Mid-Flower Defciency in Coco Top Feed?!
- Thread starter Johny1212
- Start date
So here is where I am going with this. I think this is making way more sense now. I really appreciate everyone's input! I am going to change my mix to reflect 1-3-2 npk with 88% base nutes and 12% of the protekt which is 0-0-3 silica product. I will maintain my EC at 1.0 with no added calmag. Here is what I figured out calculating npk by using the percentage of each product to get an accurate number. I finally found the correct method. Anyway, here is my mix, all are per gallon-
6 ml bloom 3-12-6
1 ml grow 7-9-5
1 ml protekt 0-0-3
NPK estimated- 1-3.13-2.04
1.0 EC at 5.8-6.2 ph
No other additives.
6 ml bloom 3-12-6
1 ml grow 7-9-5
1 ml protekt 0-0-3
NPK estimated- 1-3.13-2.04
1.0 EC at 5.8-6.2 ph
No other additives.
S
SeaMaiden
The last formula's numbers you posted sound a lot better to me, but you must remember that I am mathematically declined. At this point in time, you're awfully close to needing to cut out the Cal-Mag anyway, so don't sweat it too much because Mg is just too easy to feed via foliar applications. It's the Ca that's immobile and so must be laid down in tissues early on.
***Edited to add comments***
I would be careful adding too much silica too late into flower. I personally prefer to make it a weekly/every 10 days supplement. Remember again, however, that I prefer drain-to-waste over mixing up a reservoir and maintaining that. I prefer that method because it allows me to tailor the feed according to how I feel the plant needs or wants to be fed. I pretty much always cut out Ca and Mg by 3-4 weeks out from harvest, because I want a good fade on my plants as they near harvest so I begin ramping feed DOWN. By the time most folks are ready to 'flush' my girls are getting super-low EC feeds with no N, no Si at all, but are being given more sugars than anything to help fatten up buds and help increase scent profiles. (This is one of the reasons why I believe so many folks are married to molasses, and why I think MgSO4 can be helpful, as it provides sulfur that can help bring out scent profiles.)
The foliar application I use for Mg is via MgSO4, aka Epsom salt, at a ratio of 1/4tsp/gal clean water, don't bother pHing but I DO bother putting in a surfactant (just a drop or few of any non-antibacterial/antimicrobial dish soap is fine, can recommend something like Dr. Bronner's, but it's not at all necessary). Saturate the undersides of the leaves. You can also give the silica via foliar application, and in every instance of foliar applications where directions are not provided I begin with 1/4 of the lowest feeding dose that is provided. Does that make sense? Anyway, I don't think you need silica all the way through the grow just as I don't think you need Ca or Mg all the way through the grow, and because Ca is immobile you need to be more cognizant of when you remove it from your regimen. Btw, Ca can also be foliared.
***Edited to add comments***
I would be careful adding too much silica too late into flower. I personally prefer to make it a weekly/every 10 days supplement. Remember again, however, that I prefer drain-to-waste over mixing up a reservoir and maintaining that. I prefer that method because it allows me to tailor the feed according to how I feel the plant needs or wants to be fed. I pretty much always cut out Ca and Mg by 3-4 weeks out from harvest, because I want a good fade on my plants as they near harvest so I begin ramping feed DOWN. By the time most folks are ready to 'flush' my girls are getting super-low EC feeds with no N, no Si at all, but are being given more sugars than anything to help fatten up buds and help increase scent profiles. (This is one of the reasons why I believe so many folks are married to molasses, and why I think MgSO4 can be helpful, as it provides sulfur that can help bring out scent profiles.)
The foliar application I use for Mg is via MgSO4, aka Epsom salt, at a ratio of 1/4tsp/gal clean water, don't bother pHing but I DO bother putting in a surfactant (just a drop or few of any non-antibacterial/antimicrobial dish soap is fine, can recommend something like Dr. Bronner's, but it's not at all necessary). Saturate the undersides of the leaves. You can also give the silica via foliar application, and in every instance of foliar applications where directions are not provided I begin with 1/4 of the lowest feeding dose that is provided. Does that make sense? Anyway, I don't think you need silica all the way through the grow just as I don't think you need Ca or Mg all the way through the grow, and because Ca is immobile you need to be more cognizant of when you remove it from your regimen. Btw, Ca can also be foliared.
Sweet, I agree with reducing nutes especially n the last 2-3 weeks. Oh- I do dtw here as well. Top feed to waste. Got sick of ph ppm fluctuations of recirc. Next run I am doing organic water only. I screw around a lot trying new styles. Anyway, I think the npk should be good and I will see if I can get the silica out and maintain roughly 1-3-2 npk. I will run 1.0 EC through Monday and start bringing it down next week. I won't be adding any calmag at this point and ph is 5.9 today and i will shift it around during top offs. I have to say you are on top of your grows looking at this advice. I have learned more on this post than my whole time on another forum. I really appreciate your help. Things are much clearer now. Seeing my actual npk ratios really enlightened me.
cannastat nutrient calculator will help you find out you nute ratios, looks good
D
dramamine
Seamaiden gave some great advice. It must have been the Mag-pro driving your potassium levels too high.
Just to comment, I'm always shocked when people suggest things like feeding 15ml per gallon of cal-mag....and in late flower? It's all about balanced nutrition, first and foremost, then adjusting the EC to fit the plant's needs. Cal-mag seems to be a favorite placebo for so many, but it's really not necessary for most strains, and will throw off nutrient ratios in high doses.
Anyway, nice to see you got it sorted out quickly. Right on.
Just to comment, I'm always shocked when people suggest things like feeding 15ml per gallon of cal-mag....and in late flower? It's all about balanced nutrition, first and foremost, then adjusting the EC to fit the plant's needs. Cal-mag seems to be a favorite placebo for so many, but it's really not necessary for most strains, and will throw off nutrient ratios in high doses.
Anyway, nice to see you got it sorted out quickly. Right on.
Yeah, I am sure the magpro threw me off. I think now that I actually understand how to figure my npk things are gonna get way better! You are right on seamaiden. Funny how you can tell if someone knows their shit even if you don't
I am impressed with the level of knowledge and ability here. Some damn solid grows going on and solid advice!
I am impressed with the level of knowledge and ability here. Some damn solid grows going on and solid advice!For anyone looking to find their npk this worked for me and has been a revolution of sorts for me
Posted on rollitup by mccumcumber-
Have you heard of weighted percents? It's very simple math so it shouldn't be too hard to explain.
Lets take a basic class as an example.
You have a paper worth 30% of your grade, a final worth 50% and a midterm worth 20%.
You get 100/100 on your paper, a 70/100 and a 80/100 on your midterm.
Without using weighted averages you would add up 100+70+80= 250 and divide by 3 = 83.3. This is wrong. What you should do is:
100*.30 (30 percent)=30, 70*.50 (50 percent)= 35, and 80*.20(20 percent) = 16. 30+35+16= 81.
Now, lets apply this to NPK raitios, you have:
Bloom(least amount)4ml, 0-5-4
Grow(least amount)4ml, 1-1-6
Micro(least amount)4ml, 4-0-0
B52(least amount)2ml, 2-1-4
This is relatively easy since almost everything is the same amount. You have 14ml total. So, to find percentages you need to divide the amount of you nutes by 14. Your two different amounts are 4 and 2, so this is relatively easy.
4/14 ~ 28.5%
2/14 ~ 14.5% (the decimals go on forever so I just rounded)
Now, you multiply your values by their respective percentages, in this case, .285 gets multiplied by bloom grow and micro, and .145 gets multiplied by b-52.
0-5-4 * .285 = 0-1.425-1.14
1-1-6 * .285 = .285-.285-1.71
4-0-0 * .285 = 1.14-0-0
2-1-4 * .145 = 0.29-.145-.58
Now, add up all the values.
N = .285 + 1.14 + .29 = 1.715
P = 1.425 + .285 + .145 = 1.855
K = 1.14 + 1.71 + .58 = 3.43
So, at 14ml your NPK ratio is 1.715-1.855-3.43, or rounding you get 1.7-1.8-3.4
I took th number for N and assumed 1 then just divided th P and K numbers by the original N value. So this one would be 1= 1.7 so divide 1.8 and 3.4 by 1.7 and you get 1-1.06-2. Hope this is helpful to someone else.
Posted on rollitup by mccumcumber-
Have you heard of weighted percents? It's very simple math so it shouldn't be too hard to explain.
Lets take a basic class as an example.
You have a paper worth 30% of your grade, a final worth 50% and a midterm worth 20%.
You get 100/100 on your paper, a 70/100 and a 80/100 on your midterm.
Without using weighted averages you would add up 100+70+80= 250 and divide by 3 = 83.3. This is wrong. What you should do is:
100*.30 (30 percent)=30, 70*.50 (50 percent)= 35, and 80*.20(20 percent) = 16. 30+35+16= 81.
Now, lets apply this to NPK raitios, you have:
Bloom(least amount)4ml, 0-5-4
Grow(least amount)4ml, 1-1-6
Micro(least amount)4ml, 4-0-0
B52(least amount)2ml, 2-1-4
This is relatively easy since almost everything is the same amount. You have 14ml total. So, to find percentages you need to divide the amount of you nutes by 14. Your two different amounts are 4 and 2, so this is relatively easy.
4/14 ~ 28.5%
2/14 ~ 14.5% (the decimals go on forever so I just rounded)
Now, you multiply your values by their respective percentages, in this case, .285 gets multiplied by bloom grow and micro, and .145 gets multiplied by b-52.
0-5-4 * .285 = 0-1.425-1.14
1-1-6 * .285 = .285-.285-1.71
4-0-0 * .285 = 1.14-0-0
2-1-4 * .145 = 0.29-.145-.58
Now, add up all the values.
N = .285 + 1.14 + .29 = 1.715
P = 1.425 + .285 + .145 = 1.855
K = 1.14 + 1.71 + .58 = 3.43
So, at 14ml your NPK ratio is 1.715-1.855-3.43, or rounding you get 1.7-1.8-3.4
I took th number for N and assumed 1 then just divided th P and K numbers by the original N value. So this one would be 1= 1.7 so divide 1.8 and 3.4 by 1.7 and you get 1-1.06-2. Hope this is helpful to someone else.
Mia
Active member
What is the deal with silicates in flower?
I've been told by numerous "knowledgeable" people not to use them in flower but no one is ever clear on just exactly why not when I ask them.
Something about it screws up the flavor or something?...
Can you shed any light on this for me SeaMaiden?
Please pardon the threadjack OP.
TIA.
read crazy composers thread "pictures and note on growing my cannabis" i think you will find what your looking for concerning silica in flower....fwiw it's a good thing....and hard to be much more knowledgeable than CC.
Last edited:
Mia
Active member
Looks good just bookmarked it and will go through it tomorrow.
Thanks.
Got to motivate myself to do some gardening tonite. ugh
What strain is that? ^
