit smaller then yours but it still should be taking somthing out, i had to put in a hydrofogger to keep my room above 35% that the A/C took out...
great thread SKELTOR!~
great thread SKELTOR!~
G
Guest
Thanks GZA......
Thanks GZA......
I was really leery of using the water off the roof also but on another thread a couple of the guys are using it and said they are showing almost not EC or ppm.
I actually disagreed for awhile until some stepped forward who were doing it successfully. I am going to send a sample off to have it tested.... most big companies that do water softeners and R/O will do tests for free and tell you everything in it... including any specific pollutants.
We had a major softener put in and R/O system due to well water that is crazy hard. Problem is not enough pressure to get more than 1/4 gal water per day out of the R/O system. Buying is too much exposure 30-40 gal at a time and many sucks. Best is Walmart distilled but definitely other growers around because the shit is gone as soon as they put it on the shelf. Bet the buy wonders, "what the hell", but never enough even going to different Walmarts around in thirty mile radius.
Hoping the water tests out. Not much rain or snow here either.
Peace
Thanks GZA......
I was really leery of using the water off the roof also but on another thread a couple of the guys are using it and said they are showing almost not EC or ppm.
I actually disagreed for awhile until some stepped forward who were doing it successfully. I am going to send a sample off to have it tested.... most big companies that do water softeners and R/O will do tests for free and tell you everything in it... including any specific pollutants.
We had a major softener put in and R/O system due to well water that is crazy hard. Problem is not enough pressure to get more than 1/4 gal water per day out of the R/O system. Buying is too much exposure 30-40 gal at a time and many sucks. Best is Walmart distilled but definitely other growers around because the shit is gone as soon as they put it on the shelf. Bet the buy wonders, "what the hell", but never enough even going to different Walmarts around in thirty mile radius.
Hoping the water tests out. Not much rain or snow here either.
Peace
G
Guest
Does anyone else that uses dehumidifier water notice the low PH?Its usually around 5 when I check it,its so clean though it just needs a few drops of ph up,the cleaner the water the more any nute or ph up/down will affect it.
^^Yeah...but as you said, it's easily taken care of.
G
Guest
I wonder what causes the ph to be so low when the water is so clean.I was under the impression that distilled water if done correctly would have 0 PPM and a 7.0 PH.Another words "pure" water is supposed to be neutral,I havent found this to be the case though.Even some of the bottled distilled water I used to use years ago had a low PH,I wonder why this is?
G
Guest
Skeletor and Sandman......
Skeletor and Sandman......
I have found that the pH changes seasonally also. I pretty strictly have used Walmart distilled for the past few years. The pH will be pretty much the same for a few months and then it shifts in the next batch I get. Weird....... The reason I use it is because the EC is usually 0-5. I tested everything around our area and all had ECs higher but some had higher pHs. Don't know what it is but doesn't hold a current whatever it is.
Peace
Skeletor and Sandman......
I have found that the pH changes seasonally also. I pretty strictly have used Walmart distilled for the past few years. The pH will be pretty much the same for a few months and then it shifts in the next batch I get. Weird....... The reason I use it is because the EC is usually 0-5. I tested everything around our area and all had ECs higher but some had higher pHs. Don't know what it is but doesn't hold a current whatever it is.
Peace
G
Guest
Is it true that "pure" water with 0 ppm will always have a 7.0 ph or not?
I've got a feeling that since we're both running CO2, we may be forming carbonic acid through the condensate somehow and that's what's dropping the PH...dunno...anyone else got any possible ideas of why this is happening? 
I haven't had to buy water in several months now, so I'm perfectly willing to deal with minor PH flux but of course I'd rather not have to mess with it if I didn't have to...
Supposedly...but then again when the water is that clean getting 1ppm of contaminent could dramatically alter the PH.
I haven't had to buy water in several months now, so I'm perfectly willing to deal with minor PH flux but of course I'd rather not have to mess with it if I didn't have to...Skeletor said:
Supposedly...but then again when the water is that clean getting 1ppm of contaminent could dramatically alter the PH.
G
Guest
Great questions!!!!!!!
Great questions!!!!!!!
I have had distilled water that had a 0 EC with a freshly calibrated Hanna tester that has pH in the 5.35 range. I wonder if there are organic substances that do not conduct electricity and therefore are not detected by the meters.???
Sandman--I have often wondered that myself and it doesn't have to even form carbonic acid. Carbon Dioxide is a acid when dissolved in blood in the human body. Just like the oxygen gets mixed and dissolves into the water, there is no reason carbon dioxide would not do the same. I have notice I have been putting much more pH up in since I increased my CO2 up to 2500ppm. Carbon dioxide moves across the membranes in the little sacks in the lungs where oxygen exchange happens.... 20x faster than oxygen. Good thought man. Crossed my mind before but never really thought it through but I definitely think you hit on something there. If you added increased CO2 levels in an enclosed office space and then pulled blood gases.... they definitely would have increased CO2 levels... it is called hypercapnia. We are mostly made of water so it makes perfect sense. Gases do not carry an electrical current and therefore would not show on EC, TDS, or ppm meters.
Peace
Am a specialist in the human body by profession even though you couldn't tell it by my writing ability.
Great questions!!!!!!!
I have had distilled water that had a 0 EC with a freshly calibrated Hanna tester that has pH in the 5.35 range. I wonder if there are organic substances that do not conduct electricity and therefore are not detected by the meters.???
Sandman--I have often wondered that myself and it doesn't have to even form carbonic acid. Carbon Dioxide is a acid when dissolved in blood in the human body. Just like the oxygen gets mixed and dissolves into the water, there is no reason carbon dioxide would not do the same. I have notice I have been putting much more pH up in since I increased my CO2 up to 2500ppm. Carbon dioxide moves across the membranes in the little sacks in the lungs where oxygen exchange happens.... 20x faster than oxygen. Good thought man. Crossed my mind before but never really thought it through but I definitely think you hit on something there. If you added increased CO2 levels in an enclosed office space and then pulled blood gases.... they definitely would have increased CO2 levels... it is called hypercapnia. We are mostly made of water so it makes perfect sense. Gases do not carry an electrical current and therefore would not show on EC, TDS, or ppm meters.
Peace
Am a specialist in the human body by profession even though you couldn't tell it by my writing ability.
Hmmm....I think you are on to something with disolve CO2...I guess I didn't think about it as a disolved gas like that, but it makes perfect sense. My bubblers in my res may actually be working against me somewhat since they're probably introducing higher levels of CO2 than normal. Maybe remote the res outta the grow area?
As far as I know the only way to remove disolved CO2 gas from H2O is to boil it...anyone else have any input on this that might offer a cheap perpetual way to remove trapped CO2 from the rez?
As far as I know the only way to remove disolved CO2 gas from H2O is to boil it...anyone else have any input on this that might offer a cheap perpetual way to remove trapped CO2 from the rez?
G
Guest
VT I sure wish we could.....
VT I sure wish we could.....
I really think Sandman came up with something there. Dissolved C02 in the res would account for a pH shift without an appreciable change in the EC due to it not conducting electricity. I wish I had full access to our lab. CO2 acts as an acid in the body while dissolved so why wouldn't it in the res.
My air pumps sit on the floor. CO2 is heavier than air so would be more concentrated there despite major air circulation. Since I have raised the CO2 levels in my room, I have had to raise the pH back up every day from about 5.2 and takes quite a bit even though not adding ferts with it. I changed the res couple weeks ago. Definitely could be explained like that. CO2 will displace some of the waters ability to dissolve O2 in it also. I am going to move the air pumps out of the room.
As far as removing the CO2 from the water. Just let it go. The CO2 will go from a greater concentration to a lesser concentration. But just thought of that too, CO2 will be absorbed from the surface of the water into itself, for the same reason, but in reverse. That is how non-turbulent water has enough O2 for fish up to very high altitudes. The pressure causes it to diffuse into the liquid but at very high altitudes like 13,000 the lakes can not support fish due to not enough 02 in the water. Same percentages of O2 but less dense... Kind of a trip. When we add CO2 to our rooms we create an actual pressure if you will to cause diffusion of the CO2 into the waters. One way to tell would be a room with the res inside with the high CO2 and bubblers and a CO2 room with a res outside with bubblers outside...... according to the laws that apply to human physiology the res in the room would definitely show a difference.
Wish we had a chemist, physicist, and marine biologist on hand.
Lots to think about.
Peace
VT I sure wish we could.....
I really think Sandman came up with something there. Dissolved C02 in the res would account for a pH shift without an appreciable change in the EC due to it not conducting electricity. I wish I had full access to our lab. CO2 acts as an acid in the body while dissolved so why wouldn't it in the res.
My air pumps sit on the floor. CO2 is heavier than air so would be more concentrated there despite major air circulation. Since I have raised the CO2 levels in my room, I have had to raise the pH back up every day from about 5.2 and takes quite a bit even though not adding ferts with it. I changed the res couple weeks ago. Definitely could be explained like that. CO2 will displace some of the waters ability to dissolve O2 in it also. I am going to move the air pumps out of the room.
As far as removing the CO2 from the water. Just let it go. The CO2 will go from a greater concentration to a lesser concentration. But just thought of that too, CO2 will be absorbed from the surface of the water into itself, for the same reason, but in reverse. That is how non-turbulent water has enough O2 for fish up to very high altitudes. The pressure causes it to diffuse into the liquid but at very high altitudes like 13,000 the lakes can not support fish due to not enough 02 in the water. Same percentages of O2 but less dense... Kind of a trip. When we add CO2 to our rooms we create an actual pressure if you will to cause diffusion of the CO2 into the waters. One way to tell would be a room with the res inside with the high CO2 and bubblers and a CO2 room with a res outside with bubblers outside...... according to the laws that apply to human physiology the res in the room would definitely show a difference.
Wish we had a chemist, physicist, and marine biologist on hand.
Lots to think about.
Peace
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N
Neptune
Bree,
interesting post... things to think about.
I am just setting up my CO2 enrichment and I do use air bubblers in my res. What are the problems I will encounter, aside from lowering the PH? This is actually a good thing for me, since my Hydroponic PH is usually 6.4 in the winter.
Will it be imperative for me to move the airpumps outside of the room?
Or is it something you can deal with?
interesting post... things to think about.
I am just setting up my CO2 enrichment and I do use air bubblers in my res. What are the problems I will encounter, aside from lowering the PH? This is actually a good thing for me, since my Hydroponic PH is usually 6.4 in the winter.
Will it be imperative for me to move the airpumps outside of the room?
Or is it something you can deal with?
G
Guest
Neptune and others......
Neptune and others......
I have been doing some research on the subject for quite some time today. I think we really do have something here that is not covered in any of the current grow books.
The CO2 definitely will dissolve in the reservoir just as oxygen would up to a point even if bubblers were not used. By increasing the the CO2 in the area, we are increasing the atmospheric pressure of the CO2 (or partial pressure that is what it is called inside the air sacs of the lungs) on the surface of the water. If using bubblers, we are also increasing its diffusion into the reservoir just like oxygen. Now is this a bad thing or not?
Water has a capacity to hold a finite amount of dissolved gases but just because we are causing more CO2 to dissolve does not mean we are limiting O2 in the reservoir but we could be. We also are very obsessive about our hobby and tend to push the limits of all parameters which means we want to dissolve as much O2 as possible and not something that does not assist. So this part of the question is unanswered.
Next, the question of pH. I had noticed long ago that at times my reservoir pH would drop and despite compensation and solution changes it would always be down again the next day. Thought of many other variables, respiration of microbes (good and bad) in the reservoir, temperature changes, build up of organic components etc. Eliminated these one by one through various tests. Now I am almost certain it had to do with the subject at hand; thanks to Sandmans brain storm... I went back over log books and these times always corresponded to periods when I concentrated on keeping the CO2 up due to need for increased growth rates such as accelerated veg, flowering or hurrying a batch from one stage to the other. Possible down sides of the pH issue that I can think of are over compensation with Potassium hydroxide or carbonate to compensate for pH shifts. Many negative aspects can be the outcome of this but deficiencies due to nutrient ratios and lock out would be the worst. It may be why Mg and Calcium enrichment is so needed during these times. (not saying it shouldn't for other reasons) but may explain the spots and blemishes often noted during flowering on foliage due to CO2 use particularly during this time.
CO2 is not needed for roots but oxygen is... I know this is an obvious statement. So I think this is a phenomenon thant requires more investigation and thought.
I have to state again I am not an expert on plant physiology but am on human physiology and cellular function but have found them to be very similar in function just not in parameters. Cardiac muscle does not respond to medications (which usually work by effects of ion shift modification) due to intracellular acidosis caused by a build up of lactic acid which does convert to CO2...thus the need for ventilation during resuscitation.
Simply this means that the acidic state in the roots intracellularly could be causing negative effects, and definitely does not cause good ones. The intracellular CO2 in root cells that are exposed to water with abnormally high CO2 levels would have to be increased and effect abilities to exchange cations and anions....... Not sure of the application of these concepts but think it should be a subject for discussion, thought, and experimentaton.
Peace
Neptune and others......
I have been doing some research on the subject for quite some time today. I think we really do have something here that is not covered in any of the current grow books.
The CO2 definitely will dissolve in the reservoir just as oxygen would up to a point even if bubblers were not used. By increasing the the CO2 in the area, we are increasing the atmospheric pressure of the CO2 (or partial pressure that is what it is called inside the air sacs of the lungs) on the surface of the water. If using bubblers, we are also increasing its diffusion into the reservoir just like oxygen. Now is this a bad thing or not?
Water has a capacity to hold a finite amount of dissolved gases but just because we are causing more CO2 to dissolve does not mean we are limiting O2 in the reservoir but we could be. We also are very obsessive about our hobby and tend to push the limits of all parameters which means we want to dissolve as much O2 as possible and not something that does not assist. So this part of the question is unanswered.
Next, the question of pH. I had noticed long ago that at times my reservoir pH would drop and despite compensation and solution changes it would always be down again the next day. Thought of many other variables, respiration of microbes (good and bad) in the reservoir, temperature changes, build up of organic components etc. Eliminated these one by one through various tests. Now I am almost certain it had to do with the subject at hand; thanks to Sandmans brain storm... I went back over log books and these times always corresponded to periods when I concentrated on keeping the CO2 up due to need for increased growth rates such as accelerated veg, flowering or hurrying a batch from one stage to the other. Possible down sides of the pH issue that I can think of are over compensation with Potassium hydroxide or carbonate to compensate for pH shifts. Many negative aspects can be the outcome of this but deficiencies due to nutrient ratios and lock out would be the worst. It may be why Mg and Calcium enrichment is so needed during these times. (not saying it shouldn't for other reasons) but may explain the spots and blemishes often noted during flowering on foliage due to CO2 use particularly during this time.
CO2 is not needed for roots but oxygen is... I know this is an obvious statement. So I think this is a phenomenon thant requires more investigation and thought.
I have to state again I am not an expert on plant physiology but am on human physiology and cellular function but have found them to be very similar in function just not in parameters. Cardiac muscle does not respond to medications (which usually work by effects of ion shift modification) due to intracellular acidosis caused by a build up of lactic acid which does convert to CO2...thus the need for ventilation during resuscitation.
Simply this means that the acidic state in the roots intracellularly could be causing negative effects, and definitely does not cause good ones. The intracellular CO2 in root cells that are exposed to water with abnormally high CO2 levels would have to be increased and effect abilities to exchange cations and anions....... Not sure of the application of these concepts but think it should be a subject for discussion, thought, and experimentaton.
Peace
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G
Guest
You hydro folks really need to post this in the hydro section,I think its pretty important.Not that it shouldn't be here also
