Well everyone the 205w and the 126w have shipped out.
Figured had to spice things up a bit so gonna run another side by side against the HGL 205w, the Jumbo 180w, and also against another companies 180w. So should be pretty interesting around here once things get all fired up....
Yes, I most certainly will as I am very curious about the 180w that uses 175 3w LED to create a total usage of 180w...
Yes, I most certainly will as I am very curious about the 180w that uses 175 3w LED to create a total usage of 180w...
Are you sure they use 175 individual LED spaces, WW? Or is that 175 'chip-watts' total, with the 3 chip-1 watt diodes counting as 3 units (watts)?
I was given to understand the boards they are using mix 3 chip/1 watt diodes and regular 1 chip/1 watt LEDs on the same board, as that company couldn't get 3 chip LEDs for every color they wanted. I thought it was mainly the white LEDs with the 3 chip units, not the red (and perhaps blue) also?
I would put a watt meter on that board as soon as you get it and find out what the true draw is. You might be unpleasantly surprised.
I think you'll find the main reason they use the 3 chip 1 watt diodes is: they're cheaper for the manufacturer (then buying three 1-watt LEDs). If you're lucky, they may pass on some of that cost savings to the user. More likely, they'll just pocket the difference.
Cheaper. Not better. At least, for the consumer.
Whether it's a 3 chip model or 1 chip, the three watt LEDs are always less efficient than a manufacturer having 3 individual 1 watt high-bin LEDs. Go take a look at their spec sheets. Since the manufacturers get compared by the LED wattage spec, not the actual draw, they can use a 3-die chip and charge (and rate the unit) by the watt as if it's the same as 3 one-die chips, even if it puts out less light.
I will *never* buy a unit using 3 chip LEDs. I consider it a low-quality approach to providing a barely adequate lighting solution. They may work for awhile - but they're inefficient, are more prone to failure from heat, and more expensive to run, especially vs. 1 chip 1 watt models at the same total lumens. And if you simply space fewer 3 watt LEDs out on the board, you'll get less even (more inconsistent) lighting distribution and color blending than if one was to employ more 1 watt LEDs over the same area, using the same total watts.
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By the way, if that unit is anything like their smaller 120w unit, the thermal management is horrible. Not only are they using the smaller board for those, they're running it 'hot' (500ma) to compensate for the fact they're using lower light output (per watt) LEDs. Which reduces the efficiency of each die (in lumens/watt) even more.
Heat is the enemy of LED boards (just like with CFL), and will kill it faster than anything. That's why the PAR38 profile LED 'bulbs' suck, and can generally fail after several hours (especially in enclosed/recessed lighting); in a round profile they're basically heat traps, even with their heat sinks. (Put anything over 5w in a 'bulb' style, even in non-recessed lighting, and say bye-bye to your light quickly. At 12-15 watt ranges, just forget about it. You NEED active cooling, as well as purpose-built lighting fixtures that completely replace conventional ones, with more watts. NOT retrofits.)
If their smaller 120w unit is any indication, I'd stay away from these. Running 119 1-watt LEDs at typical amperage draws in that profile is bad enough (I wouldn't do it, no matter what the Chinese engineers tell you); put 3 watts in the same spacing, AND raise the power requirements 50% (~43% for the mA and another ~7% from the increased Forward Voltage (Vf), and you will greatly shorten the lifespan of your unit.
I understand they wanted to run the whole board at 700ma (!), including the 3 chip diodes, but the engineers said they'd fry the board.
Yup.
I wouldn't have done even 500ma. The Chinese version of 'the customer is always right', though, apparently means giving the customer what they asked for - even if it's a bad idea. Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.
I want to give LED manufacturers the benefit of the doubt, I really do. I hope every new one entering the market serves the customer better and better.
But when a new one shoves 3w into a space designed for 1 on a regular PCB (horrible thermal junction/junction temperature (Tj) heat dispersion characteristics), they overdrive the LEDs to make up for the lower light output (which means you pay more for electric - you don't get more), and still charge customers accordingly - it doesn't exactly inspire confidence, you know?
According to the manufacturer, their smaller 120w board actually uses 165w, correct?
So, where's the cost savings there? And you're putting extra heat into your grow space - using higher watts, and less efficient power conversion. Sounds like they're just passing the burden of using a bad design and cheap LEDs onto the consumer.
The end user (YOU) gets penalized with the true cost of using those models.
Cheaper. Not better.
I hope I'm wrong about them, truly - but I don't think so. Best of luck there WW.
Cheers mate,
-SX
According to the manufacturer, their smaller 120w board actually uses 165w, correct?
So out of curiosity, do you think we should re-name our products based on actual wattage, or keep it based on the amount of 1W LED's we use?
Hmm, our 126W on a larger board (the one everybody uses for their 300W models) has an actual power draw of only 112W with the LED's running at 350mA. I can't imagine trying to pump 165W through the panel we use for our 63W light...
So out of curiosity, do you think we should re-name our products based on actual wattage, or keep it based on the amount of 1W LED's we use?
Personally, I believe that the manufacturers currently have it correct. Listing wattage based off the number of 1w LED's in use.
However, the company that SX is referring to that used 165w on their 120w panel... I do feel that they should rework thier numbers. In one hand it seems like a bargain (if the lights work out) because you are getting a lot more wattage than what your paying for. Other hand, seems super shady! And from an electrical standpoint, seems like a big no no...
Always know what you're buying beforehand!
Cheers,
-SX
Since the only thing I'm selling is the truth, I simply want to see that folks know exactly what they're getting, before putting down their hard-earned cash. And if they're buying a panel that's sucking up juice to make up for putting fewer LEDs in them, people should know about it...
Always know what you're buying beforehand!
Cheers,
-SX
I've gone ahead and changed our site to reflect both the power consumption and the # of 1W LED's used in our products. Thanks for your input SX, we'll keep out lights rated at the amount of individual LED's they use