Minions of the Dark

[Gold Hill Ganja]

I wouldn't worry to much about the labs SG, I fully expect high teens and several 20+% scores. I only popped a 10 pack of nocturnals last year got 4 females, gave 2 fems to RD he thought they were one of the most potent strains he ran last year. I got my 2 nocs tested one at 17.5% and 18.5% and these two were late starts and both in the same 10 gal grow bag so not the best example still tested well and taste awesome. I couldn't be happier with it tasty good stony smoke from every female in a ten pack.

 

[Pepe le skunk]

Took 10 samples to the lab for testing today.

I was told that my older cuts are not gonna give as high a reading as they were within the first 4-5 sets of cuts.
This has been tracked according to results of other breeders watching there prize cuts diminishing in potency in time.
Gotta love science and good record keeping.

A Gob Queen pheno update coming soon.

What type of test are they doing? Hope not TLC (thin layer chromatography) and they are using GC or HPLC. Great info about testing is found in the IC420 thread. Cherima and sam the skunkman have real good info on testing if you haven't read it.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=284135
Agree that terpenes are more important then just raw thc numbers. They definatly effect the overall quality and effect of the high.

As for genetic drift in clones science is the answer. You could always square and bx X 4 the clone to help restore the genetic drift or S-1 it to help restore it.

Just remember that Gob Q is an F-1 hybrid.
, but doubt I'll take GQ another step forward due to the mutation rates.

All we can look forward to is finding some nice cuts to keep in our stables at this point.

Would it be worth it to select the best pheno's out of them and S-1 or square and BX X4 to eliminate the mutation genetics? BX x 4 will get you 98% of the genetics in seed form and by using s-1's to help incorporate more than one of the best clones into the mix you in theory could stabilize only the best GQ.

I've entrusted mt GQ cut to local minions,

The GQ pictures I recently posted really don't do this beast justice. She is really massive and special. Hoping for 6-8 oz off just this one plant. If you SG1 or Any minion who has grown her out would recommend were she is lacking, maybe I'd consider trying to fortify her with an attribute or genetic boost in the male selected for a square and cubing of the strain. Any suggestions?
It sounds like the mutations of the seeds are the biggest complaint? Do you think it could be fixed?

Sea, Think I want to build one of those male isolation chambers you built. We should talk about doing this sometime soon. It is like you in one respect, "pimp azz hell."

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

Pepe - could you explain what you mean by square and BX X4? I'm new to this breeding terminology. So I would appreciate a short explanation. Thanks.

 

[Pepe le skunk]

Pepe - could you explain what you mean by square and BX X4? I'm new to this breeding terminology. So I would appreciate a short explanation. Thanks.

If you BX X 4 you are back crossing the strain to itself at least 4 times. What makes cubing a clone different is you are using one single female (for example) and always crossing it's offspring back to just that female clone to solidify it's genetic profile as opposed to all of the genetic material of the strain.

In the example I was looking to express to SG1 is the clone of GQ I have is really nice, so if I wanted to cube that cut I would only use that cut (always as the female producing seed) in the breeding.

Looks like this
GQ#1 (female) X Male doner pollen (GG4) for example.
= offspring gq1/gg4 f1 seed.
1st cube
gq1 female cut X f1(gq1 x gg4) Male (looking for squat thick branched male and if he has that grape smell all the better.
= 65% F2 gq1 seeds
2nd cube
gq1 x f2 male (gq1 x gq1 x gg4) seeds
= 78% f3 gq1 seeds
3rd cube
gq1 X f3 male
= 87% f4 gq1 (see above add additional gq1) seeds
4th cube
gq1 x f4 male
= 97% of the genetic material or better is gq1 in a stable seed.

Almost all of the seeds will be concidered a BX cubed clone in seed form. You know how some people want to avoid multiple phenos in a seed pack. Well now you know. Helps stabilize a strains genetics.

It's offspring should resemble the original gq1 clone so closely that even the grower wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the clone and the seeds producing females. It will also restore hybrid vigor to the seed line.

Most important is the offspring male used should resemble the qualities the original clone possed. For gq1 I would be looking for the smell, growth pattern, terpene profile, structure, branching ect.. time it takes the male to show sex after 12/12 started and I would select the latest showing male everytime if possible.
The great thing is the f2, f3 and f4bx females are your guage for how the processes is coming along. If you select a bad male the offspring would show it and you would want to go back one f generation to help correct the abnormality. (with goblin queen the problem genetic for example SG1 spoke about.)

Once read a male selecting thread and someone who knows their stuff suggested that later showing males are generally more potent and that the earlier males tend to be more hempy compared to later flowering males being more drug type cannabis.

If for example you were trying to get the females from the seed to flower earlier then you would select for early males to help quicken the resulting offspring.

Hope that explains the cubing process as compared to just the crossing or backcrossing of a strain.

One cool thing you could do is use the GQ1 I have and also use some pollen from a reversed GQ#2 from you, another GQ#3 and GQ #4 from the best ones sg1 has and then the genetics would contain more of the genetic material found in the make up of GQ.
So maybe sg1 GQ has thicker bud structure or is a more potent pheno of GQ then mine but mine has the smell then you could breed better genetics into the GQ and have all the favorable traits in the final seed f4 bx seeds. And a very high percentage would be uniform across the seeds you give out or grow.

 

[SG1]

What type of test are they doing? Hope not TLC (thin layer chromatography) and they are using GC or HPLC. Great info about testing is found in the IC420 thread. Cherima and sam the skunkman have real good info on testing if you haven't read it.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=284135
Agree that terpenes are more important then just raw thc numbers. They definatly effect the overall quality and effect of the high.

As for genetic drift in clones science is the answer. You could always square and bx X 4 the clone to help restore the genetic drift or S-1 it to help restore it.


Would it be worth it to select the best pheno's out of them and S-1 or square and BX X4 to eliminate the mutation genetics? BX x 4 will get you 98% of the genetics in seed form and by using s-1's to help incorporate more than one of the best clones into the mix you in theory could stabilize only the best GQ.

The GQ pictures I recently posted really don't do this beast justice. She is really massive and special. Hoping for 6-8 oz off just this one plant. If you SG1 or Any minion who has grown her out would recommend were she is lacking, maybe I'd consider trying to fortify her with an attribute or genetic boost in the male selected for a square and cubing of the strain. Any suggestions?
It sounds like the mutations of the seeds are the biggest complaint? Do you think it could be fixed?

Sea, Think I want to build one of those male isolation chambers you built. We should talk about doing this sometime soon. It is like you in one respect, "pimp azz hell."

1. GC = Gas chromatography
They assured me that they follow the exact standards as the labs used by the High times canna cup standards.

2. Your breeding questions are answered as follows.
I have 3 separate breeding agendas.
a. Breeding hybrids for fun of the community.
b. Breeding to save and preserve cut only lines, both S-1 and F-1's.
c. Breeding to establish seed lines, Halo for example, which is at the BX3 already(not BX X3).

3. The GQ's ---- have some beauties coming soon, but can't continue from that breeding.
But....... I have more Dark queen seed, which is the stock which bred the GQ.
I will, in time, grow another male and rebreed the exact line.
A diff male will surely offer a diff genetic combination even with the repeat lineage.

GQ is a fun run for those willing to deal with the mutations.
But also know that if just one branch of a GQ is mutation free, and take a cut from that area, the cuts grow mutation free.

Hope I got all your questions

 

[SG1]

Well got my results from the labs.
I'm a bit disappointed for sure, but as promised, no BS.
I will list from worst to best, new F-1's to keepers.

Dark Goblin #1 --- 12.94%
This was flowered early and not much veg time.
I've done better with her, but she must go.
I will grow the one I have outdoors, then terminate this cut.

Nocturnal #8 --- 13.44%
Only 4 samples of 15 grown.
Had same issues without sufficient veg time.
This cut is terminated.

Goblin queen #1 --- 14.02%
This was the 3rd round with this cut and not happy with the 3rd run.
I will grow the OD plant then terminate.

Goblin Queen #2 ---- 14.63%
Great flavor to this cut.
Will grow her OD then terminate.

Goblin Girl original cut --- 15.39 %
This cut has it all in flavor and scent.
I also believe she has further potential.
Still keeping her.

Nocturnal #2 --- 16.64%
Tasty cut, but have to stick with better cuts.
Terminated

Nocturnal #6 --- 16.90%
Perfect structure, dank as hell, frosty, yummy.
Gonna finish her outdoors and take another cut for indoors.
Terpenes off the hook, so decide later.

Jihad - original 1980 cut --- 17.33%
If this cut is wore out, there is a bunch of potential in her.
Gotta keep her, gotta!!

Afgooey -- my old PNW cut --- 18.54%
Still a keeper/breeder

And the winner is

Nocturnal #4 --- 18.76%
Very sweet and fragrant, great bag appeal, and stoney enough to keep a while.


So there we have it.
My first labs were a disappointment.
Won't be attending any Canna cups with these.
But, the journey continues, 8 GQs all sticky as a mo-fo testing next.

Will post a GQ pheno update later this week.

 

[Seaf0ur]

All quite good as far as I see it.... terpine profiles are the most important, and mendo purps itself only tested at 13.4%

http://budgenius.com/search.html?cmd=search&query=Mendo+Purps

 

[SG1]

That's a great link.
Lot's of great strains over 20%

We're still gonna keep our standards high.
Keep the mighty, abandon the weak.

Bet I see a 20% next testing.
8 GQs coming next and 12 DCD's flowering for next run.
PDPs after that, Oh my!!!!!!

 

[MrTea]

Have you thought about introducing some genetics known to be 20%+ into one of your lines?

 

[PakaloloFromPNW]

Pepe - thanks for the lesson. It helps me understand breeding terminology better.

SG1 - thanks for posting the lab results. At least that removes the guess work from decision making.

 

[Seaf0ur]

Its been a race between shriveling cotyledons and the first new leaves on my successful C-section PDP..... A race that all of a sudden this morning the sprout seems to now be losing

which leaves me with 2 fems, and a 2nd regular C-section that may or may not make it...

 

[MrTea]

My best wishes to you Sea! Really hoping it can pull through.

 

[Seaf0ur]

I'm bothered cuz I really wanted some PDP action goin.... but I look to the future as opposed to the past. In the chance of failure I will simply continue on to the next planned activity.... Minion City Glue.

 

[SG1]

Have you thought about introducing some genetics known to be 20%+ into one of your lines?

Of course, silly human.
We all bleed grower blood, and never have enough good stuff.
I have an order waiting for seed availability for Kosher Kush Reg seed. (very limited)
Got a few others in mind, but none available.

SG1 - thanks for posting the lab results. At least that removes the guess work from decision making.

I'm brutally honest, both to myself and to friends.
Science and fact are rarely made without honesty.
I owe the truth to everyone.

Its been a race between shriveling cotyledons and the first new leaves on my successful C-section PDP..... A race that all of a sudden this morning the sprout seems to now be losing


which leaves me with 2 fems, and a 2nd regular C-section that may or may not make it...

All we need is one male to hook up to some of the 20 fems growing now.
I think we'll get one.

 

[MrTea]

What else you want to cross with that's not available? I am sure some Minions here might be able to help.

 

[SG1]

Dark star from TH seeds

Gage green Grape stomper

Dark star is back in stock now.
Was hoping to get at least 2 of these when counting the Kosher kush.
Love to make one order.

 

[HillBilly1]

I have grape stomper

 

[SG1]

I have grape stomper

Oooooooooo

 

[HillBilly1]

Haven't even opened the pack yet lol or my lost coast OG,
Or the Ramulan haha Waiting for winter playtime

 

[Cougartex]

Running a kosher cut from a buddy down street. I wish I had the grape stomper but I have grape puff, gape stomper og, and d-cure which all have some stomper in there. I actually crossed the halo 2x with some grape puff pollen for my first seed run. Popped 10 for 10 of those a few weeks ago. I do have some dark star in the vault as well. Might have to pop some of them here soon. Hah I like your style SG!