Lammy's Ace Seeds Journal.

[Levitationofme]

Nice resurrection there!
Great Photos.
interesting crosses.
This should be a great thread

 

[dubi]

Hi Lammy,

Thank you very much for supporting our work and for your interest to explore a wide variety of our genetics Such seed menu should keep you busy for a few years

GG4 x Orient Express ? Wow, sounds interesting, with a bit of selection i think you can get a very nice and high yielding hybrid

 

[Lammy]

I just ordered some more seeds from Ace but it's going to be a little while before I have any new pictures of ace genetics to post. so I thought I'd post some from last year.

here are some Orient Express that were not given any nutrients and we're just left outside in one gallon pots. The Roots grew threw into the ground. unfortunately because of light pollution from outside lights these did not finish up like they could have.

 

[Lammy]

This is my panama red #23. I called this the double Leaf mutation.

 

[Lammy]

I just placed a new order from Ace. I'm getting the Panama breeders pack feminized, the Malawi breeders pack feminized & Destroyer regular
freebies: Old Timers Haze, Zamaldelica & Violetta

I am trying to meticulously plan various crosses with the Panama, Malawi and also the Destroyer which was a last-minute add-on.

 

[Lammy]

DSW#29

DSW#29

I want to share some of the breeding work that I've done. while it's not really ace genetics I'm figuring out what to combine with Ace genetics.

I called this DSW 29. It is from a recent female selection I did. in short it's Death Star X WFO#43(male). The #43 is the selected male/brother of the WFO#51 i posted recently. I also selected another female WFO#17. She was more WiFi leaning. The male #43 was a real stud. I used him to make this DSW#29. In long form the DSW#29 is Death Star × White Fire OG × OG18 × Bubba Kush × 8 miles high.

 

[seeded]

I love the double leaf mutation and how frosty your own work turned out. It looks decent as

Have you been able to sample your dsw 29 yet?

 

[Lammy]

I love the double leaf mutation and how frosty your own work turned out. It looks decent as

Have you been able to sample your dsw 29 yet?

Thanks seeded.
It came down in December. But i quit smoking before i got a chance to try it. LOL
But i did jar some for a later date.
The WFO cross i made really changed everything for me. they're really easy to grow, have a good yield and a couple of them were really Frosty. but when I cross the male, which i named Weyland, to anything I've tried so far it lets the female be dominant in the crosses and I get tons of Frosty choices. I've got some young Gorilla Glue X weyland I'm going to be able to select from. And another cross that is with a female i made called BKR2. BKR2 is 75% Bubba Kush and 25% Eight Miles High. she's really special she grows Compact and dense buds dark green leaves that don't like to yellow and won't purple. she's not bothered by light pollution or disruptions in the light cycle and is just one of the most vigorous plants I've ever grown.

 

[Lammy]

I recently received my latest order from Ace. By memory it took approximately a week for it to make the journey from Spain to the US. To add to my vast collection I've got another feminized Panama breeders pack, feminized Malawi breeders pack and Destroyer standard. I think i got 2 packs OTH, violetta and zamaldelica as freebies.

It's hard for me to find a time and space to run anything that takes more or less than 8-9 weeks. but by the end of the year I'd like to do selection on some incredible sativas and also some breeding work. I'd like to find a flower room where I can run up to 12 week sativas on a semi regular basis. As my medical Garden is my only real source of income, what is grown is dictated by the whims of popular demand.

I'm considering placing another order for another feminized Malawi breeders pack, some GT and maybe fem Destroyer.

A few years ago i made a cross of (Katsu?) Bubba Kush×VBT. If anyone remembers the picture of the vbt that Ace used to have up. It looks like it should make beautiful babies with my Bubba Kush, which usually purpled. Perhaps I would try growing out this cross at the same time as doing the selection on the Ace gear. But I'm worried about needing to keep a large number of back of up clones for a long period of time. Mainly for a three month flower and then if I needed to cure the Malawi, destroyer and golden tiger for a couple of months before being able to test. Does anyone think that I would need to cure the Panama for months before testing it adequately?

I am looking for ideas and what I should cross the Bubba Kush X VBT to? I'd definitely want to pollenate the best BK/VBT female with my. GG4×OE male. Sure I want to cross everything to everything but that's a lot of work. I'm wondering what would make the best use of my time and pollen? Also I'd rather not go over 12 weeks with anything. So I'm wondering what kind of crosses I might do to bring down the flowering time of the golden tiger and Destroyer if necessary.

I thought maybe purple Malawi × Destroyer or GT

 

[Mephorius]

Great journal and plants

 

[seeded]

Those are some great genetics you bought but 12 weeks is expecting a bit much from some of them as most of those are going to want an extra few weeks while the best ones want even longer.

I honestly think your best bet is working out your weekly grow expenses and how much you want to earn and then divide that by how much you yield as doing it would set up a tiered pricing system based on flowering time which makes sativas seem more top shelf. It's not going to work immediately though as people are retarded and mostly just want cheap prices and bag appeal so what I'd do is plant violeta as it's a hybrid of purple malawi and purple pck which is going to be much faster and next to impossible to pass up and then whatever strain tickles your personal fancy the most from the remaining sativas which you give them a small sample of with their purchase. Be honest about why it looks different, costs more, etc. and if their experience tells them it truly is top shelf stuff and worth the extra expense it'll become herb they use to show off to their friends while parroting off your lines as selling points instead of whinging about how badly you ripped them off. It's only going to work up to a certain point though as you're not likely to find someone that wants to pay 5-10x as much for old timer's haze than they would the latest flavour of kush but I'm sure you'll figure it all out in the long run.

Oh and hit a cut of all your best with your pollen. You know you want to especially with the gorilla glue #4 x oriental express that will bring speed, frost and terps in spades to everything it touches

 

[Lammy]

Hi seeded. I noticed yesterday that you had already replied to my thread before I mentioned in yours that you should check it out.

I'm definitely going to have to think of some marketing strategy. I didn't even really think about the fact that I haven't been going to the clubs as much and mostly my stuff just goes in bulk to a few people. Who are generally only interested in one or two things. If I can find a sativa that just totally kicks their ass like descriptions I've read of Malawi and golden tiger I think they would be interested.

While I understand breaking down to per week what it cost to run these strains and figuring out based on that there's other more complex issues. Right now my main flower rooms work in pairs. With a common veg area to feed them. So each flower room is set up for 10 weeks including about a week of veg time and the veg room has 5 weeks to get the plants ready for each room. So I think I'm going to have to set up a separate room for the sativas.

But as far as flowering time goes. I realize that the golden tiger and destroyer will probably flower for too long. But I'd like to at least make some crosses with them. And maybe if I can think of a different setup I could run something up to 14 weeks. Of what I've selected according to the product information it's supposed to be able to come in at 12 weeks. The new Malawi killer S1 I believe is 11 - 12 weeks. the Panama Red is around the same time and I believe the lemon/incensy Panama is around the same time. I might just be using the golden tiger and Destroyer 4 crosses but I'm holding out hope to find something. I started doing crosses with the GG4×OE because of this ordering flower times in the popularity of the Gorilla Glue.

It's possible in the end I may end up just running crosses of these sativas for the lower flowering time and improved bud structure and smells. But it seems like it would be a shame to cancel a Malawi that could be done in 12 weeks just to have a cross of it that was just a shadow of its potency/effect.

I assume that people run their strains longer because they are starting them from seed and under weak lights. Some of these plans would probably do best with a unique strategy. I would like to be able to flower golden tiger from the start because it would certainly use less electricity to run the lights for 12 hours a day rather than 18 or 24. The new golden tiger seems to have a shorter flowering time as Dubi has incorporated the new Malawi killer. But I'm going to have to think long and hard on how to incorporate these plants into my garden and then I'm going to have to see what concrete individuals I can come up with.

But all of this does worry me because it is quite a risk to run something so different like this. I've got to make sure the rest of my garden is highly popular and doing well if I have a Mite issue or something in my other Gardens I probably won't be able to do this at all

 

[Lammy]

In all honesty when I initially set out to do this I was only planning on making crosses to grow out. I've had really good success lately with my own crosses. They tend to do well in my flower room and with my nutrients and so forth. I'm sure I would keep the selected plants from the ace genetics around. Even if they were only used for breeding and flowered out occasionally. While the sativas thing is my own Hobby. I have to realize that and keep it separate from most of my stuff which is dedicated to the medical community. I quit smoking at the end of last year while I still enjoy this I mainly have to ask other people what it's like to smoke a couple crosses that I spent months working on. But I will probably take up smoking again when I catch up on my work.

I appreciate all the input and interest. I'm very curious how this is going to turn out.

 

[seeded]

Those sativas might be mostly tamed but there's still going to be a regression to the mean so taking that new 11-12 week malawi for example and it coming from a strain that averages 14-16 weeks for me I'd expect most of the seeds to fall in right around the middle and be ready in around 13-14 weeks. It'd definitely be faster than the older version but in all likelihood it's still going to take a couple of weeks longer than you'd like and the same is likely true of the other strains like golden tiger that use the new malawi mother too.

Since I can sometimes have time restraints I've been forced to risk my mothers by taking cuttings and then killing them all off to free up my vege tent so I can flower plants in it. I can get a good 3-4 weeks of flowering done while the cuts root and vege in my clone tent under fluros so maybe you could do the same to help make things more manageable for the longer flowering girls? If not I'd really try to get them a dedicated spot because it's probably not going to be worth the risk growing untested sativas for a commercial crop. Yields, flowering times, quality, etc. are going to be all over the place and having another spot and new genetics to play with isn't likely something you'll regret having in the long run either.

Good luck with it all and I can't wait to see what you go with because those are some truly amazing genetics in your possession which $10 says sees you take up smoking again when you harvest

 

[Lammy]

I definitely agree that on the first run of all these different genetics that plenty of them will want to go longer than 12 weeks. It's a long ways away so I don't know what's going to happen. Maybe I'll chop them down prematurely or allow them to run up to 14 weeks. A large percentage of this will be the Panama Red which is listed as 11 weeks. I'm thinking about ordering another feminized Malawi breeders pack so that I can primarily run the new killer S1 and the purple malawi. Both of which should have shorter flowering time. I may never be able to flower the golden tiger or Destroyer for as long as they want. But if I'm able to select the best one of each maybe I could occasionally run it for personal use and move it from one flower room to another.

And yes I can agree that when I get a good cure on some Malawi or golden tiger or Destroyer or Panama red or green I am going to smoke that stuff. I didn't intend to quit forever but I'm way behind on my work and I've been quitting for New Year's Eve because once I start smoking again I just start smoking more and more until it's out of control.

I'm setting up a couple new flower rooms right now. I've got a small one that I could probably use for these sativas for two runs next winter.

I can not get the BK/VBT×GG4/OE cross out of my head. It should be 1/4 VB and the other 3/4 can flower in 9 weeks. That cross could be amazing.

But for now I need to focus on more practical things.

 

[Lammy]

So on the more practical side the current female selections that I'm working on are all fairly Young. Mail that I named Wayland. He is a WFO and the brother of the WFO#51 i posted recently and the father if the DSW#29 i posted. He seems to be an incredible stud. The DSW is between him and death star. That was an incredible cross. The Death Star was dominant and smell and all The Offspring were incredibly Frosty.

I flowered another of his crosses i called BKRW unfortunately I did not take any clones off of it so I'm flowering new females to do a selection. The mother of this cross I call BKR#2. I originally crossed my Bubba Kush clone 2 Eight Miles High. And then back crossed a male from that to the Bubba Kush. One female, the number two had very dense buds and is very vigorous and compact. So I pollinated her with Weiland and about a quarter of The Offspring were phenomenal. The Bubba Kush smell really comes through but not quite as strong as on the original Bubba Clone. They were super Frosty with a good yield and remarkably easy to trim. The buds rolled through my trimming machine in record time and were super easy two hand trim afterwards. The smoke reports I got on this cross in general said that it was a well-balanced high that was enjoyed by everyone and had good sativa effects. I'm thinking of crossing a male from this line to the Malawi considering that this already has some African genetics.

The second cross that I have in progress to test now is Gorilla Glue times Wayland. Called GGW. I'm just now sexing the plans based on preflowers. I have a lot of Hope for this cross considering how the other two turned out. I'm hoping to find some females that have the gg4 smell with a superior bud structure more consistently and higher-yielding for me.

And the final cross that I have in progress is just starting to germinate. Is a continuation. A few years ago I crossed a Grape Ape clone that I had with a Satori male. When I grew the Satori my selected female had a strong smell of kerosene. I accidentally discarded my selected female and cancelled all my Satori out of disgust for myself. I'm not sure if the clone that I received as Grape Ape is actually such. I've heard of Grape Ape described as an indica but mine grew on the sativa side. But it was certainly really good smoke regardless of the name. So last winter I grew out about a dozen females of this Cross of Grape Ape and Satori. Every single plant had a different bud structure. But they all had to Smells in common they were made up of different amounts of a candy sweet smell and kerosene. My favorite for smell was the number 10 which had a balance of those two. The plant itself was low yielding with small buds spaced out. I was so in love with the smell despite the fact that the plant itself could never be anything with such a low yield and possibly an anxiety-producing High. But I kept her around for a little while and pollinated her with Wayland. I recently remembered the smell that I described as kero-sweet and was thinking about how Wayland seems to improve bud structure and create a bunch of Frosty individuals with the mothets smell so I figured I would give this one a chance to find a phenomenal individual. I call this cross GSW. Some of these GA/SI individuals had a smell that could be described as Lemon Pledge and I think it could make a good cross with the Panama.

Whoops i forgot i have a few f2 seeds going from the WFO. #17×wayland. The number 17 is the sister to the 52 I had pictured earlier. The 52 is really Stony and Bubba dominant but the 17 is perhaps just as Frosty but as more of a Fire OG phenotype. Because the WFO is White Fire OG X a male (OG18 × BK×8MH) my crosses might be hard to read but I don't do any feminized crosses. So there's always a male used. I killed wayland because I usually just keep a male around for a while and make a variety of crosses before moving on to the next thing. Then I realized how incredible he was as a stud. So i started these f2's in an attempt to recreate him. Also I want to cross them to the Fire OG clone to improve that.

Anyway I'm pretty sure that's all the selections I'm currently working on. LOL I know this is the Ace forum so just have patience with me and this stuff will eventually get crossed to a bunch of Ace genetics

 

[dubi]

Hi Lammy,

Sounds like you are busy with your own selections and breeding
The WFO#51 looks like a very interesting and resinous hashplant, well done

Looking forward to see females of your Orient Express x GG 4 hybrid, it's important to evaluate first the females of the cross before using its males in other outcrosses or polyhybrids.

Bangi Haze, Congo, Orient Express and Panama are suitable genetics for your 12 week flowering room. You should be able to find very nice parental plants to work with if you grow 1 or 2 packs of each strain, the Breeders Packs are especially interesting for the task.

Maybe it's a good idea to concentrate your breeding in 1 or 2 hybrids at a time, it takes lot of time, space and energies just to work properly one hybrid.
I would highly recommend you to clone and label everything you start from seed, you never know which parental plants will make the difference at the end, and it's important to keep everything in clone form before you can start to discard, and to be able to replicate previous successful crosses with selected parental plants. This will add consistency to your breeding practices. Once one hybrid or line has been improved and you keep the desirable parental plants then you can focus your energies and resources in other line, and step by step progressing towards your breeding goals.

Let us know if you have any doubt when working on your selections, or pm or email me if you need a fast reply. Good luck!

 

[Lammy]

Thought I'd move terpenes advice here as I'm better equipped to do this cross now. I have the Fire OG clone and plan on doing breeding with the Malawi breeders pack

First off, Lammy - you are going to be VERY happy with this cross! Excellent thinking!

If you haven't ever smoked Malawi, prepare for a penetrating, hitting the ceiling, somewhat energetic, paralyzing high with a slightly heavy and narcotic come down. Fire OG should calm down the energy a bit but prepare for some really intense smoke! Going to be a damn frosty cross, that's for sure. The Malawi will also make the Fire push a lot harder, a more vigorous, larger, faster growing plant is in your future.

Judging a male is just like judging a female. How does it grow? How does it stink when you rub it's stem? Hows the color? Does it do anything unique that you haven't seen before? etc.

As far as Im concerned, if you have a great looking specimen of either line, male or female, and you smack em together, you're going to have beautiful children.

- Or if that's too pollen chuckerish for ya, pollinate a few separated females with different males and grow out the beans to find the exact plant you're looking for.

The speed, smell and yield you are looking for will all be things you will have to select for in the resulting cross.

The amount of variation in the first cross will be a standard bell curve from mom to dad. Most will fall in the 60/40 & 50/50 range, but some will be very malawi, and others will be very og. To give you an idea of how far things go one side to the other, here's my cross of Fire / Destroyer. Seed #1 (Fire side) first, seed #2 (destroyer side) second.
View Image

View Image

The above cross is an example of the pollen chuckerish method. It's been a couple years since I planted the first bean and I have yet to be disappointed by the cross, in the second pic you can see my f2s forming. "Napalm" as we decided to call it, is a perfect mix of Destroyer's clear headed, soaring, "omg lets go ride bikes" ADD high and Fire Og's stoney, body buzzing, "OG" high. The smell is interesting, Fire's fuel smell and Destroyers lemon pepper combined into an "electric neon blue" smell.

Stop reading and get to pollinating already, that cross is going to be bitchin!

 

[Lammy]

Hi dubi. Somehow i did not see your reply.
I know it's less than ideal to use a male without seeing what the female population was like. But it comes down to a matter of resources and time for me. it was either run the male without running the females or not do it at all. It's definitely a Gamble. My main breeding goals are to have fun and make something unique but it's more about being able to select any leak loan for myself to run rather than to make a great set of seeds.

I just collected more seeds from my GG/OE male he pollenated: ghost train Haze, sour dub, Fire OG, my WFO51 and a back cross to the GG4.
I had fun making the seeds but I don't think I'm going to start any of them right away. I would probably choose two of those crosses to grow out and compare and see which is superior. I may grow out one of my VBT crosses one day and use pollen from this male to cross the two different lines or grow out one of these sub crosses to mix with the VBT cross.

I think for my selection I'm going to focus on the Panama Red and the new Malawi killer with a few green Panama's. I'm really good about labeling everything and taking back up clones of the females. I would have about 10-12kw for the garden to do this selection and a decent number of square feet. So hopefully I'll be fine with the number of plants I want to test.

I can definitely appreciate your advice about keeping clones of the male and testing his progeny to have better and better success at breeding. I'm used to just making a few crosses within a few months and discarding the male. But my WFO43 male made exceptional crosses and I regret having discarded him. But the thought of keeping backup clones of a male going long enough for me to test the progeny just seems overwhelming.

Some of the Crosses I'm thinking about. I plan on getting a clone of the 10K Jack herrer. Which somebody on here describes it as smelling like sweet lemon lime candy syrup with dense buds. I thought that could be fun to mix with the green Panama as a different version of the Panama Jack. I also thought it'd be fun to mix with the Destroyer. I'm considering using my current pack of Destroyer just to select a male. I can just buy more seeds in the future if I find the time and room to select a female. I also like terpenes success with his napalm and since I have the Fire OG clone and I'm impressed by the density of the flowers I think I might "recreate" the napalm. I like the idea of combining the green Panama & Destroyer with perhaps one more plant in the mix.

I'll have to see how it goes but I'm thinking about making some crosses that are 75% new Malawi killer. Using the Breeders pack in general I can select a male new Malawi killer to cross with my female clones and then back cross to my selected female from the new Malawi killer S1's. I would probably pollinate most of my best females but the crosses I'm most currently interested in with the Malawi are to the Fire OG as I started on years ago also I've got a couple females, Eight Miles High from Mandela mixed with Bubba Kush, and also crossing to my DSW29, destroyer and napalm. But I'd have to see how the Malawi turns out and what females/males I have ready when this project takes place as it's a long ways off.

I've currently got so many breeding projects started I've gotta do a bunch of female selections so that I can greatly reduce my backup clones.

 

[Lammy]

So I started a few seeds of Destroyer which I recently got from Dubi and Neville's Haze mango which I've had sitting around for years. I know this is going to kill everyone to read it but I started these seeds for male selection only which means I will be discarding the females. These are currently strains that flower for too long for me to practically run them. Considering I can order more destroyer from Ace at any time I don't mind spending a couple dollars to find a male Destroyer to breed with. I have these going at my friend's house who's a caregiver so I can keep my numbers under control. I mainly started the destroyer and the Neville's Haze mango was an afterthought. I figure I can do about the same crosses with both of them. I'm thinking of making a three-way cross between the Destroyer and this 10K Jack Herer clone I got. Bodhi uses it for breeding and it's supposed to have a very sweet lemony lime smell with dense buds flowers in around 9 weeks. So I want to make it three way cross between the Destroyer the 10K Jack herrer and a green Panama that I'll be doing a female selection on hopefully by the end of the year.