Original Haze hybrids and psychohaze phenotypes

[RandyCalifornia]

there is no relation between how buds look and how much psychoactive they are. no.

I don't think it's the density that matters, I think that the time flowering matters.
My experience has been the floofier buds(shawaggy refers to badly grown where I'm at.) have had the best high, not saying that no one will find grail in hard buds just that I have not. And it's quality of smoking and high I'm talking about, not just stone power.

I found it in F1 haze hybrid, only 90 days needed. not really schwaggy buds, and the effect was better than most of those long flowering ones.

So Maha, you think that the plant is wasting time going 4-8 more weeks longer flowering than another plant? Or could it be doing something with all that time?
Maybe I need to try some WallyDuck seeds.

Spectacular. My kind of weed. What is it?

Thank you, the top one is Purple Congo x HolyHanh and the second and third are HolyHanh.
HolyHanh= Nevil's Haze x Lieu Hanh

 

[Sub24ox7]

Punto Rojo x Congo (vision creator cut)

 

[Sub24ox7]

Icmag haze(seedsman haze)

 

[Sub24ox7]

Purple haze v2

 

[Limeygreen]

Punto Rojo x Congo (vision creator cut)

Looking good, how are the smells for you? Stretch is pretty reasonable no?

 

[Sub24ox7]

Stretch is good, not to much and smell is really really good and smelly on most and definitely lemon foremost with a little dirty smell so far.

 

[MAHA KALA]

I gotcha...
So if you can see through the flowers and it looks like a broom people assume it's going to take them to outer-space?

My first original Haze was like that. I thought I was going on a journey for sure. 25 weeks at 11/13.
It's very dreamy though. And it has some optimism in it. So I guess it was worth the wait

yes, narrow leaf extremists. they also very often judge plant according to how much narrow leaf is... while again there is not connection between shape of leaf and effect. it is only association of human mind, when somebody got tripped out on needle leaf sativa, so it can appear it works like that. but not really. no scientific fact for it out there.

look at toms haze, some call it skunkhaze or that there is deep chunk in it... because they are looking at leaf. if they would judge it according to effect, cant write such bullshit. there are narrow leaf long flowering ones, that will knock out you on your ass, makes red eyes and makes you lazy... it is different than indica, but sure it is not electric flying high. pretty dissapointing for 16/18 weekers. I would rather smoke broader leaf plant which gives me electric high instead of narrow leaf which gives me relaxing dreamy high. my opinion. most of those long flowering ones are not worthy, you need to find that one in 50 or 100. then it is very worthy

So Maha, you think that the plant is wasting time going 4-8 more weeks longer flowering than another plant? Or could it be doing something with all that time?

I dont say anything. I just shared my experience. I dont think so. first weeks of nld flowering is not flowering anyway. it is kind of vegging - first 4/6 weeks, and there is very little resin production. so time for producing resin would be same long for 90 days or for 120 days.

look of buds has nothing to do with smoke effect.

indica in nevilles haze or bandaid haze is not visible in the look, it looks sativa, but ceiling is lower(due to indica) than at original haze from my experience, the look means nothing imo.

 

[TPFTFW]

It is not opposite of what you are doing, it can be considered as a first step towards what you are doing. By using Trainwreck in your Haze hybrids, you are one step further, simply a head start. Remember that to create Trainwreck, someone had to cross Ghani to Mexican/Thai which is same principle, as what I am doing, isnt it?

I am open to any result, just dont want to dismiss anything in hypothetical discussion. I will let you know and maybe some others will chime in with their kushyhaze experience.

as someone also with a lot of PK experience.. I can attest that that pic you posted of the pk x I haze looked fucking insane and is prolly insanely potent.
I’ve become obsessed with making something similar now haha.
gonna cross a pk to the haley comet for sure.

And @MAHA KALA all these hybrids of yours look great too

 

[RandyCalifornia]

producing resin would be same long for 90 days or for 120 days.

What about for 60 days?
Can it also be as good as 90 day or 120 day?

 

[MAHA KALA]

What about for 60 days?
Can it also be as good as 90 day or 120 day?

hehehehehe I had 65 days pheno of otm x deep chunk haze, very floral and it smoked like the best toms haze. only first hour hehehe. so yes, but duration will be drasctically shortened and followed by relaxing effect, which sativa lovers dont like.

this is pheno of grandfunk(25% of trainwreck - tw itself is like 70% sativa, the rest is thai and thai haze), which took like 15 weeks to finish. it is the stuff you would like probably. it gives strong head high, space out trippy dream with total hazy cartoon vision, for like 8 hours instantly. no joke. I didnt like it. it was too instant to the point it became boring, no change for 8 hours... just strong overwhelming buzzing.

I like shorter flowering phenos more, they were more electric and flying levitation, and it has some development, first ringing in the ears then some electric waves through body then some euphoria. I like when effect has development, more degrees of consciousness shift. from cut it is quite compact, but sure it is not dense like kush, and it has totally different texture than indica. it is very sativa.

 

[MAHA KALA]

Okay after some time curing in a GroveBag Ill give a little report on the Mindblower haze pheno 1 the more colourful and dense of the two phenotypes.

View attachment 18131637

As you can see lots of shiny trichome coverage and not the greatest trim job by me. Sticking my head in the grove bag and taking a big inhale... I get hazey oily metallic smell. I notice though that it smells musky/kushy almost from a distance of more than about 0.5m. It smells through bags. Not the smelliest cannabis I have had but no slouch in that department IMO in terms of how strong the smell is.

I find the high very similar to Mindblower Haze 3 but a bit heavier at the end. It still brings an onrush of electric energy feeling in my chest... but I find the burnout to come a wee bit faster. I gave some of this flower to a friend who has only been smoking dispensary cannabis (I know, I know not exactly a glowing recommendation)... she has sent me about 5 texts about how good it smells and how it reminds of of prelegalization cannabis here in Canada. (The AAA stuff you could sometimes get). I have got more compliments about this strain than any other I have grown in my modest 3 years or growing this wonderful plant.

I find I really like listening to music after a nice J of MB Haze. The music seems to swell in my chest and seems more.

View attachment 18131639 View attachment 18131640



Here are some MB Haze 1 clones I passed out to a friend that look ready to take over part of his 10x10. Topped multiple times. Sorry not sure how to flip them the right way around.

MB Haze is a lovely variety... I hope to find some space to run it again.

great to hear you enjoy it man. and your friend too!

it sure is mix of two old school heirlooms.

I like that rush too, it is from haze male. odor is from hawaiian. does MB3 still smell pineapple?

 

[GreenAndFast]

Acid beauty

 

[OldCoolSativa]

yes, narrow leaf extremists. they also very often judge plant according to how much narrow leaf is... while again there is not connection between shape of leaf and effect. it is only association of human mind, when somebody got tripped out on needle leaf sativa, so it can appear it works like that. but not really. no scientific fact for it out there.

look at toms haze, some call it skunkhaze or that there is deep chunk in it... because they are looking at leaf. if they would judge it according to effect, cant write such bullshit. there are narrow leaf long flowering ones, that will knock out you on your ass, makes red eyes and makes you lazy... it is different than indica, but sure it is not electric flying high. pretty dissapointing for 16/18 weekers. I would rather smoke broader leaf plant which gives me electric high instead of narrow leaf which gives me relaxing dreamy high. my opinion. most of those long flowering ones are not worthy, you need to find that one in 50 or 100. then it is very worthy

I dont say anything. I just shared my experience. I dont think so. first weeks of nld flowering is not flowering anyway. it is kind of vegging - first 4/6 weeks, and there is very little resin production. so time for producing resin would be same long for 90 days or for 120 days.

look of buds has nothing to do with smoke effect.

indica in nevilles haze or bandaid haze is not visible in the look, it looks sativa, but ceiling is lower(due to indica) than at original haze from my experience, the look means nothing imo.

I disagree. Respectfully.

 

[MallardDuck]

great to hear you enjoy it man. and your friend too!

it sure is mix of two old school heirlooms.

I like that rush too, it is from haze male. odor is from hawaiian. does MB3 still smell pineapple?

Yes I enjoy it very much my friend.

Yes MB3 smells of haze and dirty oily pineapple. I have also sent a cut of the MB3 to a friend who also runs a cut of Jamaican Pineapple Haze (Jamaican Pineapple skunk x O Haze) from White Buffalo Seed Collective! Its going to be a Pineapple Haze Party in there.

 

[Donald Mallard]

I disagree. Respectfully.

can you elaborate on what you disagree with,
maybe you are misunderstanding,
or maybe it wasn't described properly and something needs to be cleared up??

 

[Limeygreen]

Stretch is good, not to much and smell is really really good and smelly on most and definitely lemon foremost with a little dirty smell so far.

I don't know if you've had the congo cut before or not, lemon boot polish type smells with woody scents.

They look very happy, should be a pretty good yield too it looks like, great work

 

[OldCoolSativa]

can you elaborate on what you disagree with,
maybe you are misunderstanding,
or maybe it wasn't described properly and something needs to be cleared up??

Certainly. FWIW, I was replying to MK's post (#1227).

I disagree that there is no connection between shape of leaf and effect. Of course there is, at least in my experience. While there are always outliers, skinny-leaf plants tend to have a less narcotic effect than broad leaf. It's not a hard-and-fast rule, but I have used leaf morphology as one of my selection criterion for plants in veg, and especially with landrace sativas, it has been my experience that the plants with the skinniest leaves often turn out to be the keepers when selecting for quality of effect, which is what I select for. Obviously there are other selection criteria, but for plants in veg, all you really have is leaf morphology, internodal spacing, hollow stems, and aroma. Not surprisingly, long skinny leaves usually correlate with longer internode spacing, because it's a sativa characteristic.

I disagree with the statement that most of the long-flowering plants are not worthy, and that you need to find that one in 50 or 100. Maybe I'm lucky, or maybe it's because I try to start with good genetics. but I not only prefer the long-flowering (18+ weeks) plants, but I select for long flowering. Yes, again there are exceptions, but it has been my experience with sativas and with haze hybrids that the longest flowering ones give me the effects I prefer. I smoked trip weed in 1974 or 1975 that gave me full on hallucinations. Haven't seen it since. There are over 5,300 replies to the "search for trip weed" thread and as far as I can tell nobody has really found it. Why? Because in 1975 the only weed you could buy was grown in tropical climates and took forever to flower, and since then every breeder of note has worked to reduce flower time. Magical effects take time, and some things can't be hurried.

I disagree strongly that the look of buds has nothing to do with smoke effect. I'd always prefer to smoke a Grinspoon-looking bud than a round, dense Indica golf ball. I select for fenotrigo bud structure and on every occasion I've grown a plant with that structure the effect has been extraordinary. Those who have come close to finding trip weed will probably tell you the plant had airy sativa buds and/or fenotrigo structure. Fenotrigo structure takes a long time to develop...you don't even see it start until 12-14 weeks.

I disagree that the time for producing resin is the same for 90-day plants and 120-day plants. A 120-day plant starts to produce resin at week 4, and finishes at 17 weeks. That's 90 days of resin production. I prefer 140-day plants. A 20-week sativa will produce resin for 14-15 weeks. More importantly, that extra time allows the plant to develop the necessary systems to produce truly special cannabinoid and terpene profiles that are simply not available in a 90-day plant.

I disagree that Bandaid Haze looks like a pure sativas because it doesn't, at least to me. And some NH plants can look decidedly non sativa.

This is all subjective but this has been my experience.

Proud to be an "extremist."

 

[Limeygreen]

For the Grandfunk haze reports, several things to note, curing is making them much more potent overall on the strongest ones, the ones that were good after drying didn't get much more potent compared to the stronger ones. 2 out of the 6 were quite potent and now getting stronger and stronger. The best effect one that is chunkier and uneasy electric is great, makes you pace around, jittery body, introspective for sure, good taste of lemon woody, not the strongest smell or taste but it's still having a good taste. Only problem is my tolerance seems to build quickly to it, so after a few nights in a row it's not having the same effect and I need to switch up to get the same effect, it's still strong but the body and mind are getting used to it. 5 hours when I haven't had it for awhile, so good legs on the first hit, then gets shorter each night.

The other pheno is not as chunky flowers, more foxtails woody metallic smells and taste, quite a good centred high, electric still but not jittery, good feeling and more euphoria but not super euphoric if that makes sense. A friend grew out some thai stick from mad mac that make them from gypsy nirvana stock and likened this pheno to similar of the thai stick pheno so I call it thai stick pheno (it is not thai stick I know, just in terms of description) tolerance build up is less on this pheno but still builds up faster than tom hill haze for an example or faster than mextasy.

The other phenos had some purple foxtail that was the tastiest and best effect when dry at first but became more pale in comparison as the curing went on. there was a beautiful chunky pheno with lime green flowers that had a really good euphoria and feel good high that just didn't improve with curing and became ho hum compared to the top two. The other two were just alright in the end not much note worthly on them other than great resin on them all.

Friends have liked them so far, will pass out a few cuts to people interested, quick sativa hybrid with great resin and some have amazing tastes.

 

[Limeygreen]

Certainly. FWIW, I was replying to MK's post (#1227).

I disagree that there is no connection between shape of leaf and effect. Of course there is, at least in my experience. While there are always outliers, skinny-leaf plants tend to have a less narcotic effect than broad leaf. It's not a hard-and-fast rule, but I have used leaf morphology as one of my selection criterion for plants in veg, and especially with landrace sativas, it has been my experience that the plants with the skinniest leaves often turn out to be the keepers when selecting for quality of effect, which is what I select for. Obviously there are other selection criteria, but for plants in veg, all you really have is leaf morphology, internodal spacing, hollow stems, and aroma. Not surprisingly, long skinny leaves usually correlate with longer internode spacing, because it's a sativa characteristic.

I disagree with the statement that most of the long-flowering plants are not worthy, and that you need to find that one in 50 or 100. Maybe I'm lucky, or maybe it's because I try to start with good genetics. but I not only prefer the long-flowering (18+ weeks) plants, but I select for long flowering. Yes, again there are exceptions, but it has been my experience with sativas and with haze hybrids that the longest flowering ones give me the effects I prefer. I smoked trip weed in 1974 or 1975 that gave me full on hallucinations. Haven't seen it since. There are over 5,300 replies to the "search for trip weed" thread and as far as I can tell nobody has really found it. Why? Because in 1975 the only weed you could buy was grown in tropical climates and took forever to flower, and since then every breeder of note has worked to reduce flower time. Magical effects take time, and some things can't be hurried.

I disagree strongly that the look of buds has nothing to do with smoke effect. I'd always prefer to smoke a Grinspoon-looking bud than a round, dense Indica golf ball. I select for fenotrigo bud structure and on every occasion I've grown a plant with that structure the effect has been extraordinary. Those who have come close to finding trip weed will probably tell you the plant had airy sativa buds and/or fenotrigo structure. Fenotrigo structure takes a long time to develop...you don't even see it start until 12-14 weeks.

I disagree that the time for producing resin is the same for 90-day plants and 120-day plants. A 120-day plant starts to produce resin at week 4, and finishes at 17 weeks. That's 90 days of resin production. I prefer 140-day plants. A 20-week sativa will produce resin for 14-5 weeks. More importantly, that extra time allows the plant to develop the necessary systems to produce truly special cannabinoid and terpene profiles that are simply not available in a 90-day plant.

I disagree that Bandaid Haze looks like a pure sativas because it doesn't, at least to me. And some NH plants can look decidedly non sativa.

This is all subjective but this has been my experience.

Proud to be an "extremist."

I also seem to always prefer the effects of the longer flowering ladies, not all of them seem to have great resin but different oils etc, just more rounded and complex highs over all. I shamelessly let everything live in hopes of finding anything I like with shorter flower but within seed lots it's always ending up being the longer flowering ones for me.

Bandaid haze looks much like a sativa leaning hybrid to me in how it behaves.

I have a 20 week aculpoco gold x haze from white buffalo and I love it, such a warm and happy high, makes you a bit loopy but you can function well and enjoy the sun, birds singing and the colours. Punto rojo you already know what I have on those but the 20-22 weeker was the best for me, colombian black 16-18 weeker.

I will let you know how it goes with ojd's outback haze crosses, but your grow logs made me buy them so I'm looking for some nice ones in there like you seemed to find, soon come.

 

[Donald Mallard]

Certainly. FWIW, I was replying to MK's post (#1227).

I disagree that there is no connection between shape of leaf and effect. Of course there is, at least in my experience. While there are always outliers, skinny-leaf plants tend to have a less narcotic effect than broad leaf. It's not a hard-and-fast rule, but I have used leaf morphology as one of my selection criterion for plants in veg, and especially with landrace sativas, it has been my experience that the plants with the skinniest leaves often turn out to be the keepers when selecting for quality of effect, which is what I select for. Obviously there are other selection criteria, but for plants in veg, all you really have is leaf morphology, internodal spacing, hollow stems, and aroma. Not surprisingly, long skinny leaves usually correlate with longer internode spacing, because it's a sativa characteristic.

I disagree with the statement that most of the long-flowering plants are not worthy, and that you need to find that one in 50 or 100. Maybe I'm lucky, or maybe it's because I try to start with good genetics. but I not only prefer the long-flowering (18+ weeks) plants, but I select for long flowering. Yes, again there are exceptions, but it has been my experience with sativas and with haze hybrids that the longest flowering ones give me the effects I prefer. I smoked trip weed in 1974 or 1975 that gave me full on hallucinations. Haven't seen it since. There are over 5,300 replies to the "search for trip weed" thread and as far as I can tell nobody has really found it. Why? Because in 1975 the only weed you could buy was grown in tropical climates and took forever to flower, and since then every breeder of note has worked to reduce flower time. Magical effects take time, and some things can't be hurried.

I disagree strongly that the look of buds has nothing to do with smoke effect. I'd always prefer to smoke a Grinspoon-looking bud than a round, dense Indica golf ball. I select for fenotrigo bud structure and on every occasion I've grown a plant with that structure the effect has been extraordinary. Those who have come close to finding trip weed will probably tell you the plant had airy sativa buds and/or fenotrigo structure. Fenotrigo structure takes a long time to develop...you don't even see it start until 12-14 weeks.

I disagree that the time for producing resin is the same for 90-day plants and 120-day plants. A 120-day plant starts to produce resin at week 4, and finishes at 17 weeks. That's 90 days of resin production. I prefer 140-day plants. A 20-week sativa will produce resin for 14-15 weeks. More importantly, that extra time allows the plant to develop the necessary systems to produce truly special cannabinoid and terpene profiles that are simply not available in a 90-day plant.

I disagree that Bandaid Haze looks like a pure sativas because it doesn't, at least to me. And some NH plants can look decidedly non sativa.

This is all subjective but this has been my experience.

Proud to be an "extremist."

nice reply ,
and i agree with a fair bit too ,
particularly with your reasoning about lack of trip weed ..

but having lived in the tropics most of my life , and growing ,
i can say that not all of those thin leafed girls are great ,
some are out of this world , some medium , some not worth growing ,
but i also tend to lean towards thinner leafed plants to fat leaf plants ,

having said that , the laos i grew a few years back wasnt particularly thin leafed and was definitely a keeper , so as you noted there are plenty of exceptions to that rule , as many i guess as there are with all fat leafed plants are narcotic and produce couch lock ,
because ive found some that have a more sativa high to them ,
this is the beauty with cannabis , and why we cant judge it all based on leaf morphology , length of flowering etc ,
but as you say its a criteria to follow when looking for something specific , you will likely find what your looking for , just not all the time and be willing to have an open palate a bit ,
just because a plant has thin leaf and long flowering , doesnt necessarily mean it has a specific high ,, just that chances are better than if she had fat leaf and shorter flowering times ,
visa versa when looking for couch lock , narcotic types of highs , they can come in long flowering , thin leafed plants too ,
plus we can use curing methods to alter those highs ...

did u also consider that because that 20 week plant has been producing resin for so long , some of it is over ripe , some ripe , some mid range and some a little early,
this could be playing a part in the high one gets ,
then of course how it is cured , and the length of the cure can also play a part as i mentioned ,
theres a lot to consider , lucky there are so many happy to experiment and then share their experiences with us here ,
thanks for taking the time to explain your post further ocs ,
i appreciated it and enjoyed reading your answer ...