dang thats too bad. so is there a certain brand you guys like? i have O.P.M.S. Silver capsules but im not feeling anything. do i have to take 10 of these things or what? so far its been a wate of money. heroin would be cheaper and more affective
farmerfischer
Well-known member
Take 8.. 10 may give motion sickness or eye bobbles..
I take 10 to 14 caps depending on the brand, but id say I'm a pretty heavy user..
moose eater
Well-known member
I've used Kat's Botanicals, and they're fairly well-reviewed.
My findings when taking 3-4 for depression, anxiety and pain a while ago, was that it quickly developed a tolerance with me, and eventually I ceased using it. Still have a fair amount of it in both their Red Bali and Green Bali.
The initial effectiveness was positively noteworthy, but, like I just stated, for me the efficacy waned a bit.
And read up on health concerns, from reliable sources, as, for some, long term detriment, especially with large doses, can be a real thing.
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yeah ive heard all that too which is why i havent taken any in a while. It doesnt make any sense to me to take this stuff if its so easy to build a tolerance. i feel like im being duped and this is a scam. I saw like little bottles for $25 or $30. thats BS. We have all this synthetic THC and crap. We need safer and better legal opiates cause this chit dont work in my experience. I wont be wasting any more money on this stuff. Id rather make opium tea or snort heroin. This shit is not it. At least the stuff i tried. Im pretty damn pissed cause im poor as hell. this stuff is expensive as hell by me and its in every gas station and head and vape shop.
moose eater
Well-known member
Not everyone who takes Kratom necessarily reports the same drop in efficacy.
And I don't know if it's related or causal in nature, but a long-time former friend in a remote location up here was medevaced a bit over a year ago from a remote location for heart issues that apparently came close to being his end. He'd been taking Kratom in powder form quite regularly, a teaspoon or 2 each day at the end of the day.
Again, I can only hypothesize as to whether there was a connection between his heart issues and the Kratom, though despite age, he'd nearly always been healthy as a young, fit horse.
Thanks for sharing thar moose. Yeah its very hard to say. Too be honest id either just say fuck it or be extremely careful what id do if i lived in the middle of Bumfuct Nowhere. Sounds scary and i understand how you guys feel but if i had a family, i know you said your kids are grown up but it just boggles me to be up there whit so many things that can go wrong. Once again i tip my hat to you sir. you guys are tough as nails and i thought my family and i were tough
i had a very bad thought just now. i bet someone could make a ton of money selling heroin and other opioids up there. no doubt lots of people need it up there.its just not fair and if it wasnt for the fact that you HAVE to be so self reliant and the cold weather id probably chance it up there. and i sure as hell wouldnt rely on kratom for anything. anyway thanks for that info.hope your friend is doing better
moose eater
Well-known member
Illegal/black market opiates have been pretty prevalent here for -many- years, especially starting after Vietnam; many First Nations folks are veterans, fighting for the same people who fucked them over. Oddly enough.
But the onslaught of fentanyl and oxy has permeated villages in recent years, whether road-connected or not.
It's a huge thing here.
Alaska had the greatest increase per capita between this year and last for opiate ODs in the US.
Yeah it figures. Even got to you guys. My uncle is hooked on the Fent bad. He says he knows what hes doing and he must cause ive never seen anyone shoot up as long as he has. I can think of 4 or 5 close deaths in recent memory. Glad i never touched the stuff. Im too scared to even touch heroin these days. Ive even heard of Fent in weed,coke, just about everything. its disgusting.
And what pisses me off the most is these doctors nowadays wont prescribe ANYTHING so people are forced to take these shitty street drugs. I even had to get a piss test recently to show my doc i wasnt on hard drugs.i tested positive for legal THC in gummies i bought from IA. Its weird THC 9 or 8 whatever. anyway i took the piss test cause i told my doc i wanted Clonazepam which i was prescribed for years and she turned me down and wasted my time. These fuckers dont know who they are messing with. Im WAY smarter than this bitch and she insulted me and wasted my time. Shes lucky it was a video call cause i might of beat the shit out of her in person. not joking at all and anyone who fucks with me like that gets no special treatment. right or wrong you know you dont play with certain people like that. she clearly wants to act like se has power. Im either gonna drop her or im gonna come to her office and use a Chinese palm strike to the side of her head. I dont care anymore
And what pisses me off the most is these doctors nowadays wont prescribe ANYTHING so people are forced to take these shitty street drugs. I even had to get a piss test recently to show my doc i wasnt on hard drugs.i tested positive for legal THC in gummies i bought from IA. Its weird THC 9 or 8 whatever. anyway i took the piss test cause i told my doc i wanted Clonazepam which i was prescribed for years and she turned me down and wasted my time. These fuckers dont know who they are messing with. Im WAY smarter than this bitch and she insulted me and wasted my time. Shes lucky it was a video call cause i might of beat the shit out of her in person. not joking at all and anyone who fucks with me like that gets no special treatment. right or wrong you know you dont play with certain people like that. she clearly wants to act like se has power. Im either gonna drop her or im gonna come to her office and use a Chinese palm strike to the side of her head. I dont care anymore
moose eater
Well-known member
There's suspect science stating there are contraindications and possible negative effects from combining opiates and cannabis.
This is what happens when knee-jerk reactions to social issues (the 'opiate epidemic') joins with barely closeted neo-puritanism, and leverage from the DEA compliance officers, who typically have no real medical credentialing, but can frighten docs into one path or course of treatment or another, thereby, to some degree, negating the significance of the Hippocratic Oath and the sanctity of the doctor-patient relationship..
A family member works a methadone program, and they have routine interactions with the DEA's drug diversion people.
Sometimes a lot like letting Mr. Magoo drive the school bus.
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RobFromTX
Well-known member
Same situation here. its that fentanyl. The dealers keep cutting the heroin with it. Ive already lost two friends. Im sure everybody knows someone its gotten by now
moose eater
Well-known member
Oddly, these days fentanyl can be found in drugs that would typically have the opposite desired or sought after effect, including coke, etc.
ronsonmatsuo
Member
I used kratom for five years. Actually I used it for about two years then Kratom used me for 3. be careful with this shit. If you’re content with just using the leaf I advise you to not try the extracr. Once I used extract the leaf/pill wasn’t shit
RobFromTX
Well-known member
Dangerous times. The two friends i had were heroin users but they had jobs and kids. Dont seem right to me but its not going anywhere. Thats for sure
moose eater
Well-known member
It can have physically addictive properties for some, and like opiates, not for others.
And there are some less-than-fully researched health issues that seem serious. Including a limited number of known deaths.
moose eater
Well-known member
My family member who works at the methadone program, years ago, had clients who were in their 70s, respectable in appearance, successful in all ways in life, many with families in their rear-views, and were functional successful LONG time heroin addicts.
Some of heroin's rap is hype and politics, while other bits are quite solid.
Not all drug users come in tie-dyed jeans with a ponytail and under 30-years-old anymore, and the boomers who were some of the earlier most visible recreational drug users years ago are mostly little old men and women in spectacles these days if they're still alive. We're all getting older.
See that just dont make sense to me. I know it has something to do with activating some opioid recepters but how can some people experience withdrawl and not others? i guess more research needs to be done but lots of things just arent making sence. i think until the day comes where you dont have to take 5 or 7 grams to feel anything im just gonna stear clear. still got like 90 or 100 capsules left.ill take 7 or 8 and see what happens next time
moose eater
Well-known member
Each person's metabolism and construct can be/is unique.
For some people, drinking milk or eating peanuts can be terminal or make them very fucked up. For others they're just another food item..
I've had oxycodone in ample supply numerous times, including post-spine surgery and post-cancer surgery. I still have an ample stash here now.
Never had any issues with dependence at all.
And I still am one of those dinosaurs that remembers (esp. as a former clinician) when there wasn't so much profit in treatment programs and enforcement, and there was a definable difference between physical dependence and psychological dependence.
Nixon went on a witch hunt when he heard that enlisted personnel in 'Nam were smoking pot. What they found was that the greater number of users were in the Air Force, though there were plenty of drug users in other branches then, too). (*Created whole new meaning for the Air Force's slogan 'Fly High!!') and it wasn't simply weed; there were LOTS of service personnel who were using opiates, whether opium, heroin, or morphine.
Only ~4% of those who actively used opiates in 'Nam returned home to continue the stereotypical lifestyle of John Prine's Sam Stone. The rest changed environment, changed requirements for daily living and responsibilities, put on a clean shirt, and went about business.
'Set and setting', as well as anticipation/expectations of the user (psychosomatics and placebo affect) and personal metabolism matter.
I don't crave opiates and never have. In fact, the constipation they bring with them is a pain in the ass... or, more aptly, the intestines. When I've been in pain, I've continued short-term use of opiates PRN, like when I do a trip into the bush and effectively kick my own ass by pretending to be youthful again, but I also now know they're -NOT- the more effective treatment for long-term pain and especially nerve/spinal cord generated pain.
(**I've since discovered some drugs that offer incredibly effective relief for spinal cord-generated pain that worked like a charm, better than anything I ever tried before, but they fucked up my glucose and blood pressure a bit, and they're not to be taken lightly or without due respect. Fortunately, when I slowly DCed those/that drug(s), I began bringing my various indicators/levels back to around closer to normal and had no return of the nerve/spinal-generated pain.... yet).
Drug enforcement and packaged drug treatment programs want everyone to think that a specific drug does x, y, or z to everyone. The fact is that it's not always the case. Just as some drugs are effective for some and not for others. While we all mostly look the same, we're not.
My initial experiences with Kratom involved the stuff creating a virtual, nearly visible (in my mind) veil between the heartache and despair I'd been plagued by re. my younger son: the Kratom put that shit to rest like RIGHT NOW, to a manageable and tolerable level. That didn't last long enough over time, however.
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Yeah i know. Your right. I dont really have anything to add except ive done crack, heroin and meth and i never was addicted to them. i probably never done enough of them but alcohol as im sure ive said has always had me by the balls. with the help of Naltrexone ive gone from 20 beers a day to less than 30 a month. so im not completely cold turkey ive done what most people i know havent.
Ive heard good thinkgs about kratom being good for addiction and thats what initially made me want to try it in the first place. i have at times done the wash method with big spoons and it did seem to be a mild you know what feeling but it just doesnt quit scratch that itch and you want more. well thats my experience. take it as you will.i guess i just had too high of expectations especially when it costs more than heroin
moose eater
Well-known member
Some people have used Kratom to come off of opiates, but the jury's still out on the efficacy and wisdom of this.
For the record, most stimulants and amphetamines are not physically addictive like heroin, alcohol and benzodiazepines are.
Most stimulants and amphetamines are psychologically addictive for some/many people, and sometimes greatly so, because of the 'dopamine effect'; that pang and sometimes immediate effect/message or urge in the brain that after one does a REALLY clean line of good coke, for example, the statement in the brain is "DAMN!! THAT WAS GOOD!! DO ANOTHER!!" Why we referred to coke as a "S'mor drug" back in the early 80s.. As in, Do some more!
Sometimes you'll get the same message from the first or second beer or alcoholic beverage, too. Still dopamine at play, even though alcohol is, in fact, physically addictive..
My favorite thing to tell folks about dopamine, whether in response to a really good food item, alcohol, coke, or whatever, is this, and it's true to some extent, in my opinion and experience; "Dopamine is a LIAR!!" Because more isn't always better. Sometimes the opposite.
When you get that feel-good urge to immediately do another line, or drink, or whatever, tell yourself that. "Dopamine is a liar!!" It can be very helpful.
