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Organic Growing from a Microbial Perspective

Microbeman

The Logical Gardener
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Suby,

Previously I believe you suggested that I post something as a sticky, unless I misunderstood, however, I was unable to figure out how to do so.

I have posted this monologue to my website http://www.microbeorganics.com and am posting it here as I have promised to some of the forum members. Please feel free to transfer it as a sticky if applicable or desirable.

Organic Growing from a Microbial Perspective:

To come to a rudimentary understanding of how organic or natural growing really works, one must cast off previous miscomprehensions from the chemical model, that when we fertilize or add compost or other organic matter, we are feeding plants. This is not the case. With true organics one is feeding the microorganisms in the soil which convert organic nutrients into a form which can be assimilated by the roots of plants. According to studies, there are only a very few plant species capable of absorbing only a very few organic nutrients. Most plants are only capable of absorbing inorganic nutrients which are made that way by microbes which live at the root to soil interface, the rhizosphere. So the idea which you have, that you are feeding your plants when they appear to need nitrogen and you feed an organic fertilizer deemed high in nitrogen is bogus. You are feeding the microbes which feed the plants.

Chemical fertilizers, mostly derived from petroleum are inorganic and can be absorbed by the roots of plants, however they are pollutants, which **kill beneficial soil microbes, build up unused residues which run into the water table and, in my opinion, create harmful tissue changes in the plants which humans consume as food and medicine. In addition, I believe, the use of chemical fertilizers promote the incidence of plant pathogens like powdery mildew, erwinia, fusarium, pythium, etc. The grower can end up in a vicious spiraling downward fall as they use one chemical after another to control the effects brought on by the others.

The plant is no passive player in the natural growing game of survival but is the master conductor of this delicately balanced orchestra. The plant receives energy from above the soil in the form of light. This photosynthesis results in the plant’s internal production of carbon. It utilizes this carbon to create and reinforce tissue as it grows, so it is a very valuable commodity. As we all know the plant also requires a form of nitrogen (N) and other macro and micro-nutrients which it receives through the root system. As already stated this N must be in a form which the plant can directly uptake and use, usually a form of ammonia (N). Research has shown that when a plant needs to uptake N from the soil it sends out some of its precious carbon through it’s root system as a feed for bacteria and *archaea which live in the rhizosphere. [* Archaea are prokaryotes indiscernible from bacteria except through specialized testing; usually DNA] There are more complexities involved, such as, that certain plant types attract certain bacteria/archaea types but that is beyond the scope of this portrayal. When the bacterial/archaea population has increased in response to the carbons excreted by the roots, protozoa and bacterial feeding nematodes are attracted to the region, ‘hatch out’ from cysts and eggs respectively and in the case of protozoa multiply rapidly. Protozoa consist of flagellates, amoebae and ciliates. Some protozoa can multiply (divide) every 2 to 4 hours so their numbers can increase in short order. The protozoa and nematodes consume the bacteria/archaea and release as waste the ammonia (N) which the roots can then absorb. The multiplication rate of the bacteria/archaea increases in response to this predation and so on. This has been called the microbial loop. Protozoa are particularly good providers as their ‘digestive system’ only utilizes about 30% of the nutrients consumed meaning that roughly 70% is released as the waste which the roots crave. This factor, combined with their short generational time makes them real feeding machines. Undoubtedly there are micronutrients also processed and absorbed in this cycle. There are still many mysteries which research has yet to unfold or are not yet known to this author.

This is not the end. The concert continues. The bacteria/archaea also consume the ammonia (N) which is now bioavailable to them, so are in competition with the plant for these nutrients. Because of this, if there are no predators or insufficient numbers to consume the bacteria/archaea they could potentially lock up the N. When the plant is growing it is in a vegetative state and requires a large load of available nitrogen (N) so it is advantageous for it to continue this release of carbon and maintain a balance of bacteria/archaea and protozoa, while uptaking just the right amounts of nutrients. Don’t get me wrong. There are other players in this orchestra, either playing subdued roles or waiting their turn to play. There are higher order animals like mites, other microarthropods and worms. There are various forms of fungi, most of which are degraders but some of which are mycorrhizal. These all have roles in breaking down organic matter into a form which can then be mineralized by the plant’s bacteria/archaea team or delivered directly to the roots.

When the plant receives its signal from the upper world, above the soil, that it is time to switch gears and produce flowers and or fruit, its nutrient requirement changes. Although the mechanics are not well known to this author, studies indicate that the plant then increases the uptake of the ammonia (N) (bioavailable nitrogen) and reduces or stops excreting the carbon which feeds the bacteria/archaea. This effectively starves the bacteria/archaea which will react by dying or becoming dormant. This of course results in a similar reaction by the protozoa and bacterial feeding nematode population. The mycorrhizal fungi previously mentioned is then triggered into increased growth and production. Studies have indicated that the transference of bioavailable phosphorus and potassium to the roots occur mainly as a function of arbuscular mycorrhizal fungal hyphae in symbiotic relationship with the roots of the plant. The fungal hyphae (microscopic strands) grow right into the root cells and exchange nutrients. In exchange for carbon, once again released by the plant, the fungal hyphae delivers the required bioavailable nutrients to the root system. The fungal structure derives these nutrients from organic matter and food sources in the soil, some naturally processed by the other players as previously mentioned. It is my hypothesis that the form of carbon released to stimulate the mycorrhizal activity is of a varied molecular structure from that released to promote the bacteria/archaea population previously discussed, however I have no direct data to substantiate this. There are often different types of bacteria which accompany mycorrhizal fungi, adhering to the fungal hyphae in a symbiotic relationship. It is thought that these bacterial species function to exchange nutrients with the fungi as well as to protect the fungal hyphae from consumption by other microbes and even contribute to the protection of the plant from pathogenic fungi. There are other types of mycorrhizal fungi (ectomycorrhizal) which encapsulate roots rather than entering them but these are mostly associated with trees in the temperate and boreal regions.
So you see it is quite a complex arrangement which the plant conducts or controls and there are many facets which yet remain a mystery.

How to Apply This to Horticultural Activities:

You say, okay so that’s how it works but how do I apply that to my growing situation? The answer is pretty simple really. You need to assure that there is organic matter, mostly in the form of composted plant and animal (manure) substances in or on your soil for a microbial inoculant and food source. Additionally you can add microbial foodstocks such as diluted fish hydrolysate and molasses and kelp meal, alfalfa meal and rock phosphate and other clay and rock powders if available. It is very good to include rock phosphate in your composting process if you are making your own. Rock phosphate in the compost adds a long lasting source of phosphorus for microbes to draw from. At time of planting it is highly beneficial to place some mycorrhizal fungi spores in the hole or on the root system. You can research the best strain of fungi for the plants you are growing and purchase the spores from a number of suppliers. [ http://www.mycorrhizae.com http://www.fungi.com ] You may also consider seeding companion edible mushrooms which provide a dual benefit of cycling nutrients to your plants and providing your breakfast. You may research this at the fungi.com site. The rest is governed by the plant, as previously discussed, assuming that all the necessary components are available from the organic matter and additional foodstocks provided. In my opinion manipulation of the pH is not a wise practice in natural growing unless dramatic acidity or alkalinity are measured. Soil with a healthy microbial population tends to self regulate the pH. One should disturb the soil as little as possible so as to leave fungal growth and strands intact. I realize this is challenging when growing in containers. I have run trials where wooden bins were constructed (2’x3’x1.5’ deep) where soil was successfully left intact after annual plants were harvested and replanted over several seasons. In between plantings composting worms were introduced to help consume the residual dead roots and plant matter. The worms were later trapped out. Compost tea was applied regularly to boost the soil microbial population. Over time there developed something of a miniature ecosystem complete with mushrooms, rove beetles and other beneficial bugs. If you are growing in smaller containers it is a good idea to provide a high volume of quality compost and or vermicompost at the onset.

Some people grow herbs and edible produce in containers organically. Because this has been practiced extensively utilizing chemical fertilizers, there is a period where growers have flushed the soil with copious amounts of water, the thought being that they are removing the harsh or harmful chemicals from the plant tissues. Too late! Those chemicals are already integrated into what you plan to put on your dinner plate or in your medicinal tea or pipe. At least that’s my opinion. If you have grown your produce naturally allowing the plant to be in control, this flushing routine is not only unnecessary but sort of stupid. Since plants are not able to uptake organic nutrients, what exactly would you be flushing away? You might instead be water logging your soil and roots.

Using Compost Tea:

The use of compost tea (CT) is one of the best ways to inoculate your soil with the beneficial microbes you wish to have for optimum health of your plants. It is also good if your supply of compost or vermicompost is limited, as it multiplies those microbes, we have been discussing, by the millions. Remember the protozoa I mentioned earlier? Well you can brew an aerated compost tea specifically to have a large population of protozoa, usually mostly flagellates. If you have a good quality compost or vermicompost, protozoa will already be present, often in a resting cyst. If you have an efficient aerated brewer you can pretty much count on having a high flagellate (protozoa) population combined with bacteria/archaea and fungal hyphae (not mycorrhizal) at 42 to 44 hours brew time (65 to 72 degrees F). If you have a microscope you can examine the CT periodically to be sure that the microbial population is optimum. The use of aerated compost tea also provides the opportunity to manipulate microbial populations for specific purposes by using various recipes and brew times. You may wish to have high bacterial or fungal numbers for pathogen/disease control or have soil or plants that require a higher population of a microbial type. I have a lot to learn yet of fungal species which can grow in compost tea so until I have learned to identify the species occurring I’m cautious about some of the tricks employed to stimulate fungal hyphae growth in compost. Better to count on good quality compost and vermicompost with natural occurring quantities and species of fungi and use known mycorrhizal and mushroom spores in the soil.

As always, I am open to correction or refinement of what I have written.

Salutations,
Tim

** EDIT in 2015: In my original on my website I have added an explanation that not all chemical fertilizers out and out kill microbes. It is more a case of them dying out from the system being by-passed.

Some References;

Protozoa and plant growth: 2003;
the microbial loop in soil revisited; Michael Bonkowski;
Rhizosphere Ecology Group, Institut für Zoologie, Technische Universität Darmstadt,
Darmstadt, Germany

Soil microbial loop and nutrient uptake by plants: 2006
a test using a coupled C:N model of plant–microbial interactions; Xavier Raynaud; Jean-Christophe Lata; Paul W. Leadley Universite´ Paris-Sud XI, France

The mycorrhiza helper bacteria revisited; 2007 P. Frey-Klett, J. Garbaye and M. Tarkka
Interactions Arbres/Micro-organismes, Champenoux, France;
UFZ-Department of Soil Ecology, Helmholz Centre for Environmental
Research, Halle, Germany

Modern Soil Microbiology; 2nd edition 2007 - Chapter 6 - Protozoa and Other Protista in Soil
Marianne Clarholm, Michael Bonkowski, and Bryan Griffiths
 
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jaykush

dirty black hands
ICMag Donor
Veteran
how do you feel about culturing natural beneficial microbes for organic growing?
 

MrFista

Active member
Veteran
I 'think' he meant nematodes....

I like this post. It might be wordy for a newbie but it's almost 'organics in a nutshell'.
 

organick

Member
Bump. Anyone growing anything should read this.
EDIT: I'm going to shave my head and distribute this at airports.
 
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Clackamas Coot

Active member
Veteran
Yelm's Earthworm Castings

Yelm's Earthworm Castings

Tim

Welcome to ICMAG! I've read your posts on Jeff's Yahoo.com list for several months and I'm familiar with your web site and the research that you've done.

Thank you for your efforts!

I have a question about a specific EWC product from Yelms Earthworm Farms. I know from reading your web site that you're familiar with their castings. You did some testing for them if my memory is correct.

So here's my question: If I'm using an EWC of a high quality like Yelms' then what is the advantage to using and applying AACT when discussing container grown plants?

For the sake of this discussion I basically use the soil mix known on this board as the "LC Mix" so you have an idea on how the soil in my containers is configured. To that I add Gaia Green Glacial Rock Dust, kelp meal, Down-To-Earth's fungai & bacteria root enhancer and a small bit of Down-To-Earth's Bio Life fertilizer mix (about 1 cup per 10 gallons of soil mix). I also add the Humate Carbon Soil product from LiveEarth.com - about 1/2 cup per 10 gallons per the label on their product.

The EWC makes up 15% of the aggregate total if that helps.

I water every 10 days with Humisolve-USA Pure Humic Acid (BioAg.com) per their recommendations.

Given the soil mix and the amendments that I'm using - is there a clear and definite reason to apply AACT to these contianers?

Thank you for your time.

CC
 
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jaykush

dirty black hands
ICMag Donor
Veteran
That is what you are doing when you brew compost tea.

um yes of course but that is not what i was thinking of but maybe i should be more clear. and no i did not mean nematodes, well i guess they could fall into that catagory.

i am talking collecting native beneficial (key word) species from local forests, streams, rivers, ponds, etc.... or species collected from root/foliar systems of symbiotic plants. healthy natural environments, not man made in a compost pile.
 
good post tim.....out of curiosity how much molasses do you use per gallon when brewing your teas?? i have been using 5 TBS per gallon but i have heard that may be too much? if using the same compost, brewer, methods but change brew time and molasses(feed) amount... say (for example) 1TBS molasses and brew for 24-48 hours or 5 TBS and brew for 48-72 hours..other than how long it takes to use up the food source would all the microbial population be the same??
 

Microbeman

The Logical Gardener
ICMag Donor
Veteran
jaykush said:
um yes of course but that is not what i was thinking of but maybe i should be more clear. and no i did not mean nematodes, well i guess they could fall into that catagory.

i am talking collecting native beneficial (key word) species from local forests, streams, rivers, ponds, etc.... or species collected from root/foliar systems of symbiotic plants. healthy natural environments, not man made in a compost pile.

In my manual which is sent out with the brewer I recommend using some virgin soil from an area where healthy plants similar in nature to the ones you are growing thrive. Also there are many methods for collecting and propogating indigenous microorganisms. Growing these is often similar to EM fermentation processes. There is a fellow in the Phillipines who is an expert. Try a google.
 

jaykush

dirty black hands
ICMag Donor
Veteran
yea i know of the phillipine expert cant remember his name, theres some of his information in these forums somewhere. i was just wondering if you have done any work like that and looked under the scope to see whats there as i dont have one or $$ to buy one, im making several different cultures in various ways right now. have been experimenting with this type of stuff for a while now.
 

Microbeman

The Logical Gardener
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Clackamas Coot said:
Tim

Welcome to ICMAG! I've read your posts on Jeff's Yahoo.com list for several months and I'm familiar with your web site and the research that you've done.

Thank you for your efforts!

I have a question about a specific EWC product from Yelms Earthworm Farms. I know from reading your web site that you're familiar with their castings. You did some testing for them if my memory is correct.

So here's my question: If I'm using an EWC of a high quality like Yelms' then what is the advantage to using and applying AACT when discussing container grown plants?

For the sake of this discussion I basically use the soil mix known on this board as the "LC Mix" so you have an idea on how the soil in my containers is configured. To that I add Gaia Green Glacial Rock Dust, kelp meal, Down-To-Earth's fungai & bacteria root enhancer and a small bit of Down-To-Earth's Bio Life fertilizer mix (about 1 cup per 10 gallons of soil mix). I also add the Humate Carbon Soil product from LiveEarth.com - about 1/2 cup per 10 gallons per the label on their product.

The EWC makes up 15% of the aggregate total if that helps.

I water every 10 days with Humisolve-USA Pure Humic Acid (BioAg.com) per their recommendations.

Given the soil mix and the amendments that I'm using - is there a clear and definite reason to apply AACT to these contianers?

Thank you for your time.

CC

If you are happy with your plants, I would find no definitive for using ACT (I refuse to use the term AACT as I find it to be a misnomer>grin) outside of intervention in the case of disease or if you just wanna see what happens.

Tim
 

Microbeman

The Logical Gardener
ICMag Donor
Veteran
BigWillyDee said:
good post tim.....out of curiosity how much molasses do you use per gallon when brewing your teas?? i have been using 5 TBS per gallon but i have heard that may be too much? if using the same compost, brewer, methods but change brew time and molasses(feed) amount... say (for example) 1TBS molasses and brew for 24-48 hours or 5 TBS and brew for 48-72 hours..other than how long it takes to use up the food source would all the microbial population be the same??

I generally use 0.5% to 0.75% molasses by volume of water unless combined with fish hydrolysate in which case I use less or eliminate molasses. Microbial development really varies according to brewer and compost quality but generally bacteria appear first and protozoa develop later depending on the variables. Once the food has been consumed and 36 hours has passed chances of having protozoa are high.
 

a12

Member
jaykush said:
yea i know of the phillipine expert cant remember his name, theres some of his information in these forums somewhere. i was just wondering if you have done any work like that and looked under the scope to see whats there as i dont have one or $$ to buy one, im making several different cultures in various ways right now. have been experimenting with this type of stuff for a while now.

I think it is on Organic Fanactive Collective thread... Gil Carandang, I was reading about it yesterday.

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=36542&page=1&pp=15
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=36542&page=4&pp=15

Peace
 

C21H30O2

I have ridden the mighty sandworm.
Veteran
great read. bacteria during veg, fungi during flower. any good tips on brewing the two different teas?
 

ThaiPhoon

Active member
Does using fermented EM solutions take place of regular ACT? I have been using EM here with pretty good results. I've made EM5 and FPE. How about using fermented fruit extracts? I've had varied success in the past...Just curious, and looking for good EM recipes if anyone has any good ones...
 
G

Guest

Thanks Tim!!

That's one of the most informative posts I have read on the subject.

Funny I had just read the article JayKush gave me regarding mycorrhizal fungi...as I plan to use mycorrhizal fungi when I transplant up next time. At the moment my plants are looking really nice in LC1 soil mix.

I love you comments about "flushing" too. I hope that ends the argument about flushing as it relates to organic growing.

I realize that out there in the natural world nobody is sprinkling dolomite lime around to help buffer the soil pH. :sasmokin:

"In my opinion manipulation of the pH is not a wise practice in natural growing unless dramatic acidity or alkalinity are measured. Soil with a healthy microbial population tends to self regulate the pH. "

So what are your thoughts on the practice of routinely adding 2Tbls/gal(1 cup/ft3) dolomite lime to these soil mixes many of us make for our cannabis growing? What effect, if any, does adding dolomitic lime have on microbial activity? I used to use lime when I lived back east for a variety of soil and soilmaking applications from houseplants to veg gardens to lawns....and on. In part because the native soil was pretty acidic where I lived.

Thanks

Pedro
:sasmokin:
 
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jj48 said:
Microbeman said:
f the pH is not a wise practice in natural growing unless dramatic acidity or alkalinity are measured.

i think peat is one of those situations that without lime could be too acidic...

tim, i'm not quite sure how the math works to change those %'s to tsp TBS for molasses....

anyone good in math? haha
 

Microbeman

The Logical Gardener
ICMag Donor
Veteran
C21H30O2 said:
great read. bacteria during veg, fungi during flower. any good tips on brewing the two different teas?

Please note that it is most likely that it is the mycorrhizal fungi which bears the responsibility of most of the phosphorus delivery. It cannot be grown in CT. Having said that, there are some who believe that brewing a fungal dominant (different species) CT contributes to this. As I pointed out I have a lot to learn about identifying fungal hyphae microscopically but using my brewer with compost in free suspension I get a good extraction of fungal hyphae at 10 hours and good growth at around 18 hours, combined with bacteria/archaea. I use good quality fish hydrolysate, kelp meal, rock phosphate and very little to no molasses. If you look at my website you can see video of the fungal hyphae grown.

Tim
 

Microbeman

The Logical Gardener
ICMag Donor
Veteran
jj48 said:
Thanks Tim!!

That's one of the most informative posts I have read on the subject.

Funny I had just read the article JayKush gave me regarding mycorrhizal fungi...as I plan to use mycorrhizal fungi when I transplant up next time. At the moment my plants are looking really nice in LC1 soil mix.

I love you comments about "flushing" too. I hope that ends the argument about flushing as it relates to organic growing.

I realize that out there in the natural world nobody is sprinkling dolomite lime around to help buffer the soil pH. :sasmokin:

"In my opinion manipulation of the pH is not a wise practice in natural growing unless dramatic acidity or alkalinity are measured. Soil with a healthy microbial population tends to self regulate the pH. "

So what are your thoughts on the practice of routinely adding 2Tbls/gal(1 cup/ft3) dolomite lime to these soil mixes many of us make for our cannabis growing? What effect, if any, does adding dolomitic lime have on microbial activity? I used to use lime when I lived back east for a variety of soil and soilmaking applications from houseplants to veg gardens to lawns....and on. In part because the native soil was pretty acidic where I lived.

Thanks

Pedro
:sasmokin:

Thank you for your comments.

As dolomite is a natural substance, rock powder, I see no problem with using it in small amounts and it likely has microbial benefits like other rock powders.

Tim
 
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