Mezz Mezzrow
Member
Really? huh.
poll: Who puts tabacco in their joints
- Thread starter rashboy99
- Start date
Really? huh.
first thing to come up in google.
Jens Peter Bork, M.D., Internal Medicine, Erlangen University Hospital
http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/2005-02/1109562409.Me.r.html
Jens Peter Bork, M.D., Internal Medicine, Erlangen University Hospital
http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/2005-02/1109562409.Me.r.html
Mezz Mezzrow
Member
But it brings up that question of if a carcinogen doesn't cause cancer is it still a carcinogen? I mean causing cancer and having carcinogens aren't necessarily the same thing. I'm not being pedantic. Cannabis does not cause cancer, correct?
...filth
haha i know what you mean mate, no cannabis in and of itself isn't what would cause cancer, but the smoking of cannabis is able to as the smoke contains the carcinogens. same as if you were inhaling smoke from cigarettes, car tyres, human hair etc. it's more to do with the smoke being carcinogenic than the item that was burned. you can still ingest or inhale vapor etc of cannabis and carcinogens (to my knowledge) aren't present. for cannabis the chemicals that get you high are effectively physically harmless (links with mental illness aside), though it's the plant matter becoming smoke that is the issue.
E
elmanito
The carcinogens in Cannabis smoke are neutralized by the cannabinoids which has anticarcinogenic properties.There is no direct link that someone ever died of lung cancer caused by smoking Cannabis.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJmQ16cGBHU
Namaste
The carcinogens in Cannabis smoke are neutralized by the cannabinoids which has anticarcinogenic properties.There is no direct link that someone ever died of lung cancer caused by smoking Cannabis.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJmQ16cGBHU
Namaste
Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse. “Legalization: Panacea or Pandora’s Box.” New York. (1995): 36.
Turner, Carlton E. The Marijuana Controversy. Rockville: American Council for Drug Education, 1981.
Nahas, Gabriel G. and Nicholas A. Pace. Letter. “Marijuana as Chemotherapy Aid Poses Hazards.” New York Times 4 December 1993: A20.
Inaba, Darryl S. and William E. Cohen. Uppers, Downers, All-Arounders: Physical and Mental Effects of Psychoactive Drugs. 2nd ed. Ashland: CNS Productions, 1995. 174.
http://www.drugpolicy.org/marijuana/factsmyths/
getting cancer is always related to chance. i know people who've smoked a pack a day and are 90 yrs old and have no signs of illness from tobacco at all... i know others who smoked much less and copped a lot worse.
part of the reason it's so hard to find any information about cancer in cannabis users and directly attributing it to cannabis is the fact that so many cannabis smokers also smoke tobacco, whether in joints with cannabis or as cigarettes themselves. so even if the cannabis were to cause cancer in those people it's more likely to be attributed to tobacco. carcinogens no matter what form, exposed to any part of your body will have some chance of causing cancer, because that's the chemical's effect on living tissue... the chance of it doing so may be relative high or relatively low, but the chance is still there. if i throw a rock into a crowd of 1 000 people, chances are it won't hit you. but just because it may miss you many times in a row, doesn't mean that it is impossible for it to hit you.
E
elmanito
These are the worst scientists you ever can imagine.Both were working for the US government.Turner was drug czar during the Reagan administration and the researches of Gabriel Nahas are fraudulence.Gabriel was using gas masks on monkeys to show that cannabis smoke was causing brain damage, but the brain damage was caused by carbon monoxide because the monkeys didn't get any oxygen to breath.
Homework
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9077214414651731007#
Namaste
These are the worst scientists you ever can imagine.Both were working for the US government.Turner was drug czar during the Reagan administration and the researches of Gabriel Nahas are fraudulence.Gabriel was using gas masks on monkeys to show that cannabis smoke was causing brain damage, but the brain damage was caused by carbon monoxide because the monkeys didn't get any oxygen to breath.
Homework
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-9077214414651731007#
Namaste
yeah i know that
but that doesn't negate the fact that their research alongside many others have proved carcinogens occur in cannabis smoke, as it does any form of smoke. i'm not saying their other experiments weren't incredibly flawed for the hypotheses they were chasing or that they didn't have an agenda but from what i know they found carcinogens in the smoke as many others have too, which is my point. though i do agree cannabis smoke is much much safer (in relative terms) when compared to that of tobacco.
E
elmanito
That's correct that they found carcinogens in Cannabis smoke, but other scientists found that the cannabinoid group has anticarcinogenic properties and the group has even stronger antioxidant properties than vitamin C & E.No substances with anticarcinogenic or antioxidant properties have ever been found in Tobacco.
Namaste
Namaste
true, but both anti-carcinogens and carcinogens aren't going to counter one another directly, so i'd suggest everyone just beware of the risks, alongside all the benefits.
exactly what i was trying to say a few pages back. wonderful though mj is, to argue that smoking it is harmless is a bit of a stretch.
VG
hehe it's good we have many options for using it though, i'll move onto hash or vaping when i have the resources
Motta-Tokka
Member
Tried it a few times and I did not like it at all. You smoke cigs and pot differently and holding in a cig mix is gross. I also smoke cigs regularly but never mixed. On another note I would love to quit the cigs. Wife told me my breath smelled like hot poop.
E
elmanito
You forget the endocannabinoid system in humans.
Namaste
hi elmanito
the endocannabinoid system wont take away the harm to the respiratory system caused by smoking weed, its not the cannabinoids but the other 80 or so percent of the mass of weed that has been shown to release toxins, some of them proven carcinogens, when it is burnt.
VG
Panoramical
Member
I smoke with tobacco, not because i prefer it, but because i can't afford to smoke it pure. In an ideal world i wouldn't smoke it with tobacco, but the supply i have access to doesn't meet my demand, therefore making it far too expensive. If i were to smoke the weed i buy (£10/g) pure, that'd be about £10 ($16) a joint. i can't afford that, which is a reason why i'm growing.
Onto the smoke being a carcinogen subject; I'm with VG on this one. Those of you who think inhaling cannabis smoke is harmless are deluded. Burning any organic substance will produce carcinogens.
Just because you may know a number of smokers that have smoked weed for 50 years and don't have cancer, doesn't mean it doesn't cause cancer, or prevent cancer (unless you vape or eat, maybe). Every individual will react differently to carcinogens over time. Some may get cancer, some may not. This is a big part of what the scientists are researching. But just because I know this woman who smoked for 95 years and didn't get cancer, doesn't mean everyone who smokes tobacco for the same period, won't get cancer either.
I'm interested in the theory about anti-carcinogens in neutralising the carcinogens. Really though? Has research been done on this or is it a myth pot smokers have created for their own peace of mind?
If you're so keen on avoiding carcinogens, why don't you just vape your bud or eat it, instead of denying that cannabis smoke could ever be bad for you. I love green just as much as the next man on this forum, but i'm still aware not smoking it is far better for my lungs than smoking it. However many anti-carcinogens are floating around in that lovely smoke, I'm not convinced they neutralise all the carcinogens. But lets face it - being high makes up for it all.
Now I think i'm gonna roll up a fat cheesey zoot (yes, with tobacco) and sit at the bottom of my garden in the sunshine, happily inhaling all the toxins in the smoke and just hope that maybe I'm one of those that won't get cancer
Onto the smoke being a carcinogen subject; I'm with VG on this one. Those of you who think inhaling cannabis smoke is harmless are deluded. Burning any organic substance will produce carcinogens.
Just because you may know a number of smokers that have smoked weed for 50 years and don't have cancer, doesn't mean it doesn't cause cancer, or prevent cancer (unless you vape or eat, maybe). Every individual will react differently to carcinogens over time. Some may get cancer, some may not. This is a big part of what the scientists are researching. But just because I know this woman who smoked for 95 years and didn't get cancer, doesn't mean everyone who smokes tobacco for the same period, won't get cancer either.
I'm interested in the theory about anti-carcinogens in neutralising the carcinogens. Really though? Has research been done on this or is it a myth pot smokers have created for their own peace of mind?
If you're so keen on avoiding carcinogens, why don't you just vape your bud or eat it, instead of denying that cannabis smoke could ever be bad for you. I love green just as much as the next man on this forum, but i'm still aware not smoking it is far better for my lungs than smoking it. However many anti-carcinogens are floating around in that lovely smoke, I'm not convinced they neutralise all the carcinogens. But lets face it - being high makes up for it all.
Now I think i'm gonna roll up a fat cheesey zoot (yes, with tobacco) and sit at the bottom of my garden in the sunshine, happily inhaling all the toxins in the smoke and just hope that maybe I'm one of those that won't get cancer
Panoramical
Member
I always assumed that smoking with a filter won't get you as high. Would you agree?
I've thought this since making secret-agents (emptying a cigarette and filling it with weed) as a way of disguising (visually) what we were smoking. And I was convinced they didn't get me as high.
I suppose the real question is; what does a filter catch and what does it let through?
Anyone?...
how much is your health/life worth? you're from the uk, so you have access to honey blend herbs - http://www.honeyrose.co.uk/prod10.html
it costs a few dollars for a ton of this stuff, probably 10 cigarette packets worth and it makes the smoke smoother without any filthy tobacco related chemicals added to it. it's made from pure, natural ingredients are found in Honeyrose Herbal Cigarettes: rose petals, marshmallow leaves, red clover flowers, honey and apple juice. this stuff is used to help smokers quit. any tobacconist will sell this... why are you not mixing with it? i bought 1 pack over 6 months ago and am barely half way through it, lol 25c a month or less is pretty easy to come by compared to the ridiculous price of cigs, monetary wise and health wise.
Panoramical
Member
because i wasn't aware of it's existence, thank you for bringing it to my attention.
i suppose the reason i still use tobacco - even after quitting smoking cigarettes 2 years ago - is because I've always used it to mix with weed. habit sticks.
i'll go to my local tobacconists today and see if they stock it.
The only thing I did try once was some herbs they had in a cafe in Dam, after the smoking ban was brought in. I thought it was awful.
Have you tested a lot of these tobacco like products? I'd not even thought of trying anything else until I read Dödsknark's post earlier in this thread, where he suggest mullein as an alternative.
